Good morning, everyone.

Did we expect anything different?

There's is more than enough time to impeach these bozos and get people elected. Come on this is ridiculous. When do election cycles need to start 18 months in advance. I refuse to get sucked up into this. I suspected from the outset that the GOP was doing this (extending the campaign cycle) on purspose just to distract us.

I think we can forget about getting much done in Congress. It's going to be either a bad compromise with Chimpy - no more of that! - or just get filibustered / vetoed. We might as well turn to impeachment.

Posted by rjsnj on July 3, 2007 at 07:39 AM

It's both sides. The election cycle began before the ink dried on the the official results from the Nov. '06 election.

Over the next month, I'm scheduled to speak to the democratic base (16 counties) about the grassroots campaign we have established for Z. There goes (almost) every evening through the work week for me. I'm taking off a week to get ready for our wedding though. ;)

ah, come on, Steph! let my post go through. It's been one hellofa weekend and starting off to be a difficult week as well.

(what doesn't kill us makes us stronger...and all that jazz)

Posted by SandyH July 2, 2007 at 8:35PM
This a great post Sandy, I hope that when you come in, you will repost it here for those who may have missed it....Thanks

Ghouliani thinks Bush made a good call on Libby.

Bush:Libby::Guiliani:Kerick

If "all" Libby did was to lie to FBI agents and a Grand Jury "all" Bernie did was to "house" the coin boxes of vending machines at Rikers and invite the Sammy the Bull wing of the Mafia into Gracie Mansion.

Bush and the Ghoul are cut from the same cloth, the bolt for Bush was from Savile Row, the one for the Ghoul was from John's Bargain Store but in both cases the product was horseshit.

guiliani (and the others who agree) are only pandering to the hard right. gotta keep their base happy.

message to dems: work harder, laugh longer.

p.s. I have a concern about those who say they won't vote for Clinton if she gets the nod...that they will vote for the ghoul instead. (3rd party doesn't appear on all states ballots)

by mcjoan
Mon Jul 02, 2007 at 06:26:39 PM PDT

Mark Halperin on The News Hour just said that Bush was playing to his base, that he was making a lot of Republicans happy.

Maybe not so much. Check out this rushed SUSA poll, via TPMCafe:

• 60% say the prison sentence should have been left in place.
• 21% agree with the commutation.
• 17% say Libby should have been pardoned entirely.

The kicker for Bush and the GOP? A high percentage of respondents, relatively, knew about the case--55 percent. More Republicans than one would expect felt the prison sentence should have been kept in place--40 percent, fairly high considering they're GOP. They can kiss independents good-bye again: 56 percent said the commutation was wrong.

****

Well, here's one prediction. Expect to see Chimpy drop another 2-3 percent in the polls. How low can Chimpy go? I am convinced he will break all records for unpopularity right up to his impeachment.

It's both sides. The election cycle began before the ink dried on the the official results from the Nov. '06 election.
****

Yes I know but come on do you ever recall a time when campaigning for president started so early?
I just won't get drawn into it or spend money right now. Let the pugs campaign. I just don't care as they show themselves to be complete idiots everytime they open their mouths.

Get impeaching now!

Fitzgerald Reacts
by mcjoan
Mon Jul 02, 2007 at 05:58:32 PM PDT

FDL has Fitzgerald's statement:
We fully recognize that the Constitution provides that commutation decisions are a matter of presidential prerogative and we do not comment on the exercise of that prerogative.
We comment only on the statement in which the President termed the sentence imposed by the judge as "excessive." The sentence in this case was imposed pursuant to the laws governing sentencings which occur every day throughout this country. In this case, an experienced federal judge considered extensive argument from the parties and then imposed a sentence consistent with the applicable laws. It is fundamental to the rule of law that all citizens stand before the bar of justice as equals. That principle guided the judge during both the trial and the sentencing.
Although the President’s decision eliminates Mr. Libby’s sentence of imprisonment, Mr. Libby remains convicted by a jury of serious felonies, and we will continue to seek to preserve those convictions through the appeals process.

For all of the citizens of the United States, the imposition of a sentence that is consistent with the sentencing guidelines makes it "presumptively reasonable." At least that's what the Roberts Court said just last month in Rita v. United States.

That's for all the regular folks, but not for the Special Assistant to the President and chief of staff to the Vice President. At least not in BushCo. Paris Hilton and Martha Stewart should have been working in the administration.

Patrick Fitzgerald isn't happy...
by dmsilev [Subscribe]
Mon Jul 02, 2007 at 05:38:19 PM PDT

about being called, by implication, an excessively harsh prosecuter.
dmsilev's diary :: ::

via TPM, his statement:

We comment only on the statement in which the President termed the sentence imposed by the judge as “excessive.” The sentence in this case was imposed pursuant to the laws governing sentencings which occur every day throughout this country. In this case, an experienced federal judge considered extensive argument from the parties and then imposed a sentence consistent with the applicable laws. It is fundamental to the rule of law that all citizens stand before the bar of justice as equals. That principle guided the judge during both the trial and the sentencing.

Although the President’s decision eliminates Mr. Libby’s sentence of imprisonment, Mr. Libby remains convicted by a jury of serious felonies, and we will continue to seek to preserve those convictions through the appeals process.

So, he just called Bush a liar in not so many words. I wonder whether he's considering either reopening the probe or, alternatively, calling up Pat Leahy and John Conyers and say "so, what do you want to know?"

-dms

no, I don't remember it beginning so early, but then, I've never been this close in power politics either.

I respectfully disagree about impeachment.

Call the White House:

202-456-1111 9-5 EST

Fax number is: 202-456-2461

You can get through to the White House via fax any time.

President Bush is holding private meetings "over sodas and sparkling water" in which he asks trusted advisers -- "Why does the rest of the world seem to hate America? Or is it just me they hate?"

Perhaps some clarification is in order...

good morning, truthseekers

no, I don't remember it beginning so early, but then, I've never been this close in power politics either.

Posted by Esmeralda on July 3, 2007 at 08:23 AM
****

esmeralda, I been around it awhile. It's never began this early. The GOP did this on purpose to distract us from Bush and Iraq. Naturally, once one party does something, the other feels it must counter.

It is of course completely absurd. Very few people have sufficient spare cash to dump into politics 18 plus months before an election and even less are all that interested until a few months before the election. I suspect this may even turn some people off as they are overloaded with politics too soon ... maybe that's also part of the GOP's plan.

HONK TO IMPEACH

Americans celebrate July 4 as a day of patriotism, but the true spirit of July 4 has been lost. After all, July 4, 1776 was the day our Founding Fathers declared the American Revolution against King George!

Our ancestors won that revolution, but after 224 years King George came back through Texas. Fortunately we don't need to fight another revolution because the Founding Fathers gave us a Constitution with the power of impeachment. We just have to demand that our Representatives use their impeachment power to hold George Bush and Dick Cheney accountable for their crimes.

So let's use this July 4 to declare our independence from King George W - and let's make some noise!

Local impeachment activists report great success holding signs at busy intersections that say "HONK TO IMPEACH!" Most of the drivers who pass these signs are delighted to honk - which makes them happy and makes our activists happy too. Best of all, the drivers and pedestrians discover how much support there is for impeachment - something they never knew because the Corporate Media won't tell them or even conduct a poll. Here's a great report from Bob Feuer of Great Barrington, Mass: http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/honktoimpeach-1

July 4 is a great day to "HONK TO IMPEACH" because there's already lots of noise from fireworks and people are relaxed. So here's our plan:

rj, Kennedy announced in August that he was running before he won in November.

this is not wise and will disenfranchise more than energize, imho

we have 20 people for our corner...i'm looking forward to it

fireworks?

hope you will think twice before participating in the mini-bomb symbolism, and if you hang your flag, please do so properly to indicate distress

i am haunted by the "shock and awe" bombing, still...and we've certainly killed a million there and Iraq

read the declaration of independence and celebrate the holiday by taking bold action

IMPEACH

hey fade, great stuff...is it me? nooooooo its the salt water taffy we have been sending overseas the past two hunderd years....turns out it was all salt and no taffy....OF COURSE ITS YOU, YOU STUPID MORON! THE WHOLE WORLD THOUGHT IS STEPPED IN DOG POOP, CHECKED THE BOTTOM OF IT'S SHOE AND SAW YOUR FACE...

rj, Kennedy announced in August that he was running before he won in November.

this is not wise and will disenfranchise more than energize, imho
****

Hi fade!

Yes indeed I recall that well. It's was quite common to announce in the summer before an election. That's one reason why insane amounts of money were not spent back then.

American politics have gone completely nuts. It's way too much about money and with that latest rulings from the sick right wing supreme court that impairs mccain-feingold, it's even more about money.

From a practical stand-point, you just won't get many people to campaign for 2008 at this point. The candidates can build organizations, devise platforms, etc... I suppose some may get interested on door to door for the primaries ...
not too many from what I seen so far.

from Josh Marshall:

I hate to rain on the all Libby all the time parade, but there's something else you should know about, something which might be no less important.

In various posts over the last couple years I've pointed to the as-yet-too-little-investigated Pentagon dimension of the Duke Cunningham scandal. In brief, the Cunningham case appears to tie directly to efforts by top ranking Pentagon appointees, around and including Stephen Cambone, to set up their own domestic surveillance and spying operations. Key contracts for the CIFA (Counterintelligence Field Activity) program went to Cunningham's bribers. And there is good reason to believe that politicals at the DOD choose to ignore Duke's crimes in exchange for help running their programs outside of the safeguards in place in the rest of the intelligence community, and quite likely well outside the bounds of American law. In short, a big part of the scam may have been that Duke and his crooked pals got big bucks in exchange for helping Bush-appointees at the DOD spy on American citizens.

Now, one of these DOD programs was something called TALON (Threat and Local Observation Notice), a program to collect information on Americans involved in anti-war protests. This evening I saw this post from Emptywheel which discusses the recently release Pentagon IG report on the program (released June 27th).

There's quite a lot of interest contained in the report. But emptywheel immediately fixes on the key finding, or rather impediment to findings. In the report's words, "all TALON reports were deleted from their database in June 2006 with no archives."

In other words, right about the time the Cunningham prosecutors started seriously looking into this dimension of the case, and around the time information was starting to come out about the DOD's domestic 'surveillance' operations, somehow the entire record of the TALON program, every report that had been collected, was scrubbed.

Good morning Fade...hope you have a nice day!!

IMPEACH!

if you have an opportunity to see your representatives at an event, let them know how you feel...

J-Space voted against Rahm's proposal to cut off funding to the unitary Cheney's office

pfffffffft...not another nickel from me

have a powerful day, y'all

keep it lit~

read the declaration of independence and celebrate the holiday by taking bold action

IMPEACH

Posted by fade2bluz on July 3, 2007 at 08:35 AM
****

Darn right fade!

What's with Americans and fireworks anyway? I don't find the militaristic symbols all that appealing. I suppose the kids like to see them ...

As far as the flag goes, Americans should be ashamed at how they use the flag. A flag doesn't belong on your car getting battered by the elements. Show some real respect for it! No other country in the world acts this way. Jingoism and militarism.

good morning, John Boy!

you too--hope you can call the white house!

Now, one of these DOD programs was something called TALON (Threat and Local Observation Notice), a program to collect information on Americans involved in anti-war protests. This evening I saw this post from Emptywheel which discusses the recently release Pentagon IG report on the program (released June 27th).
****

fade, I recall reading about this a long time ago. So, these SOB's have been secretly diverting money to enact these spy programs. And we are still questioning whether impeachment is necessary? Come on, we need to stop making excuses. There's plenty of time until election '08. There's not much that we will get through the obstructionist GOP Congress. But, what's more important, our system of government is under attack by Bush-Cheney. They have made a mockery of the law.

Get impeaching! HRES 333 is on the table.

Snark warning on but funny in a twisted sort of way:

In Which Bush Just Goes Nuts
by djtyg [Subscribe]
Tue Jul 03, 2007 at 02:11:00 AM PDT

A future post from The New York Times, date October 2nd, 2007:

Bush Decides "I’m Doing Whatever I Want"

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/7/3/5641/71990

****

Basically, the question remains - what will Bush-Cheney have to do before some Dems back impeachment? I truly hope we don't have to find out because I think it will be something incredibly awful ... by then, it may really be too late.

Impeach Bush and Cheney would be nice, but what you all fail to realize is that neocons and zionists are on top of both parties. Its worse than i thought with how close the north american union immigration bill almost passed. Scooter is another ploy to distract citizens. Its like distracting a baby with a shiny object.
Time to remove the neocons as well as campaign against their democrat allies such as Ted Kennedy and Hillary Clinton. Kucinich is the democrats most honorable candidate I suggest you guys start to back him more or were all screwed.

good morning! remember kids the next time the fbi brings you in for questioning ( thinking of dpd and pam mostly )

LOL, gregg,

I don't need to lie. I have all kinds of cyber abuse, harassment, stalking, racist remarks, homophobia(afraid of being a homosexual oneself), threats against bloggers, wishes for deaths, that I copy and send on periodically to add to their files. I tell them they can track these sub-humans and terrorists through the DNC. I stick to facts.

ok i am tired of hearing all the "serves at the pleasure of the president, it is his right to commute the sentence" crap. since this is a case that directly involves the VP and Mr Bush, he should have recused hinself as any judge would (since he is now part of the judicial branch" in any case he is personally involved in. this is worse than any fiction writer could get anyone to believe. we will break any law we want, you take the fall, i commute your sentence, later granting total amnesty and we all walk away scott free. i am pretty sure this is once again not how the constitution was meant to work. our founding fathers had no way of knowing these kind of fellas (as in good fellas) could get elected. i would bet the numbers 666 are somewhere in this story.

rj...I agree, given enough time, Cheney will attack Iran. He needs to be impeached now. But talking about it here won't get it done. What we need is to get moveon.org involved with a petition to Congress.

i would bet the numbers 666 are somewhere in this story.

Posted by jimmyc451 on July 3, 2007 at 09:09 AM

illegal immigration. chip us all, that will weed them out! (and it helps protect against voter fraud too.)

how can you get some clean, refreshing water without your daily ration programmed in?

it's more than just "the president of the united states", it's about world power.

Jimmy...every time I see Cheney's name. the numbers "666" come to mind....

"The president has utterly subverted the rule of law and the system of justice that has undergirded this country of ours for the past 220 years," Wilson said Tuesday on NBC's "Today" show.

why can't nancy say things like this instead of...
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif., said Bush's decision showed the president "condones criminal conduct."

Nancy i know you are a politician, but moreso you are now a leader. get out there and lead and take no prisoners. the prize is the real united states.

Me gotta go, me o my o, see ya later at de by o

Some Email addresses and links for you all to be contacting:

Nancy Pelosi:
americanvoices@mail.house.gov

Harry Reid:
senator_reid@reid.senate.gov

Your Senator:
www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm?Orderby=State&sort=ASC

Your House Rep:

www.house.gov/writerrep

Just express outrage at Bush's act at excusing Treason in our country at a time of war.

Town councilman trying to make these hard working entrepaneurs (sp?) get rid of their trucks.

NEW ORLEANS - For proof that Hurricane Katrina is transforming the ethnic flavor of New Orleans — and creating altogether new tensions — look no further than the taco trucks.

Lunch trucks serving Latin American fare are appearing around New Orleans, catering to the immigrant laborers who streamed into the city in search of work after Katrina turned much of the place into a construction zone.

The trucks are a common sight in barrios from Los Angeles to New York, but controversial in a city still adapting to a threefold increase in Hispanics since Katrina.

Officials in suburban Jefferson Parish recently banned the trucks as eyesores and health hazards. New Orleans officials said they welcome the new business, but promised to make sure the number of vehicles does not exceed the municipal limit.

The mobile luncheonettes are operated mostly by Mexican and Central American families.

"I'm looking for an opportunity. That's why I left my country, and that's what led me here," said Maria Fuentes, 55, who came to the United States from Mexico a decade ago and settled in New Orleans after the storm. "This is the first time I've owned my own business and my dream is to have traditional restaurants, not trucks, all over this town."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070702/ap_on_re_us/katrina_hispanic_influx

Here's the GOOD news people. Even 68% of Republicans, plus 80% Independents DISAGREE with Bush on the Libby decision!

"Most Disagree With Bush's Libby Decision

A new SurveyUSA instant poll finds just 21% of Americans agree with President Bush's decision to commute Scooter Libby's prison sentence, 60% say Bush should have left the judge's prison sentence in place, and 17% wanted a full pardon.

Only those familiar with the case were asked to react to the President's action.

Partisan breakdown: 32% of Republicans agree with the President's decision, compared to 14% of Democrats and 20% of Independents.

http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fpoliticalwire.com%2Farchives%2F2007%2F07%2F02%2Fmost_disagree_with_bushs_libby_decision.html

We shall keep this out in front of the Voting public next year too, along with 3500+ US deaths for a lie, Katrina still a disaster, Corruption, economy, Gasoline prices, etc.

Posted by PamB on July 3, 2007 at 09:41 AM

Good morning, Bold. They are transporting my dad to Ross Heart Center and placing him in holding until they can do surgery. I'm hanging out waiting on word when it's scheduled. (neither hospital knows???)

Anyway, my older brother contracted cellulitis last year when he was working for a company to clean up the mess down in NO.

After President George W. Bush commuted the sentence of I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby, his former adviser and one-time Chief of Staff to Vice President Dick Cheney, a contender for the Democratic nomination for president in 2008 encouraged citizens to flood the White House with phone calls. A blogger raised the ante, and linked to an internal White House telephone directory so callers could reach beyond the White House's switchboard.

"Last week Vice President Cheney asserted that he was beyond the reach of the law. Today, President Bush demonstrated the lengths he would go to, ensuring that even aides to Dick Cheney are beyond the judgment of the law," Senator Joseph Biden (D-DE), a 2008 long shot, said in a statement he issued after Bush made his move. "It is time for the American people to be heard — I call for all Americans to flood the White House with phone calls tomorrow expressing their outrage over this blatant disregard for the rule of law."

One blogger followed up on Biden's suggestion and took it a step further. Lambert Strether at the blog CorrenteWire posted a link to the White House's full internal telephone directory in a Monday night entry.

"I figure the regular switchboard might be busy tomorrow, but if you’ve got the White House phone directory, you can just work your way down until somebody picks up," he wrote.

From all over the country, phone calls have flooded Washington in recent weeks. According to various news reports, part of the US Senate's phone system crashed in the wake of the contentious debate over immigration reform legislation.

"So many Senators' offices were inundated with calls, mostly in opposition, that the Senate telephone switchboard was shut down," Silia Brush reported in a June 29 US News and World Report article.

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Democrat_hopeful_calls_on_citizens_to_0703.html

here's the corrente blog:

http://correntewire.com/

Jacq, Good luck with your Dad. Thoughts are with you. I can believe that about your brother, conditions are supposed to still be horrendous. thank goodness these latinos are such a hard working community.

Goos Morning, ALL!

Congressman Jesse Jackson Jr. is calling for the House to begin investigations immediately with the express purpose of building a case for impeachment proceedings to start ASAP.

It's not about Libby, but th entire corruption of the Office of the President. Libby was the last straw.

Posted by goodfoe on July 3, 2007 at 03:05 AM

did you also predict that Skooter would skate? If you did, I'm going to start reading your posts more closely for your wise thoughts.

I've been trying to figure out just "which" news caster (the David Schuster kind) that also make good predictions (as they MAY have a better history than I)

Even though I dislike Pat Buchanan's politics I usually find him to be quite candid and you can tell when he's BSing as he always grins. Chris Matthews is almost ALWAYS WRONG! Keith was GREAT last night but rarely predicts.

Just wondering if the rest of you here (non trolls) would like to give me their thoughts. Please. Don't just say they're ALL liars or part of the machine. I know that but SOME of them can be quite the "bell weather" ya know?

so WHO are they?

Thanks to all who reply! Oh and HUGS and Goede Dag!

Fighting them over there so they won't come over here? That's a crock! Bush has spawned a whole new Arena for Al Qaeda now. Where there were NONE, now they are setting up training camps and recruiting guys from around the world. Thanks for helping out these guys, Bush! You have turned this world into a huge Terrorist playground.

Al Qaeda In Iraq Behind U.K. Bomb Plot?
Sources Tell CBS News Suspects Recruited By Leader Of Terror Group's Iraq Branch

http://www.rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbsnews.com%2Fstories%2F2007%2F07%2F03%2Fterror%2Fmain3010835.shtml

Besides saying that Clinton did it...what our friends on the right are saying about the commutation of Scooters sentence....

I thought we were the loonie left but these guys have us beat hands down with logic that defies gravity.

http://michellemalkin.com/2007/07/02/breaking-bush-commutes-libbys-sentence/#comments

On July 2nd, 2007 at 6:17 pm, citizen said:
Bush should have pardoned the man. It was a political witch hunt and Libby should not have been harmed by the out of control prosecuter. It just goes to show you that the only right you have left is the right to remain silent. Libby should have shut his mouth on the grounds that everything he said would be used against him.

He was railroaded on phoney baloney charges and Bush should have cut him loose so the sicko prosecuters don’t get rewarded.

Libby didn’t do anything wrong. The prosecuter and the entire court system is untrustworthy and shameful. It’s as if Nyquist (sp) had won.

shame shame shame on Bush for deserting a loyal friend..,

Why is Hillary leading Democratic polls? Does the base realize that there are independents and left leaning republicans who will never, never vote for Hillary? It seems like the base is setting up the nomination for failure. We need to start thinking like the republicans. Why do you think Guiliani is leading their polls? Let's be practical here. If we know that a majority (52%) of those polled will NEVER vote for Hillary if she is nominated, then why are we promoting her as the eventual candidate. This is driving me crazy!

morning dave:

does it say any of those wackos were from MN? :)

I DO agree to an extent with the one guy who says our court system is untrustworthy and shameful........ The Supreme Court is very, very shameful! Practicing politics and Religion!

bbl,

I'll vote for BOZO if he's a democrat over THIS CROOKED ADMINISTRATION!!

give me a frigging BREAK buffalobs

It just goes to show you that the only right you have left is the right to remain silent.
Posted by gnois on July 3, 2007 at 10:20 AM

Even the neocon wing nuts know that we are losing all our rights!

Call the switchboard and have them direct you to YOUR Senator and do what I just did! Even though DOLE is a PUG I still called and gave her office a PIECE of my MIND about her crooked PRESIDENT.

1-202-224-3121

I just got the number from the Lionel Show.... hehe.

Good morning, all.

fade,

Funny how we all forgot that TALON stuff. I suppose there have been so many other unconstitutional outrages and this disastrous Iraqi occupation taking place to divert our attention.

Shortly before this was unearthed a few years ago, a friend in the animal rights movement (I applaud the activism but am not a fan) warned that there was something strange going on with the surveillance of their work other than that being done by the FBI.

Sure enough, the NSA and other rouge spying operations were operating illegally with the approval and full support of the President...without oversight by the Congress. Jay Rockefeller was so alarmed with the few glimpses he got that he wrote a letter to Bush and made sure it was archived for posterity.

We need to keep our ears to the grapevine. With only 18 months to the coming change in power at the White House, those who have been abusing this system within the executive branch (and the Cheney branch of shadow government) must be desperate to find a way to keep from being brought to justice someday.

The President's action yesterday was the act of a trapped animal. Now that Libby has been set free to moon the judge who sentenced him, it also frees those who have been legally tied down to go after him in other ways.

Those who say they are strict constructionists probably are already ahead of us on this. I think those who truly believe in the Constitution and our system of check and balances may be working as stealthily as the TALON operatives were.

I know there are those among the conservatives who are as determined as us to correct the abuses that have led to a weakened military, politicalized DOJ, nonexistent diplomatic corps, and the integrity of our intelligence agencies.

We are not alone in recognizing the threat to our Republic. There is more than one way to skin a mink/skunk. When the Right and Left are forced to come together to insure political stability, you know it could be the makings of a perfect storm for those who think they are unsinkable.

Have faith in what our founding fathers created. We might have to be a little creative, but the inner workings are there to right this offense against the rights of the many by the arrogance and corruption of the few.

Essie,

My thoughts are with you and your family.

Gotta run. later.

Does the base realize that there are independents and left leaning republicans who will never, never vote for Hillary?

do you realize those people who say they are left leaning repubs will never ever vote dem?

I saw an interesting post at TPM that sums up why Libby won't get a full pardon until Chimpy is walking out the door.

All the more reason to get rid of the Chimp ASAP

Posted by Dawnie on July 3, 2007 at 10:34 AM

Atrios posted last night that the WH shut down their switchboard to the public comments number.

I just heard 5 minutes ago (on the Stephanie Miller show without Stephanie) that they shut it down AGAIN this morning!

I just called that number I listed and got right through. Lionel show said it was cuz the other was shut down indeed. This is for the switchboard of all the Senators. The lady that first picked up was chuckling. I guess she was all of a sudden getting lots of calls and was seemingly all FOR IT.

I of course ranted with her for a bit too. hehe.

I did not predict that Bush would let Scooter skate. Until the court said he had to go to prison "right now" there was no need for such a prediction. I felt that Bush would give him a full pardon at the end of Bush's term. I still think this will happen. Cheney has his shotgun stuck in Bush's ear. They have to give Scooter a full pardon in return for him keeping his mouth shut. Or kill him. That's also a possibility.

I agree Buffalo. Hillary is too devisious and has too much baggage to be a viable candicate.

what baggage? i don't understand the hatred of hillary. was it universal health care? staying married through bad times? (i thought that was the christian thing to do) i understand if you don't agree with some of her ideas, but what "baggage" and what are some of her ideas you disagree with?

No one is more outraged over the Libby commutation, but let's be honest there is no legal or constitution basis for removing the President because what he did is neither a "high crime or misdemeanor." And last time I checked, there is no provision in the const. for recalling an elected president. Besides, we would have to remove the entire administration, because Cheney would serve until articles of impeachment are passed for him as well. I don't even want to entertain that notion.

What I think is more important is to solidify the next presidential election. I don't think Senator Clinton does that. Ok, since some have said rep. will never vote for a democrat, then how about this point, some democrats will never vote for Senator Clinton. They will simply stay home. We all know that republicans will mobilize their base to vote. We cannot afford to lose any voters through disaffection. Again, we need to be pragmatic!

That's also a possibility.

Posted by goodfoe on July 3, 2007 at 10:49 AM

scary!

Hey goodfoe, was that you who signed a guest book recently? :-] Thanks!

So no one thinks ANY news broadcasters are candid and good predictors? bummer. How about Mike Barnicle (sp)?

Posted by BuffaloGrover on July 3, 2007 at 10:50 AM

(Nice town, BTW).

Then work for someone else. The Primary is 2-05-07.

my post at 10:49 was for Dawnie....sorry 'bout that

Posted by BuffaloGrover on July 3, 2007 at 10:50 AM

(Nice town, BTW).

Then work for someone else. The Primary is 2-05-08.

No one is more outraged over the Libby commutation, but let's be honest there is no legal or constitution basis for removing the President because what he did is neither a "high crime or misdemeanor."
i disagree and with a special investigator with the agresiveness of ken starr, i think more of the truth would get out and we could be done with both of these guys. nothing could be worse than watching rove, GW and shotgun walk away laughing in a year.

I'm no uber fan of Hill's.

I'm an UBER GORE and CLARK fan. But since they're NOT running....... any of the rest are fine with me. Looks like Obama had a spectacular quarter in raising cash. And it seems Edwards has some real fans over at Air America. I like Richardson a lot too. It's all GOOD on our side is my point.

I KNOW, 08.

Dawn, Cliff Schecter is good. Jack Cafferty, there are a few others, but I don't pay attention to their names because I'm not into Celebrity Journalists. The message is more important than the messenger.

Whether you like the Final Candidate for Presidency in the General Election or Not----REMEMBER THIS!

If the Dems through biting off their noses to spite their face, allows another Republican to get in office, say goodbye to those rights we have all enjoyed all our lifetime. Watch the SCOTUS turn totally Red, FOR THEIR LIFETIME appointments. Watch the Republicans tear down civil rights, workers rights, medicare, SS, disability, children care, elderly care, etc.

If Hillary is the one on the ballot- Hold your nose and pull that lever! Remember it is only for a 4 or 8 year term. SCOTUS is your Lifetime! And your children's and grandchildren's!

And I am not promoting any candidate at this point, but I will tell you that Hillary Clinton is a very intelligent woman, savvy in foreign policy , economy, health care, etc, and we could do a lot worse than her, also!

Yes Dawnie, I signed your guest book...real nice URL

gotta run to the ATM and a few chores. Gonna go see Sicko this afternoon. Should be entertaining. My sister and I taking her grandkids with us. Fine little Democrats in the making!

DPD

they don't give Jack (x pug) Cafferty enough air time on CNN. You are right he is very candid. I was just wondering cuz you always hear people like Tweety saying "you watch, I predict this" or "I bet that" or "I was RIGHT last year when I said this or that"

I want to know WHO really WAS right! lol besides us the general public who saw this Iraq war coming BEFORE it ever happened

Posted by jimmyc451 on July 3, 2007 at 10:49 AM

It's not hatred. That's a pretty strong word and personally, badly used.

But, I'll tell you what I think it is and as humbly as possible.

Hillary is more of the same and what I mean by that is Washington establishment. Perhaps the most telling was her back down on National Healthcare and her now reciprical agreements for campaign finance from the very same people she had campaigned against.

In addition, she was a Iraq hawk. I know that sounds harsh but she gave her full support to the cheesebrain. There was plenty of evidence at the time to reconsider that support and I don't buy that the democrats who supported the invasion of Iraq were give bad intelligence. There was plenty of reports that were contrary to that. It's only surfaced just recently that almost none of our representatives read the NIE report.

She's in that soup and it's unfortunate.

Posted by goodfoe on July 3, 2007 at 11:03 AM

yes I'm all dressed up for the holiday!

I refuse to let the PUGlik'ns claim my 4th of July!

Most of THEM are chickenhawks, they have little right to it!

New thread for Libby comments.

First off she's too closely associated with Bill. He alienated many of us with his behavior in office. Granted, she stuck by his side but whether it was love or fear of losing his political base is an unknown.
Her vote to go to war against Iraq is another issue. Whether you agree with her decision and then reversing herself, many of us will remember her decision.

Posted by PortlandAnnie on July 3, 2007 at 11:02 AM

Annie,

Not only did Bill leave office with a 67% approval rating, he is now sought out and beloved by the entire world. He is working on International global issues because he cared about and was respected worldwide. He will be remembered as one of the best Presidents, despite his indescretion. I will take his bj and even lying about it, over Bush's lies and killing of 3500+ US boys anyday.

and as for Democrats voting for this invasion and then reversing, we have ALL of the Democratic candidates who were in office at the time doing the same exact thing. No one said anything about Edwards when he changed his mind. Hillary says if she had the vote to do over, knowing what they all know today, she would not have voted for it. What more do we ask of her? They were lied to, plain and simple. Hillary more than the others must show a show of strength if she wishes to be considered a player for Leader of the Free World. Cut her some slack !

Joe Wilson: Bush has "utterly subverted the rule of law and system of justice" and has role in the cover up

Pam, I agree with you completely...if Hillary gets the nomination, then she's it and I will vote for her. A lot can happen between now and the general election. Obama is raising money like crazy and money translates into votes. Edwards could skin everybody in the early going and gain momentum and cash. Who knows how it will all turn out? Not me! so, I'm keeping my powder dry and will support whoever the nominee is. Any of them are much better than John, Ruddy or Fred!!!

Good morning all. I hope you all have a productive day and holiday tomorrow.

Dawnie...If you are "all decked out" for the 4th, you should take a picture of your 4th of July outfit and put that on your website too....Later....

lol goodfoe no I meant my WEBSITE was decked out.

pahaha! no not me! off to brunch (er lunch) whoa what HAPPENED to the day?

I need fuel

Peace all!

So which Dem DO you support?

The latest on scooter was that he was going to sing like a canary so I can imagine the all out panic at the white house. Not surprised that bush keeps scooter out of prison where he belongs. Actually he should have to stand in front of a firing squad for treason with many others involved in this!

I pretty much agree with everyone here. There is no real baggage for Hillary, other than her association with a galvanizing administration. Bill Clinton was a fantastic president, but the mere mention of his name sends a lot of people into convulsions. The same is true with Hillary. I've had debate, after debate about how irrational people's hatred of Hillary is, but it all boils down to a visceral reaction probably because she is the wife of a powerful man. No matter what, they will not like Hillary. If that is true, then why not back a candidate who does not evoke such aversion.

Oh, and where Hillary does drive me crazy is in her use of rovian campaign tactics. There isn't a reasonable person who thinks the "punjab" article was a personal attack on Hillary. It was a staffer's stupid attempt at wit. Yet, it became an attack point by the Clinton campaign and the true issue became buried. I wish they elevate the debate, not drag it down for political hay.

It’s easy to be a Monday morning quarterback and say that you’d not vote for the war now that it’s gone bad but that’s just CYA tactics. They blew it the first time, no denying that!

Posted by PortlandAnnie on July 3, 2007 at 11:28 AM

You are so right, and likely doing the same thing. I was against the war from the start, even refusing to watch any of the glorified killings on TV that had the nation enthralled. Your neighbors were for it. At some point though, you have to give them some props for realizing they made a mistake. Edwards apologized.

Most of those in Congress were so wrapped up in the whole 9/11 bravado that swept the nation that they were only doing the GPs bidding. What it comes down to is that by holding every candidate to the standard of "did you vote for the invasion" narrows the pool to a shallow puddle.

Just my .02. bbl.

Canadian soldier died by friendly fire: U.S. report. A U.S. army report made public Monday said it was friendly fire that killed a Canadian soldier and an American soldier in Afghanistan in March 2006. The report was released to the Associated Press through a Freedom of Information Act request.
Read more . . .

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2007/07/02/friendly-fire.html

Seven Afghan police killed by roadside bomb
KANDAHAR, Afghanistan -- A roadside bomb destroyed a police vehicle patrolling in a dangerous area of southern Afghanistan on Monday, killing all seven policemen on board, an official said. Read More:

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20070702/afghanistan_police_070702?s_name=&no_ads=

Joe Wilson is on ED SHULTZ

BuffaloGrover,

I think today's discussion is really fascinating.

I have to say that the only reason why the right-wing goes into convulsions about Bill is because he did a fantastic job.

The Republicans know that they can only dream of ever having someone as effective and as popular as Bill.

He may have lied about his personal affair (which the Republicans will have you believe an impeachable offense) but he didn't lie to the American people to start a war and he didn't lie to cover-up a conspiracy to oust and discredit it's critics.

If there are Americans who are looking for perfection in a presidential candidate, they better not hold their breath.

But let's face the facts, the problem with the Republicans isn't the fact that no one's perfect, it's the fact that the Republicans are incompetent and are mired in corruption.

madfuq,

I agree. Libby was going to sing if he spent one day in jail. He did his job as a palooka and scapegoat for Cheney but jail time for a year was not an option.

Bush didn't grant a full pardon because the prosecutors and all the judges who convicted Libby were Bush appointed and a full pardon would have been a slap in the face.

PortlandAnnie,

I support Obama and I support Edwards (although I think he's slowly losing ground).

But as far as the "I will vote for Hitler before I vote for Hillary" argument, that's getting old.

Hillary would make a great president. And that's what the Republicans are really afraid of.

After years of incompetence with this Bush Administration, a highly successful Hillary presidency would do nothing but completely embarrass the far right.

26% of the American people wouldn't vote for Obama anymore than they would vote for Hillary.

As far as the rest of America, America is just as ready for the first Woman President as they are for the first African American President.

PortlandAnnie,

I remember the Bosnian genocide and I remember being proud of our involvement in Bosnia. If we sent troops to Darfur to stop the ethnic cleansing than I would be proud of that too.

Iraq was nothing more than a failure from day one because it was based on a lie.

There was no lie that got us into Bosnia. There was no weapons of mass destruction in Bosnia. And there was no unilateral "you're either with us or against us" cowboy mentality about Bosnia.

And Hillary as well as all the other Congressional Democrats didn't vote to declare War on Iraq. They voted to authorize the President the use of force. They would have done the same for Gore had he been President. The only difference is what Gore would have done with any Congressional authorization to use force in response to 9/11 versus what Bush did.

Congressional Democrats didn't vote to declare War on Iraq. They only voted to give the President the option to use force if necessary. Not giving the President enough latitude to respond to the 9/11 attack was the right decision.

Blaming Hillary for Iraq because of her vote is a fallacy.

portland A, we do not occupy Bosnia, I am posting the results of NATO on this subject. You must be a repub swallowing the right wing spin. Oh by the way how many of our boys and girls lost their lives in Bosnia????

The 1995 NATO bombing in Bosnia and Herzegovina (code-named by NATO Operation Deliberate Force) was a sustained air campaign conducted by the North-Atlantic military organization to undermine the military capability of the Bosnian Serb Army who threatened and attacked UN-designated "safe areas" in Bosnia. The operation was carried out between 30 August and 20 September 1995, involving 400 aircraft and 5000 personnel from 15 nations.

It was initiated by NATO in response to a deteriorating situation. Although planned and approved by the North Atlantic Council in July 1995, the operation was triggered in direct response to the second wave of Markale Massacres on 28 August 1995.

During the campaign, a total of 3515 sorties were flown against 338 individual targets. Aircraft involved in the campaign operated out of Italy and from the U.S. aircraft carriers USS Theodore Roosevelt & USS America. 68% of the bombs used in this campaign were precision-guided munitions. The Bosnian Serb integrated air defence network, comprising of aircraft and surface-to-air missiles (SAMs), presented a high-threat environment to the allied air operations. A French Mirage 2000 was shot down by a Serbian SAM on the 30 August 1995. As a counter to the operation some 400 UNPROFOR peacekeepers were seized by the Bosnian Serb Army and used as human shields at key Bosnian Serb sites.

Also in August, Croatian Forces conducted Operation Storm in the Republic of Serbian Krajina in Croatia, which resulted in the expulsion of the Serb population of several hundred thousand from that area.

The air attacks increased the international pressure on (Milošević’s Serbia/Yugoslavia to take part in negotiations that resulted in the Dayton Peace Agreement

Everyone is getting tired of trying to educate repubs on the truth of history not the spin! Reading can cure this re-invention of history by the far right if they will just bother!

Not giving the President enough latitude to respond to the 9/11 attack was the right decision.

correction:

Giving the President enough latitude to respond to the 9/11 attack was the right decision.

The wrong decisions were made by Bush.

And that's not the fault of Congressional Democrats who voted yes to authorize the use of force as the President request in the aftermath of 9/11.

madfuq,

The Republicans are going to have just as easy of a time attacking Obama with misleading political spin as they will attacking Hillary.

The major difference is that Obama is still new to the political process and Hillary isn't.

Republicans can harp about Obama's inexperience until the night of the election but any suggestion that Hillary isn't tough enough or Hillary doesn't have what it takes will always be met with "rolling eyes".

The only thing that counts against Hillary is that her critics complain she is too stiff.

Hmmm. I remember when Gore's critics claimed he was too stiff. Now look at what happened to Gore.

portland A, none of us expect perfection but we do expect leaders to not act like a crime family and trash the rule of law!

PortlandAnnie,

So then I guess those who voted for Nixon had to accept everything he did cause they can't have it both ways.

Iran Contra was another example of royalty acting regimes. We created Saddam, remember???

He got us into Bosnia and we’re still there. That was 12 years ago. If the UN had done their job in the first place it wouldn’t have had gone down that was, a US incursion

the US is in bosnia as part of the UN which we are a member, not as the sole occupying force.

PortlandAnnie,

We went to Bosnia because of the ethnic cleansing.

We didn't go into Iraq because of ethnic cleansing and genocide.

We went to Iraq because the President claimed that there were "weapons of mass destruction" and critics who opposed it were discredited and their CIA wives were ousted and high level officials were convicted of perjury and there jail time was commuted for fear he may turn and tell the American people that we really went to Iraq to enrich the oil industry connections to Bush and the Haliburton connections to Cheney.

We went to Bosnia because of the genocide.

We didn't go into Iraq because of ethnic cleansing and genocide.

We went to Iraq because of Bush's claims of "weapons of mass destruction".

Posted by PortlandAnnie on July 3, 2007 at 12:50 PM

Didn't the genocide take place during the Raygun/Bush term? Why didn't Raygun or Bush I take care of the genocide? How does it help those suffering from the genocide going in 20 years after the fact?

PortlandAnnie,

Comparing Bosnia with Iraq is nonsense.

How many of our veterans were killed in Bosnia, anyway?

Is Bosnia a peaceful state now?

Is Bosnia a centerpiece for terrorist activity?

I'm glad we went to Bosnia and the President and his commanders did a great job.

Iraq is a mess.

First we were supposed to be greeted as liberators.

Then it was "Mission Accomplished".

Then it was "The insurgency is in it's last throws".

Then it was "Stay the Course"

Then it was "Changing Course" is "Cut and Run"

Then it was "Change of Course"

Then it was "Surge the Troop Levels"

Then it was "No Benchmarks"

Then it was "Benchmarks"

Then it was "No Timeline"

hmmmm. I wonder what's next.

PortlandAnnie,

26 percent of Americans approve of Bush's performance.

The fact of the matter is, if they haven't figured it out by now then they ether never will or they have political and financial issues that force them to "Stay the Course".

Clinton at this time had a 60+ percent approval rating.

I guess Clinton was a hard act to follow.

The only thing Republicans can do now is try to find ways to fracture the Democratic Party.

The Republicans certainly can't govern. The certainly can't control corruption within their own.

Republicans will continue to attack the Democratic Party agenda because they no longer have an agenda of their own.

The Republicans are so mired in drama and controversy can they ever spend time actually doing the job that they are paid to do.

Thank God, the Democratic Party isn't up to their ears in defending a failed foreign policy of nation building.

I remember the Republicans would accuse the Democrats of nation building in Bosnia.

Bosnia was a great victory for the Democrats and the world. The U.N. had an unprecedented respect because they couldn't handle the situation without our help. It was a great example of multi-lateral and international cooperation.

Iraq is a mess. One failure after the next. The Republicans decided to go at it alone without the multi-lateral support of the U.N. The only loyal ally we had were the British.

The Republicans claimed that if we took the offense and attacked terrorists in Iraq than we wouldn't have to worry about them at home.

The U.K. learned a valuable lesson about Republican Party nation building and corrupt nature. Now the U.K. is being attacked at home.

JohnnyBoswell, you wrote that 26 percent of voters won't vote for Obama either.

I am one of those people who won't vote for Hillary under any circumstances. I have my own reasons for it that are too many too enumerate here. Suffice it to say that I don't believe she is the right person to lead this country at this time. And I seriously hope that the Democrats find the person whom I can support.

But I am not alone in that. A recent mason-Dixon poll showed that 52 percent of registered voters would not consider Hillary. Conversely, 48 percent wouldn't even consider Romney. If Democrats are to regain the White House, they need to consider things like that and how to win independents who will actually decide the election.

Hillary is part of the NWO none of us independants, libertarians,real conservatives, etc will vote for her. Ron Paul has much of our full support right now. We put our muscle to help democrats in 2006 and the turned out to be cowards. Kucinich is your only man of his word, the other lower candidates arent bad. Your top candidates are not as bad as the repubs but close. Obama and Clinton are sell outs. This is only if the 2008 elections even happen.
If Clinton and Obama our your guys then you better do some actual research.

Posted by PortlandAnnie on July 3, 2007 at 12:50 PM

Lest we forget, just prior to Saddams attacks against the Kurds, the Kurdish PKK party, exterminated 50,000 of their own people. Odd isn't it? Kurds killing Kurds. But, a battle has raged for the last century and before because of their multi-ethnic, multi religous population.

Saddam, attacked the Kurds with nerve agents and chemical weapons that had been sold to him by the United States, Japan and Germany. More to the point, we backed him in his war against the Iranians and at last count, that war cost over a million Iranians their lives.

Talk about genocide. A million people lost their lives in a war that was funded and supplied by us.

Whatever.... right?? Just Iranians and who's counting.

As far as the attacks on the Kurds, everybody knew about it, particularly us and we stood by and let it happen. We have let the Kurds down on a number of occasions. They pleaded and begged us to support them when the wanted to succeed from Iraq. First we told them we would, then we told them we couldn't and then we armed Saddam.

Bosnia....was a multi-lateral action.We are there as part of a international peace keeping force. One has a hard time criticizing an action that is truly multi-lateral not some trumped up coalition offering to carry water bottles. For shit sake, the coalition of the willing included Tonga. Tonga?? Their navy is a couple of rafts roped together and they throw coconuts as hard as they can at their enemies.

History lesson over.

However, I do like your choice of presidential candidates and honestly there is only one and he has yet to declare.

There truly is only one individual with the experience, the creditials, the intellectual ability, the wisdom and the integrity to lead this nation out of the abyss it is in. This individual does not cater to special interest and won't have to.

That's Al Gore and the what will inspire him to jump in and save our collective asses is a continued assault on reason (like that??) and the outright refusal of this cheap imitation of a president to adher to the rule of law and the constitution.

So, dumbya, keep it up. Al's coming to get ya' and the american people are going to be right behind him looking forward to your sentencing, which will be one that will never be commuted.

Count on it.

The Democratic Party is now the lone political organization that can lay claim to competence.

The Libby pardon is a "victory" for the Republican Party "culture of corruption". But the "victory" is short-sighted and narrow-minded.

The Democratic Party needs to fight for truth, justice and the American Way.

Let the Republican Party continue to nurture corruption, lies, incompetence and cronyism.

Posted by AzraelsJudgement on July 3, 2007 at 01:59 PM

Tell me your thoughts on Gore.

AzraelsJudgement and Moses,

You have made up your minds concerning scenarios that have not played out.

I don't believe you would vote Democrat under any circumstance anyway.

If you won't ever vote for Hillary under any circumstance why would you vote Obama or Edwards for that matter?

Any suggestion that you support the Democratic Party agenda is disingenuous.

The only arguments I've heard from you are arguments that undermine the Democratic Party agenda.

Anyone who claims to support Obama and Thompson, politically polar, opposites is suspicious in its motives anyway.

Posted by Moses on July 3, 2007 at 01:59 PM

And how about you?? What's your take on Gore?

AzraelsJudgement and Moses,

The "I will not vote for Hillary under any circumstance" is a closed minded view.

The Democratic Party supports an open-minded nature.

I can't believe that either of you support the Democratic Party with such a closed-mined attitude.

I voted hillary as my senator and i voted all democrat and pushed for Gillibrand to win my district in 2006 so nice try to undermine me.
I even voted for Kerry in 2004. I never voted for Bush or his neocon scum. 99% of my friends are progressive democrats. They all back Kucinich as would I if Ron Paul wasnt around.

Gore needs to chill on Global Warming a bit and start attacking corruption. That in turn will help the planet. He is not fully trustworthy but he is better than Clinton, Obama, or Edwards.

The Democratic Party was in the minority for many years during the early part of the Bush Administration.

The biggest reason is that it's hard to find open-minded/politically active members.

It's easy to mislead and brainwash the close minded. That's how the Republican Party flourishes.

However, a line gets drawn when real problems start to affect Americans in real ways. Eventually, these people will no longer put up with the corruption and apathetic close mindedness.

Posted by JohnnyBoswell on July 3, 2007 at 02:17 PM

You'll incite a riot if you're not careful. Saying you (and probably only at this point in time) wouldn't vote for Hillary is valid. I admit to fence sitting on the top three myself. I'm not convinced that any of them are what we need as the president of the united states. They need to prove that to me as I am sure they need to prove that to a lot of people.

I don't think that the mindset of anybody but a republican or anyone not related to the bush cabal is a reason to vote for any of them.

We need someone extraordinary, someone with impecable judgement and integrity. Someone that will be there for the people, who is humble and diplomatic. We need to purge politico's who are driven by K street and not by main street.

And we need someone to model that behavior, not someone who has learned bad habits.

Settling for less than that will only perpetuate the dismal state of affairs we find ourselves in.

My vote will have to be earned.

Posted by AzraelsJudgement on July 3, 2007 at 02:21 PM

Congratulations.

The reason Gore doesn't chill is because of Global Warming. And Gore is attacking corruption from corporations who are using corruption to profit at the expense of the environment.

With such a negative view of the Democratic Party, I wouldn't be surprised if you changed your party affiliation to Republican.

You and Moses don't seem to have any problems with the Republicans.