pound the lying republicans with truth and watch them melt like the wicked witch.

Good morning, everyone.

I'm interested in this: (not the poll part)

Religion Is Powerful Predictor of Vote in Midterm Elections

This is interesting...tax payers money at work?

Teams vie for U.S. border security contract

Five industry teams are competing for a $2.1 billion contract to be awarded next month to help the U.S. Department of Homeland Security beef up security along over 7,500 miles of U.S. borders with Mexico and Canada.

Cleveland = forget about ever winning Ohio.

That ought to scare the Hell out of you.

Posted by RuebenHolstein on August 31, 2006 at

That's right...the terrorists are planning on invading CLE in 2008. It's the RNC National Convention.

Essy, in the morning....

can you explain what is on that paper audit from those Diebolt machines? I couldn't figure our what all the dribble was when I voted in the primary. I didn't ask the election judges, because they seemed pretty confused about the whole thing...it being the first time they had dealt with the machines, too.

Thanks in advance. Good night.

Posted by SandyH on August 30, 2006 at 11:55 PM

You figured it out, it's dribble. No, it's votes cast that are encrypted so that your ballot is secret. VVPAT will be used for any mandatory and otherwise needed recounts. The votes match the database that is downloaded from the memory cards as well as what is stored on the archives of the machines themselves. We maintain the paper rolls as required by state law. 6 months regular, 22 months federal.

And no, usually the pollworkers don't understand. It's difficult enough for them to get the units up and running and deal with the public on election day. You know that, you have worked the polls before. It's my most favorite and most stressful part of my job...training pollworkers. It's difficult dealing with all those personalities. In my real 3-D life, I have a tendency not to take anyone's crap...I must take care of pollworkers with a velvet touch.

I'm sure one of the computer gurus can answer it more technically. I've read that the machines can even be hacked while a person votes...(must make a note to train pollworkers to watch for those voters with screwdrivers and jump drives).

These machines are not tried and true. There first real test will be nationwide during our mid term elections.

Please, cast an optical scan ballot. It is the most accurate paper trail. Follow ALL directions so that your vote will count. Know the election laws in your state.

For those of you who want to know more, you are permitted to observe the testing of the machines and ask questions. It's called a public L & A test. There are deadlines to submit your request, so once again, know your election laws. They might be listed on your Sec. of States/Election website or better yet, call your local county board of elections.

It's amazing how we can take cash out of a teller machine and have a paper trail but they give us near criminal excuses why a paper trail is not available for electronic voting machines.

Posted by Bruno on August 31, 2006 at 12:43 AM

sigh...here's a site that lists which states have VVPAT.

Voter-Verified Paper Audit Trail Laws & Regulations (As of 8/30/06)

The reason (live hard and) Die Bold didn't automatically make a paper trail, was because HAVA 2002 didn't require it. It is to be made by each states legislators. How do I know this? I'm the one in OH who asked the powers that be here while visiting Global Solutions in Canton. I was shunned by my own peers for doing so. I try to have common sense prevail. Working in elections for the past 14 years, and being a voter myself, I thought it a reasonable "demand". I suggested they (die bold) make a proto type with an internal paper trail as well as a receipt that MUST be returned to the pollworkers, much like the paper punch cards were. (NO, receipts shouldn't walk out the door with the voter! Too easy for FRAUD. you know...I'll give you $10 for some (insert your favorite vice here) if you give me your voted receipt that shows you voted for XXX candidate)

tut tut, looks like rain...Christopher Robin

Bellwether For a Bitter Election

If you seek this year's emblematic election, look at Missouri. In this bellwether state, which has voted with the winner in 25 of the past 26 presidential elections, the U.S. Senate contest between incumbent Republican Jim Talent and state auditor Claire McCaskill encompasses today's political controversies.

You're welcome.

The Democrats' Dysfunctional Calendar

Well, the Democrats have gone and messed it up again.

Good morning, all.

Thanks Essy. I thought there had to be a good reason for all the giberish. But I still would like to have something in my hand to tear off and put in a secure voting box.

I know that is silly. But I still remember those old machines where you pulled down a lever after you voted. I gave you closure are something.

I guess having my computer crash so many times and losing data has made me leary of the new technology. All those reports by hackers who have tested the new machines don't help either.

I'll take your advise. We have the choice of using the opti-scan. You have to have a really good documented excuse to get an absentee. I'm working for a candidate on an election day, so I just have to get my slacker ass out early and vote.

Thank you, everyone, for once again proving that I live up to my name.

Remember to laugh and smile everyday...and flirt if you can get away with it. (***winking at DPD***

Posted by PeppermintLizzy on August 30, 2006 at 11:42 PM)

I'm off to witness a rep. from the SOS office change the security keys on our cards and put the finishing touches on my pollworker training packets.

Enjoy the morning.

Sandy,

Always a pleasure to read you. I hope to meet you in person some day. I'd be honored.

Have a good one!

As my Pretty Bird says...late!

Talent, 49, lost a race for governor in 2000 by 21,445 votes, and won two-thirds of a Senate term in 2002 by 21,254

We need to identify and get 22,000 more voters to the polls, and they need to trick 22,000 voters. Claire has been making in roads in the rural areas, while we work the the rest. It's goin going to be a very bitter election indeed.

Good morning Dems.
Well we will have a wet weekend as well for the holiday. Thanks Ernesto! 69 more days until election day.
Have a great day everyone.

Iran is a clear threat and Iraq is a mess. It is now time to deal with these issues up front.

WE NEED TO CONSOLIDATE EUROPE AND OUR NATO ALLIES TO PROTECT THE DEMOCRACY IN IRAQ AND IN PARTICULAR PROTECT IRAQI OIL AND PRODUCE MORE, AS WE SANCTION AND CUT OFF IRAN.

WE NEED TO RECONNECT WITH VENEZUELA AND OTHER OIL PRODUCTING NATIONS, AND BEGIN ASAP WITH A GOVERNMENT SPONSORED PLAN TO LIQUIFY THE OIL SHARE IN COLORADO THAT PRESUMABLY EXCEEDS ALL WORLDWIDD KNOWN OIL RESERVES.

WE NEED TO TURN TO ALTERNATIVE ENERGY IN THE PROCESS BEFORE WE BURN UP AND OUT OUR PLANET.

WE NEED LEADERSHIP WHO WILL EVALUATE THE REALITIES OF THE BUSH MESS, THE REALITIES OF THE WORLD AND THE CRISIS THAT WE ARE IN, AND TAKE ACTION TO PROTECT OUR INTERSTS AND THE CITIZENS OF THE US.

Neither Bush nor the Dems are taking any foresighted actoins to protect Americans, only to protect the corportocracy, or to appeal to sometimes idealistic liberal causes. There is a gun to our heads, does not anyone have a solution other than to pander.

Some other ideas. WE need to stop buying middle east oil and then get off oil for the benefit of our planet, and Iraq appears to be an opportunity. Turn LEMONS INTO LEMONADE.

CORRECTION -- That is SHALE 0il in Colorado.

I'm working for a candidate on an election day, so I just have to get my slacker ass out early and vote.

Posted by SandyH on August 31, 2006 at 08:03 AM

Good morning, y'all

Sandy, that is a good excuse. Vote early! Any time you're working at the polls, you are entitled to an early vote.

Yikes, Sandy--let me clarify that. Those are legitimate grounds for voting absentee. And when we're through getting clair elected, let's work on lobbying for election reform in that regressive state. We can vote early here, for no reason whatsoever. It makes it easier on everyone and why not? This is a constitutional right and responsibility. Look at the leadership where the voting laws are ridiculous and you'll find the likes of J.Kenneth Blackwells, etc.

I'll read you tonight--been out of town on business. GO Claire!!!

Posted by Esmeralda on August 31, 2006 at 07:09 AM

Morning all,

Jacque, this proves why Republicans always throw in some reference to the Bible or God into their platforms, to sway these churchgoers into believing that a Republican vote is a vote for Godliness!

(btw, we have an Evangelical church nearby, which has grown from small house size, into a huge facility which is currently undergoing more construction right now. My daughter's best friend's husband attends regularly. They are barely scraping by, because he has bought into their rhetoric "As you tithe, so shall ye prosper" and ends up some months throwing them as much as $900! brainwashing seems to be easy ! )

If the Dems want to look strong in the face of the Bush machine, they have to be honest about how to protect the US.

We need the help of Europe and all oil producing nations to get us off Iran's oil, and to change to other alternate energies. We have that ability and if we can control and protect Iraq's production in the interim, and at the same time show strength to protect their statehood for both a local cause and greater cause, i.e. Iran having nuclear weapons, then we need to get a concensus to do all of this.

If the Republicans jump on this the Dems will be the winers and weak ones, and will lose again, as there is handwriting on the wall that Iran is a great threat. We all know this. But we are doing nothing to protect against it.

Check out the Colorado Oil Shale reserves, that work when oil hits $80 per bbl. The oil companies may not like this approach, but we need to move into these areas, and nationalize the Colorado oil to put profits and money into our treasury just like other oil producing nations do, and fortify our military, and our infrastructure/educational system.

Wake up and offer some ideas to the problems.

Does anyone hear the political ideas that are being offered up for debate, so that they can be analyzed and offered as leadership ideas, or is this just a social chat room.

Howard! Howard! Bueller!

Now I know why I am registered repubulican. Maybe they are corrupt, but they brainstorm the impossible and keep good ideas alive for further thought and problem solving.

Good bye to this social room for now. Hopeuflly someone will pick up my Iraq - Iran - global warming issue, and take the charge to refine it, debate it, and help to give the Dems a path to solve the problem and stand out as leaders.

Sorry for being so hard on all of your, but my past experience with this blog is that there is definitely a social clique (maybe repubican operatives) who let good issues die. This is not a chat room, but a blog that is intended to help our nation. I guess I am the idealistic one.

Howdy All! I hope you have been well. With the Bushies on the rhetoric trail again, here is an excellent op ed on who the true appeasers are:The true Iraq appeasers
By Peter W. Galbraith | August 31, 2006

IN HIS MOST recent justification of his Pentagon stewardship, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld reached back to the 1930s, comparing the Bush administration's critics to those who, like US Ambassador to Britain Joseph P. Kennedy, favored appeasing Adolf Hitler. Rumsfeld avoided a more recent comparison: the appeasement of Saddam Hussein by the Reagan and first Bush administrations. The reasons for selectivity are obvious, since so many of Hussein's appeasers in the 1980s were principals in the 2003 Iraq war, including Rumsfeld.http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2006/08/31/the_true_iraq_appeasers/?p1=MEWell_Pos3

Maybe they are corrupt, but they brainstorm the impossible and keep good ideas alive for further thought and problem solving.

I am still waiting for any 'good ideas' to come out of the Republicans for future thought and problem solving!

You go to ANY blog, and you will see that if you offer your issues or ideas they are not automatically jumped on and discussed at that minute.

We have discuseed security, oil dependency, etc many, many times here. Seems you missed them.

(ps, in this day and age here in the USA, I would not brag that I was still registered as a Republican!)

Wreck

Hop on the Change Wal-Mart bus

The average Wal-Mart employee makes $2,000 below the national poverty level. Each Wal-Mart store on average costs the community up to $420,000 per year. Those costs come from many public assistance programs such as $108,000 per year for children's health care costs and $42,000 per year for low-income housing assistance, per store. Currently, Wal-Mart's unaffordable health care leaves more than half its employees without company heath care at a $1.39 billion yearly cost to taxpayers. These jobs also come at the expense of competing stores, with better pay and benefits, which eventually are forced out of business as they cannot compete with the taxpayer-subsidized Wal-Mart.

Wis. congressman told to return PAC cash

Republican gubernatorial candidate Mark Green must return $468,000 in campaign cash he had raised as a member of Congress, Wisconsin's Election Board ruled Wednesday.

AFL-CIO launches $40 million campaign

By its estimates, the AFL-CIO is counting on a 5 percent increase in turnout. If successful, the union said, it would add 310,000 union votes to Democrat Ted Strickland's race for Ohio governor. Pennsylvania union voters could boost Democrat Bob Casey's bid to unseat Sen. Rick Santorum by 155,000 votes.

Good morning Dem's. It seems we've forgotten that "wakeupamerica" is the one who determines topics.
Sorry! Maybe we'll remember tomorrow or, perhaps, we'll continue to comment on those things that interest each of us.
As a christian, my understanding of tithing is not that it is a prerequisite for entry to heaven. I have learned it is one more way we can mirror the image of God. He is a loving and generous God and we should follow that example. However, the bible also teches that a "man" who doesn't take care of his own is worse than a non-believer. Most importantly we are to be good stewards of our assets. If both partners can't agree on tithing, my preacher would suggest tithing only on one partners share.
Another added benefit to any consistent charitable giving- whatever the charity- is that it requires more communication about a family's finances. I have found that that generally leads to better communication in other areas of a couples life.
Just food for thought.
Did anyone see the report on CNN this morning about the neighborhood redevelopment program in Detroit?

Good posts Kristen.
I never have understood the transfer of election funds. Why should candidates be allowed to keep overages at all?
If I donate $ to a person for one position, that doesn't mean that he /she has my vote in perpetuity.
Do you know if candidates are still allowed to personally keep those funds when they are no longer in office?

Posted by fade2bluz on August 31, 2006 at 09:01 AM

Hi, fade. Missouri is a regressive state. We had a horrible time getting an absentee for my mother-in-law when she was undergoing cancer treatment. Now that the Republicans are in charge in the state house, they are just making matters worse with these state IDs. They don't believe in the Constitution and particular the Bill of Rights except for gun ownership.

I'll voted absentee several times, because I was working as an election judge at a poll or the county board office on election day. Otherwise, you pretty much have to be taking a trip on the space suttle to get one.

Gotta run. later.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 10:16 AM

Gina, what I'm amazed about is that elected officials facing criminal charges are able to drop out of their campaigns and use campaign contributions to pay their legal fees.

Hi Gina,

Thank you for your comments on tithing.

This particular couple actually divorced over the fact that he was bleeding them dry with tithing, and they have since re-married with the understand that he would use better judgement in the amounts. He thinks if you give more, you will prosper more. He is having a hard time breaking that mentality, but is better than he was.

Feeling morally, intellectually confused? - Keith Olberman

The man who sees absolutes, where all other men see nuances and shades of meaning, is either a prophet, or a quack.

Donald H. Rumsfeld is not a prophet.

Ranger, Kristen, et al:

Sorry for all the double postings yesterday afternoon. I kept getting error messages. Then I had to leave work to get home to walk the dog, feed the cats and the dog, my little pug Frasier. So, tried to sign on from home and that wouldn't work. It forced me to reregister which I did (so if you see a new moniker called "lafrasier" that's me). That wouldn't work either. Couldn't sign on. Pisses me off because trollers can get on and post but I couldn't. Am hoping the problem gets rectified. Although I mostly lurk, I have to say that I respect your opinions and come here to hear, for the most part, the same opinions that I have. You guys are my inspiration to try to keep positive in this negative time that Shrub & Co. has created. I truly believe we're heading into the worst times that no one believed could happed in this country. I'm sad, angry, bewildered, etc. Anyway, I'll try to post later and try again from home this evening. Hugs & kisses everyone.

Laura

Speaking of Keith! Write your letter of Thanks to Keith and to MSNBC. the Right Wing radical wing are!!!

From DailyKos:
"You've watched the video.

You've read the blog.

You've posted the comments.

But have you written your letter to MSNBC. Have you written a letter to counterpoint the form letters that the rightwingers are trying to unleash on MSNBC right now.

The Netroots helped in getting a US Senator that said he was a Democrat, but did things that were not what a Democrat should be - thrown to the curb. Are we going to prevent the swiftboating of a journalist (remember what a journalist truly was) who stood up and told Donald Rumsfeld were to stick it?

Six Degrees of Aaron's diary :: ::
The Execs at NBC really don't know what to think of Olbermann's smackdown of Rumsfeld last night. So they are going to have to see what viewers say and that is where we need to unleashed hell itself. The inboxes at MSNBC need to be overflowing with support for Olbermann.

Just like in "Good Night, and Good Luck", the switchboard needs to be going off the hook right now. So open up your email account at hit them now - hard. And then keep hitting them over and over again until they get the point.

1. viewerservices@msnbc.com
2. letters@msnbc.com
3. countdown@msnbc.com
4. KOlbermann@msnbc.com 5. dabrams@msnbc.com

Then tonight - everyone watchs Countdown. Give the show the pop it needs in the ratings. No watching Hardball and then no watch Scarborough afterwords. Just Countdown. If you have a TiVo use it (ratings are collected according to TVNewswer).

It is time for the Netroots to show their power again.

Hi Puggles, glad to see you back today. Wish you would find time to post more often. :)

I personally think that a trip to the loo is a perfect place to listen to Bush's speach, it makes it easier when you want to vomit.

Flushes and blushes over Bush speech

NEW YORK (Reuters) - The U.S. economy may be in recession, based on Midwest manufacturing data, a report said on Thursday.

According to Kingsbury International, a partner of NAPM Chicago which puts out The National Association of Purchasing Management-Chicago business barometer, "the U.S. economy could be in a recession at this time."

...hopefully they will wake us up when they have this figured out.

Isn't this an obvious first step in any campaign reform? Any overage should be given to that level's school district, as an example. Local office goes to local school, district to all included districts, statewide to state dept. of education.
Even better, perhaps all political campaign overages should be used just for maintenance of exsisting schools and construction of new ones.
Also, the advantage of incumbents would be diminshed and create a more level plaing field for challengers.
The biggest problem with any campaign reform is that it will always cut both ways. This is why career politicians, of all stripes, can keep disagreeing with each other. It keeps the issue alive with their base and little is accomplished.

Kristen:

Thanks. I'm going to make the effort, but it's difficult from work. Too many spys reporting me that I'm on the Internet. The rethuglican lawyers are always snooping trying to look over one's shoulders. Then of course the IT Dept. thru their spying, monitors our pcs and reports their findings to HR. It's the firm's way of making sure that we are kept uninformed. Very stressful. (Have been looking for a new employer since I got here 2 yrs ago, but jobs at my age and salary are few and far between. Have the problem of being too experienced. They would rather hirer someone that is young and inexperienced so they can keep the salaries low.) When I go home, I have to entertain 3 cats and a dog. Everyone wants attention. By the time I've exhausted them, it's time for bed. Anyway, thanks for responding. You make me feel like I belong. BBL

Laura

P.S.- Tithing is giving 10% of ones income. For most people this isn't enough to "bleed" anyone dry. Anything over that is not "required". In my understanding, there isn't a "first class" section in heaven for those who give more. God isn't running a protection racket. Unfortunately, some of those in the "faith business" are.

A SATIRE BASED ON REPUBLICAN FACT CHECKING:

GOP - Republican Speech Writers and Historians have performed extensive fact checking then allowed the following speeches released by Cheney and Rumsfeld.

Yesterday VP Cheney released a speech which claimed the Islamic Radicals are follower of Mussolini, ”the Duchie” (LL DUCE) therefore they will be classified as Italians.

Rumsfeld quickly followed with speeches that proclaimed the 9-11 bombing were conducted by Hitler who survived World War II. Therefore the attackers and their supporter will be reclassified as Germans.

GW Bush reiterated his support for the good jobs Cheney and Rumsfeld are performing and claimed he would never call anyone who do not support his cause as Terrorists but now reclassified as Italians. The Italians who are linked to 9-11 are Germans. Therefore he would call anyone who does not support his war effort, Germans.

LB attended another thug fundraising event yesterday after leaving Seattle. This time for the bigot Senator Burns. It must really be bad for Bush when he has to pimp his wife out because she is the only one in the family people can stand. BTW, how many times can this guy step in it?

Sen. Burns: Terrorists drive taxis by day, kill at night

Man, where do I go to vote for this???

A Vote to Quit the Electoral College

Legislators pass a bill that could launch a national movement to elect the president by popular vote.

SACRAMENTO — Lawmakers sent Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger a bill Wednesday that would make California the first state to jump aboard a national movement to elect the president by popular vote.

Under the legislation, California would grant its electoral votes to the nominee who gets the most votes nationwide — not the most votes in California. Get enough other states to do the same, backers of the bill say, and soon presidential candidates will have to campaign across the nation, not just in a few key "battleground" states such as Ohio and Michigan that can sway the Electoral College vote.

http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.latimes.com%2Fnews%2Flocal%2Fla-me-legis31aug31%2C0%2C4024121.story%3Fcoll%3Dla-home-local

At the republican rallies ... GOP request all should hold signs proclaming:

Stop Terrorists (Cross that Out and Replace it with Facist and Cross that Out and Replace it with ...and cross that out and replace it with ...?

GOP Labels ...ain't it fun as a gun to stick labels. What to do at the next political rally?

We need more money to fund the fact checker to come up with better labels.

Good Morning Vietnam, uh! I mean America.

Posted by Esmeralda on August 31, 2006 at 07:45 AM

My point was meant to imply that banks have a paper trail. I would agree that potential corruption of voters would NOT make it a good idea to hand the voter a receipt showing how they voted.

Posted by Kristen on August 31, 2006 at 09:56 AM
public assistance programs such as $108,000 per year for children's health care costs and $42,000 per year for low-income housing assistance, per store. Currently, Wal-Mart's unaffordable health care leaves more than half its employees without company heath care at a $1.39 billion yearly cost to taxpayers
Your point is well taken. To expand on it, I don’t understand why we permit corporations to increase shareholder earnings by dumping these expenses on middle-class workers. When examining hidden costs, Wal-Mart and other big-box stores may not be cheaper than a well run mom and pop with benefits to workers.

I wish more states followed California's lead. First, the fight to stop global warming, then getting rid of the electoral college. Things couldn't be any more inspiring....

I wish environment was a bigger issue. If the Repubs like fear mongering, then blast them using their weak border security, immigration reform and utter disregard for global warming as terrorism/fascism.

one note on the fundraiser yesterday in Bellevue that was attended by Laura Bush. My husband was telling me about how the day went and he said that there had been a number of protestors on the corners around the hotel but before they moved Laura Bush out of the area all the protestors just seemed to disappear.

It seems even LB can't be bothered with being faced with dissent.

I'm sure it's been mentioned but Ted Stevens (Alaska) has been identified as the senator holding up the legislation funding to permit us to see how our tax dollars are being spent on contracts.

Frist credited bloggers for forcing the issue into the limelight.

That would truly return us to 1 man, 1 vote.
The country has changed so much since the inception of the electoral college.
Again, this can cut both ways. It will show which party truly wants the people to have their say.
I believe that Democrats are more preparedif such a radical change occurs.

A question. Since we are aware of the problems with technology, as well as its benefits, why is this nation in such a rush to entrust our most precious asset- our VOTE- to its' weaknesses?
I know it speeds the process up, but at what cost?

Good morning Bruno

1 man 1 vote sounds good to me, and screw electronic voting, stick to paper/hard copy stuff

I was reading about the WLF coming up. I noted the smallest contribution that can get you in, is listed as $250.00.
As Dem. women can't we start a "lottery" or a special selection process for women who have ideas and may not have the money to attend such events? Wouldn't that offer dignity and areal place at the table to some who normally aren't heard?

Gina W - I'm not sure I understand what you mean here:
The country has changed so much since the inception of the electoral college.

The Electoral College was established in Article 2, Section 1 of the Constitution, at the inception of our country.

In this article http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/08/30/AR2006083003177.html

and many others, it is documented that now Bush is saying the Democrats are "appeasing the terrorists" by their policy of wanting to "cut and run". What is appeasing the terrorists is Bush's policy of staying in Iraq! The terrorists want nothing more then for the American forces to stay there so they can refine their tactics against amjor world power. They would not have that oppurtunity any place else. That is playing into the terrorists hand, not leaving! If the terrorists could vote, they would vote for Bush so the US would stay there.

American policy has created a "terrorists petri dish" that they have thrived in. Where no terrorism existed before on this scale, US policy has created it.

Bush is like an exterminator who breaks into your house, throws food and garbage all over the place, and then when the place is rat and cockroach invested says "See! You need me to be here! The vermon are taking over!"

LONDON, England (Reuters) -- British public broadcaster Channel 4 is courting controversy with what it calls a "shockingly real" drama about the fictional assassination of President George W. Bush.

"Death of a President," shot in the form of a documentary examining the assassination, will use a blend of archival footage and computer-generated special effects to portray Bush in October 2007 arriving in Chicago during an anti-war rally.

In the film, Bush is killed by a sniper, and the investigation quickly focuses on a Syrian-born man. It will air in October on Channel 4's More4 digital channel, as well as at the Toronto Film Festival in September.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/SHOWBIZ/TV/08/31/media.channel4.reut/index.html

Blue in Idaho - I think that is kind of sick.

btw, Jacque when you come in at lunch or break, just thought I would comment on your post which included even CT would have problems with their voting.

We are not using electronic this fall! A few towns will have trial ones set up, but we will still be using our good old lever ones. We ARE going to optical scan when we do, which I am told will be up and running in 2007.

This Year's New Supreme Court Clerks:Why Are Only Twenty Percent Women?

Every summer at the Supreme Court, one set of law clerks departs, and another set gets down to the business of preparing the justices for the new term starting in October. This year, the new cadre of clerks is notable in at least one respect: Of the 36 incoming clerks only 7 - less than 20% -- are women. Four justices - Antonin Scalia, David Souter, Clarence Thomas, and Samuel Alito - despite having four clerkship slots apiece, have not hired a single woman.

Seven out of 36 is a startlingly small number. According to the American Bar Association, 49% of law school graduates from 2005 were women. While I do not have statistics for the top law schools from which Supreme Court clerks are drawn, anecdotal evidence suggests that the ratio is much the same as for law schools generally.

http://writ.news.findlaw.com/lazarus/20060831.html

Yes pear, I know that. The theory was to give smaller states an equal footing. Don't you the country has changed since the original 13 on the Atlantic?

I may have problems with Bush, but that isn't my idea of funny. But only because it specifies a sitting president.

Growing up in politics, my father always demanded I respect the office, regardless of the officeholder.

The more important number is the number of women who applied for those positions.

We won't be asked if we don't stand up.

Gina - pardon my confusion. I thought you were referring to re-instating a one man - one vote that had never existed on a federal election level. I must have read it wrong.

Sorry.

Posted by pear on August 31, 2006 at 11:42 AM

Not my idea...and I don't generally condone or encourage fantasizing about killing a leader of a country, any country. It would be interesting to see if they speculate through the movie about what life would be for the US and the rest of the world without King George. IMO, probably not much, because we all realize that he cannot do anything without Rove and Cheney's hands up his behind directing his movements.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 11:54 AM

Actually, the number has remained steady as half of the student body are women. These are coveted positions that pretty much guarantee a successful career. I don't think it is a stretch to believe that the men on this court, who have shown somewhat bigoted behaviour in the past, choose to hire mirror images of themselves.

Posted by Bruno on August 31, 2006 at 11:12 AM

Believe it or not, Bruno, I usually get everyone's point.

Posted by PamB on August 31, 2006 at 11:48 AM

I was merely joking about the voting in CT due to sore loserman. ;p

Kristen, am trying today, but it's pretty busy at work. I think I'm going to barf. Just took a call from Dennis Hastert's office trying to get an answer from one of my attys (who supports Rod, the IL gov), about his attendance at a fundraiser for Hastert's reelection. My guy is trying to dodge him, but I'm sure I'll have to call or write back to him with a professional "regrets" response. My guy is the board chair of IL's state univ so he gets a lot of invites from both sides of the fence.

Laura

Growing up in politics, my father always demanded I respect the office, regardless of the officeholder.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 11:50 AM

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt

Dearest Democrats,

Your suggestion of one man one vote is very dangerous because of the following reasons:

1) It would require opening the Constitution of United States for amendment process and call for review process by the legislative, executive and judical branches of the govenment then the amendment must be ratified by the states.

2) When the constitution of USA is open for debate and amendment, it is open to all changes.

Under the current climate of unbalanced politics this action would be unwise. It reminds me of the person who would shoot off his nose with a shot gun because of a pimple.

Please check the historical procedure for amendment processes to the US Constitution, include how to open the debate and document, review writing and ratification processes.

Please remember the president and his men have tried to open the Constitution several times for the amendment process to increase presidential power, alteration to the bill of rights, tax procedures. Are you willing to give up all those rights for exchange of one vote one man? Are you willing to rewrite the elective representation process? Who will formulate the budget and authorize the spending if not the congress? To seek one man one vote is in essence to devolve the congress or representative government. I think that is truely over stepping the need to go to the polls and casting your vote for representative government.

Puggles, right before the 2004 election I taking a lot of calls from the Pugs trying to get my CEO to attend a dinner with Bush. They probably called three separate times. The first time I politely said he wouldn't be available for the dinner, the second time (after telling him about the calls) I insisted he would not make the time and by the third time I very clearly said that if given the choice between dental surgery or dinner with George Bush my boss would choose Dental surgery.

It was nice working for a very outspoken Democrat. He laughed when I told him what I said. :)

Blue, I know women are underrepresented in all levels of government. We may be 51% of the population but, are we 51% of the candidates?
That's why I have to SHOW my daughters (and sons) that am participating in the process. It can't stop at discussing or donating or even voting. We must require more of ourselves.
We aren't even the majority of Democrat officeholders, and we are ahuge voting block.

Asking for one man one vote is asking the government to devolve representative government, devolving congress as we know it today and devolving the electorial collage.

I would like to ask a simple question to these far left anarchist; “Who will be left to check and balance the power of the president when the electoral collage and representative government members are devolved and replaced with one man one vote?”

Please stop being a Republican know it all and perform a little bit of historical fact finding. Review why our founding fathers decided on representative government rather than anarchy of one man one vote.

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 12:20 PM

so if we even think of doing away with the electorial college for electing the President we are 'left wing anarchist'

Hybrid, talk about an extreme knee jerk reaction to an idea.

For those who think one man one vote will gain the idividual more power; I am going to state today, "That one man one vote is a misguided concept." Effectively everyone would give up representation in government handing all the power to the president. If everyone is represented, then no one is represented. Get it!

Kristen:

Priceless! Unfortunately, due to the firm's climate, I have to be careful. Thankfully, the diplomatic responses I prepare for my guy, they back off. Haven't gotten one yet that didn't, except for Warner. I'm not overly fond of Warner and don't want him in the '08 race. Would rather see someone else. Bye for now. Expect I'll be back a bit later.

Laura

I understand Puggles. I was fortunate to work in an office with outspoken liberals. I do miss them but not the job. :)

Oh, before I go and forget. Heard this morning on GMA (while getting ready for work), a piece about global warming. They played a video showing the shrub saying he's always been concerned about global warming. Can we say liar, liar, pants on fire?

Kristen,

Please review the historical reasons why our founding fathers decided on electorical collages and representative government.

One of the biggest issues up for debate two (2) hundred years ago was anarchy. That is not my statement, it it in the historical documents, records and in books written on the subject.

I am interested in the outcome of the August 31 United Nations' deadline placed upon Iran to temporarily halt its enrichment of uranium. With diplomacy and negotiations underway among European countries and Iran, and with the possibility of nuclear weapons capability years away (if that is their intention), why is it absolutely necessary for the United States to press for sanctions today? Is it more important that Iran have the energy that it needs without having nuclear weapons, or is it more important that we publicly humiliate and isolate Iran to stop any political solution through dialog and negotiations?

With an unnamed Israeli official saying that Israel would conduct preemptive air strikes on Iran if the United States does not; With some US officials and political analysts already talking about preemptive strikes upon Iran; with Israel destroying Southern Lebanon and the United States being the only member of the UN Security Council voting against a humanitarian ceasefire; and with the Bush administration and its surrogates ratcheting-up the hate speech and unsubstantiated accusations against Iran; have we given Iran any assurances or reason to believe that it does not have to build an arsenal that would protect it from our threats?

As was the case when we rushed to invade Iraq before the IAEA could complete its work and diplomacy could run its course, we are repeating a rush to place sanctions against Iran and agitating a delicate situation that could work itself out with diligence on all sides.

I do not know the true character of Iran or its leaders, but I think that we have an obligation to find out, especially when that country has reached out several times to engage in dialog. There certainly is enough mutual misinformation floating around that could do with a good airing out.

Some Democratic and Republican leaders and analysts have recognized that the neocon ideologues are running amok in this administration, and completely control our foreign policy. Military action and not diplomacy is their agenda. What is on my mind today is whether the Democratic Party will stand united and call the Bush Administration on their reckless rampage that is creating death and world instability? Will we stand by the value of diplomacy to create a better world, or do we join in the neocon ridicule of dialog and sing the praises of war as being the only effective tool to keep America safe?

Pro’s and Con’s of the Electoral College

Pro’s:

Requires a distribution of popular support to be elected president- the winning candidate must demonstrate both a sufficient popular support to govern as well as a sufficient distribution of that support to govern

Strengthens the status of minority groups- the votes of small minorities within a state may make the difference between winning all of a state’s electoral votes or none of them.

Enhances the political stability of the nation by promoting a two-party system- protects that presidency from impassioned but transitory third party movements and forces the major parties to absorb the interests of minorities.

Maintains the federal system of government and representation

Con’s:

There is a possibility of electing a minority president- one way for this to happen would be if the country was so deeply divided politically that three or more presidential candidates split the vote and no one obtained a necessary majority

There is a risk of having "faithless" Electors- Electors who won’t be loyal to their party or candidate

The Electoral College may depress voter turnout- because each state is only entitled to so many electoral votes regardless of voter turnout, there is no incentive for states to encourage voter participation

Does not accurately reflect the national popular will because it does not elect a candidate by a direct popular vote

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 12:29 PM

Generally I think you are a rambling fool but I rarely call you one.

Ultimately the statement of 'liberal anarchist' was your statement. If you were quoting you should cite a source.

Otherwise, refrain from the labelling and we will kindly do the same for you.

Hybrid, I was commenting on the story about California. Each state can decide, on its own, what determines the votes for their electoral college representatives. This will not require a change to the U.S. constitution. It may be a better use of the electoral college.

"Please stop being a Republican know it all and perform a little bit of historical fact finding. Review why our founding fathers decided on representative government rather than anarchy of one man one vote."

Please drink some decaf.

Just a friendly joke!

Lets debate this in public and ask the questions:

1) If the electorial collage is desolved what will replace it.

2) If you strip the congress representative goverment members, house and senate, of this power to vote for electorial collage members and the right to elect the president; who in government represent and speak for the people of any given reason of this country?

3) If you stip the most powerful voting right granted by the constituton to the representative government, effectively devolving congress; who will be left to authorize the government spending. Remember the president and executive branch only submit the budget, only congress has the power to authorize the spending. If congress do not represent the people and one man one vote is how we want our government, how do you plan to authorize presidential spending requests? ...or are you planing on handing all that power to only the president the one man one vote brought into power with no checks and balances?

These were points discussed when the Constitution was written. We should discuss it again. Do you understand why and how the founding fathers could have labeled the one man one vote "Anarchy" and chose representative government?

Disaster vehicle stationed here

A radio truck - officially called the “Interoperability Communications Vehicle” - was activated on Wednesday at the Guernsey County Law Enforcement Center and will be kept in Cambridge under the watchful eye of the sheriff’s office.

The vehicle was funded with Homeland Security money.

“Ohio is the only state to deploy this type of vehicle so far,” said Guernsey County Sheriff Mike McCauley. “Other states are looking at them, but Ohio is the first to take this step.”

Doesn't anarchy require a lack of any authority? Thereby eliminating "left" or "right".
"Leftist" or "rightist(?)" anarchy seems to be an oxymoron.

http://news.findlaw.com/ap/p/618/08-30-2006/04540018055c58ce.html

Warner Urges Broader Democratic Strategy
By MIKE GLOVER Associated Press Writer
(AP) - AMES, Iowa-Mark Warner, a potential 2008 presidential candidate, voiced growing concern Tuesday with his party's electoral strategy, arguing that Democrats' willingness to write off sections of the country could make it nearly impossible to win the White House.
"I got pretty frustrated after 2004," said the former Virginia governor. "We are making a mistake if we put up candidates that are only competitive in 16 states and then we roll the dice and hope we win Ohio or Florida."
After making a negative remark earlier today about Warner, perhaps I should shut up and listen again.

Hybrid, "do you understand..."?

Whether from the spinmeisters on the right or from fellow conversationalists on this site, condescension is never appreciated.

It is much more gracious to be patient with those of us who may have a different thought process. If you would be so kind.

Gina and Kristen,

Being a rambing fool is better than someone who is willing to give up the right to representative goverment at the Federal level just to gain one man one vote.

Reminds me of George Orwell, All anamals are create equal, some more equal than others.

I cannot compete with someone with greater means and financial backing than I; the electorial collage and representative government allows those with like ideals to pool their political resources and bring those greavances and issue to the government. One man one vote circumvent that process.

Granted these days that process is broken. It just means we must debate more among ourselves to determine what compromises we can live with. This all or nothing politics of 2000+ is gaining us nothing; and most are frustrated with gaining nothing from the Republicans. You want something from your representative government, then elect the representative who has the power of authorizing the spending, congress members! You don't like the fact that the president did not put anything in his budget for your cause, then make your cause a national priotity and vote in the next president who will hear your issues. One man one vote only makes everyone have 400+ million voices. When 400+ million voices are important, no one is important! One man one vote is just another way of stating we want to give all our power and rights away from representative government to grant the power to the president.

Review American History and the debates surrounding the writing of the constitution.

I don't know if this is old news already.

Judge to Rule Soon on Wiretap Lawsuit
By TIM FOUGHT Associated Press Writer
(AP) - PORTLAND, Ore.-A federal judge suggested Tuesday that he would try to keep alive a lawsuit that challenges President Bush's domestic wiretapping program, while taking steps not to disclose classified information.
http://news.findlaw.com/ap/o/632/08-30-2006/22d500120add9aeb.html

I need to sit in the corner and reflect because I am Morally and Intellectually Confused.

Hell No!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bush and the rest of the Idiots need to go. Who was the moron who started the mess in Iraq in the first place? And Lied about it.

Oops, forgot to link sites. Here they are.

http://news.findlaw.com/ap/o/632/08-30-2006/22d500120add9aeb.html
http://news.findlaw.com/ap/p/618/08-30-2006/04540018055c58ce.html

If the evidence doesn't vanish. What comes out of Ohio in the coming months will be fun to watch.

Blackwell will definitely end up with a new job - Wearing a prison uniform.

Hybrid, your ignorance is showing. How do you think the electoral college works? It has nothing to do with Congress. Electors, not congressmen and senators, vote in the electoral college. Changing to direct election by all the people will not alter the powers of congress or the courts in any way. And how is it anarchy for all people's votes to count equally? Why should a resident of Alaska have more voting power than I have? ONe man one vote is the rule of alw in all elections except for the Presidential election. Why should that be different?

Hybrid, the last thing I can say to your insults is this...

Please, either slow down while typing or use spell-check.

Examples: "electorial"
"collage"
"anamals"
"planing"

Kristen and Gina,

People around the world have fought and died just to gain a little bit of the rights and privileges we have in this country. Do give those up so easily. Our founding fathers were very intellectual men, and they formulated a living document that blessed all of us in their quest for freedom. Let's work to fix the great process of democracy. Not destroy it and start anew. I am not smart; I am just a rambling fool who wish to retain my rights granted to me by the Constitution of USA.

Gina,

Just wanted to show you that I am a real human and not a spell checker. As you have stated,"I am a rambling fool!"

IMO, the electoral college will work if we make sure the machines record the vote we intended.

And what's that crap about opening the constitution up for amendment? The constitution can be amended at any time by a 2/3 vote of both houses of congress and ratification by 3/4 of the states, or by a convention called by 2/3 of the states and ratified by 3/4 of the states.

And 400 million? there are only 300 million people in this country, not all of them citizens, and only a small percentage of them actually vote.

Imagine debating every single republican with one man one vote and everyone has a voice. Where will we get our national platform and agenda during the election process? Simply chaos!

The Republicans have the Christian right and their churches to aid in the distribution of their message.

In a one man one vote situation, who will distribute your message at the national level?

Hybrid do you even know what one man one vote means? It appears you have some screwy notion about direct goverment, but all it means is that all votes in elections carry the same weight.

It is easy to spot a Republican (especially on these blogs) by his or her writing, which is usually illogical, poorly written, specious, and generally incomprehensible. Their "arguments" are laughable. That's why they attack. They have no other plan for when they disagree with something. Gosh. I think that includes Bush.

Dear Christopher,

Good job! Now you know how the vote tally works.

Let's take the next step and discuss, “what to change in the constitution?” Here comes the dangerous and intellectual part of the studies.

When congress open the constitution for debate and amendment it was address specific points within the constitution what needs to be amended. This is to contain the debate and restrict what can be changed. How will you structure your argument to open debate on the need to amend the constitution? What paragraph, which sentence and which law must be amended and how will you structure the debate on each item? What parts of the constitution is effected by the “One man One Vote” request for debate and amendment?

Be very careful what you ask for in this part of your studies!

OK Hybrid, you've convinced me that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.

Chris,

No I don't know what you mean by “one man one vote”. I think I am making that very clear. The republican in congress, who have the rights to vote on amending the constitution, do not share your thoughts or ideas. Please open your debate in this contained environment and let's practice. So, I understand fully what you mean by “one man one vote” rhetoric. Let’s see what real laws they impact and which rights need to be modified and amended to meet your definition of “one man one vote”.

Chris,

That is exactly what I am stating. You personnally do not have the right to vote on amending the Constitution of USA. Since you are so smart and I am a rambling fool, please explain to me in plain english which laws you would like to amend to grant, "One man One vote!"

Take it out of political rhetoric and let's see what part of the constitution we need to change.

This is a great environment to contain this debate.

Good morning, Dems. It's still morning here in CO.

Good conversation here on the blog, too. You know, according to Ted Stevens, the internet is a series of tubes.

Also, according to Conrad Burns, the fascist terrorists drive taxis by day and plot to kill us by night. Perhaps they are all a bunch of macacas.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 11:50 AM
"The theory was to give smaller states an equal footing. Don't you the country has changed since the original 13 on the Atlantic?"

GinaW - this is a serious mis conception and the idea of an earlier politically correct thing for the founding fathers to say, in reality the divisions were drawn to prevent the uneducated, lower class, unwelcomed races, and women, typically city dwellers (large populated areas) not to have a real say in the govt (flat out no voice). The land barons, business owners, rich wanted the controll, most of them, which owned thousands of acres in open range or undeveloped land, they chose the electoral college to give themselves the power (early version of rezoning if you will). It had nothing to do with equalling out the vote for the people. If you really think about it, How could one vote for one person matter, it is the only fair thing, it shouldnt matter where the person is, whether in a cluster or out in the country. Could they go to the public and say "Well Jefferson over here has 200,000 acres and Washington over here has 250,000 acres but they are intelligent but they will have no say because the 50,000 votes in New York city will not allow their vote to have any real say and all those low life will."
No they used an early rovian spin and told everyone it was to give the little state a say so , Bunk - if you don't believe me read the Federalist papers, esp #10, It is all about them having control over what they would call factions.

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 12:12 PM
Granted it is a concern to admend the Constitution under the current admin, but after Nov, and or 2008 elections it should be seriously looked at.

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 12:20 PM
"Please stop being a Republican know it all and perform a little bit of historical fact finding. Review why our founding fathers decided on representative government rather than anarchy of one man one vote."

I highly resent your statement, I am not a repub know it all and I have researched the historical facts, I have written an entire paper on the subject of electoral college. And to keep the electoral college is by far more in line with the republican views of only the rich survive or have any say so.

Hybrid, why do you seem to be making this harder for yourself?

When a state elects a senator each citizen's vote is counted. The point would be that only the President is elected through the electorial college and that he or she should also be elected with each individual person's vote counting (ie popular vote vs. electorial college vote)

This would not do away with representative government as each senator and representative would continue to be elected just as they are today.

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 12:25 PM

Pure hysteria!
It would not if decent people work to solve the issues, it does not take away checks and balances - by far not as much as Bush already has!

If the evidence doesn't vanish. What comes out of Ohio in the coming months will be fun to watch.

Blackwell will definitely end up with a new job - Wearing a prison uniform.

Posted by BayStateJim on August 31, 2006 at 01:03 PM

I doubt it's wearing a prison uniform, but I have high hopes that he doesn't make it to the governors mansion.

Hybrid, I didn't call you a "rambling fool"! That was your post! Also,there are plenty of us dem's who go to church.

Blue, my comment on respecting the office (earlier post) does not require an absence of vigorous opposition. That's why I read, write, volunteer and vote. I just choose not to use profanity or call for or use depictions of violence.IMO I feel it demeans the messenger as well as the message.

Is anyone else as irritated that the media outlets still won't let go of the Ramsey case?
HE DIDN"T DO IT! Next. Oops, the next one is here. How many hours can be filled by an evil, pedophile who says he represents God? Any guesses?

I think going back to the simple fact that the founding fathers did not have faith in the Voting public, thus put the Electoral College system in , is proof that what may have been workable 300 years ago is not any longer.

The fact that going by a State choice for President of the US, forgetting this is a National Election is not a good thing. If the majority of the country want a certain candidate, as in 2000 when Al gore won, then majority should rule, Not the state of Florida.

dk2, they didn't need the electoral college to restrict the vote, they just limited it to free men with property. It was only over time that other groups got the right to vote - women last, although blacks were not allowed to exercise the right in much of the country until the 60's.

buzzword of the day?

Bush Team Casts Foes as Defeatist

U.S. Drafting Sanctions as Iran Ignores Deadline

With Iran defying a Thursday deadline to halt production of nuclear fuel, the United States and three European allies are assembling a list of sanctions they would seek in the United Nations Security Council, beginning with restrictions on imports of nuclear-related equipment and material.

bullcrap time!

Nashville - With the midterm elections coming into view, President Bush is launching an extended publicity tour to draw attention back to the threat of terrorism, quickly pivoting to more comfortable political territory for him after the focus in recent days on the anniversary of Hurricane Katrina.

Starting with an address to veterans on Thursday, Mr. Bush intends to outline what one adviser described as the "consequences of victory and defeat." He will continue making speeches on the subject throughout the month, keying off the fifth anniversary of the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11.

The White House has made national security, and the war in Iraq, the centerpieces of Mr. Bush's strategy for helping Republicans try to retain control of Congress in this year's election. Nonetheless, as he traveled to Arkansas and Tennessee today to raise money for Republican candidates, Mr. Bush insisted that his "series of speeches, they are not political speeches."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/083106L.shtml

A brief history of the electoral college

http://www.fec.gov/pdf/eleccoll.pdf

One more, then back to the grind.

Carter Agrees to Hold Talks With Khatami

"President Carter, in his role since leaving the White House, has made his office and services and center available to basically anybody who wants to talk. He believes that it is much better to be talking to people who you have problems with than not to, and that's the approach he takes now," Wise said. "I can confirm that President Carter is open to a meeting if the former president of Iran would like to have one."

Enjoy the afternoon, everyone.

"The European Union is ready to continue discussions with Iran over its nuclear programme even though a United Nations deadline for Tehran to restrict its nuclear activities expires on Thursday, diplomats have told the Financial Times.

On Thursday, the International Atomic Energy Agency, the UN's nuclear monitor, will confirm that Tehran has refused to comply with a UN Security Council resolution that requires Iran to suspend uranium enrichment, a process that can generate both nuclear fuel and weapons grade material.

But the report is also likely to note that Tehran has not accelerated its nuclear programme, a fact that Russia and China, both of which are resisting plans to impose sanctions on Iran, are likely to emphasise.

The lack of unanimity of the Security Council - and the hope that Tehran may yet agree to suspend enrichment - are the chief reasons why the EU is set to keep the contacts going.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/083106K.shtml

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 12:29 PM

you need to review Federalish # 10
"AMONG the numerous advantages promised by a wellconstructed Union, none deserves to be more accurately developed than its tendency to break and control the violence of faction" (unrully, uneducated - other than status quo).

"The friend of popular governments never finds himself so much alarmed for their character and fate, as when he contemplates their propensity (tendency) to this dangerous vice."

"He will not fail, therefore, to set a due value on any plan which, without violating the principles to which he is attached, provides a proper cure for it. The instability, injustice, and confusion introduced into the public councils, have, in truth, been the mortal diseases under which popular governments have everywhere perished;" ............

"There are two methods of curing the mischiefs of faction: the one, by removing its causes; the other, by controlling its effects.
There are again two methods of removing the causes of faction: the one, by destroying the liberty which is essential to its existence; the other, by giving to every citizen the same opinions, the same passions, and the same interests."

"It could never be more truly said than of the first remedy, that it was worse than the disease. Liberty is to faction what air is to fire, an aliment without which it instantly expires. But it could not be less folly to abolish liberty, which is essential to political life, because it nourishes faction, than it would be to wish the annihilation of air, which is essential to animal life, because it imparts to fire its destructive agency."

"The second expedient is as impracticable as the first would be unwise. As long as the reason of man continues fallible, and he is at liberty to exercise it, different opinions will be formed. As long as the connection subsists between his reason and his self-love, his opinions and his passions will have a reciprocal influence on each other; and the former will be objects to which the latter will attach themselves. The diversity in the faculties of men, from which the rights of property originate, is not less an insuperable obstacle to a uniformity of interests. The protection of these faculties is the first object of government. From the protection of different and unequal faculties of acquiring property, the possession of different degrees and kinds of property immediately results; and from the influence of these on the sentiments and views of the respective proprietors, ensues a division of the society into different interests and parties."

read it here

Posted by Christopher_blunt on August 31, 2006 at 01:53 PM

Yes to a degree, but there were still many low life uneducate whites - they didnt want to take any chance on loosing the control. (Irish, and others that came over, and all of Englands unwanted that were sent to the conlonies rather than debtors prison, and all of the conscripts.

if we are in world war three why so much blather about world war two?

DK, i beleive that by "factions" they meant political parties, not low-lifes. (Or is there a difference? -j/k)

As a starter let me open by stating which parts of The Constitution regarding voting are you willing to change to fullfill your one man one vote request? These are some of the areas within the constitution which grants elected official the right to vote and how to vote.

Article 1 (The Legislative Branch) The entire article on voting right and power granted to the representatives.

Article 2 (The Presidency) Starting with Section 1 (Election, Installation and Removal)

Article 3 (The Judiciary) Section 1 (Judicial Power Vested) and Section 2 (Scope of Judicial Power)

Article 4 (The States)

Article V (Amendment Process)

Amendments and Bill of Rights:
Amendment X Rights Reserved to the States 1791
Amendment XII Election of President and Vice-President 1804
Amendment XIII Abolition of Slavery 1865
Amendment XVII Election of Senators 1913
Amendment XVIII Women’s Right to Vote 1920
Amendment XX Presidential Term and Succession 1933
Amendment XXII Two Term Limit on Presidents 1951
Amendment XXIV Poll Tax 1964
Amendment XXV Presidential Succession 1967

Other current issues this need to address is definition of one man:
1) Definition of an American, immigration laws pertaining to rights to vote.
2) Gay and lesbian rights.

Good afternoon fellow Democrats.

Ridicule me as much as you can, because I am a rambling fool. Let's debate which parts of the voting rights and procedures one must change to enact "One Man One Vote", because I am stupid, dumb and thick headed. All I am trying to do is keep my rights to representative government. How would you like to change it? Please tell me.

All right HY, I'll try once more. The only change necessary is to amend Article II, section 1, to eliminate the language about electors and substitute that the president shall be elected by a plurality of all eligible voters casting votes for president in the election. That's it.

Posted by Christopher_blunt on August 31, 2006 at 02:17 PM

Christopher - it was meant as any group other than our own (any one group that could out way their control).

"He will not fail, therefore, to set a due value on any plan which, without violating the principles to which he is attached, provides a proper cure for it. The instability, injustice, and confusion introduced into the public councils, have, in truth, been the mortal diseases under which popular governments have everywhere perished"

Please remember the entire document called the Constitution of USA is based of granting rights to vote on various issues and topics and the procedures on how to vote. One man One vote need to address all those issues because it goes to the highest level of offices.

OK - let's get Thursday's blog back on track - that is . . .

lies, deceit and incompetence of the G. W. Bush administration

and that electing a Democratic congress and Democratic presidential administration will get the United States back on the correct track such that this country will again be respected through the world.

Hey, Ernesto's back. winds up to 70mph and may be a hurricane again when it makes landfall.

Hy, we already have one person, one vote in all cases except election of the president. Nothing else needs to be addressed.

What I am trying to tell all of those supporting, “One Man One Vote." is the Republicans have a very different definition of who is a man and who can vote. I am attempting to understand how all those supporting, “One Man One Vote." defines what is a man who can vote and what areas of the Constitution we need to change to enact your definition.

And do you think the majority in Congress, President and States support your definition of “One Man One Vote”. I am asking those supporting this cause to take it out of Political rhetoric and put it to the test; here and now!

blackwell has dumped it on to each board of elections office & their pro. atty. I guess I'll be wearing the black & white stripes??? (if you visit me, please bring chocolate & coffee, thanks)

Kristen,

If in the case of one man one vote is allowed for the president; will one man one vote be used to remove a president from office?

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 02:43 PM

Hybrid, you are just not making much sense. I don't think it is safe to debate with you because ultimately you might strain something.

Thank you Percy. This whole diatribe was started because California may change its formula for granting its E.C. votes.

What that has to do with getting rid of the E.C. or amending the constitution, I don't know. It did allow some to try to denigrate others' knowledge of history.

The Iran issue is sticky. The philosophy of "mutually assured destruction" doesn't fit this new world of terrorism, state sponsored or otherwise.
That is why today's diplomacy isn't as cut and dried. How do you engage an "enemy" that does not fear its' own destruction?
We can all agree peace is best. But can there be peace without the willingness of all parties? One party can disrupt peace.
Israel and Egypt aren't necessarily friendly, but at one time they each agreed peace was better than war. You can't force peace on another. That's why these are important times. We are now faced with the question in a way that we have never been. When do words turn into action?

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 02:17 PM

It could be very simple you write an admendment stating that all other parts remain the same and in tact. Then you write an ad-min to address only the voting process, It can be divided very easily, you are only making it hard.

My care about what process they use whether of census or not, to devide state federal funds is not that great. It is a small issue compared to electing an official fairly.

Each state is to have as many electoral votes as it does senators and respresentative in congress,

The electoral college is a group of representatives of electors (selected to represent the masses) and are chosen by the party they represent. (the general public does not get to vote for these electorals)

All but 2 states (to my knowledge) give their electoral votes in a winner takes all basis - allowing the possibility for a candidate that received the most votes to be the loser by rogue votes of their electorit.

Then the issue of Felons in 13 states (I believe) are counted in the census as local residents (giving more electorals by representation) and yet they never get to vote.

Take Alaska - can have 3 electoral votes that count for about 200,000 each, while California's electorals represent well over 600,000 people each.
How do you account for this - is that fair representation to you?

Posted by HybridFuel on August 31, 2006 at 02:43 PM

Hybrid, I don't think you are a rambling fool, but in this instance you are stretching the concept farther than it needs to. Blunt is right. It would only involve changing the provision of the Constitution that addresses the election of the President, nothing else...not removal, not representation, not who can vote...etc.

I'm not sold on the concept either, but keep it real, k?

Ohio farmers could rotate political field

We'll drink to being left off this list

Hybrid, Christopher, DK2, PamB, and Esmarelda:

Wow, I have been doing some lurking, and I have been learning quite a bit about the electoral college and voting process today.

I must admit that I am a little ignorant on these topics, but your debate is educational.

It does seem that the provisions for representation in the constitution were designed to favor rich landowners as DK2 says. Look at our representation in the senate: Wyoming and Idaho get as much representation there as Texas, California, and New York. People who live in DC get no representation-this is hardly fair at all. It does seem that our Founding Fathers thought that rural people were smarter and more capable of running our government, and I think that sentiment holds true today. Republicans are afraid of giving DC "voting" representation.

Updated: 9:32 a.m. ET Aug 31, 2006
SACRAMENTO, Calif. (AP) - California will impose broad caps on its greenhouse-gas emissions under a landmark plan that marks a clear break with the Bush administration and which backers hope will become a national model.
Republican Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger, who helped assemble the plan, called Wednesday's agreement "an example for other states and nations to follow as the fight against climate change continues."
“We can now move forward with developing a market-based system that makes California a world leader in the effort to reduce carbon emissions,” the governor added.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14590345/

CA leads the way again in imposing a cleaner environment. Congratulations to the good citizens and the government of CA for making a step in the correct direction.

NRSC has now spent an astonishing $656,054.58

Clicked on this from that link:

The Holy Vote

Posted by ranger995 on August 31, 2006 at 02:58 PM

DC does have three electoral votes though no voting representation in congress, if memory serves.

DC does get electoral votes, the point I was making is they get zero representation in government. There are probably nearly as many Americans living in DC as either Wyoming or Idaho, yet they get zero representation. Even Mexico gives its federal district representation.

Also, I think that getting rid of the electoral college will encourage "red" people living in large cities to vote, and "blue" voters in rural areas to vote, because in a national election their votes will matter.

Oh well, thanks for the debate.

In addition, DC doesn't really get self-government either. They have a mayor and city council, but oversight and ultimate authority rests with Congress, which meddles with them a lot.

Only one thing I want to say about "one man, one vote". Can we please change the slogan to "one citizen, one vote"? I'm not caring about being PC here, but it removes one of the stupid arguments HybridFuel is using.

I believe felons should be disenfranchised. They have shown contempt for our society and system. They are counted in census figures because they still require assistance or retain the benefits of gov't.
This doesn't make them less deserving on a human level. They still can stay engaged, if they choose, by volunteering and donating.

The one person, one vote case. for those who still care.

http://usinfo.state.gov/usa/infousa/facts/democrac/68.htm

GinaW,

What happens when it becomes a felony to protest?

What happens when someone marching in a peaceful demonstation, gets arested and charged with a felony?

Gina, I think felon's rights should be restored once they have been discharged from supervision by the court. Why should they continue to be second-class citizens when they have paid the price for their crime?

Esmerelda, thanks for the link.
According to "The Holy Vote" I don't exsist. A rural, church going, liberal doesn't have a place in todays environment.
Too bad. Now more than ever we could use some "love thy neighbor as thyself" in politics.

Baghdad bombings take heavy toll:
Mortar attacks and bombings killed at least 45 people and wounded 180 others Thursday across the Iraqi capital in the latest wave of apparent sectarian violence, police officials said. Full story in link below:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/08/31/iraq.main/index.html

A recent letter to Tide.

Dear Tide,

I am writing to say what an excellent product you have! I've used it all of my married life, as my Mom always told me it was the best. Now that I am in my fifties I find it even better! In fact, about a month ago, I spilled some red wine on my new white blouse. My inconsiderate and uncaring husband started to belittle me about how clumsy I was, and generally started becoming a pain in the neck. One thing led to another and somehow I ended up with his blood on my new white blouse! I grabbed my bottle of Tide with bleach alternative, and to my surprise and satisfaction, all of the stains came out! In fact, the stains came out so well the detectives who came by yesterday told me that the DNA tests on my blouse were negative and then my attorney called and said that I was no longer considered a suspect in the disappearance of my husband.

What a relief! Going through menopause is bad enough without being a murder suspect! I thank you, once again, for having a great product.

Well, gotta go, have to write to the Hefty bag people.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 03:30 PM

When a person is finished repaying his/her debt to scoiety (i.e. incarceration, probation, parole, etc...) their voting rights should be automatically restored. I agree that they should forfeit their gun ownership rights if convicted of a violent felony. They are tax paying citizens again. To continue to punish a person by denying him/her the basic rights of citizenship after they have finished their sentence is wrong.

Valid point, Ranger. No doubt, revamping is in order.

Ranger, what gov't is considering this? If memory serves, we have the right to assembly. I realize there are local rules that govern this.

By protest, do you mean legally exert your right to oppose, or assault someone with foreign objects and damage property? I can't get geared up about the latter.

I believe each state has a variety of means to regain the right to vote. The standards should be strict-IMO. Anything so valuable, that was thrown away so easily, shouldn't be returned without earning it.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 03:43 PM

Love thy neighbor except for the convicted felons, eh?

Can't some "non-violent " crimes have a "violent" aspect? Drug dealing is non-violent, but is it really? Is stealing using a knife any less damaging than by invading someones privacy or attacking their life-savings?

Senate committee to block Bush nominee to head broadcasting agency

(AP) - WASHINGTON-The Senate Foreign Relations Committee does not plan to act on President George W. Bush's re-nomination of the head of the agency that oversees U.S. government broadcasts, who is accused of misusing government money, overbilling for his time and hiring a friend as a consultant.

http://news.findlaw.com/ap/o/51/08-31-2006/71ac0005611fdd3b.html

Bob, how is that inconsistent with understanding there are real consequences to our actions and being held accountable?
I love my children, but they have rules and standards by which they are to abide.And they have consequences for not following those rules.
Just as they reap rewards or benefits for abiding them. That's not mean, it's reality.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 03:30 PM

Gina, I would have to disagree. I believe there are certain rights felons should have to give up for the protection of society (violent felons should not be able to purchase guns) but believe the point of punishment is that you pay your debt to society and you are given a second chance.

I tend to think of Martha Stewart who technically is a convicted felon and would think ultimately nothing she did should prevent her from voting.

I'm so pissed. The UPS man just delivered our absentee ballots for our repug special primary which is in 2 weeks. He said, "burn them if they are democrat ballots, democrats are useless!" I looked at him oddly and he said, "you must be a democrat. It's amazing that I found one that isn't on welfare." I informed him that I have always worked, so have all of my people, that while I'm fortunate to have a job, I don't condemn those that receive help and that I was offended by his comments. He shrugged his shoulders and laughed in my face as he walked out the door.

I just reported this to his supervisor.

Thank goodness the work day is over!

Enjoy the evening, everyone.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 04:13 PM

I teach my children that when they mess up they need to do their best to make amends, accept their punishment and then they are forgiven. I would like to think that we as a society don't believe every crime committed deserves a life long sentence of shame and 2nd class citizenship.

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 03:43 PM

That is why more "liberals" need to have their lay speaker training and teach from the pulpit.

I want my G-d back as much as I want my country.

Posted by Esmeralda on August 31, 2006 at 04:17 PM

that is disgusting. Glad you reported him, hopefully they will remind him that politics and their business don't mix.

Good thing he delivered them and didn't destroy the package himself.

Except that, as a successful and highly educated the professional,she had more of an awareness of what could happen to her and did it anyway. How much more contempt for the rules of society is that, compared to a person hooked on drugsnwho holds up a convenience store with a plastic gun?

Here we go folks!! (from the findlaw site)

Bush says Iran must face consequences for refusing to stop enriching uranium

(AP) - SALT LAKE CITY-President George W. Bush said Thursday that Iran has responded with defiance and delay to demands to stop enriching uranium and "there must be consquences" for Tehran. He said the war between Iranian-backed Hezbollah militants and Israel demonstrated that "the world now faces a grave threat from the radical regime in Iran."

• Bush stumps for Iraq policy
• Attacks kill 51, injure 126 in Iraq

States ranked on pocketbook issues

With a quarter of its population lacking health insurance, Texas held on to the dubious distinction as the state with highest rate of uninsured residents in the country, followed by New Mexico, where 21 percent of residents had no coverage.

Posted by puggles on August 31, 2006 at 04:08 PM

Good news indeed. I've been following this bum for some time now. Another Republican (Rove friend) stealing from the US Treasury.

Maybe bankrupting America by elected officials should be considered treason. After all, it is an attempt to destroy our republic.

hello there

Hey, Jen

Hi Jen!

Posted by GinaW on August 31, 2006 at 04:13 PM

A person is held accountable by the punishment they receive from the judicial system; nothing more, nothing less. Not to mention how many innocent people are incarcerated as we debate this. GinaW, this is one subject we'll have to agree to disagree on. To continue to punish a person after they have completed their sentence is, IMHO, far from being Christian, or whatever religion you practice, masochistic (sp?), and a tactic worthy of a Republican.

Looks like Kathy Harris has a lot more problems ahead.

Republicans Fail to Woo Top Candidates
By DAVID ESPO AP Special Correspondent

(AP) - WEST PALM BEACH, Fla.-Click on Katherine Harris' Senate campaign Web site and look for the blog.

"This section will be updated soon," reads a message - dated May 29.

A Web site 100 days out of date is hardly the worst of it for Harris, whose political wounds, many of them self-inflicted, make her the poster woman for Senate Republican recruiting woes. Missed opportunities, stumbles and bad breaks in a half-dozen states or more in 2005 have tilted the map toward the Democrats in ways that are still unfolding.

http://news.findlaw.com/ap/p/622/08-30-2006/ce510051e096a8d3.html

Bruno, my fear is that given the culture of our administration, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee will probably appoint someone even worse.

Laura

hi Blue! hi Blunt! what up?

What Happens to All Those Unused Embryos?

DefCon's friends, the Ninth Floor Project, have put together an amazing video exposing the fate of all the unused embryos the religious right fought so hard to "protect" from embryonic stem cell research.

View the video here.

The video exposes once and for all how absurd the religious right's "defend the embryo" argument is. Instead of choosing life - providing health and hope to millions - they are the ones who have condemned these embryos, and more importantly the incredible potential for cures that they hold, to certain destruction: a.k.a. the trash can.

Hi Jen!

nice find jen.

Gosh Jen, I've felt like half a person lately, and now I know why... ;)

Hey Kristen!

I missed this, did you all see it?

Evolution Major Vanishes From Approved Federal List

the U.S. Department of Education ended grants for students studying Evolutionary Biology - an alarming omission that came without explanation or warning.

--the Ohio Board of Education - who voted 11-4 in February to strip language from their science standards that allowed for the teaching of intelligent design - is under attack again. Local creationists are floating a proposal that not only encourages the teaching of intelligent design, but also calls for teachers to question global warming and highlight opposition to stem cell research.

thx gregg!

awww, {{{blue}}}, same here! i feel better already!

for you art lovers out there, they found the Scream!

Rumsfeld Vote of NO CONFIDENCE

I just heard a few days ago on Hardball (I think Norah O'Donnell accidentally let it slp out) that the Democrats in the Senate will be demanding a vote of No Confidence on Rumsfeld as soon as the Senate is back in session. Lincoln Chaffee already said on air that he would vote YES.

This should have happened a long time ago, but the DEMS must follow through immediately! Our soldiers should not have to suffer the incompetence of Rumsfeld any longer. Many DEMS voted to put the troops in this position under Rumsfeld and now it's time for all of them to crash the gate and make it right. NO CONFIDENCE!

Posted by jen on August 31, 2006 at 04:52 PM

Cool! Any data on how they found it?

Yeh, but if Rummy goes they'll find someone even worse. That's been the consistent patern of the misadministration. I still think he should be thrown out on his keister, just don't expect it to improve the situation.

I was out canvassing again last night, this time fairly successfully. While at least half the homes I visited did not answer the doorbell, I found those who did very encouraging. There were only a couple of people who didn't want to talk at all and didn't want any of the candidate literature. My favorites were:

- Husband clearly a hardcore Republican, but the grudgingly admitted his wife, the Democrat, might want the sample ballot and literature.

- Republican who I think may switch to the State Supreme court candidates with our Democratic endorsements as the opposition are hardcore right wingers with close ties to the building industry (that's where all their funding is coming from).

- Democratic supporter who wanted to talk about how "Bush lied, people died". He tried to be coy, but it was obvious he is hardcore Democrat to the core, so I told him we could have great fun talking for the rest of the evening, but it wouldn't help elect any Democrats to office since both of us are clearly already decided voters. Turns out he works for the city Election department and has been an active Democratic party member for years.

I think people were a bit surprised to see me as our precinct hasn't had a PCO for many years, and many have never had one call on them... ever. I can see the power of doing this enough that I am recognized. I think it will definitely help turn out some voters and maybe even switch a few votes each election.

2 pages of my walking list down, 9 more to go, and my deadline is Monday night. Whew, its going to be tight... but I've found a new aerobic exercise!

bob, click my name for the link

Hi Democrats!

I have to say its great to live in Seattle, even if it does rain all the time!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2006/08/31/seattle-san-francisco-na_n_28464.html

• Bush stumps for Iraq policy
• Attacks kill 51, injure 126 in Iraq

Posted by gregg on August 31, 2006 at 04:23 PM

Shouldn't that read

bUSH stumped on Iraq policy?

It appears that Congress' desire to give the president the authority to rule over this country's national guard in a natural disaster without the knowledge of the governors isn't sitting well with them. After the horrific job our administration did on Katrina, the governors don't want to be put in the situation on having to wait for Shrub to make knowledgable and intelligent decisions on aid.

http://news.findlaw.com/ap/o/632/08-31-2006/a3cc001082723c10.html

Governors Bring Guard Appeal to Rumsfeld
By ROBERT TANNER AP National Writer

(AP) - The nation's governors sought help Thursday from Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld in their ongoing fight against proposals in Congress to give President Bush more control - and governors less - over the National Guard during disasters. A letter from the two chairpersons of the National Governors Association, along with the two governors who head the group's work on the Guard, asked Rumsfeld to join the unanimous opposition of governors to proposed changes spurred by the chaos and delays in sending help that followed Hurricane Katrina.

WAL-MART LICKS ITS WOUNDS
Barbara Ehrenreich, AlterNet
Who's really to blame for Wal-Mart's sagging sales --
Democrats, Korean fruit vendors or unions?

Posted by jen on August 31, 2006 at 05:07 PM

Thanks, jen.

Posted by Marc on August 31, 2006 at 05:08 PM

Don't believe him...it hasn't rained all summer! But it is still great to live here.

hi Marc! good job!

Shay's is on CNN shooting down Bush's speech today in Utah on the time-table for withdrawing from Iraq.

For those of you canvasing or attending events , here is a great handout put together by DNC. This is one of those areas where people are still fooled by this administration:

DNC: The Bush Administration Has Made America Less Safe

http://www.buzzflash.com/articles/releases/015

Kristen:

You gotta love this place... 52.7 percent of its residents age 25 or older have completed a bachelor's degree or higher. I guess everyone has to do something constructive on all of those rainy days.

Jen:

Thanks... I'm still just learning my way around, but it was nice to have a successful experience last night.

Oh, have I mentioned the rain here in Seattle?

the reality is bush's policy creates stumps but that is too ghastly to focus on.

Well, Well ! After cowering and hiding 5 years ago when this occured, seems like he needs a little PR right now!

President Bush to visit all three sites on 9/11 anniversary

http://www.rawstory.com/news/2006/Bush_to_visit_all_three_sites_0831.html

just getting out there Marc is the biggest thing!

Gee.

I am not a Republican.

I do try to be honest and open.

I am not a troll.

I guess I am no longer welcome here.

Tsk-tsk.

Posted by Paul on August 31, 2006 at 05:45 PM

Now why would you say that?

Jen;

The fate of unused embryos is worse than the video shows. That red biohazard bag that you saw going into a square cardboard box is done so for a reason. The entire box is then placed inside an autoclave and cooked in live steam under pressure for an hour. The whole box is finally incinerated at 4,000 degrees C just to make sure that nothing has the remotest possibility of escaping alive. It is all federally mandated standard operating procedure for all labs in the country dealing with biologics. Please don’t tell anyone or they will have us all doing embryo funerals.

Posted by Julio on August 31, 2006 at 05:50 PM

Please don’t tell anyone or they will have us all doing embryo funerals.

Either that or the fundies will attempt to prosecute some $8/hr flunky for 10,000 murder charges.

Posted by Paul on August 31, 2006 at 05:45 PM

Huh?

Airline passenger told to conceal Arabic T-shirt

One official told him, “Going to an airport with a T-shirt in Arabic script is like going to a bank and wearing a T-shirt that says, ‘I’m a robber,”’ he said.

Anti-Bush shirt OK in school, court says

"The pictures are an important part of the political message Guiles wished to convey, accentuating the anti-drug (and anti-Bush) message," the appeals court wrote. "By covering them defendants diluted Guiles's message, blunting its force and impact."

"We will not walk in fear one of another. We will not be driven by fear into an age of unreason if we dig deep in our history and our doctrine, and remember that we are not disended from fearful men, not from men who fear to write, to speak, to associate and to defend causes that were, for the moment, unpopular. And so, goodnight and good luck.” - Murrow, 1954

Good Evening Dems. Can't stay long as I have a house party to attend for our 4th district candidate Carol Gay.

Wow did Keith Olbermann smackdown Rumsfeld. Please write letters to msnbc in support of Keith:

letters@msnbc.com?subject=To%20the%20Editor

Here is Keith Olbermann blog on Rumsfeld in case you missed it:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12131617/#060830b

Howdy, everybody!!

Kristen, thts "turrrr" crapola has gone TOO FAR!

Evidence ruled sufficient in penis pump case

Linguists have stated that there is no "P" sound in that guys dialect.

so bush and rummy are out barking about how they are fdr and winston churchill. i am confused. a few weeks ago i could have sworn the president we installed in iraq took the side of hezbollah against israel, so doesn't that make him hitler and bush emperor hirohito?

so bush and rummy are out barking about how they are fdr and winston churchill. i am confused. a few weeks ago i could have sworn the president we installed in iraq took the side of hezbollah against israel, so doesn't that make him hitler and bush emperor hirohito?

Posted by gregg on August 31, 2006 at 06:45 PM I happen to agree with many who believe Hezbollah is a resistance group, not a terrorist group. The Iraqi President was not out of line in Middle East opinion to speak out on Hezbollah.

I also believe Iraq was the wrong war, in the wrong place at the wrong time and for the wrong reasons. The result of this foolish foreign policy decision was empower Iran, who does support terrorist groups, does train its own suicide warriors and is seeking nuclear weapons.

I received this request as a comment on my Blog today. I'm passing it along.

Mullah Khatami (the ex-President of the terrorist Islamic Republic) is coming to the United States:

Blog of the person commenting:
http://aryamehr11.blogspot.com/

The Iranian people are being killed by these terrorist mullah's which the state department has listed as the world's no. 1 state-sponsor of terrorism (be it foreign or domestic)!

Please do what you can to protest this terrorists invitation to the United States and if you are able to attend any demonstrations that will take place at the duration of his visit.

The United States foreign policy should be that of empowering the Iranian people not their oppressors which have held that country hostage for 27 years and commited mass murders without the international community so much as raising their objections.

Posted by Roxie on August 31, 2006 at 06:52 PM

Hezbollah is a terrorist group. It is their own stated mission to destroy Israel. The same goes for Hamas. Any state or organization that calls for the destruction of Isreal, or any other nation for that matter, should be considered as such, IMO.

Posted by Roxie on August 31, 2006 at 06:54 PM

At least we agree on Iran! :-)

Good afternoon, all.

After listening to all the Nazi fascism hype these last two days, I'm convinced that the Republicans don't have any idea who the enemy is or how it thinks.

They are now falling back to the old Asian domino theory in the Middle East. Bush and Rumsfeld sound as desperate as Johnson and Westmoreland. It's going to end bad. Why take the country down that failed road again?

The Republicans have led us astray since 9/ll. They panicked and occupied Iraq and now they are picking fights with everyone but Bin Lauden.

That isn't national security, it's incompetence.

Hy, we already have one person, one vote in all cases except election of the president. Nothing else needs to be addressed. Posted by Christopher_blunt on August 31, 2006 at 02:37 PM

No Christopher, actually we don't have "one man, one vote" for the senate, and that's where the problem lies. The pugs have 55 senators while we have 44, plus one independant ally. Our 45 senators represent a larger part of the American population than their 55 does. I don't feel that's right, nor is Democracy to me. Each state gets two senators no matter how many people they have. So a state like Montana with one million people gets the same say so in the senate as California with 36 million. It takes 36 Californian votes to equal one Montana vote. And with states with only half a million (or less) like North Dakota and Wyoming it's even worse. This inequality shows up also in the Electoral College system also. The small states have more clout per vote than the big states do and because of that in presidential election after presidential election they've been the ones who always have been getting their way. I think it's about time to allow the rest of to have our fair share for a change. As far as I'm conserned, the Electoral College system has got to go. It's unfair and undemocratic.

Once there was a President named Bush
Into war he loved to Rush
Without a plan he invaded Iraq
He wanted to get Saddam Back

Because Saddam tried to kill his dad
Do you think our President is mad?
He let Bin Laden get away
After he promised to make him pay

For killing Americans on 9/11
And Bush took instruction straight from heaven
To attack Iraq and create distraction
In order to insight voter reaction.

By: RoxieAmerica

When is the President going to understand who the enemy is?

Today he said in his speech that the Iraqi Shiites allied with Iran were the same as Saddam's Sunni henchmen. That is so wrong. He didn't know there was a difference between them going into Iraq and he still doesn't?

Four years of occupying Iraq and the neocons still can't figure out who all the players are? They have them all confused. No wonder their foreign policy is so ineffective.

The bums and their rubber stamp Republican Congress need to be thrown out ASAP. There is no excuse for this stupidity with our troops risking their lives over there.

SandyH. It's his lie and he's sticking to it. And another lie he keeps repeating is, if we don't keep killing the Iraqi civilians, big mean bad guys from Pakistan and Saudi Arabia will come over here and hit us again. Now I ask you, is this man a first class liar, or what?

Worried that too many members of the military are falling to victim to ruinous interest rates and getting into deep financial trouble, the Pentagon is backing an effort in Congress to slap a nationwide cap of 36 percent on payday loans to troops. An increasing number of states are taking steps, too.

that is nice. only 36 percent. you can count on your fat assed congressfolk to look out for those whose lives are on the line.

Here's a sample of how nuts the kooks on freepers are.

To: dirtboy
Olbermann is a crapless feckweasel....no lessfeck weaselcrap.......no feckless crapweasel...that's it. He is stoned or something and is nothing but a useful idiot of the enemies of our nation.
14 posted on 08/30/2006 7:41:08 PM PDT by shankbear

To: governsleastgovernsbest
Keith Olbermann is morally and intellectually bankrupt, he was scolding and blaming America. Basically he said, "the enemy of my enemy is my friend." = The jihadists against Bush and America are his friends.
42 posted on 08/30/2006 7:58:48 PM PDT by FreeRep

To: governsleastgovernsbest
The closer a critic gets to the truth of these people; the more vitriolic. . .inauthentic; pathetic and extreme, their response.

Rumsfeld has hit a 'truth nerve'. . .and they are bloody screaming. . .
. . 47 posted on 08/30/2006 8:02:45 PM PDT by cricket (Live Liberal free. . .or suffer their consequences. . .)

To: governsleastgovernsbest
The "peace and love" crowd seem to get hostile when the truth is hinted at. I'd love to see their reaction to my view that THEY caused the war in Iraq by giving Saddam a false sense of security. That they encouraged 9-11 by being vocal wimps when we were in Somalia. That they encourage the terrorists to fight on by dividing us, and making it look like we are 50/50 on this war when we are not.

Dailykos

This statment is classic wing-nut koo-koo, ain't it?

Keith Olbermann is morally and intellectually bankrupt, he was scolding and blaming America.

No moron, he's not "scolding and blaming America", he's blaming "Rumsfailed" who's too effing stupid to do anything right.

How does that old saying go? "Patriotism is the last refuse of a scoundrel?" Look at how these jerks are. "If you blame me, you blame America, man!" Sheesh, give me a break.

If you thought the freepers were nutty, read what Condi-lies-alot has to say.

Consider the progress we have made: Five years ago, the members of al-Qaida were largely free to operate, to organize, to travel, to move money, to communicate with each other, and to plan attacks to murder innocent people. Today, however, five years later, America is leading a great coalition of countries in the fight against terrorists.

You know, when I think about the truly GREAT countries of the world, Britain, Poland and Costa Rica are the first ones that come to mind. Absolutely. I'm sure that most Americans would agree.

Together, we are seizing their money. We're closing their sanctuaries.

Sanctuaries like...Pakistan. Have you seen the sheer number of troops we have in Waziristan right now? Why, the number must be in the high two-figures! The Taliban that originated in Pakistan, the terrorist network that the British liquid explosives guys went to in Pakistan--all being scoured as we speak by...umm....well, never mind.

We're hunting their cells. We're killing and capturing their leaders.

Lemme see about this. Osama bin Laden? Alive. Ayman al-Zawahiri, his #2? Alive. Mullah Omar, leader of the Taliban and close ally of Bin Laden? Alive. Al-Zarqawi? Dead--after three years. The general Al-Qaeda network? Stronger, by all accounts, than it used to be. Heckuva job, Condi!

Because we've gone on the offense, America is safer, but we are not yet safe, as we've seen just recently with the foiled terror plot in London.

Gee, ya think? Two years later: "Because we've gone on the offense in bombing Tehran, America is safer--but we are not yet safe, as we've seen just recently with the spate of Iranian suicide bombings in Starbucks all across America. As long as Republicans remain at the helm, you can trust that America will take the fight to its enemies.

By the way, Syria? You're next. Bring 'em on!"

We know that every day, each and every day, violent extremists are plotting new ways to do us harm.

Dailykos

domingo- just watched the olberman commentary for the first time a short while ago- what is there to say but brilliant- a certain bovine swine was here last evening claiming that olberman had accused rumdum and the admin of being chamberlain, and i thought "that can't be right"- boy, was i wrong- his comments were brilliant in turning their own argument against them with the burning calm of the truth- i think that murrow and martin luther king would have been proud- i picture kool-aid drinkers heads spinning not unlike linda blair's head spun in the exorcist

Hello everyone.

You know what gets me the most about what Rumsfailed said about comparing the left with the appeasers of the Nazis was the fact that in this country it was the Republican party during the thirties that wanted to appease the Nazis. Most of them wanted the U.S. to "stay out of it". Others like Bush Junior's family helped finance them.

Junior give the Nazi family salute, with that $#!t-eating smirk on his face. He knows what he's doing, and he thinks it's funny, too.

"they say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings, steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot, and they make you a king"- dylan

sadly, i don't believe those photos are doctored- you are right, he knows exactly what he is doing- that is why he cheekily made those remarks (on more than one occasion) about how it would be a lot easier if he were the dictator- make no mistake, he relishes the role

The right-wing-nuts will be foaming at the mouth over Olberman. How dare someone say something on the news that does not match their sycho-babble???

The really scary part is that there are not more reporters looking at Condi's and Rummies statements and calling them on the lies. The Republicans know they control the tabloid media and know that 90% of MSM will just report what they said and accept it. Thank God for Keith Olberman!!

LA Times: Pipe Down, Rummy

Rumsfeld’s cranky outburst mangles a historical analogy, bad-mouths legitimate critics, and illustrates once again why the defense secretary should resign.

Crooks and Liars

some sites today had photos of rumdum when he was in iraq playing the appeaser role with sadaam- probably receiving his thanks for the wmd's that this country and its military-industrial complex sold him- no appeasement going on there- the man is so morally bankrupt that someone is going to have to revise dante's circles of hell to include a special place for him and others in this admin

The party of Bush is morally bankrupt and inept. Let the Lamont revolution continue. Throw out all who rubber-stamp the policies of this failed administration.

Lie by Lie…

Mother Jones has created a comprehensive timeline on the lies that ran us up to the war in Iraq. Go take a look.

http://www.motherjones.com/bush_war_timeline/

Between Bush, Cheney, Rummy, Condi, and Powell, you can't get an once of truth out of any of them. And these dumb morons at freepers and like minded blogs believe every word of it.

domingo- that is an amazingly interactive resource- i wanted to copy the lie of rumsfeld in february of 2003 where he was saying how the iraqis were going to be celebrating in the streets and it would all be over in a matter of weeks- on the right hand column was his later lie where he claimed he had never said such a thing (alas, doesn't appear that the format allows for copying)- thanks for sharing that- i hope that more blog sites will offer that url so that others can become more enlightened about the lies of this administration

sex pistols liar

msnbc poll: Do you agree with President Bush when he likens the struggle against Islamic fundamentalism with the fight against Nazis and communists?

Vote

I didn't like the way that poll above was worded. To me see, it is important to go after Osama been forgotten, but this liar is sending in all the wrong directions. 90% of this stuff he keeps giving all these big scary speaches about have nothing to do with "been forgotten" or terror at all.

Good evening, everyone.

Sorry I’ve been working on a project and can’t spend much time on the blog these days. I don’t mean to ignore anybody’s posts. It's been sort of hit and miss lately.

It's his lie and he's sticking to it.

Posted by Domingo on August 31, 2006 at 08:05 PM

Will, it's not just a lie, its suicide. I just don't see anything good happening for our military in the next two years. The neocons are hell bent on starting another war, and we aren't going to be able to stop them.

I really don't know how much longer Musharf has left. You can bet Iran has been pouring money into Pakistan, too.

The wise would be woo Iranians while continuing to subvert them. This new leader is a real vanity freak. He could be manipulated just like Bush. But we don't have anyone in the administration smart enough to pull it off or willing to try.

You can just sense how itchy their trigger fingers are getting. They want to bomb Iran so bad. They want to bomb anybody Muslim just to see if those bunker busters really work. And they will after the election whether we win back Congress or not. The only question is whether they will use nuclear warheads.

The closer they get to 2008, the more daring they will get. They can't trust the electorate to fall for the BS any longer, so they will go all out before the next election. It will be Cheney's last chance to rule the world....after making so many frickin mistakes.

Bush is resolute. He’s placed his fate in the hands of God and history. But Cheney can't chance God's intervention. So we better put on our safety belts. It's going to be a really bumpy ride into oblivion.

Good thing we Democrats aren’t the defeatists they make us out to be. We are survivors and possess the knowledge that this too shall pass. I just wish I knew a lot more about radiation poisoning.

Good night.

Oh my gosh, Republicans up in arms because NBC's Brian Williams had the guts to ask some straight questions of the Pres, and Salt Lake's mayor addressed a war protest rally. Clinton the "teflon" president? How about not-so-curious George being the "president in the bubble."

90% of this stuff he keeps giving all these big scary speaches about have nothing to do with "been forgotten" or terror at all.

Posted by Domingo on August 31, 2006 at 10:13 PM

Isn't that the truth. It's no longer the War on Terrorism. It's the War of Choice...their Choice. They don't care what the American public thinks. It's their private military and they are going to use it whatever way they want.

"It's their private military and they are going to use it whatever way they want."

evening all,

sorta crusin'

sandy YELL BINGO!

that is precisely what the moron's club is doing... and we honest taxpayers are paying for it. and, you folks did see this...

"Bankrolled almost entirely by taxpayers, President Bush is roaming far and wide on Air Force One to help Republicans retain control of Congress and capture statehouse contests in high-stakes midterm elections.(msnbc)"

suppose we're paying for the moron to fly 1st class too! how much fuel is he wasting to spread his propaganda on my (our) dime?

BUSH'S CRIMES AGAINST NEW ORLEANS

Posted by DriftwoodOzzie on August 31, 2006 at 11:39 PM

Fools deny the existance of wind as it howls in their faces.

Addressing the national convention of the American Legion, the president cast the fight as a successor to the grand campaigns of the 20th century, against fascism, Nazism and communism.

Repeating a past theme, Bush said that if the United States left Iraq before insurgents were defeated and the country was secure in its new democracy, the battle against terrorism would eventually be fought on U.S. streets.

That's what they kept telling us during Viet Nam, if we didn't stay there forever and "fight them over there" they would come after us and we would have to "fight them over here" on U.S. streets. It was a lie then, and it's still a lie today. Iraq has nothing to do with the war on terror. Bush won't do anything about the real terrorists, because his daddy makes money off them. That "crime family" has been in bed with America's enemies for generations.

actually domingo,

the moron is preaching to his choir to save his legacy and his butt. he cares about the iraqis like he cares about the katrina victims... only worthy of lip service and photo ops... except his abuse of air force one is costin' us taxpayers some very big bucks for him to spread propaganda to the choir.

i hope the dnc calls him on it like msnbc did.

"I'm kind of a Lieberman Republican, if you want to say that," ~ Jack Kemp

NEW LONDON, Conn. Jack Kemp will hit the campaign trail with a fellow former vice presidential candidate from another party: Sen. Joe Lieberman.

Lieberman said Tuesday that Kemp, a Republican former congressman and U.S. housing secretary, telephoned to offer support to his independent campaign, which the three-term senator began after losing the Democratic primary to Greenwich businessman Ned Lamont.

Let me make it clear, I understand why the GOP is getting behind Lieberman over Ned Lamont. Any sane person would.

However, to see big time Republican donors, the party itself, and now long-time solid conservatives such as Kemp getting behind him must be disheartening to Republican candidates around the country struggling to do anything in their races.

Obviously the Republican, Alan Schlesinger, sitting in the 5% range doesn't have a chance. But there are plenty of good Republican candidates around the country that are within the 20-30% range that are totally being ignored: our own Dwight Grotberg here in North Dakota being on that list.

I wonder what RNC donors here in North Dakota think of the fact that the party is abandoning not only Alan Schlesinger for Lieberman, but many other candidates such as our own?

We all know Dwight wasn't the first choice, that's not a secret at all. But to have a national party that seemingly writes off it's own candidates like that is appalling. Why should any North Dakota's send any money to a national party that writes off our candidates?

Lieberman Republican

he cares about the iraqis like he cares about the katrina victims

america1st, I think all he cares about is their oil. If they didn't have oil, he wouldn't go near the place. He even said the other day we got to stay "to keep the 'terriss' from getting the oil". Now he giving us a "new" story why we gotta stay. So they didn't invade our streets. His story keeps changing from day to day. He'll say any damn thing, even if he has to make it up.

domingo,

this is a "cut-throat party" at it's worst...abandon their own. i saw this coming months ago. if i were those repub candidates i'd throw my votes behind the demo contenders just for spite. imagine having a military like this? of course the moron, shotgun dick, and rove never spent one day wondering about a commarade who's back you had to watch in a combat situation...sure kerry, murtha, mcgovern, nor carter would ever do this to a fellow soldier. of course would you want to go on a military patrol with the moron, shotgun, or rove watching your back?

So how come the trolls come out at the same time every night. Does Fox News go off the Air?

There's a new weekend open thread. Tracy says we can rest this weekend but after Labor Day.....I think it's a threat or something. The 100 Days of the Campaign or dwindling down.

NEW OPEN THREAD