Good morning, Dems. Lets get on with the INVESTIGATIONS!

Good morning

Now that I think of it ........

Hope you especially read this FOS sometime today.

During the first Bush administration and his reelction campaign there were all kinds of black pastors and gospel singing ministers coming out of the woodwork praising Bush and his "faith based initiative". How it was the answer to giving the black community what it needed without the so called "government inteference" attatched to government funding which had never helped, but only hindered African-Americans. We all know that governmental entitlement programs are not going to lift an entire ethnic race out of generational poverty and discrimination. Let me not digress here though. These big pastors many of mega churches were just what the GOP ordered up. Entire flocks were mislead and misguided.

Now that 2 years have passed and even a monk living in a cave knows that the Bush administration didn't even mean itself any good, well what are these conservative black pastors now saying?

I know what I am saying, "well if you all could be lead astray by first forgetting the principles of this country "separation of church and state" and then get sold a pile of untruths about "faith based" assistance and on top of that let the very people who have grieviously injured your ethnic group tell you what IS good for your flock?" What will happen if any more "false prophets" come along??

Lord have mercy on us .........

Morning J. Are you having a problem posting?

Losses in strongholds give red-faced Republicans the blues

WASHINGTON — When the pack of presidential hopefuls and the reporters who follow them descend on New Hampshire in January, as the 2008 campaign begins, a surprise awaits them. For the first time in anyone's life, New Hampshire has turned into a bright-blue Democratic state.

Buried in the news of the national Democratic midterm election victory was an even more dramatic power shift in the state that has become famous as the site of the first presidential primary in each cycle.

In the words of veteran New Hampshire Republican leader Tom Rath, it was "beyond historic" when the Democrats took complete control of the handsome state Capitol in Concord for the first time since 1874.

Laura Bush was just welcoming the White House Christmas tree and it was interesting to see her wishing everyone at the press conference "Happy Holidays"
i wonder if bill o'reilly will say she is anti Christmas, because we can't forget there is a war on Christmas

Posted by HybridFuel November 26, 2006 4:00 PM
That the 700 Club is engaging in "twisting" existing whole life policies and replacing them with term policies is most troubling. Older people often can be convinced to do thing that are not in thier best interest.From what I read, I take it that you are talking about permant life policies issued back in the '80's If so, they're over 20 years old. Such policies, if written on a non-par basis ( no dividends ) the annual cash value increase should be a least 50% of the annual premium. If the policy was issuued over 20 years ago by one of the better mutual companies, the casah value increase, per year with the annual dividend, should exceed the annual premiu. In either case, it is only in the rarest of cercirumstances that an existing 20 year old whole life policy shouls be dropped and replaced with term insurance.
It might be argued that pressing finalcial problems dictate that, ie need for cash for medical bills, ete. It is almost always better and cheaper to keep the original policy in force and borrow against the cash value, there by keeping the much lower premium in effect.
"Twisting" policies like this used to be a sever offence with the state insurance boards, and it should still be. And this may be a case of deceptive trade practices. For those of you who are interested, I would suggest that if we can get one or two people who read this blogg from each state to monitor the 700 club program, we may be able to do something about this. If they advertise any written material on it, call up and get it and forward it on to both your state insurance commisioner and to you state attorney general woth one question,"is this legal?" If enough peoplr do that it might cause the 700 club some problems and we might get this practice stopped.

bushfailed, Here is a little piece on the Faux Holiday Wars from our local paper.

'Culture war' in season of the Prince of Peace?

"It is hard to believe," O'Reilly writes, "but some CEOs of major retailers bought into the secular nonsense about Christmas and so they had to be educated. ... And so the great battle for Christmas was won by traditional forces, but not before there was a Battle of the Bulge-like offensive launched by the secular media."...

...Indeed, until "secular media" pointed it out last year, the Fox News Web site was hawking an O'Reilly "Holiday ornament" for your "Holiday tree."

Recently, the corporate parent of Fox News sent out a "Save the Date" message for -- you guessed it -- "the 2006 News Corporation Holiday Party."

Re: Insurace Above, I neglected to mention that the new term policy, in most cases, would have a new 2 year contestability clause and since most people in thier 50's and 60's have medical history, they could be turned down on the new policy, or rated up (higher premuim) or when death did occure, the new term policy could be contested. Its almost allways better to keep the old policy and if you need new coverage, add a new term policy on top of the existing insurance. That way you'll be able to shop for your new term policy from a reputable company

Posted by Kristen on November 27, 2006 at 10:58 AM

ya gotta love it
i just roll my eyes and laugh when they get so mad at people and stores that don't say Merry Christmas and instead use Happy Holidays or Seasons Greetings;-)

Do you hear that? It's the sound of the government pulling your Constitutional Rights out from under you.

Court shuns case of professor, FBI file

WASHINGTON -- The Supreme Court on Monday refused to consider the case of a Nobel Peace Prize-nominated law professor who wants the U.S. government to expunge his FBI file.

A federal appeals court found that information the government gathered on Mahmoud Cherif Bassiouni is pertinent to authorized law enforcement activity as part of the war on terror. The records are important for evaluating the reliability of FBI intelligence sources, the appeals court found.

The government argued in the lower courts that even though Bassiouni is not a member of any terrorist organization, it is likely agents will continue to receive information about him because of his travels in the Middle East.

Bassiouni is serving the United Nations as an independent expert on human rights in Afghanistan and he was chairman of the U.N. Security Council's commission to investigate war crimes in the former Yugoslavia.

In 1999, Bassiouni was nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize for work on international criminal justice and for his contribution to the creation of the International Criminal Court.

Bassiouni was among the U.N. human rights experts expressing concern about possible irreversible psychiatric symptoms in some suspected terrorists from virtual solitary confinement at the U.S. prison in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.

Goodfoe, excellent information. Thank you

I think I have finally figured out why the KKKristian's are so fond of war. Who knew they think that the sign for peace is a satanic symbol.

Woman faces fines for wreath peace sign

DENVER -- A homeowners association in southwestern Colorado has threatened to fine a resident $25 a day until she removes a Christmas wreath with a peace sign that some say is an anti-Iraq war protest or a symbol of Satan.

Good Monday morning,

Just passing by to say happy b-day Jimi. Twenty-six years you've been gone, but your sound survives and thrives.

I listen to "Machine Gun" to blast thoughts of violence from my brain.

W library in record book

$500M center would be priciest for a Prez

BY THOMAS M. DeFRANK
DAILY NEWS WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF

WASHINGTON - He may be a certified lame duck now, but President Bush and his truest believers are about to launch their final campaign - an eye-popping, half-billion-dollar drive for the Bush presidential library.
Eager to begin refurbishing his tattered legacy, the President hopes to raise $500 million to build his library and a think tank at Southern Methodist University in Dallas. Bush lived in Dallas until he was elected governor of Texas in 1995.

Bush sources with direct knowledge of library plans told the Daily News that SMU and Bush fund-raisers hope to get half of the half billion from what they call "megadonations" of $10 million to $20 million a pop.

Bush loyalists have already identified wealthy heiresses, Arab nations and captains of industry as potential "mega" donors and are pressing for a formal site announcement - now expected early in the new year.

"You can't ask people in Dallas for $20 million until they can be sure the library won't be in Waco," one Bush source noted.

The rest of the cash will come from donors willing to pony up $25,000 to $5 million.

Does Bush really think ONLY 500 million dollars is enough to overcome being the worst President in history? These rich bastards believe money solves everything. Paying "experts" to write propaganda in an attempt to rewrite history isn't going to work.

The truth will eventually become known it always does it can't be hidden away forever I don't care how much money is thrown at it. I wouldn't give 5 cents much less millions to promote the failed Bush Presidency.

Bush had his shot at greatness and instead of keeping the country united behind him he flushed it away by invading Iraq and alienating half of our population and a majority of the world's major powers. He's also violated Constitutional and International Laws and Treaties in his failed pre-emptive policies, this is not a record to be proud of no matter how his followers spin it.

I think I have finally figured out why the KKKristian's are so fond of war. Who knew they think that the sign for peace is a satanic symbol.

Woman faces fines for wreath peace sign

DENVER -- A homeowners association in southwestern Colorado has threatened to fine a resident $25 a day until she removes a Christmas wreath with a peace sign that some say is an anti-Iraq war protest or a symbol of Satan.

Posted by Kristen on November 27, 2006 at 11:13 AM

Is this real?

Now let me think ....... who other than the Christian Right is spinning the peace sign as something Satanic?

Hijacking Faith

It has taken me many years to understand what force had infiltrated the faith my Pilgrim ancestors brought to this great nation, but I've finally found it. For those of you who have not identified the culprit, it's Politics.

Politics and those who use faith as a weapon within it, are responsible for the deterioration of Christian belief. Republicans most often represented issues while making the claim that their stance was supported by the faith. Democrats representing another stance were then seen to be attacking faith every time they disagreed with the Republican interpretation. This ruse disrespected the Christian faith and Christians alike.

Posted by wldj on November 27, 2006 at 11:28 AM

i hope the W library includes books like State of Denial, Fiasco, the Abramoff Scandal just to name a few, i've lost count of all of the books that have been written about bush's countless lies and failures

here's a helpful link on some books...
http://www.amazon.com/gp/richpub/syltguides/fullview/3EWAXLH02YVL5?ie=UTF8&*Version*=1&*entries*=0

Posted by bushfailed on November 27, 2006 at 11:53 AM

And of course a copy of My Pet Goat.

A repost from the last thread:

J on November 27, 2006 at 06:30 AM

Well when old man Walton died those greedy kids went into overdrive changing that business into a slave shop.

------------------

J, This happens all the time when children inherit a perents wealth, and have no idea how to continue the vision that the parent began. So, they spend more time and resources with cost containment not realizing that the parents vision is slipping away, and with it the fortune amassed. Walmart is now only about maintaining the supremacy. With blinders on current ownership sit and wonder, "Where to we go from here?"

Posted by davidual on November 27, 2006 at 11:52 AM

Good morning everyone. Will be my usual lurking, here again, gone again self.

Posted by Christopher_blunt on November 27, 2006 at 11:57 AM

yep, the actual copy of My Pet Goat that he was reading on 9/11 during the attacks of the Twin Towers should be framed and placed in plain view for all to see!

wldj on November 27, 2006 at 11:28 AM,

Why don't they just put his (W's) library on his newly purchased ranch down in Argentina? Hmmm?

That was strange, I hit shift+H and my browser exited completly. I reopened the browser and my message was sill in the comment box.

What happened to Dean's reassurances that the new DNC wouldn't be anti-gay?

My support will only go where my friends are, NEVER to groups that are okay with the actions below. Bauer claims that the IN House will defeat the proposed amendment, when its history AND his fellow Democrats promise otherwise.

This action is offensive on another front: since when do Democrats support civil rights being doled out based on popularity contests? It certainly didn't serve them well in 2004...

Sarah G

From Indiana:

Democrats to allow vote on Indiana gay marriage ban
Resolution could be on 2008 ballot if approved this year
By Carrie Ritchie | Indiana Daily Student | Monday, November 27, 2006

---snip--
Soon-to-be House Speaker Patrick Bauer, D-South Bend, announced before the elections that he would allow SJR07, the proposed amendment to the state constitution that would explicitly ban gay marriage, to be heard again in 2007. Bauer said in a statement that he wants to bring the legislation to the floor to ensure its defeat because he said Indiana already has a statute that defines marriage, making further legislation redundant.

However, many expect the amendment, which passed both the House and Senate with overwhelming approval in 2005, to be passed again by both the House and Senate and placed on the 2008 ballot, when voters will decide its fate.

Rep. Peggy Welch, D-Bloomington, voted for the resolution in 2005 and said she plans to vote for it again in 2007.
--snip---

Marine on November 27, 2006 at 11:35 AM,

You got it. How'd you like to live in it?

On the hijacking faith deal, I'm one of the few "progressive" members of the evangelical Heartland Baptist Church in Paducah, Ky. It's the largest church in the area with a congregation of about 3,000. They had voter registration in the lobby going into the '04 election. The pastor, Don Young, who has been there for 40 years, would give thinly veiled sermons on "conservative values" and the importance of staying the course in Iraq. In the multimillion dollar youth center, there hung the biggest framed picture of Bush I've ever seen of anyone. In church Email threads they would spread rumors about Kerry, like the urban legend that Kerry had wrongly quoted some bible verse. I've been watching closely to see if there are signs of Bush fatigue among the Heartland faithful given the events of the last few months. They do seem less self-assured in their politics lately.

But I basically don't think there is much Bush could do to lose their support because they have raised him to the level of the annointed. It's like they think he was sent here by God to lead us in defeating the demon Islamists in Armageddon. The scary part is that they seem to have convinced GW of it as well.

Every time a Republican draft-dodging politician takes to a microphone to thank us for our service it makes my blood boil.

Posted by Jaxter on November 27, 2006 at 12:19 PM,

I am not a veteran, but I can empathise with all veteran's that have been so severly denigrated by the government that they willing served.

Then they turn around and vote magnanimous raises for the draft dodging members of the elite branches of government; IT IS SICK, AND IT NEEDS TO STOP!!!

I've been reading articles of the 50 state strategy over the weekend and i have to say i'm even more impressed than ever.

We had victories in North Carolina,Alaska,Alabama,etc. This is a great tool to use and i'm so glad we have this and hopefully this will be used for the longhaul.

I've been living in it for a while. When I joined the Marine Corps in 1990 we were merely all Marines serving the United States of America. A few years later I began hearing more and more about what Republicans could do for us. That's when the relgion I believed in became more politcal than I'd ever seen it before in my life.

Politics were always important to those of us in the military due to control that civilian leaders have over our armed forces. In recent years the civilian leaders have gone so far as to take upon themselves the tasks normally reserved for military leadership. This tug-of-war has gone on for quite some time but seldom has it led us into a war as unprepared as we were for Iraq.

Now I'm going to tell you where the use of religion by Republicans did the most damage. It was in our perseption of the terrorist threat. Because these Republican leaders relied so heavily upon their religious perspective, actions that involved a tiny rebel organization in the Middle East became known as leaders of a full fledged religious war. This Republicans touted despite the fact that our armed forces, intelligence agencies, and diplomatic powers rely upon Islamics in the region for a great deal of support.

This distorted vision of the terrorist threat led to support for a war with Iraq despite the fact that such action was not supported by the United Nations, international intelligence agencies, and despite the fact that the intelligence was in dispute here at home. Iran became known as a part of the "axis of evil" despite the fact that the country had assisted us in our attempts to rid Afghanistan of terrorists. This dispute has also caused tensions within the United Nations that now see Iran ignoring the organization.

To make matters worse the Israeli/Arab dispute has been allowed to escalate. All attempts at peace were simply forgotten at about the time we entered Iraq and have only recently been attempted again. This president ignored and thereby allowed the peace process to die. The United States was also seen as taking sides with Israel in the conflict as Palestine was shunned until democratic elections there resulted in more favorable conditions.

All of these things confused the issue of terrorism and led us into full scale war after first shunning allies who did not fully agree. I heard nothing mentioned regarding the failures of our airline security companies in the days following the attacks of September 11, 2001. I also heard nothing regarding the failures of our immigrations service. What I did hear was Newt Gingrich pointing the finger as Canada, who turned out to be absolutely uninvolved because all hijackers had entered the United States directly, some on Student Visas. Canada later decided not to assist us in Iraq, probably because relations with them were still in a state of deterioration at the time. They are and were then in Afghanistan with us.

Posted by SarahG on November 27, 2006 at 12:17 PM

I wasn't aware that Dean became involved in state politics such as this. Just the national level issues.

Marine on November 27, 2006 at 12:53 PM,

I here ya, loud and clear, sir!!! I've b3en sayin' the same things for the past six years. I stand accused of needing anger management, and of being anti-American because I refuse to buy into the terrorist lie.

This war on terrorism today is the same as the war on communism of the 1950's. I'm still waiting for a Edward R. Murrow journalist to stand up and call the bluff.

It ceases to be a state issue when they expect funds to be forthcoming from the DNC. Certainly I (and many other gay folks) won't be GIVING money to the DNC if they're passing it out to people who would do us real harm.

During his campaign and DFA days, Dean created a steady money flow from progressives that transferred over to the national party with him. I'm suggesting that a) this is going to undo all the damage control he did with the Stonewall Dems and the Washington Blade earlier this year, and b) some of his supporters will jump ship.

Also, if voters can't expect at least some lip service to the national organization's principles, why would they trust any candidate (like, say, a presidential candidate) running at the national level? Who would they really be voting for?

Just my thoughts... Thanks for the response.

Sarah G

funny, i really have a much greater appreciation for the song they are playing on wdst right now...the revolution starts now....

Yeah the revolution starts now
In your own backyard
In your own hometown
So what you doin’ standin’ around?
Just follow your heart
The revolution starts now

Last night I had a dream
That the world had turned around
And all our hopes had come to be
And the people gathered ‘round
They all brought what they could bring
And nobody went without
And I learned a song to sing
The revolution starts now

Murrow did not kill off McCarthy or McCarthyism, but he helped halt America's incredible slide toward a native brand of fascism. Unbelievable. You had to live through the times to know how fearful -- indeed, terrorized -- people were about speaking their minds. The cold war with Russia, the threat of a hot war with China, security programs and loyalty oaths -- all had cowed the citizens of the most powerful nation on earth into keeping their minds closed and their mouths shut. The Senate of the United States. in order not to appear Red, chose to be yellow. It was the Age of McCarthyism. Edward R. Murrow helped bring it to an end. [...more]

Marine, this is what I am referent in my last post.

Keeping Americans Living Below The Poverty Level Goes High Tech

New businesses use new computer technology to lower higher minimum wage fast food industry labor with even lower priced "outsourced" labor, keeping many Americans living well below the poverty level.

PROGRESSIVE VALUES

PaulSHooson on November 27, 2006 at 01:25 PM,

Not to mention powerless to do anything about it. As we all must survive, somehow. Either on the dole of government hand-outs, with all the guilt associated with that, or with a "taking-what-they're-giving" to ease your guilt job. Either way the recipient is obliged to put up and shut up. It's a lovely fascist aroma in the heir tonight wouldn't you say, sir?

Nov 23rd 2006 | NEW YORK
From The Economist print edition

No longer can America take for granted its global superiority as a market for capital. Regulatory reform might let it keep up with the pack

Down on the street

And, of course, we all recognize whom is so anti regulation.

For the better part of thirty years the american educational system has been underfunded, and later shackled by the drug industry. Is it now any wonder we are ata competitive disadvantage for capital funds. When manufacturing went overseas in search for lower wages our ability to innovate to produce future capital investment went with it.

It's also deeply discouraging, Davidual, that some food service businesses may be able to take advantage of a minimum wage loophole in some states to reclassify some food service workers as "waiters" to lower their wages to just $2.00 an hour plus any tips if Congress raises the Federal minimum wage.

Some in the Senate, like John McCain are already lining up with big business to fight any Federal minimum wage increase. If big business cannot defeat a Federal increase in the minimum wage, then they will find state by state loopholes to undermine it including using remote workers or reclassifying some food service workers as "waiters".

PROGRESSIVE VALUES

Iraq's Quagmire Of Quicksand

Quagmire of quicksand steps
Over a mine field,
Wearing leaded boots
Filled full of doubts,
Being in the middle
With no obvious path,
To move forward,
To move backward,
To move sideway,
But it is show time!

Mr. President,
please solve the carnage
Of civil war in Iraq!
Be the leader that
History remembers
In glory, not failure!

May the religions of peace combine in a prayer, over the religions of religious bigoted hatred killing each other ‘At Will’!

It is time for all the religions to come together looking for peace over religious genocide. Let worldwide Moslem leaders come together for peace over the atrocities of civil war. Then lets have all religions come together to condemn politicians, zealots, and leaders, who use religion as a tool of hate, to divide and conquer for their own greed, whether it is power, influence, money, profit, and any other self centered need that destroys the fabric of human life.

David L. Young 11/27/06

It's not entirely a lie. Terrorists use a religious message to rally support because they've had results with it in the past. That being said, most Islamics still choose not to become terrorists.

Terrorists have worked in the Middle East for centuries now. They first came into being during the Great Game, an espionage campaign waged from 1813 basically until the end of the Cold War. In the Great Game British and Soviet agencies attempting to gain a foothold in the Middle East often used local Arabs to their advantage. Throughout the years local Arabs not willing to grant either a foothold chose to fight rather than choosing to work for either power.

Following World War II the United States became involved in the Great Game. We did so because oil, the driving force behind our newfound power, was plentiful in the region. This is not to say that we believed all would be lost were we to lose control of the Middle East, just that it was in our best interest to have a say in how that resource would be distributed worldwide. We often found ourselves at odds with local inhabitants even then.

In the 1970's everything changed. These local Arabs, whom we had always been at odds with, began to form greater cooperatives. We monitored the progress of these cooperatives and occasionally interrupted their progress. Then, in Iran and Lebanon, these coopertives began to take off.

It all began with kidnappings and hijackings. Things eventually got so bad that we were forced to leave Iran and later Lebanon. The problem is that we didn't make any attempt to recognize the new governments that had emerged. This would have halted the advance of terrorism and instead caused the groups to focus their attentions on diplomacy and international recognition. Instead we continued to play the Game.

The Game itself is to blame for all that we see. Espionage requires overwhelming deceit and it angers all who bought into the lies. Strangely it does not matter how small an impact the lies had on the lives of people. It matters more that the lies were told.

Terrorism that affects Americans is what we should be most concerned about. In order to reduce this form of terrorism we must reduce the urge among Islamics to take up arms against the United States. This is done through diplomacy, as we see gestures such as the removal of Saddam Hussein only agrivate the situation and lead to increased terrorist recruitment.

The message these organizations thrive upon is one of religious right and local rule. We can give locals these things without granting terrorists victory and so we should do it. When it comes to Iraq we must encourage both Syrian and Iranian involvement in bringing the situation under control. We must also reestablish relations with these nations. In the Israeli/Arab conflict we must side with peace.

The enemies we are left with are extremists. In confronting them we must work with whatever powers exist in that region within which to those extremists wish to garner support. If we act there without the support of locals we play into the hands of these extremists.

Defense is of most importance in confronting these threats. Intelligence is equally as important because it will direct whatever offensive actions we take. What we want to do is to quietly break up these cells so as not to allow them to generate further local support. This does require great cooperation, but it does not require that we force entire nations into war, as has been done in Iraq.

Posted by Marine on November 27, 2006 at 12:53 PM

Terrorism? Ha! Drawn up and cultivated by the little small band of folks that control about 95% of the world's resources or for a lack of a better name - powers that be/moneymongerers. They are a diversational tactic used by this group of folk to control world events as they see fit. Who do think funds the terrorists? Not quite enough money in drug/gun sales, nuclear weapons or whatever else to fund some of these precision terrorists activities.

9/11 was specifically designed to kowtow the US and the world for that matter into submission and petrified fear of what COULD happen.

Little food for thought: The plane that hit one of the Towers was precisely at the point needed for collapse. Now that takes information, blueprints and exact calculations which ain't cheap if it's not public info.

The GOP used religion and terrorism to beat over the heads of the American public and scare into their corner.

State minimum wages A policy that works...

Between the last time the federal minimum wage was increased, in September 1997, and the end of 2005, 17 states
and the District of Columbia raised their own minimum wages a grand total of 47 times. By the end of this period, the
median minimum wage of these states was $1.40 (more than 25%) higher than the federal value. Examination of several
demographic groups for which wages and employment are thought to be sensitive to minimum wages found some positive
eff ect on wages and scant eff ect on either employment or labor supply. Th e same can be said for employees working
in eating and drinking establishments.
For several reasons, the very few statistically signifi cant employment and labor supply responses merited further attention.

For the better part of thirty years the american educational system has been underfunded, and later shackled by the drug industry. Is it now any wonder we are ata competitive disadvantage for capital funds. When manufacturing went overseas in search for lower wages our ability to innovate to produce future capital investment went with it.

Posted by davidual on November 27, 2006 at 01:52 PM

Agreed totally. Read my comment on the last thread this morning about Walmart and how they played a tremendous role in all that you mention above.

Suicide bombing kills 2 Canadian soldiers in Afghanistan. Two Canadian soldiers were killed in southern Afghanistan on Monday when a suicide car bomber attacked a convoy of military vehicles on the outskirts of Kandahar city, according to NATO officials. Full story:

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2006/11/27/soldiers-death.html

Marine on November 27, 2006 at 02:03 PM,

Ain't it odd how, after 9/11, we had 90, no, 99% of the world's governments seeking to help us bring the perpetrators to justice. What was GW's response--"Bring it on!!" I said then, that we needed to work diligently, albiet quietly, through these nation's intelligence resources and bin Laden would have been captured in six months. Also, the other networks would not have the propoganda ammunition of this war on terror/Iraq and Afghanistan to continue raging the hell upon the world. And, who gets the blame, now? Yep, the US.

J, I read it, and posted to it in this thread. Gotta go,schools out, almost.

Davidual, Bush's battle cries were lame right off the bat. The guy showed a clear lack of discipline and should have been brought under control then. Problem was that no person knowledgeable of warfare was close enough to him to do that. And don't even start me in on Rumsfeld, the pilot instructor turned combat planner?! Or that Cheney fella with the six draft deferments during Vietnam.

Good afternoon fellow Democrats.

Can we get an email system the US Post Office runs? I cannot get email delivered nor can I get email from my sister on my hotmail account. I want email that reaches reporters, family, and politiciians without filtering. I want lawyer's email to be delivered on time. I want to be sure my email is being delivered on time, uncensored, and unopened between American citizens. We can register with proper ID's to have a Post Office emails account that is under the government promises that demands a court order for monitoring.

Yes, I fear Free Speech like the patriots of 1776 and the Patriot Act of Guantanamo justice that aborts Constitutional protections like checks and balances with Executive Privilege of totalitarian royal power of both King George’s. Back then we had Whigs and Tories, today we have Democrats and Republicans. Strange how history gives US parallels.

While I supported Afghanistan, I was not in favor of the Iraq War. As a Vietnam Vet I seen the possibility of a quagmire. Well that quagmire has turned into a civil war and worse a genocide. Well it is time for President George W(ar) Bush (He was the one that called himself the War President) to bite the bullet and go into Iraq and solve his war. In his homework of pre war plans, he must have a CIA scenario that will bring Iraq unity. The President must speak to the people of Iraq, just like he needed to speak to the people here before the election, not to those country club crowds.

We need to draft those country clubs, those fraternities and those religious leaders, who supported the invasion, challenge them to go over and fight for their President, They can enlist their children in a show of support and join the soldiers of America’s public streets. So Halliburton’s sons/daughters and other contractors can support the drive for Iraqi peace by volunteering for Iraqi security. Let ask Bush’s Patriot Act supporters to go over and help him create peace. Or is it they will cower and say the have the Executive Privilege to ride the war out at home like those who could stay at home during the Vietnam War. Where a man only had the following options enlisting, going to eternal college, getting drafted, slipping into Canada , or having family influence to join the National Guard or the Reserves. So I ask Bush’s supporters to volunteer to help him solve the problem.

It is strange but with Bush actively pursuing peace and the unlikely partner of President Carter (Not Clinton in this case), who is respected worldwide as an diplomatic American, they might find a Iraqi solution out of the impending genocide, which will happen if US troops leave or stays. Maybe they can create a secure island where Kurdish, Sunni, Shiite, and others with Americans mediation come to a foundation that supports human life over human waste decimating Iraq. That in the meeting the human rights of all Iraqi’s are protected under Allah, God, and the heavens. But Bush must talk to the Iraqi people themselves, to start the process of Iraqi reconciliation, before Iraq is blown away in anarchy.

Good Afternoon, ALL!!

Well, it's official; the MSM has finally (temporarily) removed their blinders, and are calling Little Georgie's stab for "Glory" exactly what it is, and has been, A CIVIL WAR

This can complicate matters for the Insane Clown Posse in the White House, because since it is NOW OFFICIALLY a Civil War, the "Iraq Resolution" is null and void, and there is no longer ANY authorization to continue funding, or troop deployments.

Here's something from last August spelling it out.

Warner Suggests Congress May Need To Vote On New Iraq Resolution If Civil War Grows

Tomorrow marks the day that we will have been in Iraq longer than we were in all of World War II.

That's right. We were able to defeat all of Nazi Germany, Mussolini, and the entire Japanese empire in LESS time than it's taken the world's only superpower to secure the road from the airport to downtown Baghdad.

And we haven't even done THAT. After 1,347 days, in the same time it took us to took us to sweep across North Africa, storm the beaches of Italy, conquer the South Pacific, and liberate all of Western Europe, we cannot, after over 3 and 1/2 years, even take over a single highway and protect ourselves from a homemade device of two tin cans placed in a pothole. No wonder the cab fare from the airport into Baghdad is now running around $35,000 for the 25-minute ride. And that doesn't even include a friggin' helmet.

Is this utter failure the fault of our troops? Hardly. That's because no amount of troops or choppers or democracy shot out of the barrel of a gun is ever going to "win" the war in Iraq. It is a lost war, lost because it never had a right to be won, lost because it was started by men who have never been to war, men who hide behind others sent to fight and die.

http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/message/index.php?id=202

So this is Christmas
And what have you done
Another year over
And a new one just begun
And so this is Christmas
I hope you have fun
The near and the dear ones
The old and the young

A very merry Christmas
And a happy New Year
Let's hope it's a good one
Without any fear

And so this is Christmas
For weak and for strong
For rich and the poor ones
The road is so long
And so happy Christmas
For black and for white
For yellow and red ones
Let's stop all the fight

And so this is Christmas
And what have we done
Another year over
And a new one just begun
And so happy Christmas
I hope you have fun
The near and the dear one
The old and the young

War is over if you want it
War is over now

Posted by J on November 27, 2006 at 02:11 PM

I heard this morning that Walmart seems to be one of the few retailers that didn't get a push from all the shopping this weekend. Couple this will ongoing lack luster sales at Walmart and it would seem folks are sending them a very clear message about their business practices.

Good afternoon, everyone.

Posted by wldj on November 27, 2006 at 11:28 AM

wldj,

What are they going to display at the library? Empty beer bottles and drug paraphernalia? Or that notorious pretzel?

I suppose the Goat book will be proudly displayed along with the megaphone from Ground Zero. And that video from the Press Club Dinner featuring a smirking Bush looking under his bed for those missing WMD…laughing all the way.

I'm sure the leaders of the Axis of Evil countries will be happy to video tape their congratulations along with those new leftist leaders in South American and Islamic citizens around the world who hate his guts. The Pope will have to be brought in to exorcise the place of the stench of sulphor.

They could devout an entire wing to Bushisms and another to Karen Hughs inspired photo opps. Or how about one wing defining the Bill of Rights Bush-style...with a Freedom of Speech Zone a mile away from the library?

I suggest they call it the Bush Believe It Or Not Museum. I can't imagine even a rich person wasting their money on this folly. Hey, that's a great idea for the architect....shape the library as a folly. Or maybe a pretzel?

Oh, this is too easy. I could go on all day with ideas.

SandyH on November 27, 2006 at 03:54 PM,

As I said earlier, they ought to put W's lie-berry on his new reanch in Argentina.

Here ya go, Sandy...Brutal selloff on Wall Street. Nasdaq slumps over 2%, Dow pares about 155 points as weak dollar, higher oil prices, Wal-Mart rattle investors.

Let's put Social Security into Lotto tickets, too!

By TIM PARADIS - AP Business Writer

NEW YORK(AP) Wall Street suffered a sharp pullback Monday as investors returned from the Thanksgiving weekend with questions about the strength of the retail sector following a rare sales decline at Wal-Mart Stores Inc. Concerns about a weak dollar also weighed on stocks, pushing the Dow Jones industrials down 160 points.

Investors were uneasy after news that Wal-Mart, the world's largest retailer, saw a 0.1 percent drop in same-store sales, those from stores open at least a year. Same-store sales are the industry standard for assessing a retailer's strength, and while retail sales overall were strong last weekend, Wal-Mart's first deficit in a decade raised concerns about the strength of consumer spending during the holiday season.

"There is now significant concern that the holiday retail season is going to underperform," said Gregory Miller, chief economist at SunTrust Banks. "Traffic doesn't necessarily translate into profits," he said, referring to reports of crowded stores over the weekend.[...more]

Don't know if the link will bring up the article, or just link to roadrunner homepage.

out again, bbl!

Not in Argentina, david. The Bush twins were told to leave last Friday, and not come back because the Government said they could not guarentee their safety.

To All The Ladies,

Please don't hurt your husbands wallet and request hime to purchase a Coach leather bag.

Please do us all a favor and purchase Coach stocks instead.

Coach Inc. (NYSE Syb. COH) was $4.00 per share in January 2002 today it is trading at $42.12 per share.

Please buy Coach Inc. stock and buy your own coach bags. If you purchase $1000.00 of Coach stock you will earn enough to purchase one of their large leather bags by the end of the year on Coach Inc. for free from the earning!!!

Concerned over women waiting in-line at 6:00 am in the slush rain in front of Coach last Monday.

Merry Christmas to all!

DPD, the US Embassy 'strongly suggested' they leave but according to ABC they didn't take the hint.

Seems to run in the family.

The problems also seem to stem from out of control partying leading to outrageous tabloid headlines, like the twins running nake through the halls of their hotel.

Please don't hurt your husbands wallet and request hime to purchase a Coach leather bag.

Posted by HybridFuel on November 27, 2006 at 04:24 PM

This was an extremely sexiest post. Many of us work and contribute heavily to our husband's bank accounts.

But then, I really don't expect better from you.

The "ranch"...100,000 acres is in Paraguay. One report had it at 100,000 acres, another had it much larger. I suppose that after Bush finishes bankrupting the US, he will retreat to Paraguay and laugh at all of us as our children and grand children struggle to pay off the debt he has run up. Instead of using 500 million to build a presidential library, that money should be donated by Bush and his wealthy supporters to help pay for his war. Fat chance!

Women and men often misunderstand one another, and lash out as a result. We all know different people and inhabit different social environments. In yours women may hold the majority of influentual positions, while in someone elses social environment the opposite is true. These variations make their way into our language only to be misunderstood by others.

Kristen, it is very likely that Hybrid was not attempting to upset you or any other woman with his remark. I'm thinking that perhaps he exists in a social environment that differs greatly from your own.

Marine, if Hybrid didn't show his backside so often around here I might give him a break. I don't feel it is necessary to make allowances for his narrow view on the real world.

Anatomy of a Civil War: Writer Nir Rosen on Iraq'a Descent into Chaos

Asked by Amy Goodman what should be done in Iraq now, Freelance journalist and author Nir Rosen says, among other things, "There is no solution....[The U.S.] destroyed Iraq. There was no civil war in Iraq until we got there and took certain steps to pit Sunni against Shia....We need to know that we are responsible.We've managed to make Saddam Hussein look good, even to Shias, at this point."

Don't miss Rosen's assessment of the situation in Iraq. This is information everybody needs to know when they are evaluating forthcoming possible "solutions."

There's nothing to add except, "Hey, Bush, you did one heck of a job in Iraq. We warned you."

right after bush was first elected in 2000 the kid who was going to yale was flying down the interstate to nyc to attend a concert. they were in real hot cars and going over 120mph to get away from the secret service. the secret service gave up the chase for the fear of their being an accident at such speeds. sounds like a fun crowd to run with, i might be able to hang if they let me have a two hour nap every afternoon while they roam the streets trying to score the brown acid...

Sandy, the twins were planning to stay in Argentina until this Thursday, but skeddadled to Chili last Friday. They have managed to get an entire continent pissed at them in less time than it took their drunken old man to get the whole world mad at HIM. The gals are motivated boozers.

...And your Old Man, Too!

tylin, i am with you. this situation is like you have a cousin who is a junkie and he gets all his kids and wife hooked on junk and they all share needles and get obscure heart valve infections and you have been telling him for years to stop it and to think about the implications of his actions and so now you stop by and he says to you " ok mr. know it all what do you suggest we do? ". and you just sit down in a tattered old chair and stare off into space as you take in the unecessary human suffering you are witnessing.

WASHINGTON (AP) -- U.N. Secretary General Kofi Annan said Monday that Iraq is close to civil war, as the Bush administration stepped up diplomatic efforts to stabilize the war-torn country.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/11/27/us.iraq.ap/index.html

Why the hell is it so hard for some people to say the 'C'-word?? Say it sl-ow-ly: IRAQ IS ENGAGED IN CIVIL WAR. If we can't even recogize it for what it has become, how the hell are we supposed to fix it?

so the twin who got her purse stolen also got her cell phone ripped off. that should be an interesting item for some creep to explore.

Posted by gregg on November 27, 2006 at 04:56 PM

Greg, I firmly believe that how our children behave is directly related to how much respect they have for us as parents. I personally never through parties when my parents were out of town (and they left us often) because I realized how hard my parents worked for what we had.

When you look at the Bush children (Jeb's included) you have to realize that those good ol' 'family values' seem to be missing from this clan because all of their children seem to have the 'screw you Dad' attitude.

I took a course in Women's Studies a few years back and learned an interesting bit of history. In our discussion of Feminism it was revealed that the movement had been started by minority women as they struggled to provide a better life for their families. This was at a time when few women worked and even fewer were able to work due to discrimination.

It was said that the Feminist movement was hijacked around that time by an upper class attempting to drive a wedge between lower class men and women who worked together to improve their lots in life. If you consider the divorce rate and number of single mothers within the lower class a problem, then you might consider how it became that way. I see far too many couples seperating because they stop working together and instead start fighting one another over "what their partner is supposed to be". This keeps the poor down, while it has little to no impact on the wealthy.

Remember the era.

Marine, gender inequality isn't just a historical problem.

Costco is currently facing discrimination complaints because they seem to promote very few women although the majority of their employees are women and the Supreme Court heard testimony today on a pay discrimination case.

High Court hears pay-discrimination case

Who decides what their partner should be? I'd say that it is the individual. She or he will no doubt hear many opinions from members of both the sexes and yet must maintain a solid grasp on their own interests. This is difficult, especially for the young and impressionable still trying to decide what they want out of life. Many allow themselves to be led from one partner to another for years on end in search of that individual who meets the requirements of friends and family. Some never find that person and never get out of the habit of moving on.

I know that it isn't Kristen. I was speaking of history.

Posted by Marine on November 27, 2006 at 05:08 PM

I don't buy that "wedge" theory. I believe that the two classes were working independently for generally the same purpose. The wealthy women, while not looking for more employment opportunities, surely sought more of a voice in their communities, through the right to vote and so forth.

It isn't that women want so badly to do the same jobs as men and get paid the same wages. Women just want the same power that men have---over their own destinies.

My Womens' Studies class put forth the idea that the "Seven Year Itch" was directly related to the Draft, which took males beween the ages of 18 and 26. At 19, it was pretty much a given that you were going in unless you were married. Voila!! Lots of guys getting married right of high school, and getting divorced right around 26 years old. This forced women into the workplace as more than temporary employees until the baby came. Add the pill into the mix, and women no longer HAD to depend on men for everything, and the male dominated "ownership" society of all things domestic was pretty much old hat.

I pointed to the inequalities that exist between American men and women during the push for Iraq invasion every time someone suggested that we would be liberating the women of Iraq. I said that we could not do such a thing so long as the women of America were not themselves liberated. We still have women being sold as objects, sometimes by other women who should know better. The cause of this exploitation is money and the lack of companionship. Both sexes involved in this exchange lack one, the other, or both.

Not in Argentina, david. The Bush twins were told to leave last Friday, and not come back because the Government said they could not guarentee their safety.

Sandy, the twins were planning to stay in Argentina until this Thursday, but skeddadled to Chili last Friday. They have managed to get an entire continent pissed at them in less time than it took their drunken old man to get the whole world mad at HIM. The gals are motivated boozers.

Posted by DPD on November 27, 2006 at 04:19 PM

The problems also seem to stem from out of control partying leading to outrageous tabloid headlines, like the twins running nake through the halls of their hotel.

Posted by Kristen on November 27, 2006 at 04:26 PM

so the twin who got her purse stolen also got her cell phone ripped off. that should be an interesting item for some creep to explore.

Posted by gregg on November 27, 2006 at 05:04 PM

I said earlier this week those two were doing everything they had no business doing. Just let your imagination run wild times 10.

Since I'm obligated to use civil and clean language, I won't take this to the gutter where it belongs, but I'll say this: No one will be giving the 411 on who did what with whom.

I guess I would have sent my wild kids to another continent to hide their behavior too.

You might be right, Blue. I'm just sharing what information I was presented. Honestly, I see more reason for the poor woman of yesterday to have taken on the fight for rights than the wealthy woman, but I'm basing everything on historical accounts. I was not alive during that time and didn't run with wealthy crowds so I couldn't know for certain what went down.

I pointed to the inequalities that exist between American men and women during the push for Iraq invasion every time someone suggested that we would be liberating the women of Iraq. I said that we could not do such a thing so long as the women of America were not themselves liberated. We still have women being sold as objects, sometimes by other women who should know better. The cause of this exploitation is money and the lack of companionship. Both sexes involved in this exchange lack one, the other, or both.

Posted by Marine on November 27, 2006 at 05:28 PM

So true Marine, so true.

And as far as liberating the women of Iraq, one must first understand the culture of these women. I have always felt that the Bush administration was only paying lip service to this libertation of Iraqui women while not taking the time to understand culture and religion that has these women in the societal positions they're in.

How are you today, J?

Posted by J on November 27, 2006 at 05:34 PM

J, this was all a big, fat, lie to let the big, fat, liars like Rush pretend that they care about Iraqis and/or women. And their audience nodded, folded their hands across their big, fat stomachs, and ignored the bloodshed and the tears of the Iraqi women.

J, I struggled with this issue for quite some time and have argued from both sides. I see many women of the culture who want to maintain that culture and others who want it to change. I decided that it should be left up to each woman to decide for herself what she wanted. I have no doubt that the results will be mixed.

The burqa issue troubles me at the moment. I see some governments attempting to deny women this cultural identifier and others attempting to force it. I think it's beautiful, so long as the woman chooses to wear it. I believe that it should be her choice.

I saw that too Blue. Political posturing before, ignoring the pain they'd caused after.

Welfare reform hasn't made a dent in poverty

Ten years into welfare reform, caseloads may have decreased, but the number of people living in poverty has not. At the same time, the safety net of services and support that once protected the poor lies in tatters. Today, working parents in ill-paid jobs often work themselves right out of eligibility for desperately needed assistance.

Large colleges taking fewer low-income, minority students

DAYTON — Public flagship universities have faltered in enrolling and educating underrepresented minority students and those from low-income families, the Education Trust said in a new report.

In the past eight years, the number of poor students in the 50 states' flagship schools decreased from 14 percent to 9 percent, while the number of high-income students went up from 16 percent to 28 percent, Education Trust researchers found.

Posted by Marine on November 27, 2006 at 05:44 PM

Do you think a woman, absent religous or cultural pressures (in this case created by males) would "choose" to wear a Burka? I would compare it to the spiked 3-inch heel in our society.

As for inequalities to women in this country, it is shameless that a case like Costco has to go to a high court because they refuse to promote women.

As a black woman, I can testify to gender and racial discrimination all wrapped into one little neat package. I've had everything thrown and told to me from: this is a male dominated field, have sensitivity to the male occupation, you need to get your workforce educated in diversity, they don't understand the professionalism of the field - you name it, all these reasons and more were given to explain bad behavior, noncivility and just plain old incompetence. And I won't even go into the instances when racism reared it's ugly head. I've had to be a warrior and I've fought many a battle, lost a few, won some, but always ready.

Women have uneven terrain to travel whether it be in their personal or professional lives. And think Kristen put it best when she said we just want to have the power to control our own destinities.

J, the case before the high court is actually Goodyear, not Costco. I realized after I posted that my post was a bit confusing.

and the 'control our own destinities' was Blue!

I was the mouthy one that told Hybrid that I'll buy what I want. ;)

Welfare reform hasn't made a dent in poverty

Ten years into welfare reform, caseloads may have decreased, but the number of people living in poverty has not. At the same time, the safety net of services and support that once protected the poor lies in tatters. Today, working parents in ill-paid jobs often work themselves right out of eligibility for desperately needed assistance.

Posted by Kristen on November 27, 2006 at 05:47 PM

Check me out later on this one Kristen. I could write up a ton of thread on this subject with all kinds of documentation to support the sad facts.

Oh Blue I'm so sorry not to give you proper credit!

Kristen, due to Bushco cuts in Pell Grants, and the doubling of interest rates for Student Loans, Colleges are being forced to recruit out of State students from wealthy families, who can afford the higher out of state tuitions (which offset the Bush education cuts). This forces lower income in-state students out of the running for freshman openings. It's all just another part of Bushworld, where the "Haves" get more, and the "Have nots" get screwed.

More wealthy students at U. of I.
Lower-income ranks shrinking

J, I posted it because you were here and I knew you are just as interested in poverty issues as I am.

Yes I believe that many do choose to wear the Burka as many women here choose to wear heels. The Burka is much different of course.

As far as I know the Burka became traditional garb for these women at a time when their ancestors were using them to keep out the desert. There will always be those women who choose to continue wearing the Burka and those who wish to give it up. I can't tell you why this is true, I just know that it true as I know that it is true that some American women will continue to wear apparel like high heels and mini-skirts.

Posted by Marine on November 27, 2006 at 06:03 PM

From what I have read, the Burka was created by Muslim men in their interpretation of the Koran. It was used to de-sex, if you will, the women.

I can also assure you that, absent men, no sane woman would wear either the Burka or three-inch spike heels.

The burqa issue troubles me at the moment. I see some governments attempting to deny women this cultural identifier and others attempting to force it. I think it's beautiful, so long as the woman chooses to wear it. I believe that it should be her choice.

Posted by Marine on November 27, 2006 at 05:44 PM

Is a burqa the drape-like material that the women wear that covers their head and partial face? By denying these women to wear a part of their heritage and culture is so crude and ignorant.

Blue, this might sound silly but I think women dress as much for the other women around as they do for men.

As for the burka, there are definitely days when I think this would be a fantistic option.

It's a Civil War, Stupid

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/linkset/2005/04/11/LI2005041100879.html

Maybe if Prince George didn't feel the need to flee from his own people, his motorcycle officers wouldn't be put in such peril.

Motorcycle officer dies of injuries

http://starbulletin.com/2006/11/27/news/story01.html