Shame, shame, shame on Bush! He's been quite good so far with a general open borders plan that's allowed millions of undocumented future voters to enter the U.S., but now he wants to stop that? Shame! But, at least he's not anywhere near our side anymore.

Hey, president Bush: when you want to join with the majority of Americans who support free immigration (of all kinds), let us know! You can spot us easy, we'll be right over here marching through the streets demanding the rights you won't give us.

Bush comes to his senses just in time for the Nov election. Too bad the Democrats didn't beat him to the punch. Why do the Republicans always have some hot button, like making illegal border crossing illegal (duh), just in time for the election? Maybe the Democrats need to stop using their advisors who cause them to lose.

Flip flopping into another publicity stunt, are we Mr. President?

The Republican incumbents will pass another "tough" law that they all know Bush will not enforce it...just so they can say they address "the crisis." Standard Republican operating procedure. Cover your right wingnuts' fears that Rove whipped up with his with a lot of propaganda and then "seriously" take care of your corporate contributors' interests with all kinds of loopholes and tax incentives.

Can't wait to see what he writes as his addendum to this one. Something like:

"Why are we wasting time with this border security law, when the land could be developed into a string of golf resort/condo projects? Cheney says Halliburton needs some more no bid contracts closer to home. The large supply of cheap illegal laborers makes the deal even sweeter.

Someone get on top of this. Harriet get Condi to call the new Mexican President, what's his name? Gotta think up a nickname for that guy.

Anyway, the Mexicans will want a piece of this action per our new North American Governing agreement. Draw up the secret agreement and have the NSA kill anyone who leaks it to the NYTimes."

Border security for Republican lobbyists and their clients.

Hi MominTn,

We all feel the same...have you written to your dem representatives asking this? Also you might try writting a letter to the editor of your local paper.

The DNC is also doing a 50 state strategy and trying to get everyone to sign up with their local chapter (just go looking around this website, you'll find it) and as a group, possibly you can start the change you want to see! You know....be the change....

Well , just let them all stay and one day they'll have your job. You might think this is a joke JUST WAIT AND SEE
COME SEE ME WWW.FREDWILKES.BLOGSPOT.COM

Actually, if Bush is serious about securing the borders BEFORE amnesty, I would say it's the first decision he made in a long long time that makes sense. But, I don't trust Bush. He may be just throwing a bone to his party so they can get better results in the 2006 election.

Bush is so lame, it hurts to watch him try to show authority but noone believes him when he speaks. Once powerful men loose confidence in you, you might as well fold your tent and leave.
That is what has happened to Bush.

There is very little doubt that Democrats will win the majority and then Bush will have to deal with powerful Democrats that can spot a lie a mile away. It will look like Golith going up against Daved. No Contest, Democrats have followed more closely the Word of God so they are the favorite sons. God Blessed Democrats to work according to his purpose, watch them shine.

Duh.

We dont need new legislation. Just enforcement of whats currently on the books. GOP will call this a huge victory, meanwhile not one thing will change.

Cant wait to see how ridiculously spun this will be on HOAX (FOX) News and what type of alternate reality devoid of facts they will spin tonight!

I don't know why they are still running this lie. On Larry King, Bush corrected himself and said he didn't mean any of this to be interpreted this way.

Nothing has changed. Except that more and more people are begining to see how he may be impeached for trying to end American Sovereignty with the SPP and Nasco.

OK I just have to say this. I know I will be a minority considering the site I am on.
But here it is Becasue some say they are of a political party does not mean they are all the same!! That is a problem. Sterotyping is wrong.I am a democrat but I don't beleive in everything they do or of any party. The party system was setup so we would be able to debate. The north vs the south why are we still thinking like they did 200 years ago? Did we not grow as people and a country during that time?

BTW I do beleive the President is doing this for politacal purposes but not becase he is rep or not a dem. Just because he is out of a job soon and needs to posture himself for that, making money doing speechs and such.

Any way thanks for listening (reading) my rant.
and look for my name to be heard soon. As I am tring to run for the office of president. It is time for change! Time for someone who is going to help the country before their wallet ect... I am that person. When my website is up I will post here so you can judge for yourself. Thank you for your time Al Langlois

Posted by Alpatfan2 on July 7, 2006 at 05:47 PM

No Al, you of all people should know that...not all Dems think alike.

If you lurk (or join in - either is good) you will see we often disagree right here on the blog. But we are all Dems....

Good luck with your campaign....come back often, there are some amazing people on this blog and other dem blogs...use them to your advantage....but use them only for good! (No more dictators needed thanks)

I wonder why no one is talking about NAFTA.

I was listening to Sean Hannity 2 days ago and a caller mentioned that this was a flip-flop for W.
Sean asured him that it was no flip flop just an "adjustment to his legislative priorities". Sounded like a flip-flop to me. I publish a blog at www.dumptherepublicans.blogspot.com being somewhat new to the blogosphere I could sure use some traffic,comments, advice.

I've been a democrat my entire life but I disagree with our party this time. Myself and many of my friends believe "illegals" are criminals in the most basic sense. Yes, I said "Illegals" because thats what they are, I can't stand hearing "Undocumented Workers" they are what they are. They broke the law to get here and should not be rewarded for being good at hiding . Too many people have had to wait and are still waiting to be allowed to work in this country and this is a slap in the face to them. I believe we must protect our borders first and go after every single buisness that hires these people. As much as I dislike Bush and his administration I will not vote for a party that will promote a guest worker program unless it includes them going home. Illegals are often paid under the table, american companies will not pay americans a fare wage because they can pay illegals less than min. wage. I believe our party is so busy courting votes from the hispanic communty, it will lose the middle class and minority vote.

Posted by ragincajunwoman on July 7, 2006 at 08:44 PM

ragin, I agree with you in principal. Why should those that came in illegally get in before others waiting in line? But that was part of the compromise, they would have to wait. I'd like to see it 20 years not 12.

Anyway, let's be realistic. How are we going to move 20 million people back to Mexico? Reagan put out the welcome mat 30 years ago and they came. Bush and Clinton ignored it. They are here and rounding them up and sending them back is not feasible.

We have to deal with the situation we have. Just passing laws that nobody intends to enforce is a waste of time. We need to address the real problem of why they came in the first place.....employers hire them knowing there will be no repucussions.

So go after the employers. Make the illegals already here wait 20 years for their citizenship papers and bring back the troops so they can patrol our borders not Iraqi's.

I heard he told Larry King last night that he was mis-underestimated. He's changed his mind or his understanding of what his mind told him he understood. Or some such thing.

He's bobbing and weaving. He wants this as an issue for his incumbent Republican Congress, so they can run on it (supposedly against him) not on Katrina, the occupation, or the soaring cost of energy.

And it's working to some extent. But the thing is that most of those who are so upset with this fake amnesty issue also voted for the Republicans for the last 15 years on guns, abortion, gays and afirmative action. The wouldn't would never vote for us anyway.

It's the independents who don't like the WMD lies, the growing inflation and the way FEMA wasn't there after the hurricanes who we can move to our side. Most people could care less about illegals as long as they "stay in their place."

I say we bump up the probabion period for gaining citizenship from 12 years to 20 and this all goes away.

Posted by SandyH
Reagan put out the welcome mat 30 years ago and they came.

My recollection says that it was Carter and at about the same time. This is what has brought the movie Scarface.

Either way, Carter has just celebrated a 50th wedding aniversity (talk about family values!).

I do agree with you when you said, "So go after the employers. Make the illegals already here wait 20 years for their citizenship papers and bring back the troops so they can patrol our borders not Iraqi's."

As an employer and someone who could profit from the cheap labor offered by illegals, I will not employ them b/c they do not have documentation and do not pay taxes.

We need them, I want them, but lets make it legal, is that to much to ask? Let them fill out the forms, wait in line, then make a fortune in our great country.

SandyH says: "Anyway, let's be realistic. How are we going to move 20 million people back to Mexico?"

How very true. Once anyone can make it across the border, it's almost impossible to send them home. Wouldn't it be better to stop spending all that money on the border patrol, and spend it on unemployment insurance or something? What harm could there be in allowing anyone to just come here when they want?

The DNC needs to explain this to the American people, as a way of promoting their new, free immigration policies.

Unfortunately, the DNC is starting to look like a "Lite" version of the DLC. They really need to follow the lead of the Democrats in the California legislature, who've been quite upfront with their complete support for all immigrants, regardless of whether they're "undocumented" or not.

If the DNC wants to win the support of the majority of Americans, they need to stop doing their own scapegoating and follow the lead of our Democrats in California: start supporting full rights for all immigrants, regardless of status!

what do I see ? Not a shift by Bush. After all it is a word management game he plays so well. Not a shame but a real honest attempt to mask his inability to lead. von.

Party Crasher
Can Houston's king of right-wing talk radio bust into the Texas Senate?

by Paul Sweeney
TheTexas Observer

~snip~
But Patrick saves his most hard-edged oratory for illegal immigrants. He blames them for a rising crime rate, overcrowded schools, an overburdened health-care system, and runaway growth in the state budget. “The number one problem we are facing,” he tells audiences, “is the silent invasion of the border. We are being overrun. It is imperiling our safety.”

“The crime rate is soaring,” he says, “and most of it can be tracked to illegal immigration. There are terrorists and drug runners coming into Texas and the sheriffs in 15 border counties are being asked to stop them with only a .45 on their hip and a shotgun in the trunk. They’ll tell you it’s the federal government’s responsibility,” he adds, “but the cavalry is not coming. It’s up to us to protect our borders.”

Illegal immigrants, moreover, are walking pathogens. “They are bringing Third World diseases with them,” Patrick asserts, citing “tuberculosis, malaria, polio and leprosy.”
~snip~

"What harm could there be in allowing anyone to just come here when they want?"

I am not trying to pick on the author of that statement, so please do not take this personally. It is just such a good example of the undeveloped thinking of many in the Party.

1) Name me one country in the world that allows this. One. Can't find one? And do you think that's because they're all stupid? Or maybe they've evaluated the fiscal, organizational, and labor impact and discovered that unlimited immigration and open borders are a bad thing? Don't agree? Well, maybe you're just smarter than the rest of the world. Or maybe you're wrong.

2) Where shall the extra tax dollars come from to provide basic services for these millions of poor people just searching for a better life? Or do they not require roads, sewage systems, water systems, police protection, schools, medical care, etc.? At low wages, they won't be paying federal taxes, they'll be getting EIC payments. They won't be paying property taxes. Sales taxes are easily and commonly avoided today. Shall it come out of your paycheck or your city's budget? Why not get your town to sponsor a few tens of thousands of these folks since you seem to believe that providing basic services to them won't be any problem at all?

3) No jobs for them in your town? Just wait until every employer in America can request and receive guest workers at lower wages than you'd work for, using an employment agency created and maintained by your tax dollars. Happens routinely today under current immigration law for legal immigrants. Ask anyone in IT whether or not their employer has made minor changes to a job description, made the obligatory "effort" to recruit locally, then hired a legal immigrant for much less than what they paid an American for the same positon. When every employer has this out, market forces will make it inevitable that they will take it. Any smart employer would. Supporting the employer over the American worker is evidently the Democratic Party way! Oh, right, we'll enforce these new laws better than we do the ones today. Saudi Arabia's population is nearly half guest workers. Is that the vision you have of America's future?

4) "But the solution is to redirect current spending away from the military and other unnecessary things and toward social services!" Uh huh. And when you see a snowball's chance of that happening, let me know. Remember the interest on the federal debt? Social Security? Medicare? Current taxation levels cannot cover those basics for citizens who have paid taxes for 30 years in expectation of getting something back, and you want to pretend that money is unlimited. Assume you pay for all of these basic services for 10 million new residents every year and recalculate the next few years federal budgets, then let us know what funding you'd change.

5) Do you know any illegal immigrants or are you just assuming you know how they feel? Making small talk with the guy who mows your lawn doesn't count.

While my exasperation is showing, my questions and the problems I raise are valid ones. If you can answer them intelligently, please do. If you can't, then you really haven't gotten beyond the warm fuzzy feeling you get inside from thinking about how kind you would be to those poor immigrants.

And, BTW, by framing this issue as anyone who's not for amnesty and guests workers is an extremist, the Party has guaranteed a loss in November. Sad for America but good for you; you get to keep that warm fuzzy feeling while the Republicans continue to run this country into the ground.

I have a real problem with the title of this article written by Christy McConville. Even the last name makes me think it is just someone trying to con someone into a false assumption.
My democratic grandfather who worked his entire life in a tire mfg plant certainly would never be for illegal immigration or allowing any immigrants, illegal or not, to take Americans' jobs. And I do not believe it is the "right-wing extremists" who are insisting on border enforcement and enforcing existing laws on the books against any form of illegal immigration.
As you can see, the House of Representatives who are elected locally by district are the only wing of our government that did what the public wants. Even Howard Dean, who spoke on CNN yesterday, realizes that our democracy depends on the will of the people, not some platform that comes from the top down. So Christy,you might want to shut up your name calling.
Too get a good picture of the concerns the governors have with the issues caused by illegal immigration, go to this link which is the National Governors Assoc position:
http://maketiny.com/3Cx
When the states get into a big concern with financing both the crime, healthcare, education, and social services then you know something just isn't right. Who is going to pay for all of this immigration? One way or another it is the tax payer, whether it is federal or state.
Another thing to remember is that there are people mucking up politics by posting on the blogosphere topics which incite others often to their own detriment. Why they do this, could be a job paid by some advertising firm or lobby group or even Rove.
So if you don't know the person, I wouldn't put too much stock in their article.

Excellent link, MominTN.

Sounds like the National Governor's Association, and by logical extention all the state Governors both Democrat and Republican, are siding with the extremists too.

I thought the name of this site was The Democratic Party, not some group that exists in a vacuum, isolated from and failing to consult other Democrats.

I am continually stunned that democrats believe we should have a comprehensive immigration bill. Thats what Bush wants because it ensures a continuing flow of illegal aliens whose very presence in the labor market keeps a downward pressure on wages, benefits. it definitely benefits business, but not the American middle class. They keep saying "jobs Americans will not do". Did these jobs suddenly spring into existance with the appearance of illegal aliens? No. they are jobs Americans did do for good wages and benefits until business found they could hire illegal aliens much cheaper. The senate bill talks about border security, stopping illegal hiring practices, guiding illegal aliens to citizenship. Guess what? there is no funding for any of that in the bill. What agency is going to do all of the above? I.C.E? they can't do their job now. They need vastly increased budget and manpower just to do their current job. The senate bill is a blatant in your face sell out of the American working class. The cost to our infrastructure, our schools, hospitals, social services, and welfare structure will be devastating. Look at the increasing numbers of school dropouts, workers without health insurance and overburdened police forces. These problems will only multiply. The democrats even voted to give illegal aliens social security benefits. this to a system already on the edge of collapse. This is a cry for help. Obviously I cannot vote for the corrupt republicans, neither can I vote for such oblivious democrats. They have all been in office too long, we need a third party. What can we do? We are now really enduring a state of "taxation without representation". I am open to suggestion.

Senator Obama,
I've said for some time that any immigration overhaul must be humane, reasonable and effective. The test for effective reform is straightforward: Congress and the president cannot reform immigration if the federal government cannot control it, and the federal government cannot control immigration unless it first secures our borders and our ports. Any legislation that fails to meet those tests will only worsen what is already a crisis. This immigration deal appears to fail the first test: border security. Geo. Bush and the Republican Party have left this country wide open for terrorists and yet they are known as the Party that has secured this nation.
This would be an excellent time to show Americans that the Democrats are the Party for national security! But…
I couldn’t believe my ears when I heard that YOU voted for Amnesty for the illegal immigrants!?! Do you have any idea what that will cost this nation?? Have you listened to Sen. Jeff Sessions’ report? I know that you’re busy but maybe you ought to watch Lou Dobbs on CNN sometime! He seems to understand the problem! Sounds crazy I know, but his listener base has gone up 36% just because of this immigration problem. The borders need to be closed. People doing illegal activities need to be arrested. You are a law maker. Where is the debate? The law is the law. Do your job. Why are you so concerned about illegal immigrants when there are homeless people living on the streets of Chicago? There are ninety thousand (90,000) homeless in L.A. alone. We all need affordable healthcare. Poor Americans need jobs that pay a living wage, not 8 bucks an hour. But you want to give Amnesty to a bunch of people that broke the law! They illegally entered this country and you want to protect them? Not even the legal immigrants want the illegal in this country. Oh yeah, but the Corporations are making a 300% profit! I sure hope those corporations can pull the line for you the next time you’re up for re-election. From a long time Dem., Close the borders first, then arrest the illegal's and send them home to sort out who will immigrate here first legally.

SOS
Everyone wants to avoid the NAFTA question. Looks like no one wants to solve the problem.

>>Yes, I said "Illegals" because thats what they are, I can't stand hearing "Undocumented Workers" they are what they are.

I didn't know a human being could be "illegal." There is a huge difference between "illegal" as a noun and "illegal" as an adjective.

I am the son of former illegal immigrants (my dad is now a citizen, my mom a permanent resident -- beneficiaries of the Reagan amnesty), what some might call (derisively, I might add) an "anchor baby." I recognize the right of the United States to secure its borders by whatever reasonable means necessary and to enforce its immigration laws; however, it's not that I find deporting 12 million illegal immigrants impossible (Hitler rounded up far more people within a matter of weeks, if not days), I find it unjust. Yes, they broke the law -- I understand that -- but is illegally crossing the border the most heinous crime one can possibly be guilty of? Many of these illegal immigrants have children honorably serving in our armed forces. I'm willing to bet (though I can't prove) that a huge amount of our Hispanic military men and women have a relative or family member illegally residing in this country.

I know many illegal Hispanic youth that would love to prove their loyalty and patriotism by wearing the uniform of our country. Hispanic patriotism stems from an enormous sense of gratitude to the United States. Although many of us illegally came into this country, it has given us opportunities that we wouldn't have found in our countries of descent or origin. So to express our gratitude, we emulate Roy Benavidez, the Mexican-American heroes of Heroe Street USA, and Eugene Obregon, among many, many others.

So should we round up all the illegal immigrants and send 'em back home? OK, fine -- but you'll also have to deport all the Hispanic men and women serving our nation. You'll have to unbury and deport all of our Hispanic military heroes as well, our Medal of Honor recipients, our Purple Star recipients. I don't think most of them spilt their blood so that their family members could be deported, nor do I think I'll be joining the military so that my aunt can be deported, leaving my cousins motherless (and orphaned -- my uncle is dead). But who knows? I might die in my tour of duty. Then I'll have my grave unearthed by Tom Tancredo and have my remains dumped into the Rio Grande.

There are many legal hispanics in our community and serving our country in the military. They should be given preference for jobs and for their family members to immigrate before illegal border crossers.
I know a Vietnamese woman whose dad was an American veteran but when she was allowed to immigrate to America her mom and siblings were all left behind in S. Vietnam which is now controlled by the communists, so she cannot even visit them without being in fear for her life.
Her sister lives in a grass hut and is dirt poor. I do not hear anything about letting them immigrate.
Obviously we cannot take in every poor person in the world who wants to come here. The problems in Mexico need to be fixed by their government instead of their poor people moving here. Maybe the illegal wage earned here is higher than the minimum wage in Mexico or in the USA. I do know the estimates I've received for lawn work and for painting were higher than the Americans I used to do the jobs. I think people are using the Mexicans because we are being told they are cheaper and they are literally making out as bandits with no health or car insurance to pay. As long as we do nothing about it, then why should they go home? If you get in a wreck with one of them, guess whose insurance will have to pay the bill. If you take them to court, how will you get the money they sent to Mexico?

Raza

If you listen, you will not hear anyone on this site or others saying "round 'em up and send 'em home." No one is advocating any kind of massive search and deport mission. No one.

We understand that most came with hopes of building a better life, as they have for years. However, we cannot allow unlimited migration and uncontrolled entry. Mexico needs to learn to take care of its own citizens, and Mexicans need to focus on changing their goverment, not on relying on handouts from ours.

Want to do your part as a citizen-son? Then encourage immigrants to be self-reliant, not to rely on public services, but to accept and abide by the current American philosophy that the taxpayer should not be expected to pay for medical care costs that should be bourne by the individual through direct payment or through paying for health insurance. Nor should the taxpayer be expected to pay for the birthing or daycare of children. Most Americans handle that out of their own pockets. We expect immigrants to do the same. My parents were not wealthy; when the kids were sick, Mom handled it, because we could not afford to pay for medical care. And we grew up just fine. Many citizen-children and immigrants run to the clinic or emergency room for care they would not seek if they had to pay for it, and for care that is not needed. I see this every day. (I lump citizens who sponge off the goverment in this category too. People need to work, and if your work doesn't pay enough, don't complain if your illegal presence is the factor that has driven down your own wage, or if you chose not to develop the skills needed for a better paying job.)

A California poster reported recently that almost half the drivers in California don't have car insurance. Same philosophy -- you need to pay for insurance. Can't afford it? Then don't drive. That's what a law-abiding American would do.

It is the entitlement attitude, the disregard of our laws, and the extreme costs to the taxpayer that are bothering most folks.

Has the DNC become pro big business or has the DNC lost it's mind on illegal immigration?

If the DNC continues to say America needs more cheap labor for big business and an unenforced border, we will lose more elections as we just lost in California.

The DNC needs to get with it. 2004 was handed to Kerry on a platter with the blatant incompetence of the chimp, and it was thrown away because he couldn't take one simple issue like illegal immigration and run with it.

We Democrats want illegal activity by employers and immigrants stopped, and we want to make a fair wage competing with other AMERICANS not with illegals!

Serfer, I wasn't arguing against border enforcement, or massive, uncontrolled immigration. As I previously stated, I recognize the right -- indeed, obligation -- of the United States to secure its borders by whatever reasonable means necessary. What I am against is denying these people the opportunity to legalize their status after already having established lives here. Many of their offspring are serving our country honorably in the armed forces. We're not asking for government hand outs -- we don't want them --, we're simply asking that you legalize our parents, brothers, sisters, aunts, uncles, etc. Sure, if they're criminals, deport them. In fact, if I had my way, I'd deport every rapist, every child molestor, every murderer, regardless of legal status. Just don't deport your lawn mowers, construction workers, cooks, chefs, nannies, etc.

"Just don't deport your lawn mowers, construction workers, cooks, chefs, nannies, etc. "

This kind of thinking is the basic problem. There is no excuse for hiring an illegal alien. People make a living legally in the construction business, in restaurants, in daycares, etc. Do you want to be responsible when someone is injured on your property or working for you? Do you want to expose your family to people who haven't had their vacinations? Do you want to be prosecuted for tax evasion? There are many reasons to not hire illegals. The first one is principle. It takes away jobs from Americans and it drives down the wage earned that law-abiding citizens need to support themselves. Only the wealthy want this scheme to continue because it just means more money for themselves. But it will backfire because once the work ethic in this country is destroyed by rewarding people who work hard with losing their jobs to illegal aliens or outsourcing, they will become like the illegal aliens themselves demanding social services and voting for left-wing presidents like Chavez. The very mindset of wealthy corruption will send them to their grave as broken as Ken Lay. People in this country aren't going to stand for this abuse forever.

But while security might start at our borders, it doesn't end there. Millions of undocumented immigrants live and work here without our knowing their identity or their background. We need to strike a workable bargain with them. They have to acknowledge that breaking our immigration laws was wrong. They must pay a penalty, and abide by all of our laws going forward. They must earn the right to stay over a 6-year period, and then they must wait another 5 years as legal permanent residents before they become citizens.

But in exchange for accepting those penalties, we must allow undocumented immigrants to come out of the shadows and step on a path toward full participation in our society. In fact, I will not support any bill that does not provide this earned path to citizenship for the undocumented population--not just for humanitarian reasons; not just because these people, having broken the law, did so for the best of motives, to try and provide a better life for their children and their grandchildren; but also because this is the only practical way we can get a handle on the population that is within our borders right now. ~ Senator Barack Obama

4 more days and everyone is still avoiding the root cause.
ITS STILL NAFTA, STUPID!