This is when I glaze over and go into overload, as I also read an article yesterday that Greencard holders, (which is what I am) are busy signing up in vast numbers for Citizenship, as they're getting afraid of this whole process of immigration reform, and what it could mean if the rules change.

I'm not sure I want to do that just yet, and don't want to lose my UK citizenship.

In basic language, what exactly do these changes mean for people like me? I'm not good at sifting out the facts sometimes from all the technical language and ideas in articles like this. It's all a bit worrying.

Though I'm guessing as I'm English Caucasian, my legal journey might be a bit less fraught. A mixed blessing, very bittersweet. I sometimes have to remind my Republican friends that I'm an immigrant too, and could be badly affected by this legislation.

People who want to become citizens of the United States must remember that they are agreeing to be spied upon and their rights trampled upon. Something to think about before pledging allegiance.

But, an advantage apparently is that you can have dual citizenship (like Mexicans) and then vote in Mexican elections AND in US elections, as many immigrants from south of the border did recently in the Mexican presidential election.

But, dual citizenship is starting to look pretty good. Maybe I'll seek dual citizenship myself. It's starting to look like it has a lot of advantages over US citizenship.

On the front page of this site, you left out the word statement after Dean's...thought I would mention it. The article about the energy independence.

Chandira, you might want to double check but I believe the UK would still recognize you as a British citizen if you ever decided to return. There are only a couple countries that require you renounce your citizenship, and the US is one of them.

Are we to believe that the Congressional Repubublicans will pass some "get tough" legislation that suggests putting 20 million more poor people in jail? We don't have any room for the ones there already.

So now they want to use these illegals not as cheap labor but slave labor? How would they enforce any such law and does anyone seriously think they would even try...outside of the Arian Nation crowd?

How about winning the occupation in Iraq instead? Do any of the Congressional Republicans have any bright ideas about bringing victory there? In this century?

They're always talking like they mean business, but they never enact any meaningful legislation. Problems never are addressed. Wars turn into occupations that can't be won. Budget surpluses turn to massive national debts.

Speak loudly and carry a fly swatter.

The one thing that occurs to me is that if the repubs can make them criminals,they won`t be able to vote.Obviously,Tom Delay wanted the Mexicans not able to vote with his redistricting.They always have a way of packaging what thay are really after.

What, exactly, is the Democratic position on this issue anyway? It's easy to criticize but much harder to come up with a workable plan.

So, from the tone of this article, the Democratic Party is against border control? Believes that anyone who wants to be here should be allowed to? Supports massive employer fraud and a permanent cheap labor pool? Thinks we can continue to spend tax dollars we don't have on healthcare for citizens of Mexico instead of on taxpaying and voting American citizens? Thinks that those poor big businesses that rely on illegal labor really need help in finding workers, instead of perhaps letting the current (legal) labor market set more appropriate wages? Or thinks that I really care if the price of lettuce rises?

This is the issue for the 2006 elections. COME UP WITH A PLAN if you want to be taken seriously by the swing voters. There are plenty of old-time Democratic principles and ideas that can be applied here, and this issue is one that could get folks who normally would vote Republican to vote Democratic instead.

It's a sad day for America when the only possible balance to the excessive power of the current party cannot figure out a way to leverage this situation. By all means, boycott these events and provide proof to the voters that you really don't care about their concerns.

Amnesty, by any name, will only please your far left base. They aren't enough to regain power. You are losing Moderate Democrates by the droves on this issue.

It's your choice.

The serfer is right on!As Democrats we seem to know what`s wrong,and we are really lousy about putting out our message.We as a party leave ourselves wide open for the repubs because of this.Once again you can not go forward when you`re on the defensive all the time.The republican party is not going to change!My question is the Democratic Party going to evolve into what it needs to?You can`t expect different results doing the same thing!Some people see it loud and clear,but the majority of our representatives are too complacent,can`t change,or whatever.Most of them are still trying to be friends with the repubs?It`s not a user friendly relationship,and it doesn`t work.Our Democratic senators&congress people need to pull together!If you don`t fight for something,you stand for nothing!

We put out our plan and Frist and the rest of the Republicans in the Senate adopted it...it was a good compromise on a serious problem that action needs to be taken on.

The Repubicans in the House are stalling and would rather continue with the same plan Reagan put forth 30 years ago....don't do anything except let employers continue to hire illegals for rock bottom wages with no chance of ever becoming legal.

We have our plan. It's been out there for months now. Where do you get your news?

"It is time for Republicans to stop playing political games with immigration and join Democrats in fighting for comprehensive immigration reform that strengthens our borders, PROTECTS U.S. WORKERS AND THEIR WAGES, reunites families and allows hard-working immigrants who pay taxes and OBEY THE LAW the opportunity to earn the right to apply for the responsibilities of citizenship."
You cannot protect the U.S. workers and their wages if you allow all the illegal immigrants to remain in this country.
There are no illegal immigrants who are obeying the law so none of them should be given amnesty or the opportunity to earn the right to apply for citizenship unless they go back home and apply to come here legally. Is it fair to reward the ones who broke the law to get here with citizenship and ignore the ones who are obeying the law and have applied to come here?
The Democratic Party has some cockeyed views on immigration and the environment and my family and I will be voting for the candidate who best represents our views on both issues.
Illegal is illegal and should not be rewarded!

Have you read the Senate bill? And you still think it's a good solution? Amazing.

The amount of federal bureaucracy that will have to be created (and funded) to administer this bill could make NASA look small. And why, exactly, should we be spending money on a system for providing "approved" foreign workers to businesses physically located in the US? Can't they find employees on their own AND obey the law at the same time?

You prefer this expenditure on citizens of other nations and on businesses that won't be hiring Americans over, say, better medical care? better roads? providing an old-age safety net to our own citizens? Oh, right, we'll just borrow more money. . . just like the Republicans.

If the Senate bill is the Democratic Party's official plan, then the Party deserves to lose for selling out the American worker.

Employer enforcement, border control. It is really that simple.

If the Senate bill is the Democratic Party's official plan, then the Party deserves to lose for selling out the American worker.

Employer enforcement, border control. It is really that simple.

Posted by Serfer
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Oh, SHUT UP with that crap.It's not going to work.The only reason why it was discussed was to excite, well ......YOU!

I see it worked.You played right into it.How does it feel to be treated like fish? A few flakes of bull sh*t and here you come.

"gulp, gulp, gulp I'm a stupid fish with an 8 second memory......."

I am a card carrying Democrat. In fact, every time I use my credit card the DNC gets a donation. However, on this issue, it appears the DNC is more concerned with the rights of criminals, spies, terrorists and other illegal aliens rather than US citizens. If the DNC cares more about the future votes of illegals rather than the present and future security of US citizens, than I must voice my opposition in the only way possible, by voting for a pro-US politician. DNC, have you forgotten your base?

I honest-to-god do not know WHERE people are getting the idea that Howard Dean and the DNC are looking to leave the borders alone and let people keep streaming acrosss! WHERE did you people hear this? It is WRONG!

Go up to the Search bar, put in immigration and you will see all the recent speechs and articles on immigration.

EVERY DEM WANTS THE BORDERS CLOSED, LIKE THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN AFTER 9/11, AND SECURED. THEY ALSO WANT PORTS SECURED, BUT THE REPUBS ARE JUST LETTING THEM SIT THERE INVITING ATTACK, TOO!

Get your facts straight before you decide on who you will vote for.

Pam is 100% right go to google search guys and you'll see recent articles and speeches on the immigration issue.

And to the poster above who wrote about the DNC concerned with the rights of criminals,spies,terrorists,etc is just stupid and BS!

Freedom and Pam

You are missing the point entirely. Here on this board you have average Democrats explaining to you that the Democratic message is being misperceived, is perhaps not in line with the voters the Party needs to win over if the Party really wants to regain any power, and all you can do is slam or say "gee, can't you read." Lovely way to win votes.

The purpose of political statements by the Party are either (1) to please the roughly 30% that would never ever vote Republican anyway, or (2) win votes by encouraging someone in the 70% to either go to the polls in the first place or to change their vote from R to D.

Sounds like you're just fine with option (1). Unfortunately, only option (2) can change the balance of power in Washington.

You're obviously in a conceptual box and cannot honestly see how the statements by the Party are in fact damaging the Party's chances of winning over enough of the 70% to do any good this November. That's fine, we all struggle with our own boxes, and you're entitled to your opinion. But you are willfully disregarding and dismissing well-intentioned advice from like-minded individuals, instead of giving it some real thought.

Unfortunately, all of the illegal aliens aren't lettuce pickers.
Here is just one of the many illegals that is a criminal and has raped many women in Nashville. It was in today's paper.
"Former FBI Top Ten Fugitive Ruben Hernandez Martinez, who is accused of being a serial rapist, pleaded not guilty Wednesday to 26 counts of rape.

The former Nashville construction worker, who was jailed two weeks ago after a four-year extradition process, is accused of terrorizing women in south Nashville in a series of armed home invasions and rapes in 1997-1998.On at least one occasion, authorities said, Martinez was not alone.

He and Luis Castanan were accused of attacking a woman at knifepoint after invading her Edmondson Pike apartment on the night of May 17, 1998. Castanan was convicted of his role in the crime and sentenced to 60 years in prison.

Martinez, 38, fled to his home country, Mexico, and was placed on the FBI's Ten Most Wanted Fugitives list on May 1, 2002. He was arrested the next day but didn't return to Nashville to face charges until two weeks ago. Authorities said he was in the country illegally at the time of the crimes.

He is also charged with four counts of aggravated burglary, two counts of especially aggravated kidnapping, one count of attempted rape and one count of fleeing the Nashville jurisdiction.

Martinez, 38, entered the plea through his lawyer, Nashville attorney Jerry Gonzalez."

Until the border is secure, and all of the current criminals are caught and prosecuted, I really don't think we should take in any more illegal border crossers.
The candidates that are the strongest against crime will win. We would rather pay more for our produce than be victims.

ITS STILL NAFTA, STUPID!

I really think hard facts about strengthening the border security and appropriation bills to fight agaist crime is what the Democrats should be doing. This lawlessness is hurting many border states. It is also making it difficult on legal Mexican immigrants who deserve to be paid the minimum wage and do not deserve to be treated as though they were illegal aliens. The Democrats are too quiet on this matter for their own good. I think John Edwards saying that illegal aliens were just good people looking for jobs hurt the democrat ticket in the last presidential election. The American public just isn't that stupid. There is no reason to wait until Dec 2007 to require a passport to return to the USA across the Mexican border. Fraudulent id rings need to be busted, people who are using the same social security number need to be arrested and prosecuted, and people who apply for welfare, drivers licenses, and other federal and local services illegally need to be deported. The Democratic party needs to get law enforcement out in front of the public and put together a plan for ensuring protections for its citizens. Talking about a guest worker program at the same time is just falling on deaf ears and isn't going to win you anything.

Serfer:

If this Republican Administration were not such prodigals, we would have the money to handle the borders, proper education in public schools, health and dental for all citizens and would not have a problem with imigration.

I would say that the immigration problem is going to get worse since Vicente FOX has managed somehow to steal the election in Mexico for the Conservative RED, undoubtedly the way it was done here in the United States.

Although the United States should have border control, what is happening to the people in Mexico and the United States is not the people's fault, but is a plan being carried out by the government of the United States and the government of Mexico setting the working people up to have only an elite capitalists class and the working and poor class. No MIDDLE CLASS of working people, ONLY Professional academics.

Serfer...Agreed the DNC doesn't get it on immigration. They are taking either the tact to attack the House bill as racist or to say nothing. If 10 average Democrats were polled I'd surmise that 7 of them would favor the House bill instead of amnesty and huge increase in immigration of the Senate bill. In addition to the base the Democratic candidates need to get votes from independents and some Rs. Appeasing to the base on this does nothing.

====================

Kirsten says...."There are only a couple countries that require you renounce your citizenship, and the US is one of them."

I don't believe the US requires one to renounce dual citizenship. There are those with dual Israeli-US citizenship but maybe they get special dispensaion...lol.