Thanks, Michael.

Overheard a conversation today in a local area and believe it or not they were discussing Florida not having delegates to the convention or as one person termed it - "The state's being barred from the convention". Well that's not true, but the conversation participants quickly agreed that this is what the punishment amounted to.

But to me the most weary and tiring comment was from the the lady who stated - "You know all those "up North folks" been looking down their noses at us because deep down they think we all in the South run around barefoot and chewing tobacco"....... "when in actuality alot of us are degreed/professionals who have no trouble balancing a state/county city budget".

This is how parts of Florida feel that the nation views them whether it be true or not.

Guess there won't an announcing of "The great State of Florida........." when it comes down to the voting. Oh yeah, after all is said and done - the blame will lie squarely with Florida. But there were two participants with this line drawing in the sand. Someone should have been the bigger person/the older child. The tantrums ended with one child saying they would hold their party at home whenever they liked and the other saying, Fine! You can't come to my bigger party next year!

All the states play in the sandbox on the playground and all should be able to come to the big party.

All in reality

Peace \/

Civility

Believe it or not, there was a time in this nation when people who had different philosophical views could sit down and discuss them like adults as opposed to every little difference devolving into a "Crossfire-esque" shouting match. I, for one, would like to return to that time.

I'm tired of calling Republicans money-worshipping, Bible-thumping, bigots and I'm tired of them calling me a terrorist sympathizer or un-American. Because you are civil to someone does not necessarily mean you agree with them but, it does mean that you start a dialogue off on the right foot (no pun intended). And by starting a dialogue, even with someone who you probably won't agree with, at least you have the opportunity to get to understand the person's motivations or chain of thought on a particular issue or group of issues. And who knows, maybe one can change the other's mind or make him realize the error of his ways.

But that won't happen when the attack dogs come rolling out any time anyone even flirts with an idea that isn't absolutely lockstep with the far-left, liberal wing of this party. I am not anti-liberal. In fact, I am quite proud to be a liberal on many domestic issues such as judicial appointments, abortion, stem cell research, the minimum wage, welfare, and a number of other issues. But, I am not a liberal on every issue and that is no requirement to be proud Democrat, at least not the Democratic Party I grew up in.

So here we are. Do we automatically write-off over 59 million of our fellow Americans because they were duped into voting for President Bush in 2004 or do we make them try to see the error of their ways and bring them back into the fold? We all know that we will never convince all 59 million. We'd be lucky to convince ten percent of them but, I'll take any part of those 5.9 million votes any day and I'm sure whomever we, as a party, decide to nominate would love to have them as well considering how painfully close the last two Presidential elections were.

There will be partisans on both sides of the aisle. That is inevitable. There will be some people who will be just so bitter about there side of an issue that there will be no debate, no civility, nothing but insults and caustic accusations hurled back and forth. Frosty and Burd_man are prime examples. If you want to be one of those people, that is your choice as an American voter. But, IMHO, that makes you no better than them because you are doing the exact same thing they are, just for a different side of the proverbial aisle.

There will be times when we have to stand firm as well. It was our steadfastness that got a well-deserved increase in the minimum wage after nearly a decade. It has been our perseverance on bringing the Iraq debacle to an end that has forced Republicans to time and time and again go on the record as supporting the President for maintaining this quagmire which is costing the American taxpayers, and more importantly their children, over $10 billion a month. They'll be held accountable in 2008.

So I come back to civility. If a person is lying in the street, an obvious victim of a violent crime, do you stop to ask them their party affiliation before you help them? When the wildfires in Utah and other states in the west were burning did they ask for assistance only from the "Red states"? And when a person has an idea to espouse, do you automatically dismiss them thought simply because they're not of your political affiliation? Of course not; you are your brother's keeper. Civility, my fellow Democrats, is a clear path to the White House in 2008 and a path worthy of a Democrat. The other way is for partisan hacks with an ax to grind.

J, as I understand it, FL will still be represented at the convention, just not the State Party's hand picked Delegates. I may be wrong about this, though.

Remember when the Illinois Delegation was barred from the Convention in Miami, and an alternate group of Delegates was seated instead? (1972).

Hello Again! A beautiful summer-like evening here in the Midwest. Bumper crop of corn this year despite the drought conditions and a very good price per bushel; corn, wheat and beans.

Food prices are high though, this ethanol business is siphoning off a lot that used to go for feed, animals and human. I think it's time to rethink these alternate fuels.

I am strictly on the side of the DNC on this issue about Florida. They voted 115 to 1 with the GOP, and they knew exactly what the rules were. I am angry at all the suing going on. Bill Nelson is trying to make a name for himself when he never stands up for anything.

I call them right now the the gang who can't shoot straight

No, asswipe. The people of IL had an alternate delegation not picked by the Machine, idiot. What an SP!

(I got it first!!!!!I WIN!!!!!)

Posted by Midnight_Rider on October 4, 2007 at 06:47 PM

...Food prices are high though, this ethanol business is siphoning off a lot that used to go for feed, animals and human. I think it's time to rethink these alternate fuels.

You're correct; alternate fuels should be scrutinized a bit more. While I'm sure that all of us would love to have this nation energy independent we have ask to ourselves, at what cost.

I think we need to get away from ethanol mixtures that uses edible foods. There are many alternatives available such as methane, hydrogen, and even sugar beets and switch grass on the bio side of the equation.

What I find unusual is that their is a conservative posting here complaining about the free market. It's simple supply and demand. At least that was the excuse handed to us by conservatives when gas prices shot above $3.00 year before last after Katrina. Are we really going to begrudge some poor farmer in IA because he had a bumper crop and got paid a better than expected price for it? I'm sure ADM and the other big food manufacturers aren't complaining. Nice try at starting an argument, though.

I have listened to nearly all of our Democrats lately. I guess it is good to be on message. I am afraid they are on the wrong message though, and they will go ahead and vote to let Bush attack Iran. That we will stay in Iraq because they won't use their power of the funding.

I listened today to Governor Dean on Ed Schultz. He was using talking points as well. It did not sound right coming from him, and I would rather he stay off the air than do that.

I think they are playing to Bush's base, and I don't think they care one bit about all of us who are opposed to the war, opposed to giving up our freedoms to be safe. I don't even think they know we are here.

They did it about the MoveOn ad...they treated their base badly on that. They did it on purpose to get the right on board with them.

The Democratic leaders sent "the left" to bed without their supper

And it shows in every other area. They have got to stop ignoring their base.

The conservative Democrats actively oppose "the left" in the party.

And it's a shame. It is showing more every day.

Do you remember the story abthe Marine Corps Osprey being sent to Iraq? This is the plane/helicopter that has had a terrible record of failures but the Marines finally have it under control.

On the CBS Evening news tonight they had Vice President Asshole blaming the Democrats for letting the plane go into production. Asshole claims that in 1991 he came out against the Osprey after all the accidents but the Marine Corps went to the Congress (Democratically controlled at the time) and got the plane accepted for production.

We don't see this asshole for months but he comes out for a political slam at Congress. cheney is a MF POS.

FU harpy. ESAD

Posted by Johnedwrd on October 4, 2007 at 07:14 PM

It would also appear that our Vice-President has forgotten that his party had complete control of congress from 20JAN01 through 20JAN07. They had their chance.

Punishing the millions of Democratic voters from Florida because of what their legislators voted is a very undemocratic thing to do - as well as spiteful and childish. I was a hard worker for Kerry in 2004, but since the party has given up on Florida, I will give up on the party. I am discontinuing my email subscription, will not make any contributions, and I have written my former presidential nominee choice to inform her of my disappointment in signing the pledge not to campaign in Florida unless the attendees pay to see her. This can only be bad for the Party. If there needed to be some sort of sanction, it should have been more measured.
Steve

Bite me, chubbley wubblwy SP. If you ever knew what you were talking about it would stop the rotation of the Earth. P.S, look up the meanings of "your" & "you're". God are you a iggnerrunt dunsze.

Punishing the millions of Democratic voters from Florida because of what their legislators voted is a very undemocratic thing to do - as well as spiteful and childish.

Steve, you have it all wrong !

It was not the legislators in FL who voted for this New hampshire goes first. It was your State PARTY. They are the ones who are undemocratic, childish and spiteful. They are trying to use their electoral vote size as blackmail !

Go and yell at THEM! See, this is why we have FL people in here yelling at Howard Dean-----they do not know the facts ! It is Howard's job to see that ALL states do the fair, honest, and voted upon thing !

http://www.democrats.org/a/2005/06/florida.php

Posted by Steve_from_Boca_Raton_FL on October 4, 2007 at 07:22 PM

Steve, thank you for your post. I, too, wish that htis could be handled in a better way. I'm sure Chairman Dean will come up with something between now and the holidays. Hang in there. It's not over yet.

DPD,

You won all right ! First one to call a SP a SP ! Somehow though it is almost sad, that these pea brains cannot think for themselves.

Drudge is now off the air, btw. Let's continue to work at Anal Cyst Chicken Hawk Limpballs ! Once there are no more distorted, lying sources, these SP people will wake up.

WASHINGTON - A Republican organization that advocates gay rights is targeting GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney in an ad campaign, seeking to undercut his support among social conservatives by highlighting his past statements in support of abortion rights.

Romney, a former Massachusetts governor, has spent months courting social conservatives in key primary states, trying to erase doubts about his previous moderate stands.

But in a 30-second television ad that will air in Iowa and on national cable, the Log Cabin Republicans use clips from a debate during Romney's unsuccessful 1994 campaign for U.S. Senate from Massachusetts to portray him as an enemy of religious conservatives.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071004/ap_po/anti_romney_ad

"

Posted by PamB on October 4, 2007 at 07:35 PM

Pam, you're more involved with party functions than I am. Could the Log Cabin Republicans be brought over to our side or do we need to leave them in the political wilderness a while longer?

So here we are. Do we automatically write-off over 59 million of our fellow Americans because they were duped into voting for President Bush in 2004 or do we make them try to see the error of their ways and bring them back into the fold? We all know that we will never convince all 59 million. We'd be lucky to convince ten percent of them but, I'll take any part of those 5.9 million votes any day and I'm sure whomever we, as a party, decide to nominate would love to have them as well considering how painfully close the last two Presidential elections were.

Bob, I admire your optimism, but the days of Civil discourse here with Republicans ended with Stan and Nick. They were two republicans who were gentlemen, who kept it civil, but don't forget, we never ever did change their minds! So I see you approach new comers with an olive branch and hopes of perhaps making them see the light, but remember that they are stumbling into here because of Sore Loser-ism. They lost last year, and they see the writing on the wall, they will lose even more this next election, and they are taking it out on us ! Somehow it makes them feel better to have a place to take out their anger and hatred. So keep trying , maybe you will hit pay dirt here sometime. :)

Posted by PamB on October 4, 2007 at 07:40 PM

One can only hope. Thanks for the encouragement.

Pam, you're more involved with party functions than I am. Could the Log Cabin Republicans be brought over to our side or do we need to leave them in the political wilderness a while longer?Posted by BobVADemHawk-Biden-Obama2008 on October 4, 2007 at 07:38 PM

Bob, it boggles my mind still, as to how Gays could possibly be Republican. Sure, they may believe in the frames of 'small government', less spending, etc, but to overlook their Very existence with the Bias from the Right?? I just don't get it. I saw a round table on C-span one time with the Pres of Log Cabin Republicans, and he never clarified WHY a gay would vote Republican ! This was during last election's terrible attack by the right on Gays and their rights !

Now is this assanine, or what???

Iraqis---the people we are trying to Train, re-construct their country, the people we are losing 3800+ boys to defend them, are spending their money in China !!!

Iraqis to Pay China $100 Million for Weapons for Police

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/100407S.shtml

What a wonderful group of fine Christians, doing just what they believe Jesus wants them to do !!!!! NOT !!!

Bill Moyers Journal reports on the politically powerful group Christians United for Israel, whose leader, Pastor John Hagee, advocates for a preemptive strike against Iran.

As leader of the politically powerful group Christians United for Israel (CUFI), Pastor John Hagee wants to bring millions of Christians together to support Israel. But some say his message is dangerous: "It is time for America to ... consider a military preemptive strike against Iran to prevent a nuclear holocaust in Israel and a nuclear attack in America."

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/100407V.shtml

Posted by PamB on October 4, 2007 at 07:44 PM

It boggles my mind as well. I believe they are true to their opinion of small government, lower taxes, and all the other trappings of being a conservative.

I think this is one of the few areas where the DLC could be helpful. The DLC is as far right as this party will go and should be fairly attractive in its philosphy to the Log Cabin Republicans. Besides, I want to turn 2008 into another 1964. I'll settle for a 1976 type outcome, or even 1992 for that matter, but, a twenty point, or more, defeat for the GOP in 2008 will solidify our base for decades to come.

So I guess the Log Cabin Republicans will have to ask themselves do they want to remain with the likes of Sen. Craig (R-ID) and former Rep. Foley (R-FL) or would they like the respect they deserve from people like Rep. Frank (D-MA)?

So I guess the Log Cabin Republicans will have to ask themselves do they want to remain with the likes of Sen. Craig (R-ID) and former Rep. Foley (R-FL) or would they like the respect they deserve from people like Rep. Frank (D-MA)?

Posted by BobVADemHawk-Biden-Obama2008 on October 4, 2007 at 07:56 PM

I know the frustration of the Gay community that does come in here, with the Democrats, but when you lay out the two parties, and their adjendas towards gays, you have to admit that it has been Liberals that have taken them further, and offers the best chance for future Equality of rights ! It is my opinion that when there is all Democrats in office, that the question of Gay Marriage will be settled once and for all. But for those in areas right now where you still have bigots, the Dems have to ride the fence in order to keep their office. I believe this is true for many so called Centrist Dems, that they must project images of being moderate, but I read an article one time on Bob Casey of PA, which said, he does not believe in Abortion himself, but would NEVER try and take the right away from women.

Posted by PamB on October 4, 2007 at 07:48 PM

I wonder how many of those weapons will end up getting recalled for defects? After all, we know China's record in this regard...

Hey thanks, DNC moderators, for the swift cleanup. Appreciated by all of us on our blog.

Here is some good news. This has been brewing for quite a while. I HATE it when these same religious fanatics turn around and say Muslims should not try and force their Beliefs onto us!!! Yet they think they should be able to force their's ! If you don't believe in Abortion, then just don't have one.

Planned Parenthood Clinic Opens Peacefully

The Herald News Online

Aurora, Illinois - After weeks of controversy and legal wrangling, Planned Parenthood's new health center on East New York Street opened peacefully Tuesday morning.

Supporters flocked to the parking lot, while more than 100 protesters lined the street near the clinic's access drive.

Anti-abortion demonstrators sang songs and said the rosary, but did not disrupt Planned Parenthood's 10 a.m. press conference announcing the grand opening of a center its owners say is seriously needed in Aurora.

The center, which is within the Joliet Diocese, will offer a wide range of services, from contraception to cervical and breast cancer tests, at prices affordable to those without health insurance. The clinic also will offer abortions, which Planned Parenthood staffers say will make up about 10 percent of the health services provided there.

http://www.truthout.org/issues_06/100407WB.shtml

heading out, Dems. you all have a fine evening.

wonder how many of those weapons will end up getting recalled for defects? After all, we know China's record in this regard...

Posted by BobVADemHawk-Biden-Obama2008 on October 4, 2007 at 08:03 PM

I think as long as the Iraqis don't try to eat them or chew on them, they should be ok! :)

Now really out of here...........

Posted by PamB on 4 Oct, 2007 at 08:30P
The article states the facts, but is avoids mentioning the reason we cannot provide the arms. We no longer have the manufacturing capabilities to produce materiel in quantity to satisfy large orders in a timely manner.
Our manufacturing capabilities have been shipped overseas. We cannot even produce our own gun tubes for tanks and artillery in any large quantities any more.
If a larger conflict broke out tomorrow, we could not produce the arms and equipment to defend ourselves. That's the bottom line.
This weakening of our capability to produce the materiel necessary to defend ourselves is another of the "benefits" of these "free" trade agreements.

Imagine that, another Republican that broke his promise...

Senator Craig not resigning, despite his promise last month to do so if he wasn't able to withdraw his guilty plea.

This will be an intersting case to follow as a comparison to the Jena 6 case. Currently the case is being investigated and charges haven't been filed.

Police: Black student marked with 'KKK' at deaf school

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- A weekend incident with racial overtones at a high school for deaf students could result in criminal charges with "enhanced penalties for a hate crime," Metro Police Chief Cathy Lanier said Wednesday.

A black student was held against his will and then released with "KKK" and swastikas drawn on him in marker at the Model Secondary School for the Deaf on Sunday, she said.

No charges have been filed, and no names have been released, Lanier said.

The incident began when a group of black students and a group of white students were in a dorm. "My understanding is the two groups engaged in friendly horseplay," she said.

But, she said, the groups got "angry with each other."

The two groups separated, she said, but later, six white students and one black student -- all between the ages of 15 and 19 -- took one of the black students into a dorm room and "held him there against his will."

"They used markers to write 'KKK' and draw swastikas on the student," Lanier said.

The student was released after about 45 minutes. He notified dorm and school authorities, who called police.

Senate Committee Weighs Costs of 'Mass Incarceration' as Marijuana Arrests Top 800,000

WASHINGTON, D.C. — As the Senate Joint Economic Committee prepared to hold a hearing today examining the costs associated with the United States' exploding prison population, marijuana policy reformers urged the lawmakers to consider recent statistics suggesting an epidemic of frivolous marijuana arrests.

The hearings come as the U.S. prison population – including rising numbers of nonviolent offenders – nears what many experts believe to be an economic as well as a humanitarian crisis.

Officials at the Marijuana Policy Project cited several recent government and independent reports suggesting that misguided marijuana policies play a major role in prison overpopulation:

- The FBI's 2006 Uniform Crime Reports, released Sept. 12, revealed that marijuana arrests reached record numbers for the fourth year in a row, with 829,627 arrests, or one arrest every 38 seconds. Eighty-nine percent were for possession – not sale or manufacture. Meanwhile, marijuana use rates remain far higher than they were 15 years ago when marijuana arrests totaled nearly a third the current number.

- According to the latest Bureau of Justice Statistics report, released in October 2006, 41,507 marijuana offenders were in state and federal prisons in 2004. This figure did not include those in county jails, where large numbers of marijuana offenders are incarcerated. Because marijuana arrest rates are far higher than they were in 2004, the number of marijuana offenders in prison is also likely much higher.

- A report released by public policy expert Jon Gettman, PhD, calculated that marijuana arrests, which constitute 5.54 percent of all U.S. arrests, cost taxpayers an estimated $10.7 billion each year, including the price of incarceration.

"Considering that the U.S. comprises less than 5 percent of the world's population but a quarter of the world's prisoners, the Joint Economic Committee deserves credit for taking this problem seriously," said Aaron Houston, MPP's congressional lobbyist. "But anyone serious about fixing U.S. prison overpopulation must be ready to talk openly and honestly about how our failed marijuana policies have contributed to this crisis."

With more than 23,000 members and 100,000 e-mail subscribers nationwide, the Marijuana Policy Project is the largest marijuana policy reform organization in the United States. MPP works to minimize the harm associated with marijuana — both the consumption of marijuana and the laws that are intended to prohibit such use. MPP believes that the greatest harm associated with marijuana is imprisonment. For more information, see www.MarijuanaPolicy.org .

Date: 10/4/2007

Good night fellow Democrats. Keep the Faith and keep the faith. The liberal revolution is now.

Posted by gro4me on October 4, 2007 at 08:31 PM

WASHINGTON, D.C. — As the Senate Joint Economic Committee prepared to hold a hearing today examining the costs associated with the United States' exploding prison population, marijuana policy reformers urged the lawmakers to consider recent statistics suggesting an epidemic of frivolous marijuana arrests.

Wow, I didn't know the senate had a committee on economical joints!

Sorry, Gro, I just couldn't resist. Keep up the good fight.

Again, good night everyone.

Howdy-Howdy everybody! Haven't posted on the OT for quite some time, or the PB blog for that matter, just wanted to check out the posts and submit my own little opinion of what I think of Mr. Bush for his veto of SCHIP. So. this here's for are glorious president that wants to be a dictator, and thinks that God speaks to him about killing a million or so people. Yeah, it's alright bud...here's to ya!

Kristen on October 4, 2007 at 08:20 PM,

What's new? He's a family-values Republican. They can't tell the truth from fiction, or is that friction? Just like our fearless faithless Godless leader Mr. Bush he said anyone in his administration that was implicated in outing Valerie Plame would be terminated. One person was finally implicated in their little cover up, and Mr. Bush commutes his sentence even before appeal.

How have you been anyway? Good I hope.

goodnight all!!

"It was not the legislators in FL who voted for this New hampshire goes first. It was your State PARTY. They are the ones who are undemocratic, childish and spiteful. They are trying to use their electoral vote size as blackmail !"

So now the DNC will attempt to use the admission of Florida's delegates as blackmail. I guess two wrongs make a right now?

Posted by BobVADemHawk-Biden-Obama2008 on October 4, 2007 at 07:38 PM

The "Log (HAHAHAAAAAA they are SOOOOO full of themselves, lirerally") Cabin Pugs" are already picking off their own candidates.

Gay GOP Group Targets Romney In Funny New Ad

(And don't even think about Sunday morning "brunch with Maple Syrup".)

Posted by BobVADemHawk-Biden-Obama2008 on October 4, 2007 at 08:42 PM

HEY that was funny!!

Davidual - welcome back!

Clinton pledges to overturn limit on stem cell R&D

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. Democratic presidential front-runner Hillary Clinton vowed on Thursday to lift President George W. Bush's restrictions on federal funding for embryonic stem cell research.

YIPPEEEEEEEEEE!

Posted by PamB on October 4, 2007 at 07:51 PM

I saw that nut job earlier today on a different "show" and he was saying that the Babble STATES that Christians MUST defend Israel because it says so in Genesis, Romans, and a bunch of other OLD TESTAMENT chapters.

Really? Christ wasn't BORN until the NEW Testament, ergo NO "Christians" back then.

And this asswipe claims to be an authority on the subject?

Open his tax exempt books NOW!

Davidual!! WELCOME BACK!!

Posted by DPD on October 4, 2007 at 10:13 PM
lol ok Vinnie

Ok - I like it! Progression to point A.

Sounds almost tarheel!

Dawn, do you remember before he was "Vinnie" he was that pimply faced kid in the shower singing "I am stuck on Band-Aids, cuz Band-Aid's stuck on me"?

What a change to "Pulp Fiction".

What do you think?

does it work? Or too tight? LOL

Posted by DPD on October 4, 2007 at 10:24 PM

blame scientology and too many air miles (lol)

too much high elevation will mess you up in the head (hehe)

I got it. I had to look twice, but I got it none-the-less. I thought it was the Right Rev. at first. Cubs are still tied, BTW.

0-0 in the first. GO! CUBS, GO!!

I got it. I had to look twice, but I got it none-the-less.
Posted by DPD on October 4, 2007 at 10:31 PM

my job is done

lol

I wonder who will call me a troll first?

who are they playing?

My story of Wrigley Field

(about 5 on vacation after moving to FLA a few years before, back to visit family in Gary and hit a game)

I only remember the hotdog and that I thought it was the most delicious thing I had ever had. And for years after that my MOM said every time we used to get behind a TRAILWAYS BUS and I smelled the fumes I'd yell out - CHICAGO!!! I want a hot dog!

I remember a little of the game but only enough to know that it was so FAR away (or seemed to be) from the stands.

I remember the Science Museum more than Wrigley but I've been back to see it since. I hate big city parking, etc. Too much traffic makes me nuts!

473 days
1 hours
13 minutes

hour

anyway

are you listening to Mike Malloy while watching the game?

Va. teacher fired for buttocks art sues

RICHMOND, Va. - A high school art teacher fired after officials learned he moonlighted by creating paintings using his bare buttocks and other body parts sued his former employers on Thursday

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071005/ap_on_re_us/teacher_butt_art;_ylt=AvwM0IFuT2HrSBH.YeAbqt.s0NUE
==============================================
Here is an art teacher who used a ghost name and kept it secret from his students and gets terminated for artistic expression on his own time.

Are we on the clock 24/7 while being employed that one cannot paint, write a story, a love novel, Poetry, and any form of creative art in our homes? That what we do in our own homes are grounds for being terminated at work without due process. That companies "At Will" can stop creative self expression without any written policies. Are they not obligated to supply the Corporate guidelines before they ban you or is it in the South that they can ban all art by Liberals "At Will."

Those that may be able to write Biblical verse are allowed Freedom while others are denied their abstract verse or Anti-Bush verse Democracy. What if politicians demand that Corporations employees stay silence on the Iraq war, demanding workers stay silent in order to stay employed, is this right?

Did Mercedes ban Poetry "At Will" of all employees or was it selective segregation? What color is a poet's words? Why, was I even denied the right to write biblical verse?

Conservatives are in the attack mode of destruction by abolishing the Constitution art of self expression for all art must be approved by their view of what God allows, when it was God that gave an artist his gift.

I can see it know a teacher have a book about sex and it problems and solutions, only to be fired for sex education over the Internet promoting the book.

In Tuscaloosa they want to ban any book written by gays in the public library and the University of Alabama for it might open minds to the children of the campus. It seems students never grow up there.

Congress please allow artists their own homes to use for self expression deny corporations, business, and employers the right to enter without due process, for God's sake we are not in Red or Communist China.

Iraq: Criticism Of U.S. Senate's Partition Resolution Echoes Across Arab World Updated at 7:51 PM

Source: RadioFreeEurope

~snip~

October 4, 2007 (RFE/RL) -- The U.S. Senate's passage of a nonbinding resolution calling for a formal separation of Iraq's 18 governorates into three autonomous regions that would reflect the country's largest ethnicities has sparked a massive outcry both inside Iraq and across the Arab world, with critics suggesting the United States has overstepped its role in Iraq.

Time for JON

that name was just too long

you all have a great night
Peace

Well, Dawn, my number 1 goal for the remainder of my life (how ever short that may be) is to have a hot dog at EVERY Major League Ballpark. I'm pretty much through the line-up.

Dorsano will be happy to know that the Twinkies STILL rule. It used to be OLD Tiger Stadium, but since they moved to "Comerica Park" their dogs S-U-C-K!!

I got a call from my baseball buddy today, and it looks like it may be Seattle next year. (We alternate Leagues because he's a ((YUCK)) White Sox fan, in addition to being a Pug Bush lover, but he's still cool, if just a "little bit" stupid.) This Summer it was East Coast National League, so we have to go the other way in 2008 We decided that it's either the Mariners, or a combo of Oakland/S.F. I'll decide around the Holidays, when my connections with Major League Baseball send me the advance copy of the game DATES and schedules, absent the game times. I don't care what time their local TV contract says. Play the damn game and sell me a Hot Dog, Dammit!!

Bush's Law of Executive Privilege

Screw you Congress you have no power over the President, why even the Supreme Court is a slave to the White House of "At Will" absolute authority. I can supersede and make up my own rules from MY Justice Department that has Watergate powers of surveillance and can do anything it wants without recourse to accountability, Yes, we have the right to impede all Congressional inquiries, and deny any supeanas "At Will" for my friends in the Supreme Court will make me a totalitarian royal ruler for history's sake.

Iraqi Sunni tribal leader killed
A leader of a Sunni Arab tribal council which opposed al-Qaeda in Iraq has been killed in a roadside bomb attack north of Baghdad, Iraqi officials have said. Full Story:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/7028934.stm

Iraq violence, in figures
More than 4,000 coalition soldiers have died, but US forces do not keep complete records of civilians killed. Read More . . .

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/spl/hi/guides/456900/456995/html/default.stm

According to the UN Committee on Drugs (UNODC) the drug lords in Afghanistan have another record harvest of 8.2 thousand tons of opium poppy.

But why does the United States and NATO, which six years ago sent its troops into the country under the banner of fighting terrorism and crime, do nothing to stop heroin production? To find out Izvestia conducted its investigation.

In the last few years, NATO forces in Afghanistan are not very interested in the fight against drug traffickers, much more important to them was the suppression of the rebellion. There has been cooperation between the Taliban and drug lords. The Taliban protected drug caravans and in turn were paid by the drug traffickers. Ideologically they are still hostile to each other, but against the Americans they entered into a tactical alliance.

But why from the beginning, immediately after troops entered Afghanistan, the Western allies did not pay attention to the flourishing drug trade. This provided a "green light".

In the six years since the beginning of operations in Afghanistan, drug traffickers have established a full production, credit and the financial and banking infrastructure.

An interesting fact: Kandahar (center of wholesale drugs) is in the zone of responsibility of 82 th Division airborne troops USA-the same Division that first entered Baghdad in 2003, and the 173rd Airborne Brigade Air.

Also in January 2006 in the district of Kandahar were transferred from the special Canadian and British troops - more than 6000.

During his visit to Afghanistan on December 22, 2005 the then Minister of Defense Donald Rumsfeld reiterated: Mission allied troops should limited to "support the legitimate government of Afghanistan, the fight against international terrorism and prosecute the leaders of the Taliban."

What can be concluded? It seems that for some reason the Americans did not want to seriously combat drug trafficking. Thus, the United States will this year provide the residents of Helmand province about 100 million dollars to replace poppy sown. But it is unlikely to tempt anyone. Indeed, the cultivation of cereals in the climate of Afghanistan is a risky form of agriculture.

Closing their eyes to drug trafficking, the American special services are able to buy most loyal commanders, tribal chiefs. Perhaps Americans simply fear that intensifying the fight against drugs undermines the government of Hamid Karzai already losing popularity.

Why the United States does not want to fight Afghan drug traffickers

bush has not ended drug trafficking in Afghanistan. bush is a total utter f**king MF who doesn't give a shit about America and went into Afghanistan without a plan just like he went into Iraq without a f**king plan.

As I was saying, bush is a total failure. The f**king dog just ate a half pound of really expensive beef jerky the f**king cat knocked on the floor.

Veteran fights back against statements made by Rush Limbaugh. Watch the video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=upCCYeGz39E

Rush Limbaugh: The real phony!
Watch this ad:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=drnQ5Pvc6nE&mode=related&search=

In Vietnam all the politicians had the FANG position tied up. FANG is for F***ing Air National Guard. Most members were the royalty of Washington power, every one knew they would never serve in Vietnam and in fact they had a pass on the war that turned into a quagmire.

So why did George W(ar president) Bush not do his homework from the Vietnam Era? Like Congress's lack of homework for the Iraq War, Bush lack of intelligence led US back on a Vietnam path only worse. His Iraq Civil War Quagmire was a Mission Accomplished failure where Bush Brenner Blackwater Blunders backfired blasting success. He had cost America its future and bankrupt the Constitutional fabric never has one man devastated this country this much. He has given the United States a Katrina Blackwater Gate black eye. His place in history will be one as an dictator more than a patriot. It will take several generations to recover from his abuse of power. Independence will be reborn on the first day of our next President in office and Bush going back to Texas.

With Florida's perennial election fraud, why should they be allowed to move the election up, and exert greater influence over the Democratic nomination process?

Year after year, Florida has massive election "irregularities" (fraud) due to corrupt electronic voting system vendors, and partisan election officials. Unfortunately, I don't trust Florida to run a fair election. So I sure don't want Florida exerting greater influence over the nomination process.

I love Florida Democrats. But I'm not stupid, and I know democracy in Florida is a hoax. I wish Florida had clean elections. But until then, Florida should not be allowed to influence our nomination process.

Do a youtube search for "Florida elections," and see what you get. Over 500 results! Everybody knows Florida has major voting issues:

Ion Sancho Speech on Election Reform Part One
http://youtube.com/watch?v=S8OUtoHtdxg
John Russell at Election Reform Rally in FL.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=29DvURtmZwM
Alan Henderson Deposition, Sup of Elections - 1
http://youtube.com/watch?v=aU13ZAxNnqE

CNN did an interview promoting Ann Coulter's new book, "If Democrats were smart they would be Republicans." HA! CNN should not promote that lying, misrepresentation of facts, and promote hate speech. It's an attack on all Democrats.

I hope CNN will let someone defend the party since they let her attack the party? Demand it!

Write Rick Sanchez on today's "Out in the Open," and let him know we want equal time. Out in the Open does not have a link, so send it to CNN Newsroom:
http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form5.cn.html

No station should air that lying hate monger. And Democrats should be able to respond.

why do you two trolls come on here for ?

it all just lies anyway

no you dont tell me what to do go way troll

Steve are you nuts not contributing,give up on the party that's defeatism. Pam is right this is the fault of the conservative Fla dems on this primary issue NOT the DNC don't fall for what Nelson and his group is telling you and also don't give up on this party cause the repubs will win if you do and again it's also defeatism on your part if you give up.

yes teacher but your still wrong mr harpy

your the trool harpy not me

you are dreaming to think the Republicans are going to win lol

this guy craig is really funny. he is leaving, he's not, he is, he isn't, he is....i'm glad the pelicans will have him along with bush and ghouliani tied to their necks next fall:

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Republican Sen. Larry Craig of Idaho reversed course on Thursday and said he would remain in the U.S. Congress despite his conviction in a sex-sting operation at an airport men's room.

In a statement just hours after a Minnesota court refused to let him withdraw his guilty plea to a misdemeanor charge of disorderly conduct, Craig said he planned to complete his third term that ends in January 2009.

"When my term has expired, I will retire and not seek re-election," said Craig, 62. "I hope this provides the certainty Idaho needs and deserves."

Craig has insisted he did nothing wrong, did not try to solicit sex from an undercover policeman and is not gay. But under pressure from fellow Republicans, he announced on September 1 he intended to resign on September 30.

He began to waffle about his resignation shortly afterward, creating uncertainty about his future even as the Idaho governor interviewed some two dozen possible successors and had picked a possible replacement in the event Craig resigned.

Even if Craig left, it would have no impact on control of the Senate, now held by Democrats 51-49.

Republican leadership aides said there were no plans to try again to push Craig out, and there was no way to force him to leave, although he will face a Senate ethics probe.

The case has been a major political embarrassment for Republicans, since they have long billed themselves as the party of conservative family values...

and the next right wing nut who hopes to run our country???? saint ghouliani of the marriages!!

"In 1994, Mr. Giuliani applauded President Bill Clinton for banning assault rifles and urged Congress to enact physical and written tests and stringent background checks for prospective handgun owners. He also saluted the Clinton health care plan as “doing some pretty good things” and boasted that New York offered “universal health care,” not least for illegal immigrants.

"Isn’t it better they get some humane treatment for themselves?” Mr. Giuliani told a caller."

now this is going to be fun....

bushwar. the beat goes on.

Roadside Bombings Kill Prominent Iraqis

Thursday October 4, 2007 10:46 PM

By KIM GAMEL

Associated Press Writer

BAGHDAD (AP) - Roadside bombs killed the top Shiite official in a volatile area south of Baghdad and an anti-al-Qaida Sunni sheik to the north Thursday as internal power struggles within both Islamic sects threaten to complicate U.S. efforts to stabilize the country.

Car bombs, meanwhile, struck Iraqi civilians in Baghdad and the northern city of Tal Afar, with at least 31 people killed or found dead nationwide, according to police reports.

Abbas Hassan Hamza, a political moderate and the top official in the Iskandariyah district, was killed by a bomb that struck his convoy while he was going to work, a police officer said. Four of his bodyguards also were killed and one was wounded, the officer said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he feared retribution.

Hamza had defected two years ago to Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's Dawa Party from the largest Shiite party, now known as the Supreme Islamic Iraqi Council.

Suspicion for the killing fell on Shiite extremists jockeying for power ahead of expected provincial elections.

Iskandariyah has a volatile mixed population that is about 60 percent Shiite and 40 percent Sunni. The Mahdi Army militia, loyal to radical Shiite cleric Muqtada al-Sadr, is active in the area, some 30 miles south of Baghdad. The Sadrists boycotted the previous provincial elections in January 2005, ceding most local leadership posts to Supreme Islamic Iraqi Council and other rival groups.

Rising internal violence threatens to plunge the southern Shiite heartland into political turmoil. The tensions pose a dilemma for the U.S. military, which must decide whether to intervene in what essentially is a civil conflict even as critics step up calls to start withdrawing U.S. troops.

Meanwhile, Sheik Muawiya Naji Jbara, the Sunni head of the Salahuddin Tribal Awakening Council, died from head injuries he suffered after a roadside bomb exploded as his convoy traveled near Samarra, 60 miles north of Baghdad, said his brother, Marwan Jbara. He said two guards also were wounded.

The blast occurred as the prominent sheik was traveling to an area southwest of Samarra to support the anti-al-Qaida fighters there, a day after 16 members of the council were wounded during clashes with gunmen, according to his brother.

Nobody claimed responsibility for the attack, but al-Qaida-linked Sunni insurgents have been fighting back against initiatives promoted by the American military to turn Sunni sheiks against the terror network.

U.S. and Iraqi troops meanwhile detained a lawmaker from Iraq's biggest Sunni bloc after he allegedly attended a meeting of suspected al-Qaida in Iraq fighters.

Naif Jassim Mohammed was taken into custody Wednesday during a funeral for one of his neighbors in Shurqat, about 140 miles north of Baghdad, according to Salim Abdullah, a spokesman for the Iraq Accordance Front, an alliance of three parties that have 44 of parliament's 275 seats. He said he didn't know why Mohammed was arrested.

The U.S. military said American and Iraqi troops acting on a tip seized a member of parliament Saturday. It did not identify the man other than to say he was a ``suspected criminal leader.''

He was being held for questioning ``after being found at a suspected al-Qaida in Iraq meeting,'' according to a statement.

Morning gregg,

craig is a poor excuse for a human being. If he does not resign, the repugs will have him around their necks during the next campaign. craig is a real loser on the Salmon issue. He appears to be anti environmental.

Looks like the ahole troll stole Dawnie's name. I can't see any difference in the spelling but it is definitely the troll stevie. I guess he got tired of the other trolls humping his leg.

morning gregg,

I am loving Craig staying in the Senate, right there in front of the world, representing the Party that pretends it is for Family Values !

The perversion has nothing to do with his being gay ! NO, rather it has to do with soliciting sex with strangers in bathroom stalls. ewwww.

Betca a couple of MN trolls have been spotted going into the MN airport hoping to have a little peep show for themselves! :)

Happy Friday, Dems!

Psst! It's Barbi's birthday and Night Bird's Fountain is serving cake. Pass it along. Thanks.

http://nightbirdsfountain.blogspot.com/

Morning Cyn and Pam.

Morning, Johnedwrd. Yankees bombed last night. But, our weather is still unseasonably warm!

Cyn,

It was 86 here yesterday and 54 this morning. We again received a little rain last night. The desert wildflowers are all in bloom as if it is spring again. It was so dry this summer, they never got enough water to flower.

Cyn,

What's with the Yankees. They are my wife's team. The 49'ers are my team. I left San Francisco in the early 60's before the Giants moved from New York.

It was a record high here in CT yesterday for October 4th. I made myself pull out my summer annuals and plant mums and my Halloween scarecrows, etc, even though they were flourishing like it were July. I hope this is a sign of a mild winter, but I have a feeling it is not!

babysitting today, so will be in and out most of the day.

John, I would say pitching is their problem right now. However, I still have a lot of faith in them, so we shall see. Tell your wife to keep her fingers crossed!

56 degrees here now. Hard to believe it's October. But, New England weather can change in a snap.

On the brownshirt hearings.

"Beau Phillips, a partner with the public relations firm Chlopak, Leonard, Schechter and Associates, said Blackwater needs to continue stressing that most of its employees are former military personnel."

"They need to help people understand that as you attack Blackwater, you're really attacking soldiers in a sense," Phillips said. "I think that's a message that would be helpful."

Here we go with the regurgitated repuke talking points. "if you attack blackwater, you are really attacking the troops." What a load of crap. If you attack blackwater you are attacking bush (aka Hitler).

Blackwater Aided by PR Giant

Why do we need 1,000 State Department employees in Iraq? Why do we need the largest and most expensive embassy in the World? The only answer I can come up with is that cheney plans to stay in Iraq permanently.

Iraq. Get some balls and kick them out.

Steve from Boca has said what most here in Florida are feeling. 98% of the Democrats in Florida had nothing to do with the change in the primary date, but that apparently does not matter to most on this site. In 2004, I was one of those who supported Howard Dean and "hit the bat" with $25.00-50.00 every two weeks or so to help make sure his campaign continue it's upward climb. I was at the Florida State Convention when all of the candidates were here and it was highlighted by Gov. Dean. Because of his campaign I became a precinct committeeman, joined the local DFA group and the County Democratic party. I was not for John Kerry and was quite upset when he became the nominee, but once it was done I joined the Kerry for President group here in Orlando and worked as a poll watcher on election day.
Like Steve, I have decided not to donate any time or money until the big wheels in the Democratic party solve this problem. I understand the DNC position, but I feel that in the long run Florid'a decision to move up the primary date will be good for all states. The primary system has not been working for many states. Our primary was at the end of March and during the last election we had one of the lowest turn outs simply because John Kerry was already the nominee before we got to vote. There has been a lot of talk about regional primaries for years but nothing has happened. Florida's move now forces each party to finally do something to stop the mad rush by each state to one up the other one. The big wheels can no longer just ignore it and continue on with business as usual. Until they face reality, this is going to happen more and more.

Cyn,

I usually root for the Yankees. My wife was born in Manhattan.

"They need to help people understand that as you attack Blackwater, you're really attacking soldiers in a sense," Phillips said. "I think that's a message that would be helpful."

That is SUCH a crock of crap!

These guys are not soldiers ! They Leave the military and then join Blackwater so they can continue have a license to shoot and kill ! Period. I read an article on Blackwater a couple weeks back, and it said these guys join up for two reasons, Combat and the high pay!
Now how many guys do you know who would want 'combat' as an occupation? It takes a slightly unbalanced mind to have no other aspirations !

Our primary was at the end of March and during the last election we had one of the lowest turn outs simply because John Kerry was already the nominee before we got to vote.

Posted by PCT546DEM on October 5, 2007 at 08:24 AM

Exactly my feelings. Before I left California it seemed like we were always last and that the candidate had already been picked because the others would all drop out. I think the February 5th date is a good choice which all states should honor.

Here is the highly touted Killing Force ! What does this say about the caliber of men they attract?

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - U.S. military reports from the scene of a shooting incident in Baghdad involving security contractor Blackwater indicates its guards opened fire without provocation and used excessive force, The Washington Post reported on Friday.

At least 11 Iraqis were killed in the September 16 incident, which has outraged Iraqis who see the firm as a private army which acts with impunity

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071005/ts_nm/iraq_contractors_report_dc

Pam,

I suppose we are paying for the PR giant to defend blackwater. Are we paying $1,223 an hour that we are paying blackwater? We need to pull ALL State Department personnel out of Iraq including the three security companies. We need to get the private contractors out or make them provide their own security. We need to get the troops out of Iraq. DO IT CONGRESS.

I understand the DNC position, but I feel that in the long run Florid'a decision to move up the primary date will be good for all states. The primary system has not been working for many states. Our primary was at the end of March and during the last election we had one of the lowest turn outs simply because John Kerry was already the nominee before we got to vote. There has been a lot of talk about regional primaries for years but nothing has happened. Florida's move now forces each party to finally do something to stop the mad rush by each state to one up the other one. The big wheels can no longer just ignore it and continue on with business as usual. Until they face reality, this is going to happen more and more.
Posted by PCT546DEM on October 5, 2007 at 08:24 AM

The reason that you won't find much sympathy here, PCT, is that if this stems back for years, (Kerry was 2 years ago, man) THEN WHY did the Florida Dems go last year to the Democratic meeting, and vote YES ? NOW they want to take back their vote? NOW they want to say they don't like things the way they are? WHY can't they wait until the next meetup and roundtable discuss what they see as unfair? This is how the rest of the world and it's operations flow! What makes FL Dems think because they have clout with electoral votes, they can change the rules to whatever they want to, despite what they already agreed to?

I will tell you this. Should by some chance the Dems lose this next election as a result of Florida again, I will be one of the ones on my way to the state to confront The FL State Dem leadership!!!

If this were my state attempting this, I would be embarassed, not defensive ! That they did not do something 2 years ago !

I don't know how we are going to heal the gaping wound bush and cheney have created in the Middle East. If left open, it will fester. bush has no plan. cheney has no plan.

bush and cheney have an open wound in Afghanistan too with no relief in sight.

Will they attack Iran next and leave another gaping wound?

Any ideas?

bbl,

bbl. Walking the dogs.

Pam, The Florida Dems didn't do anything because they can't. Our legislature is dominated by the Republicans. Kind of hard to change much when your in the minority. The Democrats are the majority in congress and they haven't been able to accomplish much, so how can we do anything here when we are in a very small minority. I really don't care if you have sympathy for us or not. What we don't like is being used as an ATM, as one of our representatives recently said and then to be tossed off to the side of the road during the primary season. It's really classy of the candidates to refuse to come here, but they haven't stopped fundraising here. I would be impressed with thier stance if they would refuse to take any money along with thier refusal to come to the state, but that hasn't happened yet. I hope this gets worked out because none of us wants to see the Republicans in the white house again, but right now the mood in Florida is not positive and this doesn't bode well for party unity. Blame whoever you wish, but our party leaders need to come to a resolution that benifits everyone involved.

I will tell you this. Should by some chance the Dems lose this next election as a result of Florida again, I will be one of the ones on my way to the state to confront The FL State Dem leadership!!!

Posted by PamB on October 5, 2007 at 08:37 AM

Not to belittle you or anyone else for that matter, but at this point Florida State DEM leadership doesn't give a damn about the rest of the nation and their anger at this point. They have another agenda quite obviously.

When Gov. Dean announced the threat of losing delegates and the DNC promptly went through with their call, Florida DEMS immediately started circling the wagons. Right or wrong, residents are going to defend and back the state. Now there are areas here in the state that it has been announced that they don't even want to see Dean and he's not welcome. The candidates won't swinging through unless coming for big checks that they can promply write off because big donors have announced they aren't going to pony up.

Oh yeah, Florida DEMS didn't actually set the Jan. 29 date - a REP led legislature did that and was signed into effect by a REP Gov., but the state DEM party choose to go along with it.

Now Sen. Bill Nelson, Alcee Hastings have filed an injunction in Fed court/Tallahassee on behalf of the citizens of the State of Florida. Where this will go??? I dunno.............

Blame whoever you wish, but our party leaders need to come to a resolution that benifits everyone involved.

Posted by PCT546DEM on October 5, 2007 at 09:24 AM

The blame is being laid at Florida's door even though there have been two parties involved in this conflict.

Florida is not blameless by itself. Instead waving punishments all around the DNC leadership should have been helping Florida find a solution. The DEM leadership have a working relationship with the GOP, something they didn't have when Jeb Bush was Governor.

J, You explained the situation much better than I could. I hope the actions taken in Florida will cause both parties to look at the primary system and ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING about it. Thanks for your input.

Good Luck Florida! (glad I'm gone)

Hey DPD - I think you told me something similar before and that's cool if that's your BLISS my Friend! LOL ;-)

Mine is less specific. Just "see the world" while I can, when I can, as MUCH as I can!! I am in AWE of it's wonder and worry about it's health every day!

Bad morning. I woke up to find that the dog crapped in my bed. I think I will just stay in bed today!