Millions for kids, not one red cent for Bush's phony war!!!
IMPEACH BUSH/CHENEY NOW!!!!

Seriously? Why don't we hold hostage funding for the war (which we should not be funding) for insurance for our children? As of two days ago, sCHIP expired... yet we can still kill innocent Iraqi's who never did anything to us before we invaded. Send a message to the President that we will not fund his war unless he protects our children.

Thank you so much Bush for turning over the presidency to us without a fight.... because for a moment there, I thought you were going to start acting human again, like your stellar performance during Katrina.

Well, since he probably wouldn't carry out the law anyway, I'm not sure why we should get all that excited.
Also, we need to be focused on getting universal care for the ill, diseased and injured. This piece-meal stuff is for the birds.
Finally, the conservative ideology considers government to be a coercive institution designed to subdue the unruly populace. Minimal benefits are merely bribes to keep the people pacified and, if at all possible, make an example of a small population to demonstrate how difficult existence can be.

Once again Shrub has taken the wrong path. If he'd ever bothered to look at the application form for Texas CHIP, he would see that they ask about private health insurance. My daughter has ADHD, has taken meds for 10 years now and if not for CHIP, I couldn't afford her meds. If he's concerned about "wealthy" people taking advantage of the system, perhaps he's like to start saving money by elimating benefits for former politicos who have been convicted of crimes, yet still get government benefits.

The S-Chip increase is for $35 billion over 5 years, roughly $7 billion per annum. The wars in Iraq and Afganistan in 2008 are expected to need nearly $190 billion in war funds. That’s for one year also. The S-CHIP increase is just 1/27th of the Iraq quagmire funding. Have our leaders lost their minds? These numbers have to be crunched, again and again. American’s should demand that we provide 100% medical coverage for all children under 18, our national leaders must be held accountable if they refuse to back that policy goal. We’re smarter than this. It’s late 2007, and we’re fighting for this policy? It’s a common sensical national policy. WON'T SOMEBODY PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDERN!!!

The american people should not blame Bush for that, they should blame a dead person, who is responsible for all that mess:
MILTON FRIEDMAN.
Did someone remember these guy?! I did it EVERY damn day!
He is the FOUNDER of this political policy!
I know, nobody should blame a dead person, but i did it here and now!
Thank you Milton!

Darn, Now that I make 200 percent above the porverty line,I can afford that Big Plasma Television on my wall now and let the gov't pick up the tab for the Healthcare for my rugrats. I was looking so forward to wacthing my favorite shows on that thing, but now the Prez vetoed S-Chip. I really wanted to spend that money that I usually spend on my rugrats healthcare to buy that 56 inch tv.

I applaud the President for vetoing this legislation. It was nothing but a money grab. The excessive tax grab was amazing to me. Did any of you know that this bill was going to cover CHILDREN up to the age of 26?!!! Just another attempt to create another dependency class as the Democratic party is want to do. Let see if this makes the comment page!!!

This is a disgrace to the Bush administration and all Republicans. No matter what age a person is health care is a human right not something only for people who can afford it. As a Christian I can tell you these Republicans are nothing but fakes because to deny the poor goes against everything the Bible says. Don't believe these Republicans who call themselves Christians yet were against this because they are frauds! It's fine to continue to spend billions and billions of dollars on a war in Iraq that was based on nothing but lies and now there's a civil war. It's no wonder why other countries look down on the United States, there is a war in Iraq with no exit plan even though they had nothing to do with the horrible events of 9/11 and the United States refuses to take care of their own people with health care.

Did anyone really expect Bush to support the legislation? What's even more disturbing to me than his lack of support for children is his posturing as fiscally conservative after years and years of completely *ridiculous* spending!

Moderator - will the names, numbers, and email addresses of potential House swing votes for this bill be posted anywhere on this site soon?

Our children need health care benefits now! If we don't pay for the benefits now, the cost will much greater later on down the road of life.
Stop funding a senseless war and take of our kids here and now!!!

Posted by SeanDB on October 3, 2007 at 03:13 PM

Here a link to the roll call, so you can see how all the House members voted. (The Senate already has a veto-proof majority).

If you see your congressman on the list of "Nays," you can always call the Congressional switchboard through one of these toll-free numbers (h/t firedoglake):

1 (800) 828-0498
1 (800) 459-1887
1 (800) 614-2803
1 (866) 340-9281
1 (866) 338-1015
1 (877) 851-6437

You can also use our online action page to send a letter to your congressperson quickly and easily, and keep the pressure up.

This fight is important. Thanks for your help.

OldDemocrat1:

What if you make 200% above the poverty line, but have 10 kids.
You're not thinking about an HDTV.
You're thinking about how you have to work so hard to barely make ends meet.

Waboom:
Have you ever put kids through college on a poverty or near poverty budget?
Excessive tax grab? Do you smoke like ten packs a day?
That's what was taxed...cigarettes.
You probably didn't know that, so now you can spew your rhetoric with a little more info.

Why do we have to be so down on the smokers? It's their hard-earned money, so f**k children who aren't born to priviledge.

You should probably take that point...some people might even agree with you for their own greedy, petty reasons.

Posted by waboom on October 3, 2007 at 02:37 PM

WOW! It's true, there are people amoungst us that do use another part of their brain which is generally a cyst on their ass.

A Tax Grab?? The tax is on cigarettes and I'm a smoker. I would gladly pay another .60 cents a pack to help in an effort to provide healthcare to children. And in case you missed it moron, $80,000.00 a year for a family of four in one of our metro areas, is the poverty level. You can thank tricle down economic's and a property boom fueled economy for that. It's an economy built on sand and most of it is sifting through most americans hands.

I don't expect you to get this though as I would imagine that you are part of the 25% of americans that back president dumbo. According to the latest poll, americans (the true americans) support the SCHIP'S legislation and this will shake the tree you live in, withdrawal from Iraq.

Do me a favor and get off my publicly funded highway or road, stay away from my municipal park and don't dare use my post office. I'm sick of contributing for freaks like you who think all of the above is your divine right and piss and moan when people like us work towards fairness and compassion for our fellow patriots and americans.

Especially kid's!

Posted by Stephanie on October 3, 2007 at 03:57 PM

At the end of the day, Kucinich will flip his vote. He voted nay because they inserted or deleted part of the legislation that included "legal immigrant children". How's that? Not illegal immigrant, but legal immigrant. they won't have the benefit of healthcare under SCHIP'S due to their legal status.

Can anybody say "discrimination"?

Is there no sanity left in DC??? What a cruel, sick joke to play on the lives of criticaly ill children and their families.

So: On one side, opposing abortion to protect unborn children; on the other side, denying health care help to living quasi-poor children.
Perfect mentality for a split-personality monster.

To the Waboom troll ...
Reminder that Democrats under the leadership of President Bill Clinton successfully passed welfare reform, helping to break the chain of a "dependent" class to use your ignorant verbage. Again you show that conservatives have no concept of how working people live and the lack of choices available to us in healthcare and education. Salaries have not kept up with the costs of housing, education and medical care. Our HMOs tell us what procedures we can have and with which medical provider. Conservatives try to scare us by saying that universal healthcare will lead to long lines and waiting weeks for medical care...just shows they really don't know what is going on right now with private care. Shows they have not had to wait 6 hours in an emergency room to be seen because so many families are using the ER for care that should be provided in the doctor's office. Preventive care that many working people put off because they don't have 4 grand laying around to apply to a family deductible.
The Bush Administration and the Feds tell us the economy is booming? For who? T

Bush is not trying to deny health care to poor children. The reason he vetoed to bill is the fact that people making 80,000 a year should pay for there own health care. Not to mention the age factor. Health care is not a God given right. My brothers kids are on the chips program and that is great because he makes in the neighborhood of 40,000 a year. and they are school age kids. Some one 26 should get a job and pay for there own health care. The people who are really poor all go to county hospitials. The goverment picks up to bill on these cases any way so what is the difference. And for the idiot that said that now there is a civil war in Iraq becuse of us. They have been fighting over there for 100's of years.

While this veto is appalling, it's not surprising. What is both appalling and surprising is the Democrat's continued support for the war. The Republicans vote against what they don't want, why don't the Democrats?

Time to impeach Chimpy!

By the way, stop with this nonsense that the Democrats support the war. They don't. The GOP and Chimpy in particular are making it impossible to end the occupation (it's not even a stinking war).

I sorta like David Obey / Jim McGovern's idea of a war tax. It's time for Americans, those who say they are for the occupation and those who say they are against it, to put or shut up. If you love the occupation pay a tax for it. If hate the occupation and resent being taxed, get out into the streets and protest this crap. That's the only way it will end. Too many people whining that Dems won't end the occupation and not enough out there doing anything about it. It's all up to us, not the politicians.

It's ok for bush to give his rich oil buddies a tax cut but he can't give out kids of this country a brake in health care,it goes to show you where his heart realy is.

I am a twenty-one year old mechanic making a little over fifteen thousand per year. The fact is, I do not want health insurance. I am currently attending college, and my school offers relatively inexpensive coverage that I could purchase if I actually wanted insurance, but I'm investing the little extra money I have instead. If I were uninformed, SCHIP would seem very appealing to me as I would be covered under this proposed expansion of the program (it covers Americans up to 25 yrs old) but the frightening reality of government sponsored healthcare is that the tax burden will be passed on to my employer who, in order to maintain his standard of living, will not give me the annual raises needed to compensate for inflation, and that is assuming that he does not simply cut my pay. So I would be indirectly paying for a product against my will that I do not want and I probably will not use. I'm sure many congressmen would be perplexed as to why I wouldn't want health coverage, but that is merely because we live in an over-medicated society. I haven't been to the doctor since I moved out of my parents' when I was eighteen, and I'm perfectly healthy, in spite having asthma and breaking my thumb. Unless they are having a child, or they have a severe condition like leukemia, there is no excuse for anyone age fifteen to thirty to need health insurance. I have found that it is far cheaper to live a healthy lifestyle and pay for the occasional medical emergency than to pay for health insurance. So while others are screaming "Think of the children," I scream back at them "Think of the struggling college student who can't afford this expansion of the welfare state."

I actually have two kids 16 and 21, under this plan they would have gotten free healthcare, the cut off age was 26, depending on what state you live in. So, i make enough money to support both children to be on my healthcare plan, but I mean come on, the gov't offered to pick up the bill,I could have spent my money elsewhere. Me and the Misses can go on a cruise or something since the gov't wants to raise my kids.Good going Bush.

CHILDREN...sick children...that DESERVE government funding

I just love politics...I think it's so funny how the Democrats plaster a pic of a cute cuddly kid on their homepage and have a 12 year old deliver the radio address. Talk about using.

Then on any given day you'll see pics of the flag on the Repubs website calling democrats traitors for opposing the Iraq war. Sad.

And some of the people who post here, libs and conservatives alike, are so much a part of the problem - they call people idiots, morons, fools for disagreeing with them. I think people who are so damn sure that their point of view is the only valid one, and anyone who disagrees is an idiot, should be ashamed of themselves.

The main point to get across, is that this administration has never shown any concern about the national debt, and has spent and cut taxes without any thought to where the money will come from. Now a bill is introduced to expand health insurance coverage to children.....and they want to bring up the DEBT? Very convenient spin, when this is another example of Republicans out of touch with what Americans really care about.

12-Year-Old Asks Bush To Sign Children's Health Bill.

I wonder. who from the DNC, wrote this for this 12 year old to read. I wonder how much they were paid too. I also wonder if this child actually understands what this is all about. I mean come on people, get real. How many 12 year olds actaully understand what gov't politics is all about. Hell, I bet you they don't know who their leaders are but they sure know how to play HALO 3 and know who Britney Spears is dating.

If people actaully believes this, I got a bridge to sell you.

Listen both parties aren't doing squat, this bill could do some good for POOR children, but to actually try to buy votes from people who can afford Healthcare for their kids is just wrong. Parents who can afford insurance for their children should get it without saying anything. Its their children, they should do everything in their power to take care of them. The gov't can't even tie its own shoes why should they take care of our children.

12-Year-Old Asks Bush To Sign Children's Health Bill.

I wonder. who from the DNC, wrote this for this 12 year old to read. I wonder how much they were paid too. I also wonder if this child actually understands what this is all about. I mean come on people, get real. How many 12 year olds actaully understand what gov't politics is all about. Hell, I bet you they don't know who their leaders are but they sure know how to play HALO 3 and know who Britney Spears is dating.

If people actaully believes this, I got a bridge to sell you.

Listen both parties aren't doing squat, this bill could do some good for POOR children, but to actually try to buy votes from people who can afford Healthcare for their kids is just wrong. Parents who can afford insurance for their children should get it without saying anything. Its their children, they should do everything in their power to take care of them. The gov't can't even tie its own shoes why should they take care of our children.

I have worked in a department at a University medical center that cared for pediatric patients. To those who don't see any moral obligation to make sure that helpless children receive medical care when they are sick, spend a few days in the waiting room of such a hospital and see if your mind will change.

For whatever reason, not everyone can afford even minimal health insurance. People who have worked all their lives can get sick, or have misfortune happen to them, and their capability to provide for their family is gone. Children DO suffer. How easy it is to put punitive labels on adults who cannot provide for themselves or their children. We are not all blessed with good health, and youth does not immunize one from illness. Not all young adults are healthy, either, and the restoration of health and the ability to work is the most precious gift a sick person could ever receive.

Have you ever seen the desperation in a parent's eyes when their child is sick and they need someone, anyone, to take away the child's pain? I have seen mothers wait patiently from sun-up until sundown at the University's Clinic -- waiting with infants and toddlers on their laps -- trying to soothe their babies to make it through the day until their name is called by the medical staff. I have seen mothers have to come back the next day with their children because there were too many that needed attention the day before. I have seen parents with children, who have tragic medical conditions, sign up for research studies just to get medical care for their child! These are good parents, but things do go wrong in life and there is no certainty regarding health for anyone.

Several years ago, I took my children to the pediatrician for a typical childhood illness. We were fortunate to have good insurance. However, a mother sat across from me with one young toddler propped up against her shoulder, with eyes half-mast, limp, and listless. The other was lying on the floor, in the same condition, with labored breathing. The mom herself was as sick as her children, and totally exhausted from her own illness and caring for her sick children. When the nurse came in to the waiting room for them, the mom stood up and quietly said that she believed that they all had the same illness, and could the doctor examine her son on the floor because he was the sickest, and then prescribe medication for all of them. She quietly said that she could only afford medical care for one person.

For all those who criticize anyone who needs assistance to pay for their children's medical care, or for their own, an appropriate saying of my mom comes to mind: There, but for the grace of God, go I.

Wake up America! What part of "a 156% tax increase on cigarettes to fund SCHIP" doesn't anyone understand?

1) That is unfair taxation, expecting smokers to pay for this increase.

2) It is a decreasing revenue source, what will be taxed next when it is not enough to pay for SCHIP???? GAS?????

3) Taxation without representation. Isn't that what the Boston Tea Party was all about??

BUSH DID THE RIGHT THING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello Fed_up_Wake_up, so you would like all of our tax money going to kill people in a war instead of helping people. You are the main reason this country has gone mad. Did you know Mr. Fed up that every time you buy gas your helping kill more people in George Bush's war machine. Well, maybe you are part of that war machine and you like to see people suffer. LIKE CHILDREN.

SHAME ON THAT FRUCKIN' BUSH ! ! ! Grahamcrackerhead (my husband's & my nickname for Granholm) is forcing people out of Michigan in herds, and now Bush is trying to obliterate our innocent children by taking away their health insurance ! ! ! SHUT UP, BUSH, YOU BAD MAN!
I honestly wonder how those two assholes sleep at night, and I'd be willing to bet all of the money in the world that they do indeed sleep at night!

I am so disappointed in Grahamcrackerhead ! ! !
I was really sorry for voting for her the first time, but I did not make that same mistake twice! Reagan, Bush, Grahamcrackerhead, and that fat lizard, Engler, really sucked all of the "WONDERLAND" and "LIFE" out of "THE GREAT LAKES STATE OF MICHIGAN!"

Also, bring our troops home from Iraq, Bush, and stop making money from a war we should never have been in!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
LONG LIVE MICHAEL MOORE ! ! ! MICHAEL MOORE IS MY HERO! ! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

To usahope1: No one is saying that the poor children of this nation will not have health care. Our people in Washington on both sides lump alot of different things into a bill and get upset when it does not pass or gets vetoed. If it is truley the Poor little childeren that these people or worried about take out the part of the bill that has the to the age of 25 or 26. I know it depends what state you live in. People making 80 grand a year should pay for there own health care. So they should lower the pay scale for who can recieve the insurance.
usahope1 I bet you are in really great shape because you must walk every where you go. Since you never by gas or use public transit since they have to use gas. The people in Iraq was suffering under the hand of Saddam long before we ever got there. If we had a media in this country that would stand up and tell the truth instead of just what the want to report we could understand that there are some good things happening over there. If we pull out of Iraq be prepared for the terroist to show up on our soil because they will. Dont forget that all of the Democratic canidates said the other day in the debate they could not guarentee that the could be out of Iraq in the first four years of their term. This is because anyone with a lick of sense knows that we cant pull out now.

Hello usahope1,

I appreciate your opinion and your right to express it, given to you by our military's sacrifice. I, as the daughter of a soldier, hope you understand that the military personnel fully know what they are doing in Iraq and they want to be there. They want to defeat Al Qaeda over there so that they don't come over to the USA like they did on 9-11 and hurt this country more. But, if you really want Al Qaeda here, just bring the troops on home without a victory and you will be silenced. Al Qaeda will not allow you to voice that opinion that you have.

Now on to the original subject we were discussing, SCHIP. I do not want people or children to suffer as I am also a parent. But I am against HOW the government wants to pay for it, the tax on cigarettes. I am not a smoker either but that tax is unfair taxation. I believe the entire country should be contributing, not just smokers. The government wants to also expand SCHIP to cover adults and children, like mine who already have insurance because I make less than the preset limit. If I can pay for it, so can others. Why do so many people in this country think the government should GIVE them everything and they should not have to work for it?????? This is the point where I agree that the governemnt is trying to take over health care.

As for the gas tax, that is a wonderful thing the democratic congress and house decided the American people had to pay. Clinton raised it and other taxes during his terms. We were not at war then and it did not go for a war then so why do you think it is now???? That money was allocated to certain programs way before 9-11 or the Iraq war. War is not pretty and no one likes it. But if I had to choose living by USA rules or living by Al Qaeda's rules, I choose the USA!!!!!!! They are the military and war is their job and they are happy to do it. If they don't want to, they don't have to join or re-enlist, plain and simple. You know, if everyone felt like you, there would be no military or USA. Then where would you and your opinions be????

So, again, wake up America!!!!

What does defeating Al Qaida have to do with any of this?
Bush had the chance to defeat Al Qaida and Bin Laden in Afghanistan, and turned his back on a war he was winning to skying off to Iraq, where Al Qaida wasn't of a bunch of false pretenses, and now Al Qaida is in Iraq too.
Now, he wants to take a tired, and overextended military and go adventuring into Iran. Why?
For reasons he's refusing to to tell us, but probably has a lot to do with controlling a major portion of the world's oil supply, and making his war-profiteering buddies richer than they already are, like they need any more money.
In the mean time we have military contractors delivering shoddy goods and services to our GIs and valiant kids getting booted out of the military so the Bushiato won't have to pay for their medical treatments.
Bush has a lot to answer for. I have friends and kids I've helped train over there, and by the Grace of God, I will push and shove until these kids are safe and this bastard and his minions are behind bars!
IMPEACH BUSH/CHENEY!!! INDICT RUMSFELD!!! FIRE BETRAY-US!!!

OldDemocrat1, now you are getting the picture. The tax is per pack so you are talking some money. But, because it is harmful, more and more people are quitting to get healthy or the cost is getting outrageous. Therefore, it is a declining source of income.

Has anyone thought about what will happen down the road? Say they override the veto, more and more people quit smoking, the revenue decreases, then who and how is the SCHIP program funded and paid for??? The program is where it is now, needing more money. How can you expand the program if you can't pay for what you have now? Well, we are talking about the governement here so it will be another tax to pay for it and the circle keeps repeating.

Why is this not a problem??? News reports don't tell the public how they will fund it or they give it one line in a 200 line article. Now they are dogging Bush for the veto. The government will not start encourging people to smoke, just tax us more!!!! Bush is trying to stop them!

Dear Mr. Bush: I just bet that day when you bent over for your colonoscopy you never gave a thought to the kids you just vetoed healthcare for - their parents PAID for YOUR healthcare! I just have to wonder how you sleep at night. The only answer I get is that if you have no conscience then you probably sleep very well indeed! It would seem to me that you would assure those kids decent healthcare...afterall, you indebted them and their children to pay for your ridiculous war. One wonders just how much more damage you will cause before we are finally rid of you!

Clinton raised taxes during his terms because it was needed. He left a balanced budget and a surplus that was quickly gobbled up by Bush and his cohorts. The money he is currently spending in Iraq and soon Iran could well be used to research alternative fuels to get us off oil dependency. He is only delaying the inevitable so his oil buddies can fatten up even more. The half trillion dollars so far wasted in Bushes' ridiculous war could well have found us good alternatives to oil, bolstered our badly worn out infrastructures and probably funded total and complete National Healthcare! Do you realize how bad it is to be so far down the list in supplying healthcare to our own citizens? This is something people in other countries do not have to worry about. The ideal of "I have insurance and don't care about you" is stupid. ALL citizens of the US count for something ALL of us pay taxes and ALL will pay hefty raises in taxes to pay down the debts we've accrued since Bush came into office. Of course, he'll leave it for the democrats to clean up so they get blamed for the raises....but everybody who owes a bill eventually has to pay it! How does it feel to belong to the "most powerful debtor nation" the earth has ever seen??? Its a disgrace. If you think we're going to miraculously get away without paying our debts...think again!!!

Incidentally, those with insurance - don't count your blessings just yet. Faced with a catastrophic illness you'll go thru your insurance in no time - most insurance plans are not bottomless. Then you'll be required to spend down and sell everything you own and then when your below the poverty line and lost everything you worked for, the government might just step in and funnel some of those precious Iraqi funds to save your now very miserable life! Something to think about?

Defense Spending Reaches Over $600 Billion
The Associated Press

Thursday 04 October 2007

Washington - The Senate on Wednesday approved $459 billion in spending for the Pentagon, after adding $3 billion for security at the Mexican border.

The bill, passed by voice vote, does not include President Bush's request for almost $190 billion for operations in Iraq and Afghanistan. The bill would increase other Pentagon spending $43 billion, up more than 10 percent from the last budget.

Much of the new money would be devoted to procuring new weapons, including the V-22 tilt rotor aircraft, unmanned drone aircraft, the next generation of Joint Strike Fighters and the F-22 Raptor fighter jet.

The border security money had been in a spending bill for the Homeland Security Department that Mr. Bush has promised to veto because it exceeds his budget request by $2 billion.

By shifting the money to the Pentagon bill, Republican leaders hoped to preserve the financing without embarrassing the president by overriding his veto.

The military bill includes more money for National Guard equipment and military health care and a 3.5 percent pay increase for military personnel.

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Child Health Veto Will Be Election Issue
By David Espo
The Associated Press

Wednesday 03 October 2007

Washington - President Bush cast a quiet veto Wednesday against a politically attractive expansion of children's health insurance, triggering a struggle with the Democratic-controlled Congress certain to reverberate into the 2008 elections.

"Congress will fight hard to override President Bush's heartless veto," vowed Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid of Nevada.

Republican leaders expressed confidence they have enough votes to make the veto stick in the House, and not a single senior Democrat disputed them. A two-thirds majority in both houses of Congress is required to override a veto.

Bush vetoed the bill in private, absent the television cameras and other media coverage that normally attend even routine presidential actions. The measure called for adding an estimated four million mostly lower-income children to a program that currently covers 6.6 million. Funds for the expansion would come from higher tobacco taxes, including a 61-cent increase on a pack of cigarettes.

"Poor kids first," Bush said later in explaining his decision, reflecting a concern that some of the bill's benefits would go to families at higher incomes. "Secondly, I believe in private medicine, not the federal government running the health care system," he added in remarks to an audience in Lancaster, Pa.

The president said he is willing to compromise with Congress "if they need a little more money in the bill to help us meet the objective of getting help for poor children."

It was the fourth veto of Bush's presidency, at a time his popularity is low, the legislation popular enough to draw support from dozens of GOP lawmakers, and an override certain to seal his lame-duck status.

Democratic leaders scheduled the showdown for Oct. 18 to allow two weeks for pressure to build on Republicans. A union-led organization said it would spend more than $3 million trying to influence the outcome. "It's going to be a hard vote for Republicans," promised Speaker Nancy Pelosi, D-Calif.

Criticism of the veto was instantaneous, from every quarter of the Democratic political firmament.

Sen. Joseph Biden of Delaware, a presidential hopeful, called it unconscionable, party chairman Howard Dean labeled it appalling, and Pelosi said, "It's very sad that the president has chosen to veto a bill that would provide health care for ten million American children for the next five years."

Republicans said none of the criticism would matter. "I'm confident that the more time we have to explain the veto, the more people will be with their position,' said Rep. Roy Blunt of Missouri, second-ranking GOP leader in the House.

Longer term, Republicans said their goal was to sustain the veto and force Democrats into negotiations on a compromise that GOP lawmakers could embrace.

"Democrats now face an important choice: Either work with Republicans to renew this program or continue to play politics on the backs of our nation's children," said Rep. John Boehner of Ohio, the House Republican leader.

He and other Republicans said Democratic plans to delay an override vote revealed an eagerness to score political points.

Democrats, sensing a political advantage, said they were in no mood to compromise. Several officials, speaking on condition of anonymity because they were discussing strategy, said Pelosi and Reid seemed set on sending Bush successor bills that are nearly identical with the one he just vetoed. The goal would be to force him - and his congressional allies - to repeatedly expose themselves to criticism that they were denying health care for kids.

Both sides took comfort from polling data as they settled in for their struggle.

Democracy Corps said its poll showed the public sides with Democrats by a margin of 60-35. The veto battle "gives Democrats a large advantage with independents, as well as mobilizing Democratic supporters. Indeed, the president has not won over Republican voters on this issue," said an accompanying memo.

House Republicans quietly distributed a survey by David Winston, who is close to Boehner, that came to a different conclusion. It said critics of the legislation can win the public debate if they say they favor "covering uninsured children without expanding government coverage to adults, illegal immigrants and those who already have insurance...." A copy of the poll was obtained by The Associated Press.

Numerous polls have shown health insurance to be an important issue with the public, and Democrats have made expansion of the children's health program a priority since taking control of Congress in January.

Health care also has figured prominently in the campaign for the White House, with presidential hopefuls in both parties sketching plans to reduce the swelling population of the uninsured, now estimated by the Census Bureau to number 47 million.

There was no doubting the bill's political appeal.

Eighteen Republicans in the Senate supported the measure when it passed, including four who face difficult challenges next year. In the House, 45 GOP lawmakers defected.

There were 265 votes in all for the measure when it passed last month. Supporters need to pick up 25 more votes to override the veto.

Majority Leader Steny Hoyer of Maryland said a few of the eight Democrats who originally voted no - principally because of the tax increase - would switch sides, and one or two more votes were available from a small group that was absent on the earlier vote.

But 151 Republicans opposed the bill when it passed, enough to sustain the veto, and absent numerous switches, Bush's veto seemed secure.

"We got what we wanted," said Rep. Tom Cole of Oklahoma, chairman of the GOP campaign committee and an opponent of the bill.

"Once they vote it's pretty hard to change," conceded Sen. Orrin Hatch, a Utah Republican who supported the legislation and said repeatedly he hoped Bush would sign it.

Some Republicans joined in the criticism of Bush.

"I believe this is an irresponsible use of the veto pen," said Sen. Gordon Smith, an Oregon Republican facing a difficult re-election next year.

The original Senate vote was 67-29, enough to override. But the House votes first, and if Bush's allies sustain his veto there, the bill dies.

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Since when did is $83,000 year in earnings considered POOR? I appreciate the vetor being used otherwise this would have simply been another step down the road toward socialized healthcare. There was no need to expand this plan beyond its current level. Ever look up the definition of Socialism? Socialism: Pronunciation: \sō-shə-li-zəm\ Function: noun 1: any of various economic and political theories advocating the collective or governmental administration and ownership (2)a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state 3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done.

Hey Old Democrat I have a very simple way for you to avoid paying what you have dubbed a "regressive" cigarette tax to pay for the expansion of SCHIP...DON'T SMOKE.

Amazing! This is someone CHOOSING to damage their health by burning up their money on smoking and then claiming they are the victim? Perhaps if SCHIP can be funded by increased taxes on cigarettes it may improve the health of more Americans. Fewer and fewer people will light up.

I have known a few hard working people who did not choose to get cancer. They could not choose that third or fourth round of chemo or radiation because ..gee..as your health deteriorates so does your ability to work and pay for care. They did not have the luxury of travelling to the Mayo clinic or getting the best oncologist money can buy. One friend was told point blank..come up with the 250.00 for the consultation with the oncologist or don't have an oncologist. She died a month ago.
If you are a working class American you don't have health choices. 80k per year doesn't go as far as it did 30 years ago Oldemocrat. If government run healthcare is good enough for the US Congress and the Executive Branch...it should be extended to all Americans.

what does a working joe making let say 45000-50000 a year in the d.c metro area an exspensive market do when family health insurance through carefirst a leading healthcare provider charges a bare plan hmo for $780/mo lowest HMO not PPo plan and mind you this is the cheapest plan take home is $600/week lets get real schip is a program for KIDS not me not adults but KIDS but we can spend billions on iraq its always pissed me off to fall thru the cracks cant afford health insurance but make make to much for govt programs sometimes ive thought id be better off making less barely under the income caps im switching my afflilation to the democratic party im not for socialized medicine capitalism always brings out the best in people but come on pure capitalism is just as bad as pure socialism

Guess what, I just talk to an Ohio democrat politican over the phone. Nice guy, I think he was on the ball.
First they do not have free gov;t healthcare, they pay for it. They all have Blue Cross- Blue Sheild. Now I did some research, Our party wants the same healthcare they have for everyone to have. Which is Blue Cross/Blue Sheild, now Blue Cross has a lobbying group in Washington, during the last election Blue Cross and other Healthcare groups gave this party over 30 million dollars in campaign funds, this year they have given Hillary' camp, Obama's Camp, and others millions more. You can look it up on opensecrets.org. This so-called gov't healthcare is really Big Business behind the scenes. Wake up America, look at the big picture.

Hi, OldDemocrat:

You make a good point about campaign financing, and hopefully there will come a day when creative, workable ideas will be allowed to see the light of day. I guess, right now, we're stuck with what we got, although some are trying to make the best of it. Even if there is no conflict of interest, the appearance of conflict of interest creates doubt and lack of trust. We can do better than that.

When I started working on health care issues, I realized how much I did not know, no matter how much research I had already done. Providing full coverage that is cost effective and well administered is a mega undertaking, but there have been mega, multi-faceted, non-political studies among some of the best and the brightest in the United States and internationally, and these reports also do not see the light of day. In the 1990's, California brought together a consortium of institutions -- universities, think tanks, etc -- to study the problem and to put together five (I think 5) different plans to provide health care for everyone. I only read summaries, but what I read seemed creative and workable. Public/Private partnerships were also explored.

Until we can come up with something that works and covers well, and will not break the bank, there needs to be something in place to bridge the gap, or people will die. SCHIP can do that -- maybe not the greatest of plans -- but it can help relieve suffering and prevent death until we can do better.

There is some terminology that is helpful to know when discussing health care delivery, and it helped me a lot:

Defined premium versus defined benefit. In the first, you have a certain amount to spend, and then you are on your own, whether it handles your illness of not. In the second one, you are guaranteed defined benefits so you know what is covered. We'd have a level playing field if everyone could get full coverage with a defined benefit. No tiered health care anymore.

Second, under our present system, we have different premiums for different ages and for times when there are expectations of illnesses. Higher costs for the very young and the very old for instance because you are more likely to need care during these times. What if there was an averaging of costs from birth until death, kind of like a fixed rate on a mortgage? A very common and good business practice. There would be an averaging of high and low periods in life when care is needed, and the healthy would be covered for those unexpected illnesses -- something that young adults don't think about when you think you're invincible. You increase the risk pool which lowers costs and costs do not soar when you are very young, or very old, or very sick. There would be no "balloon payments", sort of speak, in premiums. Less administrative costs mean more health care dollars actually go into health care. Good idea.

I'm learning, just like everyone else. We've got to be open to dialog -- everyone's ideas. In my opinion, the goal should be to be able to make sure that everyone who needs health care gets the very best, and to use the very best business practices to ensure that there is NO tiered health care -- not one set of benefits for each income bracket, nor being underinsured. When you hurt, you hurt, and your bank account should not determine whether you get treatment, or what amount or quality.

Sorry for the long posts -- I just have a lot I want to say. It's a positive thing that, at least, everyone is talking.`

Kathleen - I love to hear talk about it. Its such an important issue for everyone. Watching my own dad end up in a nursing home and watching his Medicare limit reached and his own funds depleted on a daily basis is very sad. Had he lived and been able to come home he would have had no home of his own to come to anymore. Everything he worked for during his lifetime was gone. I thought how harsh and cruel. All his life he worked and he paid his taxes to help support this country and as soon as he needs help they turn their back on him. That should not be what this country is about! People don't think about that when they're young....but everyone will age if they're lucky!

Blue Cross and Blue Shield are separate companies here, in California. Blue Cross was recently fined millions for stopping benefits to people who needed them and to leaving them uninsured. Obviously you aren't talking about the same Blue Cross I know. If poorer countries can have a national healthcare plan and not have to worry about their health needs - then only greed and stubborness prevents us from having it.

Why I'm Suing the Bush Administration
By Governor Eliot Spitzer
The Huffington Post

Tuesday 02 October 2007

Somebody had to do it.

After months of negotiation and countless attempts at compromise, the Bush administration is still refusing to let New York and other states across the country expand their State Children's Health Insurance Programs (SCHIP). The president is refusing to back down from destructive new rules his Administration has imposed - the sole purpose of which are to curb bi-partisan state efforts to insure more of our nation's children.

The reason? As the president himself put it: "I mean, people have access to health care in America. They can just go to the emergency room."

It is this politics of "not my problem" that has led to the health crisis we have today.

The bureaucratic barriers to coverage the Bush administration has imposed are not only fundamentally misguided, but also illegal.

They conflict with the statute authorizing SCHIP. Moreover, they were issued without the opportunity for public comment, as required by federal law. Accordingly, I have joined Democratic and Republican governors from states across the country to bring a lawsuit challenging these new rules in court.

It didn't have to come to this. There is widespread bipartisan support for expanding SCHIP. Even many members of the president's own party have recognized how out-of-touch he is with the American people, and instead have chosen to support compromise legislation in Congress repealing these arbitrary rules.

Unfortunately, President Bush has repeatedly threatened to veto this bipartisan bill. In justifying his position, his administration has tapped into the politics of fear - branding the effort as "socialism."

Of course, SCHIP has nothing to do with socialism. The government would be the payer, not the provider of care, and families would have a range of private plans from which to choose. But instead of engaging on the merits, the right wing has pulled out socialism from their parade of horribles in order to frighten the public.

The president has also said that those children who already have insurance will choose to give up their coverage in order to join the program.

If you talk to doctors, health care professionals, and state leaders across the country like I have, they know the President is flat-out wrong.

These are the facts.

In New York, we want to expand coverage to every uninsured child in our state. And even though experience at the state level has shown that few children drop their existing coverage in favor of SCHIP, we have instituted some of the most stringent protections in the country in order to both prevent any potential problem and satisfy the White House.

The Bush administration, however, refuses to compromise and work with us to cover these children.

Ultimately, the president just doesn't get it. There is a health care crisis in this country, but he continues to ignore the problem while vulnerable children without insurance "just go to the emergency room."

We all know the statistics. There are 400,000 uninsured children in New York. There are 8 million uninsured children in the United States.

These staggering figures are intolerable. On both a moral and practical level, we cannot allow this to stand. The president, however, continues to say the status quo is acceptable.

Children should not have to wait until they get sick enough to go the emergency room to receive treatment. Rather, they need preventive and primary care. Ensuring that children with health problems are diagnosed and treated in a timely manner will save money and save lives.

It is imperative that we all come together to reverse the Bush administration's attempt to override the will of Congress, the will of the states, and the needs of our children.

We will continue to defend our nation's kids - even if the President will not.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/100307M.shtml
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I applaud everyone who voted NO.

The 61 cent per pack tax increase on cigarettes is ridiculous and unfair taxation. It is bad business to build this program on a decreasing revenue source.

It is wrong to expect the smoker's of American to pay for this and disgusting of the supporters of this bill to try to slide this by the American people. They are just setting up the SCHIP program for more taxes at a later date not to mention making all who voted NO look bad! The supporters of this bill have set up the entire nation!!!!!

Thank you for voting NO!!!

" applaud everyone who voted NO.

The 61 cent per pack tax increase on cigarettes is ridiculous and unfair taxation. It is bad business to build this program on a decreasing revenue source. "

Want to beat them to the punch and do yourself a great big favor? QUIT SMOKING! I say that as a 35 year smoker who quit cold turkey in January, 1993! Otherwise, keep puffing and paying. Its a cash cow and if it weren't for this project, it would be another project but you are doomed to higher and higher taxes for your "sin" ...sorry, but that's the blatant truth! Deal with it because when your lungs go and you end up with one of those machines you drag around - or worse after numerous lung cancer operations and rehab - your insurance and OUR insurance premiums will be paying for YOU! How does that grab ya?

please contribute to the dnc so we can win back the whitehouse and start taking care of americans

https://www.democrats.org/page/contribute?source=NETA454

I think churches etc. would support health care for children particularly since the money for it is coming from cigarette taxes. But than maybe they don't.

I think churches etc. would support health care for children particularly since the money for it is coming from cigarette taxes. But than maybe they don't.

Most churches do support health care for kids. Republicans don't worship the same god that a lot of us do.
Like Christ said "You cannot serve both God and mammon."
Unfortunately the Republicans have chosen to worship mammon aka the Almighty Dollar.

Bush claims to love kids. He will sign off on 456 Billion dollars to Iraq. Yet he won't act to give kids in this country , who need it basic healthcare coverage. If you really believe in the youth of THIS COUNTRY, and read your Bible as you claim. And believe in it, Hear this please. My Grandma used to read her Bible EVERY NIGHT for a Half an Hour. I'm reminded that shortly before she passed away, she quoted the scripture to me. She said " He who faileth to provide for his own first is worse than an INFIDEL. And an Infidel shall in NO event enter into the Kingdon of heaven". Of course If I know classic Bush he'll do as he darn well pleases, and ignore the needs of the poor youth of this country. It's Parr for the course. Congres , Senators. Stand Up to Bush who squanders our money in Iraq, while he says No To OUR KIDS. I doubt he'll listen, But I Hope and Pray , you wil OVERRIDE his veto. That's My opinion. Speaking for My point of view. Thank-You

I know the only thing on a Republicans mind is more than what is mentioned in the story. I hope you'd find out more about an issue when the story has more to it, I'm sure you help alot and their only means of mentioning a health care issues is by means of veto, but if you have more on George Bush I'll be able to find out.

I know the only thing on a Republicans mind is more than what is mentioned in the story. I hope you'd find out more about an issue when the story has more to it, I'm sure you help alot and their only means of mentioning a health care issues is by means of veto, but if you have more on George Bush I'll be able to find out.

The bottom line is we should have health care for not only children but for everyone. It is my belief that universal health care is one of the main reasons that citizens in Norway, Sweden, Canada, UK, Japan and places like this live longer and have lower infant mortality rates. You can find the info on our very own CIA world factbook website. Yes, taxes will have to be higher, especially on junk food, cigs and booze but I will bet they won't be $1,200 per month (family premiums) higher! Will there be waiting lists? There already are. More than in the UK. Especially when you add 47 million people that are currently un insured. In these countries when it is something serious; you get in right away. This type of system will give everyone an equal chance at getting ahead in life. A level playing field. This is good for business too! Just ask the companies that are fleeing. Please fellow citizens don't be afrain of the word socialism. After all our military, public schools, government workers, fire dept, coast gaurd are all socialized! cheers, jon

Patricia,

So sorry about your Dad.

Kathleen

I am a registers voter and I would like for you to veto the Children Care Bill. They their future and they deserve more.
Thank you and please hear my plead.

Gloria Drungo

I am asking you to veto this children bill because it is not enough for their care.

Thank you
Elliott Pyles

I am asking you to veto this children bill because it is not enough for their care.

Thank you
Elliott Pyles

In any civilized country health care is a right not a privilege.

If Bush and all the other Congressmen and Cogresswomen had to survive on what we do, pay for crappy coverage on health care or not even qualify for it, I believe they would pass it with no problems. They cannot see passed their own wallets. I am actually disgusted with both sides, our children are our future, and our Government does not give a shit...especially Bush.