Humanity
A friend of mine sent this to me and I think it's important. At its core, the immigration debate is about humanity, and its nice to be reminded of that sometimes...
Today I spoke with my father who manages a large construction company in Texas. We spoke about the immigration debate and its consequences.Though recent media reports have done a good job at reporting on the rallies and planned boycotts, vigils, marches etc... They have failed to address the cruel realities of the consequences surrounding the debate on immigration.
Today, Friday April 28, African American and white workers took half a day off to come to the aid of their Latino colleagues. Ongoing INS raids in Hispanic supermarkets have caused alarm in the Latino community. Many fear getting incarcerated and shipped off to a land which today is foreign to them.
Those African American and white workers who are paid an hourly wage (overtime at this point) decided it was more important for their Latino colleagues to have food on the table than to have a few much needed extra dollars to pay for gasoline.
This is a stark reality I hope the media would pick up on instead of focusing on the wedge politics present in the current debate.
Comments (192) «
It's a sad commentary on Mexico! Why are their people having to come to America. Take the fight south of the Border so it will help all of Mexico's people.
It is sad they feel they have to come to another country.
It show how generous Americans be, and would be willing to help them with issues that affect their whole country not just those who are near enough to cross the Mexican/American border.
josh- these workers who took part of the day off- they were at your father's company?- much of the intricacies of this debate are lost in the media coverage- i keep thinking about the day that ed schultz had a woman on from michigan who represented laborers who had not gone in to work to march in the last large demonstration- i confess that as i write this i am forgetting the specifics, but i recall that many of these workers were in danger of losing their jobs for their actions- her point was that it made no sense for these employers to treat these workers this way when their own workforce was under threat from a congress hell-bent on making them all felons- i am torn by this issue, but i can't help but feel that the power of their movement has to be harnessed by those who care about rights for those who don't have a voice in this country (regardless of their status as citizens- we are all citizens of the world we live in- that is especially true when the corporate "citizens" can move across borders at will with their money and their labor)
Instead of slogans it would be nice if the media realized this issue is about people. There is a problem that needs to be addressed not an issue that needs to be exploited by politicans and news executives.
I'm sick of all the hoopla. Are we going to face our problems and try to fix them or just wait until the situation gets so out of control everyone becomes a victim?
Thanks for sharing this story.
Verify, verify, verify. Why should we believe any of this? Names, dates, who, what, where, when, please.
This is such a multi-faceted problem it can't be solved in several years ...never mind one.
It's not even about the Immigrants.
It's about cheap labor and those who benefit from it.And they don't want anything to change.
-We need an enforceable and fair Immigration policy
-Mexico needs to raise their standard of living so that their people don't want to come here
-we need to raise our minimum wage so that our own people can make a living.Instead of taking advantage of people who are in desperate circumstances-employers need to pay all workers,legal or not,a fair and living wage.
-This is about PROFITS to people who don't need them. It is just another way to keep a small but powerful segmant of the population ...in control.
We need to start protesting for ouselves and OUR rights and let our neighbors to the South protest for changes in their Country. With an equal playing field....ALL benefit!
There's a good chance this is a fake letter. Whether real or not, who could have produced it, and why? Because they're humanitarians, perhaps?
Or, perhaps they enjoy the money they make off employing illegal labor.
And, of course, the "INS" hasn't existed for several months. It's now ICE.
And, it's not mentioned exactly how those "African American and white workers" helped.
And, since the corrupt Bush administration hardly does any immigration enforcement at all (to help, for instance, Texas construction companies make money), I have trouble believing that ICE was conducting such raids, especially in supermarkets.
It's a sad day when the DNC ends up not just printing obvious urban myths, and not just endorsing illegal immigration but also endorsing opposition to the ICE doing the job that the Democrats in Congress voted to have them do.
I think feel stories like these are nice but questionable.
There is no way to verify there is any truth to the story. It could be real or it could be propaganda.
Without any means of verification, using as sounding board smacks of misinformation to promote a political agenda.
I think when party blog administrators post a story that cannot be verified they open the party up for ridicule.
In Midwest sweep, 66 illegal immigrants arrested in Minnesota
MINNEAPOLIS (AP) - Immigration authorities arrested 66 people in Minnesota as part of a Midwest sweep of illegal immigrant fugitives, the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement agency said Friday.
The 10-day operation earlier this month led to the arrests of 106 illegal immigrant fugitives and 19 others who were violating their immigration status, the agency said. The fugitives are foreign nationals who had been ordered to leave the country by a judge.
The fugitives were from 28 countries, according to the ICE.
The raids are taking place and have been for many years. Those arrested and deported in MN in this article all have criminal records unrelated to immigration violations.
They are not the norm.
Monday should be grand
To report suspicious activity, call the toll-free tip line at 1-866-DHS-2ICE.
Most of the twenty million people that are here now, cleaning our hotel bathrooms, cleaning our office buildings, fixing our cars, doing our landscaping, building our homes and the places where we work
will become citizens of this country within a decade.
That's where we all started - the country's being born again - just as it has been each generation for the last two centuries.
If anyone feels that they're not getting enough for their dollar now-a-days
or if anyone has a problem with how labor in general is treated in this country
take it up with your employer or the editors at the Wall Street Journal or the people we elect to craft trade policy, tax policy, and monetary policy.
It used to be the conventional wisdom that "One man's employee was another man's customer and that everyone needed to be paid enough so that there were people around to buy your product."
That's not the case any more - the new conventional wisdom is that "Employees are just like any other commodity and it is both fair and makes good business sense to let the laws of supply and demand work unhindered."
Figure out how that changed - undo it - and you might make some real change.
Or blame a "Spick" and feel good for about five minutes.
Saturday, April 8, 2006
To: All the Democrats who are running for election, and re-election this year.
From: A friend, who wants NOTHING more than to see the Democratic Party win back both houses of Congress. I do not feel there is ANYTHING more important to this Nation’s future. I hope you can see I am on your side, and PLEASE I beg you, heed my warnings.
Dear Gentlemen&women,
To all you Democrats who can not seem to get threw your thick heads how to win an election. You are going to burn our Party right to the ground, in other words BLOW our chances to win back either house of Congress, if you do not start listening to people like me! There is NO WAY you can do it by just voting against everything the Republicans vote for. I am an American Citizen, 43 years old, who had been a Republican all his life until George Bush came along. Because of george bush and company, I am fully willing to NEVER, EVER vote Republican again, for the rest of my life. If only, only if, ALL of you can pull back from your currant leadership, Governor Dean excluded, and Start Standing Up for what is good for America. The American people know george bush is no longer good for the country, in fact they now know he never was good for the country. He has been good at lying, cheerleading, and going to bat for big corporate interests.
As most Republican strategists will tell people, Democrats are going to try and make the mid-term election about how george bush has screwed up the country. The American people are with you there. I am not talking liberal Democrats are with you, the whole of the American people are with you. However, just constantly voting against the Republicans, regardless of the issues, is just not going to work. If you are perceived as voting against something that is good for Americans, and I mean the true American middle class, which is dwindling down at an alarming rate, you will lose the up coming elections. Or I should say, not win back control over Congress. Then we ALL, the Nation, will lose, Big Time!!!
As I see it, our leadership is letting us down. The Republicans want nothing more than to keep Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, and Hillary Clinton out there as the face of the Democrats. Reid does all he can to hold up all legislation,,, just because he can. Pelosi seems to just want to criticize the bush regime, and Hillary is always going off and saying something completely stupid. You need a new crop of fresh idealists, who will stand up for what they believe in, and not constantly flip floping on the issues, like McCain does. New Democrats can have and hold a lot of conservative values. We, you, can win a hell of a lot of Republican votes. All you have to do is point out how the Republicans in power have betrayed most of the values Americans hold dear. That is less Government, The lower the taxes the better, but you can not lower taxes during a war, and throw the whole country into huge debt, as they have done. I mean, don’t you guys want to win this year??????
One huge way of getting a lot of votes is to be centered in the immigration debate. All you have to do is point out how Bush and The Republican controlled Congress has screwed up in enforcing the laws we have on the books NOW. What would make anyone think they would enforce NEW border laws? Beyond any doubt I think most Americans want the laws we have now enforced, and the border controlled. No more illegal Mexican wave, no true American wants their country over run by a bunch of people who will bring down wages. I mean the Republicans have been hijacked by corporate America, it shows in everything they do. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out if the Republicans would have lived up to their word back in the 80's, or anytime since, we would not have the problem with illegal immigration we have now. All the Republican idea’s I use to support are totally gone from the currant regime, and their Congress.
The easy thing I am telling you, in case you are the farthest thing from a rocket scientist, you can win this year if, and only IF, you get on the right side of this immigration debate. Most of you, let me take that back, the leading Democrats, Reid, Pelosi, Kennedy, and Clinton are on the wrong dam side of this debate and screwing everything up. I can NOT over emphasize this enough to Reid, and the leadership. All of you should do what is GOOD for America, not just try and make the Republicans look bad. This issue is way to important. And if you all do not get on the right side, the American side, you will either lose this years chance of taking back the house, or win it by the smallest of margins.
Me personally, I will vote Democrat no matter what for only the second time in my life. I am now a registered Democrat. I will do it because I do not feel there is ANYTHING more important than getting george bush’s VERY DANGEROUS regime out of office as soon as possible. I just see the Democrats big chance to win BIG, being shot to hell by the leadership of OUR OWN PARTY. Why, because of the immigration issues. All you have to do is support securing the border now, enforcing the currant laws on the books, and we can take up the rest of the issues later. Because as I have said, NOTHING is as important as getting the extremely dangerous man, (bush) and his regime out of office ASAP, as soon as possible. I have felt this way for over three years now, but I have not felt as scared as I do, until recently. Everyday that goes by brings us closer to some kind of world shaking calamity that will be brought on by the bush regime, and his over ridding view that the world belongs to him and he has the right to do with it, what he likes.
Don’t you all see the danger in what you all are doing? You are playing politics with the life of every single person on earth. dick cheney and his oil barons have re-written this countries policies on global warming, energy needs, and now nuclear warfare. Can you see how the world will look at us if we even contemplate using nuclear weapons AGAIN, and to use it as a preemptive strike against a country where AGAIN we are not positive of the intel? I hardly think I am alone in my great fear of this president and what he might do. I base everything on the things I know for a fact he has already done. My opinions are not based on what he may have done. God, I hope and pray there are other ex-Republicans out there who feel the same way I do. I know the Democrats should be scared to death, and should be acting accordingly.
I ask all who read this to look at the past, and what you know in your heart bush did to get us in a war in Iraq. To torture people, to over ride the constitution by not getting court orders to listen to people. It is not so much if he has, or what his intent was, the attorney general and him are saying they do not want the court to be involved, they have discounted Congress all together. Maybe I am off beat in my thinking of the immigration question, I know for a fact if the Democrats would at least stand up for the rule of law, and the currant laws, we could win big big time. Being on what is perceived as the wrong side by a lot of Republican voters and Democrats, is taking way way to big of a chance to lose this year. To all who read this, please join with me in telling your Congressmen&women to back off on the immigration issues, to vote for much tighter border security, and to enforce the laws we have now. We can go back later and debate the issues, and take up the immigration question. Now all I see Democrats doing is pandering, or at least looking like you are pandering. As always, let me know what you, as Americans think.....
Sincerely,
Mr. Darryl McKiney
Mesa, Arizona
What Democrats should do because it is the right thing, and not vote hunting!!!
Tuesday, March 28, 2006
To: All Democrats and Republicans who wish to survive re-election
Dear Folks,
I find this debate about ILLEGAL immigration nuts. I can hardly believe there are so many Republicans who do not want to enforce the laws already on the books. I would fully support any candidate who wishes to follow some of the following guidelines. I absolutely feel things MUST be done in this order;
1. Stop or Cut to a trickle ILLEGAL immigration by securing our borders, but more importantly, our southern border. Militarizing it if need be!!! Have Americans gotten so stupid we can not figure out how to secure a border? Do we need to out source this too? How about a fence, not a wall?
2. Enforce the immigration laws we already have on the books. Raise the fines and jail times for employers who hire illegal workers over American workers. Pay American workers more money. Make being an Illegal worker, and employer, so un-attractable and costly, no one should be willing to take the chance.
3. All illegal immigrants MUST register in one year or less, or run the risk of them and their families being deported. Give them paperwork, a picture ID, saying they are a LEGAL worker if they are here and are working.
4. Reform a way to citizenship by setting down in law several enforceable policies. They should be as follows, and in this order;
A. Pay any and all back taxes by showing an employment history.
B. Pay a fine of TEN Thousand Dollars even if needing to pay it in steps. Half of all that money will go to education and medical expense repayment to the American tax payer. The other half will go to building a wall along our southern border. Or, a quarter to enforcement, and the other quarter to a wall. Last, START building this wall now, even if only 20 miles a year is completed. The point is, get the fence started NOW, and then fund the money for it.
C. Apply for permanent citizenship if that is the intent. Learn English as a primary language, and take classes learning the history of the United States and civics lessons on the responsibility of citizenship.
D. Fully comply with all Local, State, and federal laws already on the books. Such as a drivers license, and other requirements of State laws. Give something back to the local community they live in. Such as cleaning the roadways, or painting over graffiti. Stay arrest free for the duration of this program.
E. Fully complete all these requirements within eight years of applying for this program. If not, move on your own back to Mexico or be deported. If any two parents had children under this program and have not completed the program the children if under eighteen will also be deported unless given up for adoption or turned over to a family member who will take full responsibility for the children.
5. This last step is a MUST, and I know for a fact, it WILL WORK! Empower all local, State and Federal law enforcement officers to make arrests for either not complying with this program or being illegal to start with. Because to use the White House language, the nay sayers, and cut and runners, who just want to give up and say you can not deport 11 million people by saying how do you do it, you do it, ONE PERSON AT A TIME!!!
6. Stop all the rhetoric about this issue because it is the American voter will hold those accountable for Congress pandering for different reasons. Stop saying we can not deport all of them implying you are giving up. What kind of message is that sending. We need strong leaders, NOW, on this very issue. I strongly feel who ever comes out with a proposal like this one, (fair but strong) will win the Presidency in 2008.
It is that, Simple!!!
No rocket scientist needed here
Now I realize this may not be perfect or fair to the illegal immigrants. But remember, they are called ILLEGAL for a reason. Yes, this program would be tough. However, it is the DUTY of your elected representatives to be loyal, and fair to the American citizens who sent them to office. Not to be loyal and fair to the lobbyists and special interest groups who flood their offices. If the illegal immigrants from Mexico want the same opportunities in Mexico that they may have in this country, then they need to go home and build up their own country, like the previous immigrants have to this Nation. Maybe instead of protesting for rights in a country they have no right to be in, they should go home and protest in their own country. Take the American flag to Mexico city and wave it around like they have waved the Mexican flag in OUR nation. The loyalties between two nations can not be tolerated. It is loyalty to one or the other.
Sincerely,
Mr. Darryl McKiney
Mesa, Arizona
Please, send this to your States Congressmen or woman, they have harder website’s to access.
PS: Please send this to all your Congress people, friends, and family. I still think bush MUST go, he is the embodiment of corporate greed in America on every issue. bush is not for economic exploitation, he is for economic execution. As I have reported many MANY times, and the record can be checked, bush has never met an execution he did not like. The Democrats can most assuredly win Big Time later this year. However, you are going to have to be tougher than the Republicans. Especially, on this very issue. Do not water down what I wrote, or vote in a frightened (flip flop) manner, like the war monger, two faced liar McCain. McCain more than anyone knows, or dam well should know, how many lives illegal Mexicans have destroyed. God knows I know, I am a retired police officer from Phoenix, Arizona. Same thing goes for Kyl, but he is an absolute bush man, NEVER voting against bush. And a huge misconception I have heard just about every person say, and no one refute is, all of them are hard working people. In fact most are not, just go to any street corner in Mesa, Arizona, you will see 20-30 run up to the illegal employers cars and trucks, but they can hardly hire them all. Believe me or not, most Democrats feel the exact same way I do, if you do not believe it, read the Democrats own website Blog. And to all, have a good night!
You can spin it any way you like, but my family are generational Democrats who WILL NOT VOTE DEMOCRATIC THIS FALL IF DEMOCRATS SUPPORT THE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS!
Don't say "We all began this way!" BULL!
My grandparents came here hat in hand BEGGING to be let in. My Great grandfathers sister was ill AND SHE WAS TURNED AWAY so his Mother went back to Italy with her. They never saw each other again!
I am a Social worker who can tell you 1st hand that when you make these ILLEGALS Legal they will ALL be in applying for Medicaid ETC!!!!
How do you plan on paying for that MASTERMINDS?!?!?
My co-worker, whose children are half Mexican, says she and her children don't want these people here!
This issue WILL LOSE YOU VOTES.
The legislators are SUPPOSED to represent what the people who live in their districts want.
THE AVERAGE MIDDLE CLASS WORKING AMERICAN CITZEN DOES NOT WANT THIS!
It is all about Humanity. We all should never, ever forget that.
Thank you Josh for getting to the bottom line of what this immigration argument is all about: Humanity and humans treating other humans with humanity.
A few comments:
We don’t need to add any more information to our egos to know this is about Humanity. We should all try subtracting information from our egos instead. We may end up less confused.
Real heart felt Humanity (Light) is to a Republican strategist what Light is to a Vampire (Darkness)
Democrats should never, ever allow themselves to court voters by embracing Republican ideals based on division and hatred. If we are going to win, we must continue to cling to the very core values that made the Democratic Party such a wonderful organization: that is the real Humanism that is the bedrock of the Democratic Party as well our environmentalism and love of Gaia.
I don't feel that being law abiding in the USA is based on Hatred, maybe with you but not me.
I am not against immigrants, just illegal immigrants.
And frankly I am tired of being lumped with Republicans, hate mongers, and any other dispictable group you want to use to try and make your version of humanity the only way.
I would think that 11, 000, 000 (and I know they are not all latino) a large part of by all admissions are from Mexico, that they would value their own country enough to picket and change their own govenment first,
I consider them disrespectful to their fellow country man by not staying there and trying to make it a better Mexico rather than running to the easy better paying life in America.
I dont think that running is any thing to be proud of, no matter which way you cut it or no matter what negative verbage you want to label it.
What about the millions left behind, those that have run here should be proud they can send a little money back to them, I dont think so.
I think they need to fix their own government!
I am a 56 year old bluecolor democrat. I have never voted for a republican and I never will. But, many of you have misconceptions about what is happening in our country.
My last job as a ironworker was in Ohio. A small job with two dozen workers. There were 11 white workers, 1 African American, 6 Mexican Americans and 6 illegal Mexicans. Every few weeks one or two of the American workers were layed off and replaced by an illegal. I worked nine months until my turn came. I lasted nine months because I was willing to get along with the illegals and train them to do the work. When I was given my pink slip, that left 1 American, 6 Mexican American(no disrespect intended) and 17 illegals.
The contractor provided the illegals with fake documentation and deducted the cost($400) from their pay. It was said in the post that these workers are alienated from Mexico and wanted to become U.S. citizens. Perhaps this is true of many of the illegals but, I assure you this was not the case with these boys. They lived 4 to a one bedroom apartment and sent several hundred dollars to their bank accounts in Mexico. One of the boys, Leonardo, who was my helper and friend assured me that he wanted nothing to do with America except the money and the girls. He was going to send as much money home as he could for as long as he could and then go back to Vera Cruse and live like a rich man.
Many contractors are replacing their American workers with illegals because the Americans will not climb 200 feet up out on the open steel risking their lives every day 60 to 84 hours a week for 7 dollars an hour with no benefits. Most of the American workers are or were democrats and many of them blame the democrats for what is happening to them.
This job was in 2002 and I haven't worked a day of construction since. I could name the contractor but what is the use. The politicians know what is going on.
report the employers to :
866-347-2423,
they should pay a penalty for selling the american worker away,
and exploiting the illegals,
Trying to link opposition to illegal immigration with hatred towards Mexicans, Salvadorans, Chinese, Russians, Guatamalans etc. appears intellectually dishonest.
The idea that we must allow our fellow citizens and ourselves to be harmed for the benefit of others seems disingenuous.
I would like to someone who has given up their job to an illegal to respond. Someone who quit and did without so an illegal could take their job. Someone who quit their job and gave it up to an illegal and asked their family to do without because they gave their job to an illegal.
An immigration program for illegal immigrants based on a 'merit' system (very similar to the way points are accumulated with a drivers license in some States) should determine an illegal's elligibility to stay...this way, it wouldn't be a 'blanket amnesty program' and on the otherhand, it would give the government the instruments to 'weed out' undedsireables and the criminal element from those who are in our country with a work permit or illegal from entry.
Read 'the Lonely Professor'
http://thelonelyprofessor5.blogspot.com/
tLP
Weed out the criminal element among illegals?
Ok, after you show me how you take the wetness out of water.
How many laws does an illegal alien have to “break” and continue to “break” by entering the United States illegally, obtaining a job, getting a driver’s license, etc.? Do illegal aliens evade paying taxes? Do they help employers evade taxes? Do they help employers evade compliance with all sorts of “work” rules? Do they use phony social Security numbers? Are they not part of a widespread criminal conspiracy to thwart the enforcement of our immigration law?
Do they help lower wages for American workers by increasing the supply of workers available to employers? Are they usually willing to work for lower wages than an American worker?
Ask yourself if you would appreciate unlimited competition for your job?
How can we have faith in a government that can’t even enforce existing law? How can we believe that any kind of complicated guest worker, complicated amnesty, or other complicated immigration plan administered by our government can work?
Funny we don't hear all this rigtheous indignation about the millions of jobs lost to outsourcing and about the entire industries and millions of jobs lost to competitors abroad.
The "imigration problem" will never be fixed until the other two are.
Insist on trying to treat the symptoms if you wish, but we'll all die of the illness in the end unless the cause is addressed.
Anyone know what the immigration quotas are? Who set them? What is the rational for setting them at that level? Are they being met? How much time does it take to process an application?
I live in Texas and I love Mexican food. One of the hardest things I had to do the other day was call the manager of Los Lupe’s Café and tell me I would no longer come to his café or recommend it to others. I’ve been dining and bringing friends there for many years.
If the Chicano community wants to boycott my business well that’s their choice. I’ll do the same. From this day on I will not visit Mexico, buy anything Mexican made, do all I can to see our borders sealed from illegal immigration, and turn in every landscaping, roofing, construction, and other company I see that hires illegal immigrants. If illegals want rights then go home and fight your government like we did. If a small band of Texians could defeat Santa Anna, Mexico’s president and his vastly superior army, then you can defeat Vicente Fox and his army. I believe you’ll find his army is mostly on your side.
I am ashamed of Democrats who pander for votes and fail to use their great intelligence to see the big picture. Next thing you know they will be inviting every poor person in the world to come here to live an American dream that is DEAD!
A message to our party leaders. In the end you will lose out to the “workers unite” party (Socialist of Communist) or see a civil war once again fought upon our land. As a Texian like four generations before me, which included Scottish, Lipan Apache and Eastern Band Cherokee, I would rather die than live under the rule of the Mexican government.
To my fellow Democrats. You have not right to call me a racist or a bigot for standing up in support of our immigration laws. I respect every person here legally regardless of ethnicity.
I agree, that out sourcing is a major problem, also, and in the proper conversation you will see my christian indignation about it, again, dont try and turn the subject of illegal immigration to something else,
It is what it is, ILLEGAL.
Out sourcing is another problem, 2 wrongs dont make illegals alright. IMO
I have saved all my shopping for May 1st. All my girlfriends and I are going on a shopping spree. We are only going to stores that do not have illegal employees.We're never buying anything again that says"Made in Mexico".
The Democrat Party does not care about American workers anymore. They're only worried about the people of Mexico.
If a third party candidate would get tough on illegal immigrants,I would vote for them.
If I hear Bush or Kennedy say one more time that illegals only take jobs American workers won't do ,I am going to throw up.
If your concern is jobs - sorry, rounding up and deporting 20 million people isn't going fix it
if your concern is jobs - we're losing them faster to outsourcing and foreign competition than we are to any immigrants "taking them"
if you don't think all these things are related, the credibility of any argument you make is greatly diminished.
this is going to take a long time to really fix - we can go about it with some measure of respect and compassion and - or be jerks about it
but if the focus remains soley on immigration any effort will.
You can build a 20 foot wall around the entire country and require three forms of ID before anyone is let in
and we'll just as many jobs as we are today
so say what you like - but it doesn't sound to me like it has anything to do about jobs
Although illegals do contribute to the tax system, they are a net drain financially, even considering the taxes they contribute. There are simply too many of them. Further, they take jobs that should go to our own middle class and poorer citizens, and would if they were not here. Their presence depresses wages for all lower strata jobs and causes small businesses to lose business to those who hire the illegals and therefore can undercut their job bids. Many small construction and similar businesses are struggling because to compete successfully they would have to dump their current employees and hire illegals like their competition already has. Illegals are a huge drain on public health and education, consuming resources that should go to help legal citizens. Because I'm basically a liberal, I am against illegal immigration because the persons it hurts the most are the poorer classes, both illegals and our own needy citizens.
It would be great if America and society could still afford unlimited immigration, but those days are gone. Our natural resources are strained with the number of people we have NOW - adding a million illegals per year will simply bring us to emergency that much sooner. What good will it have done us to let everyone in who wants to come, when by doing so we are insuring that our infrastructure, public services and water, electricity, etc., won't be able to handle it, leaving us all in want? Will people finally learn once the US turns into an overpopulated sinkhole where no one but the wealthy can survive? It is already predicted that rolling blackouts and brownouts are expected to be a regular occurrence starting in a few years, because of demand on the energy infrastructure and lack of natural resources - how much worse will it be when we are adding a million users per year that are illegals, in addition to the normal modes of population increase? We are already fighting over water supplies in the west and southwest. The old world is gone, and we have to make hard choices.
Cesar Chavez was against illegal immigration. He even led marches to the Mexican border to protest illegals. He knew it would hurt those he was working hardest for; the poor legal immigrants who could not compete with illegals who will be willing to work for even less wages. He worked hard to get legal immigrants better rights in the fields. But we are no longer living in the 1800's where we welcomed and needed all we could get to come here.
We are digging our own graves with our misguided generosity. We are paying for a badly run war that is going beyond all normal reason and was started on false premises. We are paying for a poorly run Medicare system. We are paying for corporate welfare. We cannot afford to welcome everyone who wants to come here. Sure, I wish it were different - but times have changed.
No one is arguing for unlimited immigration - only about how to go about fixing the problem that exists
like most things - the root causes are ecconmic
documented, permanent workers can organize and bargain collectively with their empolyers ultimately waging raises
trade policy which encourages the growth of organized labor in trading partners will ultimately raise wages there.
tax policy which doesn't reward work done offshore will keep more work here.
reform of the health care delivery system that reduces the $1,200 of health care costs in every U.S. made automobile to $200 will make U.S. buisness more competitive.
as long as labor continues to be treated as any other comodity to be bought and sold at the lowest possible price and there is no counter weight to global capital and multi-national corporations,
we'll lose good jobs either because "imigrants take them", companies outsource them, foreign competition drives down prices and puts U.S. industries out of business, or business picks and move to follow cheap labor.
Or we can deport people, stick our heads in the sand and make believe that all is well.
dorsano
this is going to take a long time to really fix - we can go about it with some measure of respect and compassion and - or be jerks about it
Maybe its the illegals who are being jerks along with their supporters who expect everyone else to foot the bill.
If you look, and you don't even have to look closely, this movement is demanding free education, free college, and free medical care.
Hey bud, I could use the same thing and I'll be damned if I feel like footing the bill for them and leaving my kids to suffer in their place.
Blanket immigration will not fix the problems you mentioned, outsourcing, taxes, health care,
it certainly won't help raise minimum wages.
If you think so you are naive!
documented, permanent workers can organize and bargain collectively with their empolyers ultimately waging raises
organized collectives certainly haven't helped the current employees of america do to unscruplous union leadership, but if the illegals come here they can organize and everything will be just jim dandy, perfect, it will solve all of americas problems!
For heaven sakes and good gravy! Pooey!
Dorsano,
Thank you so much for your efforts on this thread. You are a voice of reason in the wilderness of ignorance and arrogance. Bless you, my friend.
Thank you Julio as well.
Jefro: that is only from your side of the glasses.
Walk a mile in my shoes!
It looks a little hypocritical of you to be so judging.
You are doing exactly what you dont think I have a right to do, and that is see it my way from where I am, in my life and have the guts to say so.
More power to you!
This about the jobs that can't BE OUTSOURCED! So the solution is to bring create a permanant UNDER CLASS>
LISTEN , DORSANO, Amreican Citizens have their own problems to deal with! Let MEXICO TAKE CARE OF MEXICANS.
Remember the cry "Gingo , go home!"?
Mexican 's GO HOME!!!
You STILL haven't mentioned how the Social Services are supposed to absorb all your brethren! And IF legalized, won't they be bring Mama, Papa, Grandma AND ALL THE KIDS WHITH THEM????
How do we pay for it ?
Posted by Tom_Terrific on April 29, 2006 at 05:56 PM
Tom - it's hard for me to take what you wrote seriously - nothing's free - no one that's stupid
if "they" (which is also misleading because it's not a monolithic movement) are asking for publically funded health care and college tuition then those same services would be available to you too
so maybe you should join in their chorus if you want "free" health care and college tuition :)
By the way - are you familiar with the state of Georgia's publicly funded college tuition program? Every legal resident of Georgia that maintains a B+ average in highschool and through college gets a "free" college education at any public college or university and a cost offset at many private ones.
Those socialists in Georgia are just ruining America I tell ya.
Posted by dk2 on April 29, 2006 at 06:02 PM organized collectives certainly haven't helped the current employees of america do to unscruplous union leadership
Well - you showed you Rush Limbaugh stripes with the "unscruplous union leadership" part.
If want to talk seriously sometime about the history of the labor movement in this country and things like "the weekend", the 40 hour work week, employer sponsored health care and pensions, social security and growth of real wages from the late 1930's through the early 60's
I'd love to chat.
Organized labor represents only 13% of the current workforce - their influence on our standard of living would be greater if that percentage was higher.
Posted by dk2 on April 29, 2006 at 06:02 PM blanket immigration
Like I said before, dk2 - no one is arguing for blanket immigration
are reading anything I write or are you just venting?
Posted by jefro on April 29, 2006 at 06:25 PM
Thanks, Jeff - the quality of the discussion seems to be degrading
the motivations do not seem to be about jobs - just deporting people
the only consistent argument so far seems to lie in enforcing the law.
unfortunately that won't solve the immigration problem even if someone can come up with a way to round them all up and deport them.
and it won't do diddly for job loss
I have been a union member, Have YOU?
A closed union shop, if you know what that means.
All they did for us was side with the company and go to Las Vegas for their big meetings while always voting to raise our union dues, they didn't save any jobs when our employer filed for bankrupcy, giving us checks the bank wouldnt honor, (they had frozen all funds because they were aware of the suit to come) Some of the people I worked with not only had that check (monthy) also had a second check that wasnt worth the paper it was written on - equalling 2 months income.
I am a democrat, I am not for Limbaugh, but I have lived places you have not!
I HAVE BEEN THERE DONE THAT - HAVE YOU?
The unions will only work if the union leaders care about their membership,
in case you havent noticed its kind of like the govt of this country! But then again maybe you never thought of that!
You can call me whatever you wish, and lump me where ever you wish.
It doesnt change the way life really is.
There was a saying during the 60-70
Living through rose colored glasses must be nice!
Ive never had the luxury!
Don't worry Indy, d2k, Tom - you'll find Democratic candidates willing to pander to you for your votes - Nelson in Nebraska for one.
go figure - the same state that produced Republican Chuck Hegel - who has the courage not to pander you and to try and devise a something that might acutally work.
So there you go - no need to lobby me.
You never DID answer My questions DORSANO!
But how about we put it to a popular vote? Put it on a ballet and let registered American Voters decide the fate of the ILLEGAL immigrants?
Wouldn't that be the American way, the WILL of the MAJORITY of the people?
Posted by dk2 on April 29, 2006 at 06:52 PM The unions will only work if the union leaders care about their membership
I have worked in union shops - if we didn't like the leadership we got rid of them - they are elected.
Perhaps you should have gotten more involved?
"the corrupt union leaders" is an old song played by those who have systematically attacked every percieved Democratic party constiuentcy from public school teachers - to trial lawyers - to civil servants (when's the last time you heard that term?)
i don't like the song no matter who sings it
did I answer your question d2k? I gotta run and finish painting my boy's room.
Dorsano, it is nice that what I say is venting, but you are a saint in your thinking and writing,
Someone said on one of the other threads something like, about trolls, if they cant win by truth, they result in trying to label you.
I guess that says where I lump your logic.
"I have worked in union shops - if we didn't like the leadership we got rid of them - they are elected."
Thats a brilliant statement given that we vote for the government also, but look at it, I guess I could take that logic one step further then, I guess you think Bush is great because after all everyone voted him in.
Hey, buddy, I AM a "civil servant." An underpaid caseworker who has always been a social Democrat!
Remember what FDR did during the Depression?
He CLOSED THE BORDERS AND PUT A HALT TO IMMIGRATION!
Best President , Democrat or Republican we ever had , and he agreed with me!
CLOSE THE BORDERS!
Posted by dk2 on April 29, 2006 at 06:59 PM I guess that says where I lump your logic.
I mentioned at least once - if not twice (read back) - prior to your post - that no one is arguing for unlimited immigration
You stated that I am/was
What should I think about your comments under those circumstances?
I stand by my posts - but I gotta run - cya
Hey Dors, You are absolutely right, this has NOTHING to do with jobs Mexicans are doing. And as far as their coming over DEMANDING free medical and education, that is nothing but a crock of crap too. These people are not risking their lives coming across the border, in order to get taken care of. All they want is a right to work. If they end up in and ER, it is not because they did not sit home and hope it would go away. How many of them do you think suffer with ailments like strep throats, etc, rather than go and seek ER care. And if their US born children go to our schools, well that is their right, regardless of whether US schools want them or not.
Here is Howard Dean's statement just today on the issue:
Dean: Comprehensive and Compassionate Immigration Reform NeededMarch 29, 2006
Next week, Republican Senate Leader Bill Frist is likely to introduce a harmful immigration bill on to the Senate floor that will criminalize good Samaritans, including church members and clergy, and does not provide a larger, comprehensive framework for reform or a path to citizenship. Democratic National Committee Chairman Howard Dean issued the following statement on President Bush and the Republican Congress's failure to lead on the issue of immigration:
"President Bush and his Republican Congress's failure to offer comprehensive solutions on immigration reform and their attempt to use the issue to divide Americans is contrary to our values as a people and does a disservice to all who live and work in this great nation. The hostile anti-immigrant bill passed by the Republican House and now being considered by the Republican Senate is not the answer. America needs comprehensive immigration reform that protects our borders, keeps our communities safe, and brings America together.
"Criminalizing families and the work of clergy is not the way forward. A comprehensive and compassionate approach must protect all U.S. workers and their wages, prevent exploitation of immigrant workers, and offer immigrants who have earned it the opportunities and responsibilities of U.S. citizenship. The American people want change, not more of the same scape-goating and ineffective, piecemeal immigration reform Republicans are proposing."
http://www.democrats.org/a/2006/03/dean_comprehens.php
I would really like to hear ONE person railing against illegal aliens tell me how they, themselves were affected by any of them. Did you lose your job and a Mexican was hired in your place? Did you taxes go way up, because your town if educating or proving health care to aliens? Or have you just been fed Slanted, biased stories like Republicans are spreading?
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 07:03 PM Hey, buddy, I AM a "civil servant."
Thank you for your service :)
You're right, under FDR immigration law changed and the first quotas were established.
Again - I will say it - no one is suggesting changing that
You can't practically "close the borders" without making systemic changes in the economy - sorry -
and if you could - it wouldn't do diddly for job loss
so at least be honest and say that you just want to enforce the law
Posted by PamB on April 29, 2006 at 07:05 PM
PamB, I never said I was affected by those items, (however it is possible)
What I am saying that it is Illegal - Period!
Do you knowingly break the law?
Are you sugesting that we should all break the law, because I have been paying taxes longer than most likely any of the Illegals have (37 years)
Do you really think we are all uniformed about immigration, do you want to lump people who dont agree with you always in an negative catogory?
I dont do that to the people who blog here.
Have you not read?
I AM A SOCIAL WORKER!
I approve MEdicaid and Food STamp Cases.
I haven't had a pay raise in 5 FRICKIN' YEARS!
The Feds have cut $$$ going to support social service programs to support the leisure class tax cuts!!!
The States are cutting and ELIMINATING BENEFITS FOR THEIR OWN LEGAL CITIZENS!!!
I approve , daily, Medicaid for Pregnant Women cases for ILLEGAL ALIENS!
IF said poeple become legal I may go 5 MORE YEARS WITH OUT A PAYRAISE TO PROVIDE THEM WITH BENEFITS!
Clear enough for you?
Will somebody just say who will pick up the tab for adding illegals to the Social Service programs?
Where will the $$$ come from?
PamB
As for Gov. Dean, I guess more of us need to call and write and email him about how we feel about immigration, and that, if he's not careful this issue will not only loose the election 2008 but it will devide the Democratic party,
And that goes for Senator Clinton, and Kennedy also.
Do you really think we are all uniformed about immigration, do you want to lump people who dont agree with you always in an negative catogory? I dont do that to the people who blog here.
Posted by dk2 on April 29, 2006 at 07:15 PM
Yeah, you are right. It is illegal! Period. But what people are screaming about, "round them up and ship them back" is totally unreasonable. Does anyone think they are going to come up and say, Oh Yes, I am an illegal immigrant. The Time and Money that would be spent, and Still not round up 1/4 of them would be catastrophic.
Read Howard's statement above. "need borders protected". "our communities must be kept safe". "a compassionate approach to prevent exploitation of immigrant workers". "offer those who have earned it opportunity to obtain US citizenship".
Did you watch that show on CNN a month or so ago, where they showed the old lady and man, at 2:00AM climbing into dumpsters to get bottles and cans and whatever else they could find, and they put their 3 children through school and college by working this grueling work. MANY Mexicans do not want anything for free. All they want is a CHANCE. And a humane view of them would go a long way.
Jefro
You are a voice of reason in the wilderness of ignorance and arrogance.
You are so wrong. Those of us in the southwest understand the cost. Soon Yankees will start to understand also.
Dorsano
if "they" (which is also misleading because it's not a monolithic movement) are asking for publically funded health care and college tuition then those same services would be available to you too
Try visiting a county hospital in the southwest. Listen to what Navito Lopez and the othe Mexican, not democrat politican are saying and demanding. Obiviously its not you and jefro that speak for the amnesty movement. And middle-class workers can’t afford to use county hospitals. Their assets will be seized to cover the cost. Illegals simply walk away and let others foot the bill.
Unions don’t do jack for their members other than use them for personal gain. Buts that’s ok it won’t change anything. This insane movement is dead in its tracks. I think those of us who oppse this insanity should contact our congressional leaders and demand a stop to the “catch and release” and seek a change to federal law that will allow states more power to solve their own problems.
BTW- In Texas, especially along the border we have many Sheriff’s of Mexican decent. Not one, I repeat that , not one supports the insanity of amnesty. All support shutting down our borders so we can control who enters this country. We are nearing a point of armed struggle. That will force US troops to the border and it will close.
I approve MEdicaid and Food STamp Cases.
I haven't had a pay raise in 5 FRICKIN' YEARS!
The Feds have cut $$$ going to support social service programs to support the leisure class tax cuts!!!The States are cutting and ELIMINATING BENEFITS FOR THEIR OWN LEGAL CITIZENS!!!
And you ONLY give out Medicaid and food stamps for Illegal Immigrants, right? NO US citizens have come in for any..
And you are blaming your no-raise on the fact that people are getting medical care for their children (where it has been proven if you prevent disease or bad pregnancies you save money in the long run), and the fact that people with children get food stamps so the kid can have a meal!
Yes, you should blame the fact that Services (and your stagnant salary) are the fault the last 6 years, of George Bush giving Tax advantages to the wealthy and to Corporations. How'd you like Enron's earnings first quarter of this year. What kind of increase could you have gotten from that favoritism given to their profits. And Republicans slamming down Taxing Windfall profits this last week!
I think you are taking your frustrations out on the wrong people. Also, if you did not have people coming in for Food stamps and medical care, you wouldn't have a job.
Put your anger where it really belongs. The Feds and the State which are taking from the poor to give to the Rich!
If we as a nation invest in alternative energy and plug-in hybrid cars we can keep our energy money here at home. If we stop attacking/invading other countries and use that money to create transportation infrastructure it will provide jobs with living wages and there will be plenty of work for Americans and the illegal immigrants, who can become legal. Then we must assist Mexico out of being a third world nation. It is completely possible and everybody, including the corporations, will win.
Pam,
It is not the job or responsiblity of American Citizens to take on the problems of the people of Mexico.
We have our own poor and disenfragized to take care of who ARE our resopnsiblity!
Charity begins at home.
PamB
The point is THEY ARE not OUR CITIZENS!!!!
Native Americans SHOULD receive Social Services, They are ENTITLED TO!!!
I feel bad for the illegals and their plight but my OWN NEIGHBORS AND FELLOW CITIZENS GET FIRST DIBS!
All support shutting down our borders so we can control who enters this country
And there is absolutely NO ONE I have seen, who argues against that either!
This has GOT to stop. Not only to stop this flood from going any further, but to prevent those who want to harm us from sneaking across.
This issue is not about demanding a stop to this. This issue is about the criminalization of those already here, and what to do about them. And if you are realistic, you understand that 12,000,000 to 20,000,000 who do not want to be found is almost impossible. They are now scattered from one coast to the other. Ask Georgia what they are facing. I think I saw the other day where 90 per day enter the State. So do not think this is a CA, Texas, AZ problem. We must stop the flow, first thing.
jefro on April 29, 2006 at 06:25 PM
dors and all, forgive me, that was me, jen, i didn't realize jefro was signed in on that computer when i posted.
NOW I get it...duh...smacking myself on the forehead...Jefro is your hubby;-)
And MY JOB is to provide those services to AMERICAN CITIZENS!
And my clients love me because I take GOOD CARE OF THEM!
MY COUNTRYMEN COME FIRST and THEY ARE the ones I'm there to serve you little snipp!
That is my job and I do It because I love MY COUNTRY MEN!
I was wondering the other night how both Jen and Jefro were posting. Do you just pass the keyboard back and forth? lol
yeah deb, he is. really incognito with that sly nickname there, huh? ;) lol
i have the laptop and he uses the desktop, deb, lol! crazy, ain't it?
Patriotism is when love of your own people comes first; nationalism, when hate for people other than your own comes first. ~Charles de Gaulle
Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. ~Albert Einstein
Our true nationality is mankind. ~H. G. Wells
There is a higher form of patriotism than nationalism, and that higher form is not limited by the boundaries of one's country; but by a duty to mankind to safeguard the trust of civilization. ~Oscar S. Strauss
Born in iniquity and conceived in sin, the spirit of nationalism has never ceased to bend human institutions to the service of dissension and distress. ~Thorstein Veblen
Jen, I think it's awesome. i wonder if I could get my Jeff interested in the blog? He's working right now, but when he's in he's either reading or watching C-Span and Public TV. He absorbs so much info and puts things in perspective so well. And a great sense of humor to boot. He's gone for a while, but I'll encourage it when he is home...we only have one pc so we really will have to pass the keyboard;)
I think that would be great Deb! I'd love to meet him on the blog! My Jeff said it's addictive. He's complained about how much time I spend on here for two years, last Sept I got the laptop and he complained less b/c I could bring it with me into the living room or wherever. Now he is understanding himself what the draw is. ;)
And MY JOB is to provide those services to AMERICAN CITIZENS!
And my clients love me because I take GOOD CARE OF THEM!
MY COUNTRYMEN COME FIRST and THEY ARE the ones I'm there to serve you little snipp!
That is my job and I do It because I love MY COUNTRY MEN!
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 07:53 PM
Get a grip, man!!! Gawd, you sound like a lunatic.
Have you ever put a US citizen off, in order to give their services to an Illegal Immigrant??? I doubt it!
And you Must do it because you love it, because social workers make peanuts! How you got to be so filled with hatred is another story!
You would be better served, instead of posting Hatred and Anger on the DNC blog, going instead to your Congress people, your local newspaper, TV and radio shows. Look back over today's Rant and see , what, if anything you accomplished other than to look foolish! Take a pill, will you?
Now I would love to stick around , but I must go out for the evening.
stravu9
Mexicans aren't the reason that Americans don't have good jobs, that their salaries have come down, that the money they do have isn't going as far...they aren't the enemy or the problem. Actually if we invest in America instead of invading other countries we will need more workers, and all can have a good living wage if we regulate the way corporations do business. Unregulated corporations lead to corporate fascism, which we now have.
Why?
We're supposed to remember the Holocoust?
Why is the Alamo different.
Nationalism is a silly cock crowing on his own dunghill.
Richard Aldington
It is not easy to see how the more extreme forms of nationalism can long survive when men have seen the Earth in its true perspective as a single small globe against the stars.
Arthur C. Clarke
In some states militant nationalism has gone to the lengths of dictatorship, the cult of the absolute or totalitarian state and the glorification of war.
Arthur Henderson
The drive toward economic nationalism is only part of the general revival of nationalism.
Arthur Henderson
Corporate nationalism to me is a little bit like what would have happened if Hitler had won. It's scary stuff. It's totalitarianism in a different from, under a different flavour.
Lance Henriksen
have fun Pam!
sorry stravu9, just wondering what you hoped to accomplish by saying that? what is fueling this anger of yours? do you know?
is it fear?
I have been thinking about the notion of perfect love as being without fear, and what that means for us in a world that's becoming increasingly xenophobic, tortured by fundamentalism and nationalism.
Bell Hooks
WEaring your taupe berks clogs and fat girls broomstick skirt no doubt!
Jen what kind of government do you think you will have 25-50 years from now?
So you belive socialism is the way to go?
Vincente Fox is running our country now. President Bush is nothing but a puppet, and if we vote for Democrats it will be more of the same.
no i believe strictly regulated capitalism will do.
what kind of government do you think you will have, dk2?
indygal, bwahahahaha!
where on earth is the logic in that statement?
----
omg are you spying on me, stravu9? sounds like by wardrobe. although today i wore jeans with my berks.
It doesnt matter to me I wont live that long Jen.
But look to MEXICO you may find your answer.
thx ;) they're everywhere deb.
oh yeah, stravu9, I'm a fat girl too. Even though you were talking to Pam probably, she's gone and not likely to be wearing the uniform you suggested. Plus she is petite.
Does it make you feel superior to call someone fat? It's not far from calling someone fat to calling them spic or kike or faggot. What on earth made you get into social work, because it certainly doesn't seem to be love of fellow man from what you've posted today.
Indygal and stravu9, quit believeing anything that you hear in mainstream media. Our media is owned by the same corporations that are also running the government. READ...educate yourselves!
dk2, you think Mexico is socialist or heading that way? It's an oligarchy right now, and if Bush used his power to push Fox toward making his economy work for ALL Mexicans not just the richest then there would be less people needing to leave their families and risk their lives coming here to work. But Bush likes those people coming here and working for a pittance for his rich buddies.
Hey Jen...I'm going to take a long, hot, soaking bath...walked a bit more than usual today;)
e me and let me know where the thread ended up.
thom hartmann immigration racists v. corporatists which one are you? or will you be on the side of hard working families who want to provide for their elders and children?
enjoy the bath deb, sounds good to me. i may do the same. will let you know.
Dear Xdebex
Believe it or not I do read. One of my favorite books is Michelle Malkin's " INVASION". You should read it sometime.
well what the hell are you doing here, indygal? what you're selling here is not welcome. Michelle Malkin is an idiot. You tell a lot about yourself and your intellect with that. Get lost.
another one bites the dust. i figure by november the only republican not under indictment will be ollie north ( and maybe fawn hall---if she still has that feathered hair):
Report: Ex-FDA chief faces criminal inquiry
Crawford has been accused of financial improprieties, New York Times says
Updated: 7:00 a.m. ET April 29, 2006
NEW YORK - The former commissioner of the Food and Drug Administration is under federal investigation amid accusations of financial improprieties and making false statements to Congress, a newspaper reported Saturday...
...The criminal investigation was disclosed at a court hearing in a lawsuit over the FDA’s actions on emergency contraceptive pills, a subject of dispute during Crawford’s tenure...
this particular set of crimes, deceits and misadventures is really complicated so here is the whole story:
they went down in a burning ring of fire....
I have a Masters from Columbia in English Lit.
My husband is an Environmental trainer who used to work for Greenpeace.
I ran a Borders until 5 years ago when I decided to take a job where I could help my fellow AMERICANS. I volunteered in New Orleans and worked without pay for this years 6 weeks of vacation.
What are your credentials.
By the way, Michael Lind agrees with me!
NO Jen I dont think Mexico is Socialist because if it were maybe their people would have a better life, (if the leaders didn't become greedy and make it communist but then again they leaders already are greedy arent they.)It was a question to you, nothing more, nothing less.
I understand fully that the illegals are used, I understand fully that corporate American is not only using them but the lower income people of America also. I understand about capitalism, Ive been living it clawing my way up for many many many years. I fully understand Bush, I lived in Texas 13 years before TN.
Their are many hard working americans that struggle everyday to put food on their table, to watch their taxes go up to help all kinds of countries because america is the compassionate country, they are willing to help are good people, not haters of which many on the DNC blog like to label them, they are worked to the bone and they feel that no one cares about them. The pregnant teenager gets help, the minorities get help, when there is a disaster people get some help, and yes gays get help too, but for hard working lower income people, they can barely put shoes on their kids, they work 40 50 60 70 80 hours aweek (I have done 80 hours a week) they are wondering what about me,
they feel like they cant go on any more, and to give to the illegals as much as it sounds like the human thing to do. They dont have anything left to give.
As hard working americans they are sick of rescuing everyone on the planet and still being told they are hateful when they are only tired and see no hope, if you want to value an illegal over someone who is and has been a law abiding US citizen and dont feel any compassion for your fellow americans as you told me the other night that you were disappointed in me,
I am disappointed in you.
my congressman is sweeney. he is really a weenie. he was one of the idiots who bummed rushed the vote counters if florida to stop the recount. until recently he seemed unbeatable but as of late i am getting the feeling we may just drive this clown back to the thumper games and bar bowling contests he excels at. this story is gonna help:
congressman tapakeg?
i am a brain surgeon. i graduated from the university of berlin. i have performed three thousand lobster to human brain transplants on republican politicians. i brought a giant sponge to new orleans and sopped up a million gallons of water. paul lynde agrees with me.
People like you are the reason the Democratic Party , despite the dishonesty and corruption and evil they perpetrate WILL LOSE AGAIN!
greeg, you are the ruination of the Democrats.
question: We're supposed to remember the Holocoust?
Why is the Alamo different.
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 08:30 PM
answer: about six million deaths give or take a few thousand.
Stravu9
I do not agree with Gregg , but you have to admit he is quick witted.
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 08:36 PM
When you were in Columbia receiving your Masters in English, did they teach you that name-calling and personal attacks are a respected form of civil discourse in the real world?
Or are you just having a bad day?
with effective communication skills such as those demonstrated in this bit of columbia university level writing perhaps you should see if doctor dean will give you a contract to conduct training sessions for all of us in how to win over the pagans:
"WEaring your taupe berks clogs and fat girls broomstick skirt no doubt!"
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 08:36 PM
hi lizzy. looks like the demonstration was huge. and what a great day for it!
I do Jen,
you don't read me trying to sway people by trying to make them feel like they are out of line be writing something that I don't agree with, many on this blog as much as I enjoy reading all of the post, try and make others feel inferior because we differ in our experiences and therefore have different perspectives, (and that does not mean I have any sympathy for certain trolls that have an obvious ulterior motive - let me make it clear those trolls make me sick and discussted)
but I can see both sides of this issue very clearly,
Gee, greeg, almost a million Irish were starved by the English during the potato famine. Can they have a monument built in D.C. too?
And people like you really are the reason the Democrtic Party will once again snatch defeat from the jaws of Victory this fall!
Snuggle up and star glaze and chew that over when my prophecy comes true this fall.
People like you only care about the poor, disenfranchized , down on their luck if they are from forreign lands. My anger ant you and your ilk is fueled by the fact that everyday I see American citzens who can't feed and clothe their children or themselves, the old who can't afford their medications and have no idea how to get around the botched Medicare part D. The people who are denied SSI disability automatically the first time who then hire a lawyer who tale about a third of their settlement when they start to get their 603.00 per month!
But hey, the illegal aliens come first with you right?
And that, my friend , is why people like you will turn the elections over to the dark forces of the Republican Party once again this fall.
Because you have distain for your own fellow counrtymen who live in poverty and save all your concern for other people.
Have a crummy night, you deserve it.
utter and complete bullshit this is
People like you only care about the poor, disenfranchized , down on their luck if they are from forreign lands.
stravu9, i would use the belladonna with the utmost caution.
nope. dark, thick caffinated for me. i am trying to have my teeth match the color of an old walrus tusk before i die.
something cute for pam if she is out there:
"Some of the party brass said, 'Ned, don't jeopardize a safe seat,' " Lamont recently told students at Southern Connecticut State University, who gathered for a meet-and-greet session. "But you're not going to lose a senator. You're going to gain a Democrat."
Everyone's all over the blog tonight...not complaining, just interesting.
S9, Surely you can't believe that Gregg or Jen don't care about our fellow citizens. OK, so you read a fearmongering book which has gotten you up in arms believing that Mexicans are the enemy. Just because a Republican fearmonger writes a book doesn't make it the truth.
Actually, it is beneath your education and intelligence to fall for it.
Corporate fascism is what is causing people to be poor in the US and causing plenty of poverty around the world.
CEO's are bringing in 400 mil. a year and buying laws that allow them to keep people in poverty.
Even if every single illegal were shipped back today it wouldn't change a thing for the families that you work with.
Gregg you crack me up...it's such fun blogging with you;-))
NED in 06!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As I recall belladonna was used by women to make their eyes appear dark and smouldering, and my eyes are naturally beautiful so I have no need of such things.
But speaking of pharmacudicals, how's that thorazine working out for you , greeg.
In large doses, belladonna acts upon the cerebro-spinal system, as showing such symptoms as dilatation of the pupils (mydriasis), presbyopia, or long-sightedness with obscurity of vision, or absolute blindness (amaurosis), visual illusions (phantasms), suffused eyes, occasionally disturbance of hearing (as ringing in the ears, etc.), numbness of the face, confusion of head, giddiness, and delirium.
Posted by PamB on April 29, 2006 at 07:41 PM And you ONLY give out Medicaid and food stamps for Illegal Immigrants, right?
I already posted the Food Stamp eligibility guidelines a while back - undocumented workers aren't eligible for them - he's either breaking the law or spreading misinformation
I haven't looked at the Medicaid guidelines - that program's become almost a block grant with each state determining eligibilty
Gee, what a coincidence! Even a small dose of you has much the same effect! As well as the mind-numbing boredom your arrogance induces!
Posted by indygal on April 29, 2006 at 09:22 PM I do not agree with Gregg , but you have to admit he is quick witted.
Don't encourage him :)
Now, now, now, kiddies.
Let's try and get along with one another.
If I remember correctly, the subject was immigration.
Posted by jen on April 29, 2006 at 09:00 PM Michelle Malkin is an idiot. You tell a lot about yourself and your intellect with that. Get lost.
The "Libertarian" version of Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh.
they shuffle back and forth between the GOP and the Democratic party
I think we should add Instant Runoff Voting to list of critical reforms - then they could comfortably vote for their own candidates
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 10:18 PM But hey, the illegal aliens come first with you right?
you seem to think it's a choice between one or the other (or perhaps you're trying to frame the argument that way).
it's not - and the more you imply that it is - the less credibility your argument has.
*******NEW OPEN THREAD**********
Posted by Dawnie on April 29, 2006 at 11:04 PM
take a break and look at all the great photos and read all the great stories from today
this issue will still be here tomorrow!
don't forget to Breathhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
*******NEW OPEN THREAD**********
Posted by Dawnie on April 29, 2006 at 11:04 PM
I mean BREATHE
Food Stamps cannot be given to illegal aliens however if they have documentation of somesort that states they have been here 5 years or more, and have permanant residence status people can receive. Only recently have they started to crack down on questionable documentation. There are MANY Social Security cards and numbers that come back with death matches. Meaning the numbers are stolen and the documents forged.
Medicaid for Pregnant Women is the program that covers the birth of the child as well as specified number of days for post-partum. After the birth the child is then eligible for Medicaid until the parents earnings exceed the financial guidelines which do vary from State to State and are quickly dimishing.
Illegals can also be eligible for Emergency Medicaid if their situation is considered to be dire enough. Many times these are psych patients or accident victims. I've never known of any of them to be turned away or turned in.
Okay , DORS, how do we pay for the influx into the Social Service programs this would undoubtably entail?
We can't keep them afloat NOW, how are we going to accomodate more people. Where will the money come from?
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 11:30 PM I've never known of any of them to be turned away or turned in.
We "Yankees" don't leave kids to die on the street either.
Our civil servants do reject anyone who don't meet guidelines and that includes stolen social security numbers
case load does affect accuracy - an audit was recently performed showing failures to both grant eligibilty to citizens who were eligible and grants to those who were not
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 11:39 PM
I doubt at this point that you and I agree on what those costs are
I've seen way too much misinformation spread around - so much, that I have little interest in continuing the discussion
and I've seen little truth about the economic contributions - so much so that I think the motivation is just to get rid of "them"
You got a study handy showing the costs? Maybe we can start there.
but - I need to get back to my son's room so I'll check back later and respond to the cost study then.
S9, we can't keep them afloat or we won't. Halliburton alone has more money unaccounted for than we would need to pay for all food stamps and subsidised housing. We're spending a billion every 8 hours, where is it going...I'll give you a hint...not to your clients.
We are borrowing billions from communist China. Is all that money going to the war effort? No the vast majority is being used to subsidize corporations, including oil corporations who are making record profits.
Hey Deb...just enjoying blogging tonight. Hubby is out of town so it's me and the pc...and of course all of my fellow bloggers;-)
Posted by dk2 on April 29, 2006 at 06:59 PM Dorsano, it is nice that what I say is venting, but you are a saint in your thinking and writing,
Someone said on one of the other threads something like, about trolls, if they cant win by truth, they result in trying to label you. I guess that says where I lump your logic.
OK, Deb I've read more of posts (those not directed at me)
I'm still not quite sure where you are coming from or think of what I'm posting :)
Perhaps we'll get a chance to chat more some day.
Posted by Tom_Terrific on April 29, 2006 at 07:38 PM Unions don’t do jack for their members other than use them for personal gain.
I worked in two union shops when I was younger - I know first hand what they do - and I've seen first hand what SEIU does
Workers elect the union leadership - sometimes they go bad - then we get rid them
Your comment destroys whatever credibilty any of your other arguments might have - sorry, friend
You best hope that unions find some way to strengthen their position world wide because if they don't all we're left with is tax policy and regulation to control corporate behavior and neither of those two are desireable.
Tom - if unions were ineffective, corporate interests wouldn't be spending millions of dollars to undermine their image and influence.
You're arguments are best when they're honest - you don't want Mexicans here - get the illegal ones out of here.
Stick with that
Posted by stravu9 on April 29, 2006 at 11:39 PM
If you can't find a cost study (check with Cato and Heritage) we could run through the programs
We've already determined that Food Stamps costs are neglible. And so are Medicaid costs.
The great thing about Social Security is that the benefit formulas are based on what you contribute - the more you contribute, the more you get - so that program is not an issue
They pay property taxes or rent (which pay the landlord's property taxes) so that covers elementary and secondary education for the most part
They pay gas tax so that covers road construction and maintenance
The pay sales tax so that covers a whole range of things
Which programs in particular are you concerned about?
I'm no fan of this President. Other than a great start in Afghanistan, I can't think of much anything that this administration has gotten right.
The closest he's gotten to getting something good acomplished on the domestic policy side, is his guest worker program.
I wish him all God's speed in that endevor.
Thank You,Josh
I'm so glad someone finally posted this side of the debate.As most here know,I'm one of those unique blends of Cherokee/African and the media has failed to give my side of this debate.Instead,they have lied about how the Black American Community as a whole,are irate and the native Americans as a whole are irate.That's not the truth.The truth is in the majority of us hold the view expressed in Josh's post.That is how many Black and Native Americans feel as well as Whites.I cannot express how glad I am that Josh corrected the lie that was going around in the Media (Lou Dobbs).I can't wait till tomorrow either.I will be doing no shopping.I would take Monday off,but I work graveyard and walking off the job leaving our Hotel Guest in the middle of the night poses a risk to their security and would be almost criminal.LOL So,I will be working Monday from 12 mid to 7 am and back that night at 11 pm, but I will not go shopping and I WILL support Green Bay's small Latino Community in their Protest Rally.
I've been reading, listening and talking about the march tomorrow. I'm probably going to open myself to negative comments but I am against it. I am against the illegal immigration. I am a life long Democrat. Marched against the Vietnam war, lost a very dear friend in that one. Marched for civil rights for all Americans. My Father was a Democrat, his Father (immigrant)was a Democrat. Yes, I am definitely for legal immigration. Those that want to come here and become Americans, become part of this wonderful country, and it will be again when Bush and his cronies are out, or hopefully in jail. But I do draw the line at illegal immigration. I think the Democratic party is wrong to be behind this. We have much more important issues that need to be addressed, that a majority of Americans, Democrats, Republicans and Independants stand with us. This is no win. And I'm tired of losing. BTW, yes, my Grandfather was a legal immigrant. Became a citizen as fast as he could. He came here to be an AMERICAN. He learned the language. He was a proud American. I am sorry if any of you disagree with me on this. But as a 63 year old Democrat, I do not stand with corporate America who want cheap labor nor do I stand with Bush and his guest worker plan. I stand with Americans trying to feed their families, put gas in their car, our young men and women sent to war for lies and oil. I stand with Americans.
Goodmorning all:
Dorsano:
Posted by dorsano on April 29, 2006 at 06:42 PM
Venting Posed as a question.
Posted by dorsano on April 30, 2006 at 03:46 AM
For me the issue is about breaking the law or not, for most americans it is about how it affects taxes, bottom line.
You can present any study you want to combat their belief that the load of illegal immigrants doesnt cost anything but as we all say about the govt figures they can be skewed in any direction you want.
As for paying taxes: there are some (and I dont mean all by any means, but some) business owners, and especially restaurant owners, who open up by using illegal papers in the first place, and then dont ring cash sales into their register (the IRS cant track cash sales) (and not only the Illegals do it but others also and its not right for them either). I bring this example up because you want to paint them as all perfect law abiding (not), helping with everything good (taxes, paying into SS. "not" getting free medical help - which is a drain on tax payers because (they dont turn in a workplace accident so that the employers insurane can foot some of the bill) and they are all great and wonderful people, well they are not all great!
http://www.ice.gov/pi/investigations/wanted/fugitives.htm
Call it nationalism if you must, but Americans that are already Americans need to start comming first- they are what has given you the right to free speech the people across the border didnt give it to you. Their are Americans suffering, greatly everyday, why dont we get into a discussion about all of them? abused women, abused children, or just plain Americans who cant afford their medications, or disable americans who cant do anything but reside in substandered facilities - thrown in a state run complex, or a nursing home. Where is your outrage for them? and guess what they are and have been their whole life Americans, honest,paying taxes Americans.
I used to think the Democrats were for the American people, not the Mexican people.
They have a country of their own, go fix it.
Posted by CoreDemo on April 30, 2006 at 10:13 AM
well said, I agree with you, I hope you plan to call or write Gov. Dean, Hillary Clinton, and Ted Kennedy and your own Senators and Representative, they need to be hearing your thoughts and soon.
Stop trying to add an evil face to the term “Nationalist Democracy.” Webster defines it as follows:
And none of you, not one, possesses the high ground to call those of us who are opposed to illegal immigration ignorant.
nationalist - an advocate of or believer in nationalism - a member of a political party or group advocating national independence or strong national government.
nationalism - loyalty and devotion to a nation; especially : a sense of national consciousness exalting one nation above all others and placing primary emphasis on promotion of its culture and interests as opposed to those of other nations or supranational groups
democracy - government by the people; especially : rule of the majority b : a government in which the supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them directly or indirectly through a system of representation usually involving periodically held free elections or privileges
Democrats are for people, period. Human beings. We don't make you pass a test in order to care for you. You should care about everyone that is being exploited, not just Americans.
TT you are ignorant if you think that it is not possible to care about the lives of poor suffering Americans as well as poor suffering people all over the world.
I have been a union member too and I'm tired of all the b.s. people are putting out about unions.
Dorsana
I worked in two union shops when I was younger - I know first hand what they do - and I've seen first hand what SEIU does
Workers elect the union leadership - sometimes they go bad - then we get rid them
Your comment destroys whatever credibilty any of your other arguments might have - sorry, friend
Climb down off your high horse buddy. In 1967 I joined the Longshoremen’s in Beaumont, Texas, a real union.
My dad was in the union his whole life. After Reagan broke the ATC union they have steadly gone down hill ever since.
Unions don't have the power they used to have when they broke the heads of scabs who crossed the picket line.
Now the union bosses talk tough, then surrender.
jen
TT you are ignorant if you think that it is not possible to care about the lives of poor suffering Americans as well as poor suffering people all over the world.
Don't put words in my mouth. I care about everyone. I just can't afford to pay their medical and education expenses. Especially those who come here illegally.
I asked an illegal alien at the Dallas march why he didn't come hear legally. He told you have wait to long.
That is not justification for amnesty in my book.
no, because when your family is starving, you can wait years to find a job to feed them right TT?
jen
no, because when your family is starving, you can wait years to find a job to feed them right TT?
I suppose you are suggesting the other 3.5 billion starving people in the world come here and let the middle-class foot the bill.
The trouble with the far-left is they are big on spending money they don't have or letting other people pay so they can sleep better at night.
In the Kingdom of God the streets are covered with blood and litered with the starving. I don't make the rules and I didn't create the world in this miserable mold. But I have to live in it and I have to pay for what I can and do what I can because I care. But I can't save every starving person.
Posted by Tom_Terrific on April 30, 2006 at 12:25 PM Now the union bosses talk tough, then surrender.
It's a tough world - and it's gonna get a lot tougher. Go it alone if you like.
Good luck to you.
dorsano
It is a tough world and I'm not alone. Push will move to shove and blood will be spilled. In the end, things will remain the same except for a widened border fence.
Although, most people feel sorry for the illegal population, the law is the law. Either we're a country of laws or we're not. We want to hold Bush accountable under the constitution and the laws of our land yet we overlook them when it pertains to illegal entrants into our country. I am a union member and a Democrat. I would like someone to explain to me why I should support amnesty when everything it represents works contrary to my union and it's goals of fair wages and collective bargaining. In addition, when our party supports illegals unconditionally (presently there are no conditions) we are not fighting the real fight, which should be one of civil rights and a corrupt Mexican government. These are blatant oxymorons within our own party. This will not bode well for us and if national polls are correct and 82% of Americans are against open borders, this may indeed splinter our party as well as the GOP. I hold no ill will towards these people, but I feel so strongly about this. My family had to struggle and it wasn 't easy for them to learn English and assimilate, but they persevered. My husband's family emmigrated here in small groups, a few at a time, due to quotas, and strict citizen requirements. They also persevered. No one bended or re-wrote any laws for them. They are better Americans for it because they understand the sacrifices that each immigrant makes to be part of the colorful tapestry of our nation.
The new laws proposed by the House of Representitives is a good answer to illegal immigration, why do democrats think its unamerican to send people who are disrupting the country and a burdon on the citizens wrong and now terrorizing with economic threats be sent home, was it wrong when we were taxed to much by the British to send them home , that was the revolutionary war if you've forgotten !!! What i hear from loud mouth ted is we can't , but then his message blurrs, we can't employ americans , we can't stop illegal immigration, we can't be secure , is that the real message or is it that we have been bought and owe the large corporate type s that want them here !!
The new laws proposed by the House of Representitives is a good answer to illegal immigration, why do democrats think its unamerican to send people who are disrupting the country and a burdon on the citizens wrong and now terrorizing with economic threats be sent home, was it wrong when we were taxed to much by the British to send them home , that was the revolutionary war if you've forgotten !!! What i hear from loud mouth ted is we can't , but then his message blurrs, we can't employ americans , we can't stop illegal immigration, we can't be secure , is that the real message or is it that we have been bought and owe the large corporate type s that want them here !!
Hi allenj:
Not all democrats are for illegal immigrants, Senator Kennedy is only one, have you called his office to voice your opinion, or Sen. Hillary Clinton, or Gov. Dean.
You can try and email them but a phone call seems to get more action,(in my opinion)
If americans want things to change they must get involved with the politicians representing them on all level, local and national.
To find your Senator:
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
House of Rep:
http://www.house.gov/
good luck, pass it on, contact your Representatives,
I thought this was the party of the people? What is the DP doing about letting these people work at "slave labor" prices? Who cares where the money comes from? These fat cat companies should be fined and are not. Who is responsible? BUSH and his cronies. Why isn't there a legal barrage of challenges to the rights that these people should have since they are on US soil?
Minimun wage for all, that's my motto.
Follow the law, secure the borders, deport illegal immigrants and make appropriate changes to the law.
I am the great-grandchild of immigrants. My ancestors came here legally. It took them a long time and they were far worse off than the illegal immigrants in their homeland than the ones we have here now illegally. But they followed the law. They worked the mines of West Virginia, earned some money and bought farms in Pennsylvania. The worked to improve wages and become productive American citizens.
Raise the wages to "a living wage" and many Americans will take these jobs. Granted the vendors will have to charge more for the product but the economics are apparent. They will have more spending power and the cycle will be in motion, more jobs, more taxes....
We don't take care of our American born children with adequate healthcare, but we are humane enough to give free healthcare to illegal immigrants. We even show them films in Spanish to explain to them that they are entitled to a translator, paid for by our tax dollars and they pay nothing, either for the translator or the healthcare.
Let's not forget we have laws for a reason. We are civilized people. We don't wish hardship on these people.
How about these foreign countries becoming productive in their own right so their people can work and earn a living wage.
Please don't allow the Chambers of Commerce, business people, as well as corporations, who are employing "illegal immigrants" shape our laws. They are breaking the law as it was written, and there is no good reason to break the law!
I was raised a Democrat. My family fought to establish the United Mine Workers, and it was rough, and people died for that union. Now people think Unions are worthless. The illegals are organized, and it's scary because they are organized and we, the American citizens, are not together on this issue. We must fight to have these illegals deported. It can be done alot easier than to spend lots of money trying to fix this problem by making these criminals legal. I live in Ohio and people here are fighting over minimum wage jobs. The entire country is going down the tubes because of the greed of corporate America. Don't call this a humanitarian issue. It is a survival issue because we can't even insure our current citizens a living wage. CHARITY DOES START AT HOME. Contact your representatives in Congress and ask them to stop allowing greedy business owners to destroy our country further. These illegals ARE taking our jobs because they have driven the wage scale so low, Americans refuse to go down that far, that's why the illegals are here.
I was raised a Democrat. My family fought to establish the United Mine Workers, and it was rough, and people died for that union. Now people think Unions are worthless. The illegals are organized, and it's scary because they are organized and we, the American citizens, are not together on this issue. We must fight to have these illegals deported. It can be done alot easier than to spend lots of money trying to fix this problem by making these criminals legal. I live in Ohio and people here are fighting over minimum wage jobs. The entire country is going down the tubes because of the greed of corporate America. Don't call this a humanitarian issue. It is a survival issue because we can't even insure our current citizens a living wage. CHARITY DOES START AT HOME. Contact your representatives in Congress and ask them to stop allowing greedy business owners to destroy our country further. These illegals ARE taking our jobs because they have driven the wage scale so low, Americans refuse to go down that far, that's why the illegals are here.
I was raised a Democrat. My family fought to establish the United Mine Workers, and it was rough, and people died for that union. Now people think Unions are worthless. The illegals are organized, and it's scary because they are organized and we, the American citizens, are not together on this issue. We must fight to have these illegals deported. It can be done alot easier than to spend lots of money trying to fix this problem by making these criminals legal. I live in Ohio and people here are fighting over minimum wage jobs. The entire country is going down the tubes because of the greed of corporate America. Don't call this a humanitarian issue. It is a survival issue because we can't even insure our current citizens a living wage. CHARITY DOES START AT HOME. Contact your representatives in Congress and ask them to stop allowing greedy business owners to destroy our country further. These illegals ARE taking our jobs because they have driven the wage scale so low, Americans refuse to go down that far, that's why the illegals are here.
I am of African-Native American-Cuban descent. My paternal grandfather legally emigrated to the US and picked fruit in FL citrus groves his entire life. I am not anti immigration I am anti illegal immigration. Mexico is solving its' poverty problem by encouraging illegal immigration to the U.S. Someone asked if anyone had lost a job to an illegal. My brother, after losing his home in New Orleans, got work rebuilding the city for $8. per hour but it only lasted a few weeks because he and his fellow American workers were let go and replaced by illegals who worked for $5. All of a sudden they showed up by the busload and displaced citizens of New Orleans who needed the work
.
Once I was middle class but after developing a spinal problem was plunged into abject poverty having to live on $603. per month SSI and $35. food stamps. The job I used to have at $10.65 per hour fired me when I became disabled and eventually outsourced the work to India. My disability insurance was abruptly cancelled. I cannot walk and live with chronic pain. I cannot afford the $80. per month for the therapy I need. There are millions of American citizens who share my plight but few demonstrate or advocate for us. There is no outpouring of empathy for us either.
I fully understand the plight of the illegals, but this country cannot take care of the poor, the disabled, the elderly or the homeless. I just feel that we should come before those who break our laws to come here.
By the way, I have taken care of other people's children and cleaned other people's houses and worked several jobs at a time in order to make a better life for me and my family but I find myself worse off now than when I started. I don't want charity just a little breathing room so that I don't have to chose between food and medicine and want secure borders to help keep disease, drugs, criminals, terrorists and those who come here illegally out.
If illegal immigrants want to live here to make them a citizen why not send them to iraq. We should let them serve our country, for 4 years then let them become citizens. Do they deserve food on the table? No, we need to help our homeless first. Do they deserve free healthcare? No, if we take the 11 million people that get free healthcare and give it to taxpayer. If we kick them out of the country we will not have this problems.
All we have to do is follow the current laws that we have and severely penalize the companies that employee illegal immigrants. If these two things are done, no one will be coming across our borders illegally because there will be no work for them. Our country is struggling as it is and can not afford to have it's citizens not working because employee's can get away with cheap labor. Don't we put sanctions on other countries for cheap labor? If we charge these companies with huge fines and possible plant shutdowns every time it is found they are employing illegal immigrants, this issue will be solved quickly. This way immigrants will only come here legally, the way it is suppose to be.
Everyone please contact you representatives it is important in this issue and many more to come, get involved in your local and national politics, attend any town meetings, if your representatives dont have any town meetings then call your local voters registration boards and ask for the candidates contact information and call them, write them and email them. Our working public has left this in the hands of a few for to long, get involved make your vote count, (if you haven't registered to vote than do so today), take the time and do it please.
To find your Senator:
http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm
House of Rep:
http://www.house.gov/
Want to know why Democrats cannot win on a national scale anymore? Look at this debate.
There is NOTHING wrong or inhumane with wanting to protect one's border. Painting those middle-class (perhaps even Democratic-leanign) voters as hateful because they want to outlaw illegal immigration is ridiculous and elitous. You can still advocate for increase legal immigration, and an open door, just not an open window as well. You can still be a far-left liberal and advocate for strong border policy. We have a hard enough time getting our Government to help out our OWN poor and needy, why in the world would anyone want to add more to the issue.
You can speak all you want about how cruel it is to turn away illegal immigrants. Just understand you will be doing this from the sidelines as the Republicans once again take on an issue that matters to moderates around the country and defend their hold on Congress. I want nothing more than a Democratic majority in both houses...but that is being put in turmoil.
Likewise, if Democrats do indeed want stronger borders...SAY IT. Perception is 99% of political reality...and right now Dems are percieved as the party of wide-open borders.
It would be easy to report car or truck licenses to the authorities when a (presumed) illegal immigrant is being picked up for work. That might discourage employers from hiring them.
And, these illegal immigrants are being exploited by employers who don't have to pay them vacation time, sick time, retirement, or any other benefits. Of course, the local social services agencies pay these benefits. Employers don't even have to pay them wages! Now, is the exploitation of defenseless people who don't have a legal leg to stand on what America is all about? This should also be an issue. We should send these people back to their own countries so that we won't exploit them.
And we should send bills for these people to Mexico, Ecuador, etc. For each undocumented immigrant from Mexico, we should send the Mexican government a bill for $100 per day for each day the immigrant is in our country. That might come close to reimbursing the social service agencies and medical facilities for serving these people. Or perhaps $100 a day is too low. Someone needs to calculate the true cost to our economy for these people --- not just the cost to employers who are exploiting these people, but the cost to the American citizens who are paying for these people to come here to be exploited.
I went to a Democrat conference in my state, they stressed, getting involved in your local and state politics. Asking everyone if they are registered and are they voting, well I guess they were right!
I just went to vote and I am so upset it is in the afternoon here and at a location where there were 5 voting machines only 52 people had voted!
52! Where are my fellow americans, Shame on us for not being involved, if you dont like the illegal immigrant issue then get involved, vote, call, email, go to meetings, talk to everyone but, get off our duffs and go vote!
I personally think that both the Democrats and Republicans are going to pass these laws thinking that it will get them more votes from the new immigrants that will no longer be illegal. Also, I'm sure passing this amnesty law will give them lots of money in their pockets from many companies benefiting from having illegal's as employees. This will end up being a huge downfall of the United States. I'm hoping I'm wrong but it seems that all of the law makers are ignoring us, the middle class, and paying attention to the rallies going on. The rallies equate out to a million people or so, how many middle class families are there in the US? I would expect a lot more.
Dear President Bush:
I'm about to plan a little trip with my family and extended family,
and I would like to ask you to assist me. I'm going to walk across
the border from the U.S. into Mexico, and I need to make a few
arrangements. I know you can help with this.
I plan to skip all the legal stuff like visas, passports,
immigration quotas and laws. I'm sure they handle those things the
same way you do here.
So, would you mind telling your buddy, President Vicente Fox, that
I'm on my way over? Please let him know that I will be expecting
the following:
1. Free medical care for my entire family.
2. English-speaking government bureaucrats for all services I might
need, whether I use them or not.
3. All government forms need to be printed in English.
4. I want my kids to be taught by English-speaking teachers.
5. Schools need to include classes on American culture and history.
6. I want my kids to see the American flag flying on the top of the
flag pole at their school with the Mexican flag flying lower down.
7. Please plan to feed my kids at school for both breakfast and
lunch.
8. I will need a local Mexican driver's license so I can get easy
access to government services.
9. I do not plan to have any car insurance, and I won't make any
effort to learn local traffic laws.
10. In case one of the Mexican police officers does not get the
memo from President Fox to leave me alone, please be sure that all
police officers speak English.
11. I plan to fly the U.S. flag from my house top, put flag decals
on my car, and have a gigantic celebration on July 4th. I do not
want any complaints or negative comments from the locals.
12. I would also like to have a nice job without paying any taxes,
and don't enforce any labor laws or tax laws.
13. Please tell all the people in the country to be extremely nice
and never say a critical word about me, or about the strain I might
place on the economy.
I know this is an easy request because you already do all these
things for all the people who come to the U.S. from Mexico. I am
sure that Pres. Fox won't mind returning the favor if you ask him
nicely.
However, if he gives you any trouble, just invite him to go quail
hunting with your V.P.
Thank you so much for your kind help.
~A~
Please tell Congress that it's okay to show concern for more than one NON-WHITE group at a time.Also,tell them that they are in great danger of losing the Black vote because they are ignoring the people of Dafur.I expect it from Republicans,but I am very close to telling the Democratic Party where they can go if they keep ignoring this Genocide.
Thank You,
Raimie,
I love your idea. I have been trying to figure out what to do when I lose my job her in the US because companies are dropping like flies here in Michigan. I like the no tax and free schooling in English idea and I will be meeting you there. Michigan is almost at 7% unemployement, people are dieing to find a job, and companies are still hiring illegals, I will probably need to go to a new country to find work to feed my family. Let me know what city you are in so we can make a little USA in the middle of Mexico to see how they like it. Truthfully, we would probably be shot or put in prison for attempting this in Mexico. Seems fair how things don't work both ways.
Stravu9 is correct about everything she has said.
I work for the public health system in CA.
I also brought up the issue of who will fund Medicaid and other social services to cover many, if not all, of the illegals if an amnesty plan goes through (in another post on this site).
I do not expect the federal government to provide adequate funding to the states to cover the expenses. Therefore, state and local benefits will have to be cut for everyone, including current citizens, in order to provide "coverage" for all.
I have not heard any member of our government discuss this issue of funding. I do not believe they have even begun to develop a plan. Not only would there need to be funding for benefits, but funding for staffing as well. Increased staffing would be needed in social services and public health offices (to process all the paperwork), hospitals, etc. And staff members do deserve adequate compensation! Many do have advanced degrees that were expensive to obtain!
There are real issues of practicality that have not been addressed at all.
Stavu9, if you are still reading this blog, I understand! I'm glad there's another person besides me who checks in here and understands this side of the issue.
PS Stavu9 - I have reregistered to vote as a Republican so I can vote in that party's presidential primary. I expect we will have another Republican in the White House - hopefully a Moderate Republican. I want to cast my vote for which Republican I think should get to the final election. Then we can see which Democrat they run against.
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