Afternoon Open Thread
- What happened to those huge corporate tax cuts? No more 'straight talk?'
- Health care costs continue to rise.
- Note to McCain: voters are not looking for more of the same.
- The New York Times fleshes out two "McCain moments."
Chat away...
Comments (66) «
Barney Frank Calls For Decriminalizing Small Amounts Of Marijuana
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Politico) Rep. Barney Frank will soon introduce legislation to decriminalize small amounts of marijuana, the Massachusetts Democrat said during an appearance on HBO's "Real Time with Bill Maher."
Frank offered no details on his legislation, and it's not at all clear that he could ever get it to the House floor for a vote. A Frank aide was unaware of his plans other than his statement on HBO.
Frank has introduced legisaltion in previous years to allow the use of "medical marijuana," although the bills never made it out of the House Energy and Commerce Committee.
Good afternoon fellow Democrats.
The vacation is over; darn. :-(
This pretty much sums up what the DNC is doing to the Florida voters
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/215/gallery/30643-a31192-t3.html
More on the polls. I follow pollster.com, they average all the polls out.
Clinton 45.8% vs. McCain 46.1%
http://www.pollster.com/08-US-Pres-GE-MvC.php
Obama 43.7% vs. McCain 46.3%
http://www.pollster.com/08-US-Pres-GE-MvO.php
I dont think that lead will hold. Obama took a hit on Wright, but he will overtake McCain again soon.
Just an interesting bit of information...I am a Hillary supporter. I know it doesn't look good for her, but I still support her anyway! This weekend I was talking to my father, who is a republican and has voted that way his whole life, he was saying that of the two Democratic candidates he would be more comfortable with Clinton. I know that he is not very happy about the republican nominee because he thinks he is too old amoung other things. I curiously asked if he would consider crossing over in the GE. He said that he probably wouldn't. I was very surprised that he would even think of it! Probably gives me a hint that he has actually thought about it...I can't wait to see what is going to happen in the fall!
Posted by jenar on March 24, 2008 at 02:50 PM
I don't think your father is alone! There are many sincere Republicans, decent human beings, who have undoubtedly been forced to reexamine why and how we got here. Work on him...
But what if Obama wins the nomination. Who will you vote for?
Looking at China, and seeing them beat up Tibet civilians, I am reminded of the 60's in the South, where a state government were striking blacks with batons so brutally.
Yet, our government does nothing for people of Tibet descent, can the President ask China to treat them with respect. Oh, I forgot they have Guantanamo, and Abu Graith images to use against US. By treating them as terrorists in their own land, they can give them Bush Executive Privilege Guantanamo lifetime sentences, and Justice.
The only thing we can do is boycott China travel, especially during the Olympics, after all the Bible is banned from entering China.
Posted by YoungPoet on March 24, 2008 at 03:17 PM
Why Dave, that's a no-brainer. There aren't any significant oil reserves in Tibet like there are in Iraq.
Robert Mugabe in Nigeria is another example. As long as a despot does not have oil in their country, they're safe from the GOP and the NeoCons.
Posted by BobVADemHawk-Obama08 on March 24, 2008 at 03:36 PM
Mugabe controls Zimbabwe which has very little oil-at least if there are significant reserves they haven't been discovered. And Nigeria has signifcant deposits which the US imports.
But your point is well taken.
Just an interesting bit of information...
One might ask why any life-long Republican would suddenly be so comfortable with The Clintons.
Didn't they want Bill impeached for thumbing his nose at the rule of law and were convinced that Hillary had killed Vince Foster? Maybe Limbaugh is telling them to confuse the other side to get their hopes up?
They wouldn't do that, would they?
As for what these Republicans will do in the fall...? They will vote Republican just like they've always done, because they think Hillary is a bitch and Obama's minister is trying to stop apartheid in America.
All good Republicans (or Independents as they now like to be called) knows that Rev. Wright is going to encourage young blacks to get their daughters pregnant and then make them get abortions...right after they're forced to join a union and try the lesbian lifestyle.
One can't be too safe these days. Everyone knows Democrats are atheists and vegetarians. If they aren't colored, Catholic, Jewish, or Hispanics, they're going to marry one. One might also say they are Communists, but nobody under 50 knows what that means.
And those Democratic cowards want us to leave Iraq before Cheney steals all their oil, as well as deal with the effects of global warming when we all know that the Artic ice cap is just melting because it's spring.
Remember, always say you support the troops and confuse any of your relatives who are stupid enough to think you might really want change ....that's the Republican way. It's the G'damned American way, you hear me.
Yes, Rev. Dobson. I won't vote for that crazy old man McCain either.
Posted by MARZBAR on March 24, 2008 at 03:42 PM
I stand corrected. Thank you.
As for what these Republicans will do in the fall...? They will vote Republican just like they've always done, because they think Hillary is a bitch and Obama's minister is trying to stop apartheid in America.
Posted by SandyH on March 24, 2008 at 03:49 PM
And don't forget, they drank the RED Koolaid that said Democrats are going to try and get an extra dollar out of their greasy little wallets, to try and put this country back together !
Also, the Dems will let those big scary terrorists get them in their beds at night ! :)
Posted by 7867 on March 24, 2008 at 03:57 PM
You mean you're stll looking for that gerbil that crawled up your ass and made a nest? Trollin, trollin down the river...
Getting close to quitting time and thought we might make it through the day. But...
Posted by 7867 on March 24, 2008 at 03:57 PM
Thank you, R2D2.
Looks like the spring offensive is starting in Iraq...
Iraq cleric's militia starts protest, shuts storesBy Ahmed Rasheed and Waleed Ibrahim
Mon Mar 24BAGHDAD (Reuters) - Iraqi Shi'ite cleric Moqtada al-Sadr's Mehdi Army militia ordered shops to close in some Baghdad neighborhoods on Monday in what they said was the start of a "civil disobedience campaign."
The show of force by the feared militia, which the U.S. military once called the greatest threat to peace in Iraq, alarmed residents, but leaders of Sadr's political bloc in parliament stressed that it was a peaceful protest.
The militia has kept a low profile since Sadr called a ceasefire last August and extended it last month, a move U.S. commanders say has helped to sharply reduce sectarian violence between Iraq's majority Shi'ites and minority Sunni Muslims.
But gunbattles in Baghdad and the southern city of Kut last week have raised fears that it may be unraveling at a time when the U.S. military is withdrawing 20,000 troops.
Mehdi Army fighters have complained that U.S. and Iraqi forces have exploited the truce to carry out indiscriminate arrests. U.S. commanders say they only target Mehdi Army cells that have ignored Sadr's ceasefire order.
"This disobedience is to express our objections against what is happening to us. It is a peaceful protest. Our demands are to stop these aggressions and to release all the Sadrist prisoners," said Nassar al-Rubaie, the head of the Sadrist bloc in parliament.
"This does not mean the ceasefire is over. Such a decision is for Moqtada al-Sadr to take," he stressed.
Rubaie did not say how long the protest would last or what form it would take, but loudspeakers at Sadr's office in Amil district in south Baghdad said it would continue for three days...
Posted from the other blog:
I agree too that this is getting way out of hand between Hillary and Obama. If it continues, they are both going to drag this party down.
Each should either go against and start the fight with McCain or one of them needs to drop out for the good of the party!
Either that or someone on the blog needs to start a letter to one of the candidates and have everyone sign their name saying - please stop this fighting - for the good of the party - give it up!
Posted by Kathy_from_Indiana on March 24, 2008 at 04:20 PM
Posted by Butte on March 24, 2008 at 02:26 PM
True Pfleger may put his foot in his mouth. The point is that they are not showing outrageous statements by white ministers in the MSM.
Wrapping up a nine-day overseas trip to Iraq, Vice President Dick Cheney was asked, in an exclusive interview with ABC News, about the effect on the nation of today's grim milestone of at least 4,000 U.S. deaths over the five-year Iraq war.
The point is that they are not showing outrageous statements by white ministers in the MSM.Posted by Veneita on March 24, 2008 at 04:26 PM
See, I've been saying this for over a week - why haven't the MSM played and replayed and replayed over and over again the clip where Fawell and Robertson were talking about 911??? Or play over and over again the rantings of Hegee (sp?) or Ron Parsley or Binnie Hinn or a number of white trash preachers who daily or weekly rant about how bad America is or something about political stuff that they do so well...
Posted by Kathy_from_Indiana on March 24, 2008 at 04:24 PM
What really needs to happen is Clinton needs to drop out. She has lost 14 out of the last 17 primaries and Even her campaign admits that she will be down 75 to 110 delegates at the end of the primary season. It is already decided. Obama won. The sooner everyone realizes this, the sooner we can fight McCain.
Every Clinton supporter that I have debated with in the last few days are now talking about the "GAME" ie/Even if a team is 30 points behind and there is 3 minutes to go, and it is clear they have no way to win, you don't stop the game, and call a winner, you let it play out.
YIKES, I have won every debate by attacking the framing of this primary as a GAME, without even having to go after the "mentality" of comparing a sporting game, where NO ONE IS ALLOWED TO STEP DOWN before it is over. It is called poor sportsmanship
compared to
a candidate like John Edwards stepping down for the good of the country, it is called "good sports" and "team player"
Please, as soon you hear ANYONE (from any party) mention the word GAME, STOP THE CONVERSATION!!!!!!!!
We can't let our countrie's well being depend on the mentality of playing a game
Noting the burden placed on military families, the Vice President said the biggest burden is carried by President Bush, and reminded ABC news that the U.S. military in Iraq and Afghanistan volunteered for duty.
geesh, then all those National guard and Reserves, all that Military that was in previously should all pack up and come home, they sure did not volunteer to go for a LIE !
I remember how pissed they all were when they had joined for education , and found themselves having to ship out for this ill begotten venture for nothing! I heard a Mother of a dead soldier on TV last night when interviewed, stopped just short of accusing Bush and cheney for his death. She said they 'supported their son', but she would not answer whether he died wrongly.
posted by venetia on 24 March 08 at 04:26
I was merely giving a background on Father Pfleger, I have mentioned the media's lack of discussion over extremist white right wing evangelicals several times on previous threads, and I think that it proves that there's a media bias against Obama.
I hadn't heard about Father Pfleger before, and I was curious about him. Personally, I think he's sort of cool. This country could use a few more boat rockers.
Perhaps it is time to start to ask Mrs. Clinton the hard question. How much do you love this country and are you willing to step aside, knowing full well that you can not win this thing, to make sure that our party is unified before the convention.
How much Mrs. Clinton, do you really love our country?
B. CLINTON: And I think it‘d be a great thing if we have an election in a way you have two people who love this country and were devoted to the interest of the country, and people could actually ask themselves who‘s right in these issues instead of all this other stuff that always seems to intrude itself on our politics. So, that‘s my argument for her.(END VIDEO CLIP)
OLBERMANN: Should anyone to interpret President Clinton‘s comments as an effort to draw the attention to the issue of relative patriotism at the end of the long week of controversy surrounding comments made by Senator Obama‘s former minister.
By late this afternoon, Mr. Clinton‘s spokesman was try to shelve
the toothpaste back into the tube, quote, “President Clinton was talking
about the need to talk about issues rather than falsely questioning any
candidate‘s patriotism.” Adding that, “He was lamenting that these kind of
distractions always seems to intrude on political campaigns,”
At this point, let‘s turn to our own Richard Wolffe, senior White House correspondent for “Newsweek” magazine. Richard, good evening.
RICHARD WOLFFE, NEWSWEEK: Good evening, Keith.
OLBERMANN: What did former President Clinton mean and if he was not suggesting there was some question about Senator Obama‘s patriotism, why did he, himself conclude that portion of his remarks by saying, that is my argument for her, not that is my argument for sticking to the issues and not that as my plea for all sides to stop letting this other stuff intrude.
WOLFFE: Well, it can be hard to get inside President Clinton‘s head but let‘s me challengeable (ph) for a moment and say that this was a sin of admission. You‘ve got to look at what the strategy is with these comments. And it‘s a strategy we‘ve heard before from President Clinton which is to actually, in the first instance, took up the credentials and in this case, the patriotism of John McCain.
Now, that‘s a very risky strategy, regardless of what it says about Senator Obama because of a start, if you‘re going to face John McCain in the fall that takes all those questions of his experience off the table. Secondly, really head-to-head, national security and patriotism, John McCain and Hillary Clinton, if it comes to military service and military experience, that is not a comparison that looks good for Hillary Clinton.
And then, you have the third of that level which is: Why is there repeated pattern of President Clinton sort of missing out the reference to Senator Obama when there are more candidates in the race? He‘s to rattle off everyone in the race and say, you know, you all great and never mention Senator Obama. So, there is a pattern here.
OLBERMANN: What is this other story, the Politico piece reported by Allen and Vandehei? What is the path to the nomination, if not the one that they described which essentially amounts to a post primary coupe. Is there a way for Senator Clinton to still win the nomination and still abide by what Governor Richardson was requesting that the fighting stop?
WOLFFE: Yes, well, look. I think Governor Richardson was right. But both sides here have got increasingly ugly. The gloves are off for both campaigns.
And there isn‘t any other path to winning the nomination for either side except for the superdelegates. The problem here is of course, the superdelegates for Hillary Clinton have to overturn those delegates apportioned by the voters, the pledged delegates.
And that‘s an incredibly difficult principle not just because of the passion and the loyalty of African-Americans for Barack Obama but because of that core bedrock principle after the 2000 election that the Democratic will of the people is what matters most. That‘s what‘s hardest to overcome.
The Sunni side (in case McCain doesn't know the difference) is getting ready to stage their spring offensive, too.
80,000 angry men: is the US surge collapsing?In an investigation carried out by GuardianFilms for Channel 4, we uncover how thousands of Iraqis employed at $10 a day by the US to take on al-Qaida are threatening to go on strike because they say they have been used by the 'Americans to do their dirty work' and haven't been paid...
guardian.co.uk,
Thursday March 20 2008
Courtesy ABC NewsThe Guardian video does a report, streamed below, on the prospect that some of the 80,000 members of the Awakening Councils or Concerned Local Citizens in Diyala Province and elsewhere are going to go on strike. Many of them say that they haven't been paid for a while. Others complain about their continued subjection to the Shiite government (this complaint is common in Diyala Province). Still others resent the refusal of the al-Maliki government to integrate them into the formal state security services.
Al-Hayat writing in Arabic says that it is especially the Awakening Council members in Baghad who say they will strike.
Meanwhile, this money graf doesn't strike me as promising:
' As of March 2008, fully a year and a half after the beginning of the sahwa movement, less than 11% of the 90,000-plus force has been integrated into the ISF. Moreover, the Maliki government has stated that under no circumstances will it integrate more than a quarter of these militants into the ISF. '...
Why isn't Petraeus paying protection money any longer? Can't Bernnacke print the money fast enough?
Yep - it's quitn' time here too. Great posting today.. keep up the good fight and remember - you feed the trolls and they're like big zits..the more you feed them - the biger they grow....
Keep on Rockn'
In my experience with organized religion you have two messages---
1. the "boat rockers" (butte) who not only preach the message, but live the message, that directs it's worshipers to --- "question everything" " trust but verify" just because I am your preacher, does not mean you should follow me (or anyone else) blindly.
I am so tired of being called a messiah worshipper, or drinking the Kool-aid, when the church that Barack belongs to is being critized for being rebels of America.
convoluted double speak? mmmm
2. Then there are the religions where the priest/minister tells you "if I say it, know it is true------do not question me. and if I don't walk my talk, it doesn't mean anything. Do what you are told.
Bill Richardson urges unity among Democrats N.M. governor calls Clinton-Obama primary fight ‘enormously negative’By Mike Celizic
TODAYShow.com contributor
updated 8:31 a.m. ET, Mon., March. 24, 2008If the Democrats hope to retake the White House in November, Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama must stop their negative campaigning against each other and start talking about the issues affecting the country, New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson said on Monday on TODAY.
“It’s gotten enormously negative,” Richardson said of the campaign. The governor spoke just days after adding to the acrimony that has increasingly characterized the battle for the nomination when he announced last week that he would give his superdelegate vote to Obama despite the fact that his own state voted by the slimmest of majorities for Clinton.
Richardson said that with Sen. John McCain already the Republican candidate, it’s vital that the battle for the nomination not continue into the Democratic National Convention in August in Denver...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23776463/
I agree wholeheartedly with the NM governor. The time for divisive politics must end.
HEY, they were just showing the DNC's new Ad McCain vs McCain on Situation Room on CNN!!!
LOL, now the world has seen what a doddering old idiot the jerk is !
Posted by Kathy_from_Indiana on March 24, 2008 at 04:36 PM
Veneita and Kathy,
The obvious answer is that the media is afraid to show the Far Right ministers in all their glory. A free press would have done it by now. We have a corporate media.
Kathy,
I'm not too sure we should force one or the other to step down. Let one win and the other accepting their defeat gracefully.
If that doesn't come to pass, we'll have to draft a new candidate...we have a lot of really good alternatives.
Meanwhile, the one who won't go gracefully will be tarnished for life and the stronger one will be in a position to take the prize in the future.
At this point, I think we have to let the process weed out the bad apples who think more of their own careers than the welfare of the party or the country.
Carville isn't helping The Clintons. I hope CNN gives him lot more air time....and his little dog (wife), too.
But Yeary's comments deserve special attention for a couple of reasons. He's the pastor of North Phoenix Baptist Church. And one among the faithful who can often be seen occupying a pew at Yeary's Sunday services is John McCain. For more than a decade Yeary has been his pastor and spiritual mentor. His rock solid anti-gay and abortion preachments have not been looped on YouTube, endlessly repeated on every major network, peddled on legions of websites, emailed, and text messaged to millions, and gabbed about ad nausea from the suites to street corners as Obama's much embattled pastor Jeremiah Wright's racial diatribes still are.
Sandy 5:05, I think I disagree
I believe that when Hillary is beaten, she and her supporters will go to the General with the message that she was cheated and they will covertly campaign against Obama, saying they are supporting him, holding their nose, (or as one who attacks me all the time, says she will vote for the messiah with her "eyes wide open" hint hint) and they actually will stay home or vote for McCain to prove that Hillary should have been the nominee and the DNC gave Bush another 4 term to destroy our country.
I don't know how to counter this.
Does anyone believe that Bill and/or Hillary won't do this and why would you believe that?
Her supporters all have the attitude/mentality that "it is her turn, and she is being cheated"
by this "kid" that will ruin the country, although
I have continually challenged them on how he will ruin the country, and they can't come up with anything substantial.
They just hint that they know something that I don't, and I will find out.
Posted by BobVADemHawk-Obama08 on March 24, 2008 at 04:58 PM
Bob,
Was it Penn's idea to send Carville out as a spokesperson to attack Richardson? Or did he do it all on his own?
I can't believe the bad judgment and lack of control over message. The Clinton campaign has been the worst run ever. Strategy and message has been all over the place.
And there are too many loose guns mouthing off whatever dumb thing comes into their head. At least Obama fires people when they harm his campaign. Someone is in control. Someone takes responsibility for mistakes.
It's time to put the tigers back into their cages or find a nice game preserve to which they can retire.
First, there is no way Hillary should drop out of the race at this point! I vote in NC and am anxious to have my say on May 6. It would be wrong for her to drop out before people like me finally get our chance to vote! We never get the chance to make an impact in the primary process, and I certainly don't want to be cheated out of that now! The Superdelegates can work out their problems after the primaries have been held.
As far as the general election, I had a similar experience to Jenar this weekend. I visited my parents who are strong Republicans in a red state, and although neither of them will ever vote for a Democrat in a million years (even though my dad is very unhappy with Bush because of the war), I was amused by my experiences with my mom at the beauty shop. Several of her elderly Republican women friends said they would vote for Hillary but not tell their husbands! They said it would be their last opportunity to see a female President in their lifetime (they are in their 70's and 80's) and that they would vote for Hillary but tell their husbands they voted for McCain. I just about dropped my teeth to hear that from these women!
posted by venetia on 24 March 08 at 05:05P
That Huffington Post article speaks of the evangelicals as though they are marching in lock-step with Yeary, but when you go to the Sojourners' site, you can see that that isn't the case with all of them.
What the media isn't pointing out, is that there are a lot of evangelicals who are fed up with single-issue politics, and are starting to question blind obedience to the right-wing point of view.
Take a look at;
http://www.sojo.net
I don't think that the media is taking these people seriously.
Posted by SandyH on March 24, 2008 at 05:26 PM
...It's time to put the tigers back into their cages or find a nice game preserve to which they can retire.
The Old Democrats Home? I agree.
Sen. Obama (D-IL) has run a vastly superior campaign. The junior senator from NY was supposed to have this wrapped up by Super Tuesday. She was leading all national polling beofer IA by at least twenty percent. They didn't and they didn't plan for that eventuality either. That, IMHO, is why Sen. Obama ran off eleven straight victories and has won 30 out of 44 contests.
Posted by highserenity on March 24, 2008 at 05:19 PM
high,
I don't know how to stop them from crashing and burning in a hell of their own making. Confronting them only seems to make them act more like wounded animals.
When it come to handling selfish children, you sometimes just have to let them learn the hard way. It's embarrassing to the parents who have to stand by and deal with the temper tantrums, but it finally ends.
And I really don't believe the party is going to lose because of this. We've all been there at the supermarket when these children act badly and feel worry for the parents.
Besides, the problems facing this country have become too painful to most voters to let this political infighting get in the way of them voting for change.
McCain is not a strong candidate. When it comes time to pull the lever (boy, am I showing my age) most voters are not going to vote for Bush again...no matter how hard it was to get a Democratic name on the ballot.
Americans are going to vote for the Democrat...whoever it is. I would like to have coat tails, however, which would bring about a super majority.
Perhaps that is the argument that the super delegates need to take to the two campaigns to end this food fight?
Posted by TillyD on March 24, 2008 at 05:26 PM
Women from a red states vote for whoever they please and usually flaunt it.
If you are suggesting that women in this day and age are afraid of their husbands, you've got to be kidding. Social security has become the great equalizer for women that age. Besides, most of those in their 70's are widows.
We out live them and we end up with all the money, too. Take that Pat Buchanan.
Posted by TillyD on March 24, 2008 at 05:26 PM
Several of her elderly Republican women friends said they would vote for Hillary but not tell their husbands! They said it would be their last opportunity to see a female President in their lifetime (they are in their 70's and 80's) and that they would vote for Hillary but tell their husbands they voted for McCain. I just about dropped my teeth to hear that from these women!
______________________
Yup, you are right----what a reason to vote in the most important election in their lifetime that will commit their grandchildren to a lifetime of hell,
and it isn't just the repub. old women, it is also the dems..
They will vote with their republican husbands if Hillary doesn't win. they all seem to have a sense of "entitlement"
I am lucky, my mom is the repub (who did not vote repub. for the first time in her life in 2004)
and my dad is the dem.
It has always been a family joke about how they cancel each other out. Married 60 years.
mom, even though has been a strong woman advocate hates Clinton
so, I am lucky
They both would vote Obama
On Hardball they are discussing what The Clinton strategy is. The consensus is that Hillary wants to run with McCain instead of against him because she can't win on her own against Obama.
If she continues this in the next few weeks its going to hurt her in Pennsylvania and all the rest of the remaining states. No Democratic voter wants to hear a Democrat cheering on a Republican especially when they are personally hurting economically.
There's some really bad, bad strategic planning going on over there on The Clinton side. They are siding with the incompetents. It's going to rub off on them.
Here's the sort of journalism we need a lot more of.
Connecting all the dots: Economy a victim of war
By Don Rose
March 24, 2008
The quadrupling of oil prices is not all due to the war, but much of the increase is—and was predictable. A Brookings Institution study in 2001 projected a worst-case scenario: $75 per barrel of oil and $3 gasoline resulting from an interruption in the world's oil supply in the event of a war lasting as long as 18 months. Many commentators at the time feared this alone could put us into recession
SandyH,
I grew up in a tiny little Southern town. I don't think the women are "afraid" of their husbands, but they don't want to admit that they will vote for any Democrat...and especially not a Clinton. Believe me, marriages in which older women are still subservient to their husbands is alive and well in the South. You'd think these men can't even fix their own sandwiches the way they get catered to, but that is the way they were raised.
You're right about women outliving the men, but at this point 3 of these women still had husbands whom they did not want to "disappoint" by voting for Hillary. I think that is so funny!
Posted by highserenity on March 24, 2008 at 05:54 PM
high,
I get your drift. But even Republican women are not the ninnys everyone would like to make them out to be. A lot of those old broads like Bay Buchanan and Lynne Cheney are no shrinking violets. They may be dumb but they aren't stupid.
Posted by highserenity on March 24, 2008 at 04:38 PM
Good analysis of the primary as a game.
Looking at Florida and Michigan, it seems to me that a penelty was called in the first quarter, and now in the forth quarter, one side is saying that the penelty should be reversed in fear of disenfranchising the fans for one team. After all we still want all those fans to continue watching the sport.
Obama just has to get the ball back and take a knee. Pennsylvania is a clock accelerator, if Obama pulls out Penn then time will expire. If Hillary wins Pennsylvania then there is under a minute to play, down 30 points and Obama has the ball on Hillary's 1 yard line.
In other words, one more big score puts her away for good. The end zone for Obama is either North Carolina or Indiana.
If only all the other states would have the courage to do this! Let's start taking matters into our own hands !
Vermont Argues Iraq War Is "Mission Expired"
Vermont legislators are demanding that all of its National Guard troops be sent home from Iraq.
While Congress runs out the clock on President Bush's Iraq War, some Vermont legislators hope to spark a state-by-state movement to quickly withdraw National Guard troops and stanch the flow of blood and treasure.
On Jan. 30, state House members, soon followed by state senators, introduced legislation that called on Vermont's Republican Gov. Jim Douglas to take "all necessary steps" to bring home, as quickly as possible, all members of the Vermont National Guard serving in Iraq.
the big power brokers in the democrat party got there because of their stance on and belief in "fair play".
To any of the Clinton supporters,
after watching so many of us switch to Barack because Hillary went dirty and started supporting McCain against Obama
here are my questions:
. do any of you really believe that the big power brokers will allign with her?
Richardson is probably the best example.
2. Will you come out as passionately for Obama as you are for Hillary in persuading your family friends to vote for him, if for nothing else, to save this country?
TillyD
You are a riot.
I'm getting to be one of those old ladies. and I can tell you that none of us care what our husbands think. When you reach a certain age, it just doesn't matter what others think of you any longer.
Husbands who have survived menopause count themselves as lucky. Let's be honest here. Red hat ladies know how to handle the men in their lives who "disappoint" them.
Posted by SandyH on March 24, 2008 at 05:40 PM
IMHO, if the junior senator from NY does not win PA and IN, where she is heavily favored, and NC to prove that the Rev. Wright incident has legs, then the uncommitted super delegates should step in and end this. Though wouldn't it be ironic if former Sen. Edwards' (D-NC) 18 remaining delegates ended up settling this?
What has me ticked off at the Obama campaign is the fact that since Rev. Wright's sermons are available on DVD, why aren't they playing the more positive ones? The sermons where the reverend calls on African-Americans to have some personal responsibility, to stop having children out of wedlock, and to quit playing the victim amongst other "Cosbyisms".
Furthermore, others here have mentioned Sen. McCain's (R-AZ) pastor making some unflattering remarks however, homosexuality and abortion are not the two subjects to hit at. The Holy Bible is rather clear about the first subject and the second will devolve into abortion equals murder. Also, Sen. McCain has made it clear that his campaign does not support using Rev. Wright as a "gotcha point". I respect and thank Sen. McCain for that decision.
If we could get both our candidates to go after John McCain, he will self destruct.
He is a hothead, and there is soooooo much to go after him on---
If we could get both our candidates to go after him NOW, his funding will dry up, his supporters will retreat or look stupid and
the General Election, no matter which Dem is in it will be a done deal.
Right now, we have an advantage with two still in the race if we would USE IT instead of let the repubs. frame it as a disadvantage. Two candidates, with full support of their contributors, GOING AFTER ONE, JOHN MCCAIN.
This would be the ideal
WHAT DO YA THINK?
Posted by PamB on March 24, 2008 at 06:10 PM
Pam,
I love that term, "Mission expired." They promised us that his would be over in a few weeks. Now McCain wants to make it last for a hundred years?
The clock is winding down. There is not going to be any more overtimes.
If Cheney can't swindle those oil contracts from the Iraqis by the end of their second term, there will not be a third overtime with McCain.
Good night fellow Democrats. Keep the Faith and keep the faith. The populist revolution has begun.
BOB, I SO AGREE
I have spent the last week sending the url's to these to all the talk shows, blogs, and even cnn, msnbc etc. and can't get any of them to even play the REAL sermon quoting the White Ambassador from the Fox news interview that Wright said in his sermon he was quoting.
youtube is wonderful they are so quick with this stuff and so creative
here is another one that has already been posted here, but I will post again
http://truthabouttrinity.blogspot.com/
I am angry at Obama camp for not highlighting all that is available now about the positive and not just saying "well, the full picture isn't being shown"
To the fence sitters in this country, that doesn't mean anything
SHOW IT
high,
You have to stop torturing yourself over all these questions about who will win the nomination and how. You can't make this thing end. It will come to an end when it does.
Instead why don't you concentrate on going after McCain's many weakness? He's so pathetic of a choice, even Republicans don't like to discuss him. So we should.
No self-respecting Democrat would ever consider praising him much less voting for him. Start compiling a list of all the things that are wrong with McCain and his disgraced party. Their agenda alone is a case in point; it doesn't relate to voters.
And it's much more fun, too. The other debate over candidates is fruitless at this point.
I love that term, "Mission expired." They promised us that his would be over in a few weeks. Now McCain wants to make it last for a hundred years?
Sandy, I STILL don't understand what victory they expect ! They were asking Iraqi students on CNN today, did they believe that a Democracy would EVER be possible in iraq. And the gal said NO, not when there are three different religious sects/groups there. And that many people do not WANT a Democracy. It is not what they know or believe in.
It is all nothing but a Fabricated bullshit story, which is nothing more than TREASON to our country. Kill off 4000 of our troops, injure and maim another 50,000 of them, for Oil, for Power, for Lies !
Good evening all.
We all knew this terrible day was going to happen soon enough:
4,000 and Counting...
Today's killing of the 4,000 American soldier in Iraq was the latest grim marker in the Bush administration's disastrous war and occupation in Iraq, coming just days after the tragic passing of the fifth anniversary of the American invasion.
Both occurred as the hollow claims by the Bush administration that its so-called military "surge" is "working" became even more obviously absurd. For months it has been painfully clear that the goal of the surge -- political reconciliation that a decline in violence was to make possible -- had totally failed. Now, even the reduction of violence promoted daily by President Bush and the Iraq war apologists lacks credibility.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-andrews/4000-and-counting_b_93084.html
=================================================
So, be prepared for the usual Bush response:
4,000 is just a number
...
3,000 was just a number
....
2,000 was just a number
....
1,000 was just a number.
I suppose when it hits 10,000 the GOP will say it's just a number.
The Iraq war was based on lies.
The Iraq war was immoral and Bush/Cheney should be impeached.
The surge is a lie.
Bush, Cheney and McCain have failed.
Now HERE is an Anti-American. A man who believes more in Oil, Profits, Power, Israel, War, Saudi Arabia friends, than he does in Americans.
WASHINGTON - President Bush pledged Monday to ensure "an outcome that will merit the sacrifice" of those who have died in Iraq, offering both sympathy and resolve as the U.S. death toll in the five-year war hit 4,000.
"One day, people will look back at this moment in history and say, `Thank God there were courageous people willing to serve because they laid the foundation for peace for generations to come,' "
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080324/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush
(had nothing to do with courage. Had to do with Lies and bonus money for those foolish enough to sign up. Oh, and mercanaries like Blackwater, being paid by our US tax dollars who Love to do nothing but kill and maim.)
Also, Sen. McCain has made it clear that his campaign does not support using Rev. Wright as a "gotcha point". I respect and thank Sen. McCain for that decision.
Posted by BobVADemHawk-Obama08 on March 24, 2008 at 06:18 PM
Bob,
Who do you think leaked these Wright DVDs to begin with? McCain will not say anything negative, but he'll wink at the Swiftboarders. Don't give praise where it isn't deserved.
Have a good evening. I'm signing off, too.
Good night, everyone.
Get this one. I'll let it speak for itself. Do these guys really wonder why they have the lowest approval rating in history.
Cheney On 4,000 Dead Americans: They Volunteered
Wrapping up a nine-day overseas trip to Iraq, Vice President Dick Cheney was asked, in an exclusive interview with ABC News, about the effect on the nation of today's grim milestone of at least 4,000 U.S. deaths over the five-year Iraq war.
Noting the burden placed on military families, the Vice President said the biggest burden is carried by President Bush, and reminded ABC news that the U.S. military in Iraq and Afghanistan volunteered for duty.
I love that term, "Mission expired." They promised us that his would be over in a few weeks. Now McCain wants to make it last for a hundred years?
===================================================
David Swanson is right about why we get tongue twisted when debating Iraq. We accept the GOP's terms that Iraq was necessary and end up arguing on a false ground that it's all a matter of tactics. It's not you know! Iraq was wrong from the start and therefore immoral. That means that prolonging the occupation just makes it more immoral. The right debate from the start was impeaching Bush and Cheney for their war crimes. Yes, I did say war crimes.
One for the road...
People do not vote against Obama. They vote for him because he's run a positive campaign. By making him the issue, they are raising his stock as a positive influence among all people in all the states.
I think the two front attack from both The Clintons and the Republican Swiftboaters is only intensifying Obama;s appeal as a new force in American politics....it plays to all his strengths.
SandyH
Yes people do vote against Obama and they vote against Clinton also. Anyone who thinks that Obama or Clinton are little angels are in a dream world. Either one of them could step in and stop their supporters from this crap but neither one of them do. It is truely amazing when we go out to eat, play golf, buy grociers or anything else we do, we don't ask for the Obama table or the Clinton line we all are one. I do not take issue with anyone who might not support the same person that I do, but if you want to go negative then you have to be ready to get negativity back.
Yes people do vote against Obama and they vote against Clinton also
Only Republicans do that.
Democrats vote for Democrats. But when one campaign starts praising the Republican candidate, they have crossed the line. It's going to backfire on them.
And it will backfire on the Republicans for getting involved in our primaries...voting against a Democrat they see as a stronger threat in the general. These sort of things make Democratic volunteers more enthusiastic.
All the negatives are coming from those who see themselves with a weaker candidate.
But when one campaign starts praising the Republican candidate, they have crossed the line. It's going to backfire on them.
It already did, I can't believe I am the only one that wanted no part of it and went the other way.
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