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Yet another point of view from The Nation on Mark Penn:
Mark Penn NOT REALLY Stepping Down: Smoke & Mirrors Hotlist
by dawnt [Subscribe]
Sun Apr 06, 2008 at 05:06:20 PM PDT
Rumors of Mark Penn's demise have been greatly exaggerated. I am writing this diary to try to set the record straight.
Mark Penn did not resign. Mark Penn was not fired. In fact, this is just another bit of smoke and mirrors from the Clinton campaign. From TheNation:
CLINTON DROPS PENN, SORT OF... After months of criticism and allegations of conflicts of interest swirling around Mark Penn, Hillary Clinton's "chief strategist," the Clinton Campaign announced on Sunday that Penn is losing his title.
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/4/6/20620/63110/928/489260
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Ummm Hillary Clinton ... if this is just smoke and mirrors then you have NOT done right! American workers are still angry about Mark Penn and his support of the Columbia free trade agreement. We will NOT be fooled by moving someone to a different title.
But don't think we'll let you attack the best Democrat to ever lead this Nation
Posted by Big_Yellow_Dog on April 7, 2008 at 08:11 AM
Bill Clinton Might be the greatest Democrat of recent history, but these campaign shananagans have defineately tarnished his reputation.
IMO
Greatest Democrat of all time: FDR
According to Michael Moore, 18,000 Americans die every year because they (we) don't have universal health care. So why are people upset about Iraq, and not about the war being waged on Americans by the health SNare industry? Maybe it's because the MSM gives ZERO pictures of the domestic crisis?
Another clash of politics vs. reality over Iraq
by Joe Sudbay (DC) · 4/07/2008 08:55:00 AM ET ·
For George Bush, his administration and his party, the politics of the Iraq war have always trumped the reality of the Iraq war. Under the direction of Karl Rove, Bush made Iraq his major political issue in 2002 and 2004. The American people bought it. John McCain's support for Bush's war is the central tenet of his campaign -- and, again, Rove's fingerprints are all over McCain's campaign. For Bush and McCain, the politics of Iraq have never matched the reality.
Most important of all, Bush and McCain still can't explain how Iraq is making us safer. Because it isn't.
Page A1 of today's Washington Post addresses the politics of Iraq:
The hearings before the Senate Armed Services and Foreign Relations committees promise to be as much about presidential politics as about the past six months of military and diplomatic progress in Iraq. All last summer, Washington anxiously awaited the September appearances of Petraeus, the commanding U.S. general in Iraq, and Crocker, the top U.S. diplomat in Baghdad, anticipating that their testimony could determine the political viability of continued war.
Much further back, Page A13 of the Post, addresses the reality of Iraq:
Three U.S. service members were killed and dozens were wounded Sunday in rocket attacks on the fortified Green Zone and a military base in Baghdad, the U.S. military said.
A fourth U.S. soldier was killed by a roadside bomb in Diyala province, the military said.
The rocket attacks came at 3:30 p.m., according to a U.S. military official who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to release the information. The attack on the Green Zone killed two of the soldiers and wounded 17, the official said. The other attack in the city, at a U.S. military base in Rustamiyah in eastern Baghdad, killed one soldier and wounded 14, the official said.
"It's a tough day for us," the official said. "These are our colleagues, our friends."
Unfortunately, Iraq is about politics. Only a political change in the presidency of the U.S. is going to stop this war.
http://www.americablog.com/2008/04/another-clash-of-politics-vs-reality.html
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Dump the GOP.
McCain ... same as Bush.
Wall Street addicted to emergency funds, now at $38.4 billion per day
by Chris in Paris · 4/07/2008 03:22:00 AM ET · Link
Discuss this post here: 9 Comments · reddit · FARK ·· Digg It!
Dammit, when is Congress or heaven forbid, a presidential candidate going to get serious about this? People on both sides of the isle are fuming about these handouts to the people who have created this recession. Of course nobody wants to trigger major bank failures but for goodness sakes, we keep giving and are not seeing any signs of cutbacks from Wall Street. A lot of the taxpayer money is going right back in to help them finance their bonus system and when these people wrap up the year, bonuses will be as high or higher than last year. It's the American public who will be financing those bonuses and guess what they get in return? A swift kick in the ass, loss of a job or house and a new demand for tax cuts.
The time to negotiate with this bunch is not two years from now, but now. Wall Street never hesitates to demand "what's in it for me?" and this is exactly what we ought to be asking from them today. It also makes me wonder why we only see nastiness between Democrats running for President instead of that same aggression against Wall Street and the damned GOP who started this. How could anyone possibly have faith in a Democratic candidate who can only attack a fellow Democrat and not the owners of this? Wall Street borrowing is up 200% in three weeks and you would never know it by the pathetic doddling in Washington. It looks like the Democrats are ready to let yet another key issue slip through their fingers.
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I had it with these crooks!
If they are going to get my tax money, they will be regulated.
If they are going to get my tax money, there will be a penalty when they outsource American jobs.
Enough already.
Good morning gregg and others.
Democrats call for economic aid package
by Chris in Paris · 4/05/2008 10:51:00 AM ET · Link
Discuss this post here: 22 Comments · reddit · FARK ·· Digg It!
And all McCain can say is "tax cuts and less regulation." Just as Bush ran on tax cuts and less regulation, McCain proves again that all he wants is a third Bush term. The same tax cuts and less regulation that got us in to this economic meltdown are the same tax cuts and less regulation that McCain thinks will cure all of our economic problems.
So to refresh everyone's memory, the GOP handed out luxurious tax cuts to the richest Americans and look how well that worked out for everyone else. Stagnating wages for most Americans along with increasing inflation and even less stability. The GOP followed the marching orders from their wealthy lobbyist friends on Wall Street to open up new financial markets without traditional regulations and safeguards and look how well that worked out for the rest of us. To listen to McCain talk about the issue that will surely be at the top of everyones list in November is quite revealing. He admits he has no clue about economics and to regurgitate Phil Gramm talking points only shows how incapable he is to face the economic turmoil that we will face in the coming years. We tried this GOP experiment and it failed miserably for everyone outside of Big Oil and the corporate boardrooms.
Posted by Hunt on April 7, 2008 at 09:11 AM
Thanks, buddy. If I wanted to hear people dog poor ol' Bill Clinton, I'd go the Faux News blog. lol. Here's a good one... now that he's made some money, I don't think those clowns can call him a "commie." I just can't stand when people attack Clinton. I didn't like it when Rush and the clowns did it when he was President. And I don't like it now. All those people who complained about Clinton... they didn't know how good they had it, did they? I hope they are happy now.
NOBODY DIED WHEN BILL LIED!
There goes McSame again!
Iraq continues to confuse and befuddle John McCain
by Joe Sudbay (DC) · 4/06/2008 02:18:00 PM ET ·
McCain really doesn't know what he's talking about when he talks about Iraq. Well, he either really doesn't or he's really confused. Not sure which is worse.
Think Progress spotted another blatant error today: The GOP nominee doesn't understand what happened over the past couple weeks. McCain thinks 1) al Sadr asked for the recent ceasefire; and 2) the Iraqi military is functioning "functioning very effectively." Wrong and wrong:
In fact, it was members of Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki’s government who brokered the ceasefire, to which Sadr agreed. Experts agree that Sadr’s influence was strengthened — rather than diminished — by the Basra battle.
Finally, the New York Times reported Friday that at least 1,000 Iraqi national soldiers deserted or refused to fight in Basra.
Like Bush, McCain just says things that aren't true. Part of it may be deliberate, but part may just be befuddlement.
http://www.americablog.com/2008/04/iraq-continues-to-confuse-and-befuddle_06.html
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McCain ... same as Bush.
"We’re paying executives like successful entrepreneurs, without asking them to take entrepreneurial risks"
by Chris in Paris · 4/06/2008 10:47:00 AM ET · Link
Discuss this post here: 24 Comments · reddit · FARK ·· Digg It!
Good results or bad, real or fake, job creation or job cuts, it's all the same to corporate America. Regardless of the deliverables, executive compensation never stops rising. The same people in Congress who believe until their dying day that tax changes can make or break business never make the same link with executive compensation. Apparently they must believe that negative tax consequences for business (and I mean the business itself) would not encourage or discourage behavior. We can offer tax incentives or tax penalties for everything else but not for executive pay. Funny how that works.
The compensation research firm Equilar recently compiled data about chief executive pay at 200 companies that filed their proxies by March 28 and had revenues of at least $6.5 billion. And the data illustrates Mr. Hodgson’s point. It shows that average compensation for chief executives who had held the job at least two years rose 5 percent in 2007, to $11.2 million (If new C.E.O.’s are counted, that number is $11.7 million). Even though performance-based bonuses were down last year, the value and prevalence of discretionary bonuses — ones not linked to performance — were up. A result is that C.E.O.’s who have held their jobs for two years received an average total bonus payout of $2.8 million, up 1.1 percent from 2006.
Dump Mark Penn completely OR unions will drop you completely!
Posted by rjsnj on April 7, 2008 at 09:11 AM
How can you be opposed to free trade agreements and one of your top strategists be in bed with the Colombian government? This "implosion" suggests that HRC has neither the "experience" nor the "critical judgment" to run her own campaign, yet alone this country!
It will be interesting to see how this gaffe will play out in the Pennsylvania primary. If this doesn't raise serious questions among union members about HRC nothing will.
Jane Goodall:
Q: In your years of studying chimpanzees, what surprised you the most?
A: The fact that they were capable of violence and a kind of primitive war was an unpleasant surprise. They were more like us than I thought. I was very sad, and shocked, because in some cases there were chimpanzees killing others who they had previously been quite close associates with. It was brutal and shocking.
www.sacbee.com/303/story/836130.html
Chimp wars. Sadness.
Did the turning of the millenia scare us into a return of the planet of the apes? Are we waiting for the Buddha or Jesus or what to educate us on civil and human behavior? Again, and again...
This is what's happening in McCain's war!
SURGE HAS FAILED
3 US Troops Killed, 31 Wounded in Iraq
KIM GAMEL | April 6, 2008 11:23 PM EST | AP
BAGHDAD — Suspected Shiite militants lobbed rockets and mortar shells into the U.S.-protected Green Zone and a military base elsewhere in Baghdad on Sunday, killing three American troops and wounding 31, officials said.
The attacks occurred as U.S. and Iraqi forces battled Shiite militants in Sadr City in some of the fiercest fighting since radical cleric Muqtada al-Sadr ordered a cease-fire a week ago. At least 16 Iraqi civilians were killed and nearly 100 wounded in the fighting, according to hospital officials.
A military official said two U.S. troops died and 17 were wounded in the attack on the Green Zone, which houses the U.S. Embassy and the Iraqi government headquarters in central Baghdad.
Another American service member was killed and 14 were wounded in the attack on a base in the southeastern Baghdad area of Rustamiyah, the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because he wasn't authorized to release the information.
The U.S. military said separately that an American soldier was killed Sunday in a roadside bombing in the volatile Diyala province north of Baghdad. A U.S. soldier assigned to the division operating south of the capital also died Sunday from non-combat related injuries, according to a statement.
The deaths raised to at least 4,018 members of the U.S. military who have died since the Iraq war started in March 2003, according to an Associated Press count.
A senior U.S. military official, also declining to be identified for the same reason, said the rockets were fired at the Green Zone from Sadr City, while the mortar shells came from another predominantly Shiite neighborhood in eastern Baghdad, New Baghdad.
U.S. commanders have blamed what they call Iranian-backed rogue militia groups for launching missiles against American forces.
The strikes occurred despite a strong push by the U.S. military to prevent militants from using suspected launching sites on the southern edge of Sadr City, the Baghdad stronghold of the Mahdi Army of anti-U.S. cleric Muqtada al-Sadr
Posted by rjsnj on April 7, 2008 at 09:46 AM
The criminals are at the controls and are driving the American economic locomotive over the cliff. The American economy used to be the model for the world but we had too many citizens who got their information in cleverly designed Karl Rove sound bites and bought the farm "hook line and sinker"
I hope all the young people coming into politics this year do a better job of understanding the issues.
On a more pleasant note, the Phelps Talibabdist Hate Cult has finally started taking in the arse for all the viciousness they have sown:
Walls close in on Phelpses
Judge orders liens on church building, law office
By Mike Hall
The Capital-Journal
Published Friday, April 04, 2008A federal judge in Maryland on Thursday ordered liens on the Westboro Baptist Church building and the Phelps-Chartered Law office.
If the case presided over by U.S. District Court Judge Richard D. Bennett is upheld by an appeals court, the church, at 3701 S.W. 12th, and the office building, at 1414 S.W. Topeka Blvd., could be obtained by the court and sold, with the proceeds being applied toward $5 million in damages Bennett imposed on church members for picketing a military funeral.
A lien is a legal hold on property, making it collateral against money owed to a person or entity. It can keep the owner from selling the property or transferring title to the property.
The $5 million penalty is the result of a lawsuit filed against three of the church's principals by Albert Snyder, the father of Marine Lance Cpl. Matthew A. Snyder, whose funeral was picketed by church members.
The senior Snyder contended the picketing caused emotional distress and invasion of privacy.
Westboro Baptist members regularly picket funerals of members of the U.S. armed forces, contending the deaths are God's punishment for the country's support of homosexuals.
One talibabdist hate-cult down, another nine thousand and some left to go. Now if justice would rain down on Dobson for his treasonous usurpation of the government and planting moles whose purpose is to shred the Constitution, things will get a lot better in short order. In the Revolutionary times, they hanged treasoners like Dobsonites, Federalists, Norquist-followers and neocons. Perhaps its time to revive the practice.
Posted by Big_Yellow_Dog on April 7, 2008 at 09:38 AM
I can't agree with that estimate. In reality, no one has died because they lack health insurance. That number relies an a thousand "ifs." They die do to a malady. Using his logic, everyone from ~1900 back died from the same thing; no health insurance.
We still haven't defined what universal health care includes. What, indeed, should be considered universal care? Anitbiotic treament... probably. Emergency trauma care... more than likely. Unproven, risky cancer treaments...well? Lipo...as prevention...yes but..? Facial reconstruction... not mandatory but would make the patient feel better. Lasik eye surgery?
See my point? From 30,000 feet, I with the universal health care concept but down in the weeds, I am a bit cautious on what my tax dollars will be paying for.
The latest from that right wing fascist asshat McCrap:
McCain Insists Iraq Buildup Is Working
KANSAS CITY, Mo. — Republican John McCain insists last year's U.S. troop buildup in Iraq brought a glimmer of "something approaching normal" there, despite a recent outbreak of heavy fighting and an American death toll that has surpassed 4,000.
"We are no longer staring into the abyss of defeat, and we can now look ahead to the genuine prospect of success," McCain said in a speech prepared for delivery Monday.
The presidential nominee-in-waiting is closely tied to the unpopular, 5-year-old war. McCain was a vocal advocate of the troop increase strategy eventually adopted by President Bush, and is seeking to convince people the strategy is working.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/07/mccains-latest-on-iraq-we_n_95385.html
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Hey McCrap you lost the day you invaded a country based on lies. There is no "winning" you fascist asshat. This is all an invasion for oil company profits.
Why are conservatives so retarded?
Perhaps its time to revive the practice.
Posted by TheOriginalHillWilliam on April 7, 2008 at 10:26 AM
Kill those who you disagree with because they want to shred the constitution?
Look up the 1st amendment. Just because this is an internet site, we still should refrain from threatening the lives of others.
We, and you, are better than that.
Posted by TheOriginalHillWilliam on April 7, 2008 at 10:26 AM
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To think, they have the gall to complain about Reverend Wright when these crazy anti-american right wing pastors (who picket the troops funerals!) support the GOP. Blah! The heck with the fascist GOP.
rj,it`s not entirely the oil.It`s also the key position in the middle-east militarily.You have strategic eccess to it all from there.
Anti-white, anti-Clinton; well I am sure not anti-white being a Caucasian but a pro-diversity Democrat that sees no race or gender factor in dividing Democrats.
While not being pro-Clinton, the damage being done is by them using Kitchen Sink Politics. They are their own worst enemy.
I did not tell them to invest in Dubai, and suggest having both Bush's as Goodwill Ambassadors, when we have a President Carter and Vice President Gore that are very capable of making inroads.
While I agree Bill Clinton seems to have done a great job as President setting aside flaws in NAPTA and a few other factors, the truth is that he has changed his political face during the Bush years. He is not now the best face with Hillary, for she has her own identity to elect, to tie it all to Bill's former popularity leaves, her devoid of her own message. She has to stand alone as a very talented woman, which she is.
The truth being said is that Marl The Penn did do major damage when he supported the Columbia trade delegation, much worse than Obama did, when one of his representatives met with Canada. So somehow it is less a deal when a Clinton supporter does it?
I respect your opinion for you are a true Democrat. I also respect mine and sometimes I do push the envelope, but we must question our future Democratic Presidential candidate like never before, because we must restore the Bush Intelligence total destruction done to our Constitutional fabric. "We the people" need politicians who work for US and our infrastructure, not foreign interests that take away our children's futures to Dubai, Columbia, India, and other third world countries.
I would love to see the Microsoft, AT&T, and other corporation elements invest in American educational futures. Let US create the greatest workforce in the world by taking stock in our Public Schools. Let train our children to succeed in America's diversity, rather than be swallowed up in segregated economic slum schools of poverty without dreams. Let formulate an Organization called the Franklin Brigade, that uses former teachers, colleges and university, and even the corporate giants in a program to excel our Public Schools beyond Reading, Writing, and Math. We must paint our American Artmosphere with the winds of minds reaching their potentials, where their wings spread across this nation in a rebirth of education.
This is a dream I have, it is not about making millions of dollars but effecting millions of minds in the HeArt of America's patriotism, where "We the people" flourish through our children's Heritage with the History of supporting our founding fathers ideals.
This is why, some call me "Obscene" that one can believe we are truly equal citizens, and that our words can only blossom higher in the dynamics of this nation. We must shout with a Pride that will never be silenced or conquered by any Royalist elite power broker elements. But alas, I just a David pawn on a Chess Board and what I say will be censored, filtered, and banned as Corporate Bohemian treason that people have no right to express themselves in a Bush Corporate World Republic.
You see Big_Yellow_Dog, why worry no one is reading this, it is a vent of an Vietnam Vet for an American dream of peace, where I can eventually find a place cheap enough to write my Poetry as a patriot without shackles, writing about love over political hate and division. Who listens to poets these days, they do not command performances of millions of dollars that politicians do. It seems they get paid more, when they put themselves on a platform with perfect Intelligence!
Posted by Keith1 on April 7, 2008 at 10:26 AM
I think 18,000 is a conservative number. MM always fact checks because he doesn't want to be sued. You sound like you are in the health snare field? We pay more, and get way less than other countries. It's not a question of just "your" tax dollar. It's a question of how the industry steals OUR dollars, including industry fraud paid by OUR taxes.
What was your take on "Sicko?"
Posted by virgo on April 7, 2008 at 10:39 AM
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Yes that's true. Ultimately, it's all about protecting the overseas operations of oil companies. The new imperialism is a by-product of globalization. It's not imperialism in the sense of running a country as much as a military presence to protect the assets of the globalized corporation.
When people wake up and figure this out, they will be pissed!
Posted by Keith1 on April 7, 2008 at 10:26 AM
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Oh please, this is the same rhetoric that the right wing has used for 60 years to stall all major transformations of the health care system.
You really doubt that people die because they can't afford treatment? Give me a freakin break.
What exactly should be in universal care? That's easy - pretty much what's covered today though pre-existing conditions should be excluded. Yes, we'll have to be careful about experimental treatment but I would trust someone who has no profit motive to make that judgement than someone who has one. Cosmetic procedures ... come on now, you know that isn't going to be covered.
Posted by YoungPoet on April 7, 2008 at 10:40 AM
You can call it poetry... but it sure sounds like the politics of destruction to me. I suppose you would rather Bush I not get involved in global events, like he did after the Indonesian tsunami? He helped raise money for the needy. Stop your selfishness, and blaming Clinton for everything. That's very Republican. I think the Republicans have blamed Clinton more than imaginable. The irony...
Posted by Big_Yellow_Dog on April 7, 2008 at 10:41 AM
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Big Yellow, we finally find a point of agreement. It's a very conservative number.
Posted by Keith1 on April 7, 2008 at 10:26 AM
People could get by around the turn of the last century without health insurance, because doctors weren't hamstrung by having to pay for malpractice insurance, and the myriads of electronic gadgets they need now.
Most doctors treated people who needed treatment, and let them pay the bill when, and however they could.
My uncle was a general practitioner who practiced from the 1930s to the start of the 1970s. My aunt used to tell about him getting paid in chickens, home cured hams and bacon, eggs, produce and labor during the 1930s, up until WWII when people started working at defense plants and making good money.
I know there were people who owned him money when he passed away from a stroke. He still managed to send his kids to college.
But the economics of medical practice has changed considerably, and the HMOs with their bean-counters dictating medical practice instead of relying on the trained practitioners to used their own judgment was the start of this whole mess. The way school loans are set up compounds the problem, because young doctors are forced to go into higher paying specialties so they can pay off their school loans, which is leaving us with a dire shortage of what are now known as family practitioners.
The result is not only bean-counter driven medical treatment, but few General Practitioners(GPs), who knows the patient well enough to manage and coordinate the medical treatment by whichever specialists who are treating the patient. With all these new prescription drugs, it leaves patients with fragmented medical care and the very real possibilities of iatrogenic tragedies caused by taking incompatible medications or treatments.
My uncle could do run of the mill surgery, treat a colds, broken bones, kid diseases, give immunizations, deliver a baby, and know when a specialist was needed and refer the patient to that specialist with a complete work-up.
Which leads to another aspect of the current problem.
Family practitioners are not being paid commensurate with their skills as diagnosticians. The medical payments are procedure based, and blow off the skills of a good diagnostician who can spot a problem before it gets too far, and refer to the proper specialist for correction.
A stitch in time saves nine, and that serves well in medicine too. Only the system is not set up for us to get the proper preventive and early care that we need.
It would save a lot of time money and pain in the long run.
WASHINGTON — Hospitals, schools and the assembly line at an airplane factory look like pretty good places to be with a recession looming and unemployment rising. Construction workers, real estate agents and auto workers aren't expected to fare as well.
The startling news that the economy lost 80,000 jobs last month and nearly a quarter-million over the last three months is the starkest signal yet that the country has probably fallen into a recession, with things on the job front expected to get worse.
"All the indicators suggest that we will see even larger job declines in coming months. Businesses are getting nervous and pulling back," said Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody's Economy.com.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/07/job-winners-and-losers-in_n_95353.html
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The second recession in 8 years brought to you by the GOP.
Mornin all.
Probably already posted, but we should keep reposting this list of GOP notables:
Posted by Butte on April 7, 2008 at 11:14 AM
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I have to laugh when people make comparisons to medicine from 50 years ago. In the spirit of the GOP windbag McCain, why not go back 1000 years? You could get a cheap treatment with leeches back then and then you would die that much faster!
Come on, people need to stop being such idiots on this issue. Medical treatment costs more for a variety of reasons - malpractice being the least. Yes, Doctors need to pay their loans off. That's a significant factor. The biggest cost is the equipment used and the medications.
Would you rather be treated with a procedure from 1000 years ago or use what's more likely to be effective?
Send a box of leeches out to the Senator from Arizona. That would be McCain.
McCain ... same as Bush.
Blue,
Daaannnnggggggg, that used to be a page with a paragraph or so under each name. It's gotten so huge they had to turn it into an index. Even so, it's still a huge page. It amazes me that anyone would cast a repug vote at all. Then again, I've said it before and I'll wind up saying a lot more before it finally takes hold: "Only criminals support criminals".
It amazes me that anyone would cast a repug vote at all.
Posted by TheOriginalHillWilliam on April 7, 2008 at 11:37 AM
Which is exactly whey Rove and the F-word channel have convinced their koolaid drinkers that McCain is not a republican. We HAVE to get the word out that McCain will continue the failed policies of the republicans. Some people already believe that he is some sort of "every man" that is a "born leader". It's sad to think that even a broken clock gets it right more often than the typical American voter.
Posted by BlueinIdaho on April 7, 2008 at 11:46 AM
With Rove now advising the McCain campaign, is t any surprise that they are trying to convince voters that he is the "every Man." or framing the campaign on National Security. We've seen this campaign the last 2 elections.
I sure hope we figured out how to defeat it this time.
Blue,
When I run up on repug intransigence, I challenge them to go look it up and prove me wrong. I remind them that voting records are public record. If I'm so damned wrong, then prove it; it should be easy, no? Voting records being public, right?
I never, ever have been challenged on the basis of facts. LOC doesn't lie, but let me tell you, a repub full of koolade certainly will. When something challenges their clouded view (like facts posted on LOC), you can hear the gears crashing together in their heads.
Then they go on and do what they're gonna do anyway. Sadly, cult-think is stronger than facts.
Writing in the Wall Street Journal today, Sens. Joe Lieberman (I-CT) and Lindsey Graham (R-SC) accuse critics of the Iraq war of facing “a crisis of credibility” because they “confidently predicted the failure of the surge.” But in their effort to argue that anti-war critics have “been proven decidedly wrong,” Lieberman and Graham undermine their own credibility on the issue by ignoring recent developments in the war-torn country.
As proof of the surge’s success, the two hawkish senators cite statistics that they say show “dramatic improvements in security”:
No one can deny the dramatic improvements in security in Iraq achieved by Gen. Petraeus, the brave troops under his command, and the Iraqi Security Forces. From June 2007 through February 2008, deaths from ethno-sectarian violence in Baghdad have fallen approximately 90%. American casualties have also fallen sharply, down by 70%.
The fact that Lieberman and Graham only cite statistics through February — even though numbers for March 2008 are available — undercuts their argument.
Overall, Iraqi deaths rose from a low of 568 in December and 541 in January to roughly 721 in February to more than 1,082 in March, according to statistics compiled by Iraq’s ministries of health, interior, and defense and confirmed by Smith. The vast majority were civilians.
“There was somewhere on the order of a 25 or 30 percent increase in the number of civilian casualties when you consider March compared to February,” Smith said, although “the numbers are still nowhere near what they had been last summer.”...
A new assessment of U.S. policy in Iraq by the same experts who advised the original Iraq Study Group concludes that political progress is “so slow, halting and superficial” and political fragmentation “so pronounced” that the United States is no closer to being able to leave Iraq than it was a year ago.
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I wonder if the new NIE on Iraq comes to similar conclusions on the political progress in Iraq? Maybe it is being kept secret because it will undercut every arguement put forth by the talking heads of the republic party.
On a side note, I can't wait for McCain to talk about his ability to bridge the political devide. His example of course is that turncoat Lieberman.
Sorry for the long post. Combining three posts because of errors that keep coming up.
Posted by Butte on April 7, 2008 at 11:14 AM
I think I agree. The problem, as I see it, is the fact the insurance exists! The only insurance should be for catastrophes, not general care.
Imagine you had to have food insurance. You don't actually buy any one item, you pay a middle man and the wealth is distrubuted and you go and get what is considered life sustaining. How is this different from Universal Health Care? We live in a market economy, whether we all like it or not.
Posted by Big_Yellow_Dog on April 7, 2008 at 10:41 AM
I lurk and post here and hope that people on here have open minds and want to have good intelligent dialogue. I don't work for in the "health snare" system (real cute, these are the people that will save your life someday). Lets be better than republicans and have debate, not just hurl insults. After Bowling for Columbine, I discounted Mr. Moore opinions. I have not watched his documentaries since. All I have seen is the snippets from the news, which I also discount. Where I have heard many of the things that make me think is NPR. Where it sounds like we both agree is that the system needs fixing. Do you really think that everyone will be better with universal health care? Are there things that we could think about before we just do it to be sure its the right way to go?
Posted by rjsnj on April 7, 2008 at 10:59 AM
The only examples of government health plans currently are VA and Medicare. Some cosmetic surgeries are covered under those plans. (Lasik for example in VA.) It is very concievable that there would be a lobby to push for this in a universal health care plan. Its a bit harder question than I think you see it as.
Posted by rjsnj on April 7, 2008 at 11:28 AM
I wasn't discussing the differences in medical procedures, oh Laughing One, I was pointing out the financial and the treatment devolution of our current medical care (and I use the term loosely) system.
My uncle also bought into the AMA's "socialized medicine" scare in the 50s and 60s , and the medical profession's desire to not lose their independence to "socialized medicine" is what cost them their independence from predatory insurance companies and HMOs.
IMHO if the docs practicing at that time had looked ahead a bit, they could have possibly seen the trap. But most of the older docs had made it through the Depression with their Hippocratic Oaths intact, dispensing the best care they had available and managing to feed their families while dealing with that national tragedy, and most people in the era of the 50s and 60s saw nothing but a better brighter future ahead, so they figured they didn't need government help in the future. Most of the docs' patients had their employers' medical insurance and they didn't see the need for "socialized medicine" either.
Their short-sightedness set the system up for failure. They were not prepared for the onslaught of Reaganism and the neo-cons thirty years war on the American economy and political system.
Understanding the root causes of a problem, helps to fight the problem.
I can see the neo-cons with their bath-tub drain view of government bringing out the old dinosaur argument of "socialized medicine" and trying to call it a dragon. Most voters my age grew up hearing the "socialized medicine" spiel.
Defeat that argument, and it will go a long way to gaining support for the kind of medical system we really need.
Posted by Butte on April 7, 2008 at 12:16 PM
Ok, rereading this, we may disagree on points but I think we see the same issue; we are valuing the wrong things in the health systems.
The only examples of government health plans currently are VA and Medicare.
Posted by Keith1 on April 7, 2008 at 12:10 PM
Are you talking about Virginia or Veterans Affairs?
My understanding of healthcare provided by Veterans Affairs is substandard, especially when it comes to brain injuries and mental issues.
Oregon offers a type of universal healthcare. It was suspended in 04 ( I think) and was recently reinstated. There are funding issues so a lottery was held to fill the limited number of slots that they can provide service to.
Veterans Affairs and yes, overall, I would consider it substandard. What is covered and is not is amazing. In the one location that I brought someone to, I saw some things that I certainly would not want to see again.
Happy Monday afternoon Dems! Just stopping in to let you know our newest Democrat was born on Friday!
Tet Happened, and No One Cared
Everything else Mr. McCain has to say about Iraq is more troubling, and I don’t mean just his recent serial gaffe conflating Shiite Iran and Sunni Qaeda. The sum total of his public record suggests that he could well prolong the war for another century — not because he’s the crazed militarist portrayed by Democrats, but through sheer inertia, bad judgment and blundering.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/04/06/opinion/06rich.html?_r=2&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
Posted by Keith1 on April 7, 2008 at 12:10 PM
VA and Medicare are the only governmental health care plans? Ever wonder what plan your senator is on? It's not one of those, and it works very well. FEP/FEHP. It was the same plan that John Kerry touted as the means to covering most Americans.
Kristen:
CONGRATULATIONS!
*pulled from Wikipedia
Blue Cross and/or Blue Shield insurance companies are franchisees, independent of the association (and traditionally each other), offering insurance plans within defined regions under one or both of the association's brands. Blue Cross Blue Shield insurers offer some form of health insurance coverage in every US state. They also act as administrators of Medicare in many states or regions of the U.S., and regularly can be found providing group coverage to state government employees, as well as the U.S. Federal government under a nationwide option of the Federal Employees Health Benefit Plan (FEHBP) established by the association on their behalf. Thus a strong bond exists between the Blue Cross Blue Shield system and health insurance policy-making bodies at the highest levels of government in the United States...
...Blue Cross-Blue Shield companies, cover most of their customers under managed care plans such as HMOs and PPOs which provide hospital and medical care in one policy.
Posted by Cubilist on April 7, 2008 at 12:46 PM
The Blue plans administer the programs, but they are created and managed by the US government.
My point is anyone can already sign up (through Blue Cross Blue Shield) and have the same plan that senators are covered by.
Posted by Cubilist on April 7, 2008 at 12:56 PM
No. The Blue plans simply pay out benefits and collect premiums. The government controls what benefits are provided or excluded, what premiums will be charged, who is eligible for enrollment and the ultimate outcome of any challenge to the way the program was administered.
Posted by Cubilist on April 7, 2008 at 12:59 PM
Hardly. The plan that covers Senators and congressmen is far, far richer in benefits than those offered under most BCBS plans, and the ones that are similar are ridiculously expensive. Congresspersons couldn't even afford them if they weren;t hevily subisidized at taxpayer expene.
Veterans' Administration is substandard for a reason. It has been under continual assault by the bath-tub drain neo-cons for the last 12 years at least, probably ever since Bushdaddy was in office.
These are the-promise-them-anything-and-then-kick-them-to-the-wall Republicans, who have also assaulted dependent care, brought us Tricare, which, while marginally better than Champus, has invaded and degraded the Troop Medical Clinics and helped do away with many Military Medical Centers.
After having been deliberately under funded since the Republicans took over Congress, and with a president who will veto anything that looks like social responsibility or living up to a promise, the VA is sub-standard through no fault of VA employees. They are doing the best they can with the little they get, while they see the Bush appointees over them ask for less money than is needed and necessary programs get closed down.
At its best the VA is pretty durn good, but under the Republicans is it starving to death.
The best thing that could happen to the VA is a Congressional oversight committee, and a GAO audit, with the results published in the media, loudly and clearly.
These kids have had large chunks carved out of their lives, they don't need this mistreatment!
Butte,
Longer than that. The assault on the medical system began when Nixon and Kaiser colluded to ram legislation through creating the first HMO. We knew it was all downhill from there. Sometimes it's a beeyotch being right :-\
The VA is just one more victim of the parting-out and piecemealing of the medical system.
Oh, and I'll hardly go into some of the disgusting things I saw at VAMC Miami when my dad was in there. You'd go in in the morning and there'd be some dead guy parked in the hall with a sheet over him, leave that afternoon and the poor sod would still be in the same spot, same sheet. I've been in cleaner A&P stores (remember those? each nastier than the last...)
It's some weirdass notion these pubs have about "supporting the troops". If I hadn't seen it with my own eyes, I'd have never believed it.
I see two different directions our health care can move from here.
What we see today is insurance companies beginning to tier their coverage. If you want cheaper premiums then you can opt for basic coverage, where you still pay co-pays and at least 20% of your bill. If you can afford more then you can purchase higher coverage. You get better care and cheaper out-of-pocket expenses.
If we keep moving to the right on health care then the end result will be the level of service you receive will be determined on the your position in a company or your education level. If you are the CEO or upper management, you will receive the best care from the best doctors. If you are just a laborer, then you will receive the minimum care to stay alive and that's about it.
Now, if we move to the left, then the end result will be that everyone receives care for any medical problems they may have.
We have to move to the left, the scenerio on the right, scares the bejesus out of me. We will truly be in a fascist state if that happens. And we are moving there now.
The VA Hospital in Helena isn't quite that bad. For one thing, they have fewer patients, and for another, the staff isn't as demoralized as some places.
I have a cousin-in-law who works for the VA in NM. He's been pretty disgusted with the cutbacks they've had to endure. They had a really excellent nation wide program to help blind vets, and it's been eliminated. Right now, I think that he's just hanging in until retirement. He's a vet, too, and it really gripes his guts. He cares about his clients and it's eating him.
TMH: It won't be by education level, position in the company will be about it, and since most upper echelon corporate management types think that anyone below them is disposable, that pretty much means that the workers are SOL. After all, they can be replaced by some other poor slob who is in the need of a way to feed his/her family.
As for education, I know several people with graduate degrees who are working in fields where they feel they are needed, whose pay is so low, they are living on ramen noodles and driving 15 year old compacts so they can pay off their student loans before they retire.
VP Rice? God help us all!!!!
There are reports that she is campaigning for VP behind the scenes.
How scary is this, isn't she the one who missed the intelligence report warning us about 9/11. Isn't she the one that Bush had to create a whole new arm of the government because she didn't do her job in the first place?
I think this verifies "McCain=McSame"
Blue Cross Blue Shield isn't what it used to be. The BCBS coverage I have now thru my employer pretty much sucks. I have to front a lot of the costs even after I meet the deductible. It is taking longer and longer now to get monies paid up front to be returned by the insurance company. There are some months where I am owed between $500 and $1,000 that I have had to front. Let me tell you, it eats into the food budget very quickly.
Butte,
I hear good things about the VAMC in Durham. Then again, they're sidled up against Duke Hospital, so there's at least social pressure to keep up. Still in all, if I had to choose, I'd choose Duke right next door and figure out how to pay later. After seeing what my dad and a load of my friends went through in Miama, G'd help you if the VA gets their clutches on you. No thanks, just the same; I've fought with them, advocated for my dad and friends, run paper, argued with staff, negotiated with doctors and they can just keep it.
Kristen - good news! Sooo - will we be calling the newest Democrat Hillary or Barack?
McCain: Democrats' stance on Iraq flawed
"I do not believe that anyone should make promises as a candidate for president that they cannot keep if elected," McCain told the crowd.
"To promise a withdrawal of our forces from Iraq, regardless of the calamitous consequences to the Iraqi people, our most vital interests, and the future of the Middle East, is the height of irresponsibility," he said. "It is a failure of leadership."
On Monday, Obama used McCain's own words against him.
"It's a failure of leadership to support an open-ended occupation of Iraq that has failed to press Iraq's leaders to reconcile, badly overstretched our military, put a strain on our military families, set back our ability to lead the world, and made the American people less safe," Obama said.
VP Rice? If anything will ensure an Obama presidency, that oughtta be it. Dum spiramus, speramus...
TMH - at least she'll have enough shoes for all of the different speechs she's have to make...
VP Rice - sure sounds rather hollow to me.
Despite His Votes To Cut Veterans Funding, McCain Says We Owe Vets ‘A Debt We Can Never Repay’
He also said that veterans should have access to “the highest quality health…care in the world” upon returning:
As President, I will do everything in my power to ensure that those who serve today and those who have served in the past have access to the highest quality health, mental health and rehabilitative care in the world. The disgrace of Walter Reed must not be forgotten. … Whatever our commitments to veterans cost, we will keep them, as you have kept every commitment to us. The honor of a great nation is at stake.
Not only has he refused to support the 21st Century GI Bill, which the Veterans of Foreign Wars endorsed last June, he has consistently voted against increasing funding for the Veterans’ Administration, which oversees all medical care for veterans:
– Voted AGAINST an amendment providing $20 billion to the VA’s medical facilities. [5/4/06]
– Voted AGAINST providing $430 million to the VA for outpatient care “and treatment for veterans,” one of only 13 senators to do so. [4/26/06]
– Voted AGAINST increasing VA funding by $1.5 billion by closing corporate loopholes. [3/14/06]
– Voted AGAINST increasing VA funding by $1.8 billion by ending “abusive tax loopholes.” [3/10/04]
– Voted AGAINST a $650 million increase in veterans’ medical care funding. [8/1/01]
Butte: Wow, that about sums up the company I work for. But now they have almost depleted the pool of low level workers. It is getting hard to find help at all, let alone quality workers.
We receive money from the state to pay the employee wages. Every year, for the past few years, the state has given the company extra money to give raises. Instead of passing that money along to the workers, they gave everyone a 2% raise and sent out a letter explaining that the company has high costs to pay for each employee. They attached a formula showing that how someone makeing $9/hour actually costs the company $13/hour, adding in workman's comp, SSI, Medical ins., (like everyone can afford it, but they still counted it), and taxes.
Personally, I thought all the employees should have written a letter back at $9/hour showing how they are actually earning $6.50 to $7/hour after everything is taken out. By the way, the company my wife works for gets their funding the same way, received a $1/hour raise.
All this while the upper management is driving around in brand new, shiny, company owned escalades. Absolutely pathetic.
Lest We Forget:
From 2002 as Cheerleader Condi led the nation with her nuclear bomb pom poms..
CONDOLEEZZA RICE: Well, the old rules are unacceptable. The United States believes very strongly - the president has said it - the vice president has said it - the Secretary of State has said it - that inspections are not an end in themselves.
This is a matter of disarming the Iraqi regime, because that's the danger, is that Saddam Hussein with nuclear, chemical, biological weapons will be a threat to his people, his neighbors, and to us. So this is not a matter of just returning inspectors.
CONDOLEEZZA RICE: We clearly know that there were in the past and have been contacts between senior Iraqi officials and members of al-Qaida going back for actually quite a long time.
We know too that several of the detainees, in particular some high ranking detainees, have said that Iraq provided some training to al-Qaida in chemical weapons development.
So, yes, there are contacts between Iraq and al-Qaida. We know that Saddam Hussein has a long history with terrorism in general. And there are some al-Qaida personnel who found refuge in Baghdad.
Lest We Forget:
Condolezza Rice Responsible for Bin Laden Attacks on US.
Afterward, Tenet looked back on the meeting with Rice as a lost opportunity to prevent or disrupt the attacks. Rice could have gotten through to Bush on the threat, Tenet thought, but she just didn't get it in time. He felt that he had done his job and been very direct about the threat, but that Rice had not moved quickly. He felt she was not organized and did not push people, as he tried to do at the CIA.
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latestnews/index.php?id=7995
Posted by Butte on April 7, 2008 at 12:16 PM
Posted by rjsnj on April 7, 2008 at 11:28 AM
I wasn't discussing the differences in medical procedures, oh Laughing One,
posted by Butte
===================================================
Oh Laughing One?
I assure you there is nothing funny to me about the health care disaster in this country.
I know you weren't talking about medical procedures! That other person (kevin1?) was babbling away about why does it cost so much more money today ... to me it's obvious.
That's 100% correct the AMA along with the unions (urrrrghhhh) defeated Truman's single payer proposal in 1948. The unions have changed their minds for the most part (though still waiting on AFL-CIO endorsement at the top). I have it from a person in PHNP that the AMA is still an enemy though not that many doctors belong to it - mainly, high priced surgeons.
Is this considered success??
You don't need to be a West Point Graduate to figure out who's really running the show in Iraq.
Major fighting eased Sunday after al-Sadr ordered his men off the street under a deal brokered in Iran — a move which appeared to undermine al-Maliki, who had taken personal command of the Basra operation.
The officials said the mutiny involved an army battalion from the 4th Iraqi Division numbering about 500 men as well as about 400 policemen.
Deserters said they did not want to fight fellow Shiites and turned over weapons and vehicles to the Mahdi Army, said the officials, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the matter.
Iraqi officials have acknowledged desertions but described the numbers as insignificant.
However, the desertions cast new doubt on the effectiveness of U.S.-trained Iraqi security forces. The White House has conditioned further U.S. troop withdrawals on the readiness of the Iraqi military and police.
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latestnews/index.php?id=11245
Good afternoon, all.
Just dropping by...
Clinton's best-case scenario for victory requires sundering her own party. It is an inherently divisive strategy, but she doesn't appear to care. For Clinton, all's fair in pursuit of victory—even destroying her party from within. Her campaign has adopted a bizarre "insult-40-states strategy," which has belittled states small, liberal and Red. Apparently, the only states that matter are the ones she coincidentally happens to win.
One has to wonder what she would do to get her way on domestic and especially foreign policy. How much farther would she go than George W. Bush?
I'm not criticizing her here by any means. There have been national decisions put off for far too long concerning a wide variety of problems ranging from health care and the Iraqi occuaption to alternative fuels and taxation policies.
Yet Bush will leave behind an imperial presidency with a Supreme Court that is not adverse to giving the Executive even more powers to the detrement of the Bill of Rights and our ethical standing abroad as a nation.
We need to start thinking about how that power will be used and if either or both of our candidates have the wisdom and nerve to use it or curtail it.
Think about it.
bbl.
The only examples of government health plans currently are VA and Medicare. Some cosmetic surgeries are covered under those plans. (Lasik for example in VA.) It is very concievable that there would be a lobby to push for this in a universal health care plan. Its a bit harder question than I think you see it as.
Posted by Keith1 on April 7, 2008 at 12:10 PM
====================================================
Actually, there are many examples of government health plans - you are leaving out all of the federal and state employees. You are also leaving out Medicaid, SCHIP but anyway.
It's not a hard question at all given that there is wide agreement already on what is cosmetic in the private insurance world. So, it would be something that constantly needs to be discussed. My point is so what! People like you use it as a cheap trick to paralyze real change in the way we cover health care. Any more of your CATO / Fraser Institute talking points? I heard them all at this point.
Posted by TheOriginalHillWilliam on April 7, 2008 at 01:24 PM
===================================================
William, it's older than that. The Republicans were hostile towards it even in the New Deal era. Reagan actually did alot to undermine Truman's proposal. Yes, the good ole gipper was hired to run adverts screeching about "socialism". Oh how horrible that people would have health care coverage ... yes, socialism how scary ...
The GOP should make everyone ill.
Is this success?
Rocket attacks on the Green Zone killed 2 US troops on Sunday. Guerrillas killed another with rockets aimed at the Rustamiya base, where Iraqi cadets are trained. Another was killed in a roadside bombing. The fifth died in what the Pentagon characterized as a non-combat accident. But we'd have to know the exact circumstances to decide if combat was really no consideration in the death. If you drive off the road because you hear machine gun fire, it isn't technically combat, but you would not have been spooked if there were no firing in the area.
Shiite guerrillas with at least some relationship to the Mahdi Army have been regularly sending mortar and rocket fire on the so-called Green Zone for some time, but they seldom used to hit anything. One question I hear asked in informed military circles is whether the special groups, which Muqtada al-Sadr considers Iranian puppets and rogues, have been given more accurate rockets by Iran, and maybe some better training in how to use them.
But the Mahdi Army is siphoning off a good $2 bn. a year in embezzled gasoline and kerosene, and it seems to me that with that sort of money you could pretty much buy anything you needed on the international arms black market. If Iran did not exist, would the situation in Iraq really be much different? It is all too convenient for the US to blame continued turmoil in Iraq on Iran, rather than to face up to the real divisions inside Iraq and the Bush administration's role in exacerbating them.
================================================
Petraeus - stop lying!
The surge has failed.
Monday, April 07, 2008
5 US Troops Die in Iraq;
Heavy Fighting in Sadr City Kills 22, Wounds 78;
Blockade Threatens Humanitarian Crisis
==================================================
The surge has failed!
McCain has failed.
I won't post the text but read here about McCain's temper tirades:
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/McCain_temper_boiled_over_in_92_0407.html
This man is unsuitable to be a President.
Back to Health Care:
In order to move health care in the correct direction, two things that we must do is eliminate waste and allow only those worthy of receiving wages to do so.
First, eliminate waste. I define waste in a business environment as - anything other than the minimum amount of resources to produce a quality product.
The insurance companies add a garbage truck load of paperwork to the system. Most of it dealing with, what they cover, what they don't cover, what doctors they cover, how much they will pay, how much they won't pay, what treatment THEY believe the patient needs, etc, etc,. This is the first waste that needs to go away. For the amount that insurance companies pay on paper work, they could cover and pay for many more operations or procedures that they currently do not.
Next, is the premise - that it is immoral and unethical for individuals and/or entities to make a profit from the sick and injured that have nothing to do with the health or the care of the sick or injured.
The Hospital administrators, doctors, nurses, technicians, secrateries, janitors, and any other position that makes a hospital or clinic run, have a right to earn a good wage. But also do the pharmiceudical companies, researchers, medical equipment and distribution companies.
And it is debatable whether these companies and hospitals should be able to make profits. I do see them making money for reinvestment into research, expansion, new processes, etc.
I personally, using my definition above, believe that insurance companies provide a positive contribution to the health or the care of any of the sick or injured. If you are not part of the solution then you are part of the problem. The insurance companies are a BIG part of the problem, and in my mind must be eliminated.
Looking at doing the correct thing would be to move to a single payer, not-for-profit healthcare system and still provide funding for science and technology research to keep improving our system and overall health care.
This can all be done, not through the government but through entities like the AMA or CDC to keep it in the private sector and dramatically reduce healthcare costs while maintaining a high quality of service and technological advances.
RJ,
How much of that embezzled gas and oil ya think is still showing up in Houston? Record Exxon/Mobil profits, indeed. Betcherass even though they got busted fencing stolen oil before doesn't mean they stopped doing it. Funny how the story soon scuttled, wudnit.
Mr Bubble Gteemspan endorsed McSame:
MADRID (Reuters) - There is more than a 50 percent chance the United States could go into recession, former Federal Reserve chairman Alan Greenspan told El Pais newspaper in an interview published on Sunday.
ADVERTISEMENT
However, the U.S. has not yet entered recessionary state marked by sharp falls in orders, strong rises in unemployment and intensive weakening of the economy, he said.
"We would have to see signs of this intensification: there are some, but not many yet," he said. "Therefore ... I would not describe the situation we are in as a recession, although the chances that we'll have one are more than 50 percent."
A sharp downturn in the U.S. housing market has led to a full-blown credit crisis that has reverberated throughout the U.S. financial system.
The economy has become increasingly important in the U.S. presidential campaign, topping the list of voters' concerns heading into the November election.
Greenspan, the U.S. Fed chairman from 1987 to 2006, endorsed the Republican presidential candidate John McCain in the interview.
================================================
Maybe Greenspan can come up with a quick slide presentation for McCain on his book. Do you small words Greenspan, McCain confuses easily.
The White House has conditioned further U.S. troop withdrawals on the readiness of the Iraqi military and police.
Posted by Michigan_Dave on April 7, 2008 at 02:34 PM
Dave,
And who says that these are the conditions the rest of us have to embrace?
Al Sadr and the Shiite majority in Iraq sure as hell don't. George W. Bush and his band of merry neocons just don't seem to get it.
Now that they have proved they were frauds and can't produce the results promised, they don't have any credibility. And once they lose power, they have no say.
Watch closely what they are trying to pull at the end of his presidency. Bush is already talking about instituting some sort of "alliance" between the current Iraqi leadership and our military in November. He is going to sign some worthless piece of paper and McCain is going to say it's legal.
I might be wrong, but I thought any "alliance" is a treaty and has to be approved by the Senate. And I also thought such agreements were between goverments not their militaries.
Whoever is our nominee better be on top of this one. The GOP is going to have McCain make this "alliance" another witness test for patriotic voters. We need to sink that boat before it happens with a pre-emptive attack of our own in Congress.
Pelosi and Reid are more important than our nominee in this fight...I expect them to lead the charge.
"Supporting the troops" will be the Republican ralling cry again. Our rallying response must be "Supporting the Will of the American people."
We must stop those who would use our military as an excuse to continue the biggest foreign policy decision in history...of this or any other country. We must be as resolute as al Sadr and his supporters.
It's time to give Iraq back to the Iraqis. And time to give our military a chance to rebuild its strength.
Republicans never trust anyone especially those they can't control for their own greedy purposes. Is this the reason they purposely weakened our military?
later.
Posted by TMH on April 7, 2008 at 02:55 PM
I would suggest that you do some research on what insurance companies actually do. The businesses that I am familiar with provide care management to the insureds, often finding them better care than what they've managed to find on their own. They also promote wellness and monitor the varying health conditions that the insureds have---care that, apparently, they are unable to obtain from their physician.
I know that it is popular to paint all insurance companies as the black-hatted bad guys, but that is not facilitating an honest, productive dialogue. If you work with all the current players in this tangled system we now have, we will have a better chance in solving the problems and coming up with a WORKABLE solution.
Posted by SandyH on April 7, 2008 at 03:02 PM
You'll note from the post that you truly couldn't have a better vehicle for the perpetuation of an endless occupation than "We'll stand down when they stand up", because it will never happen.
Sadr Loyalists are fighting against an occupying force (that would be us) and any Shia/Sunni, that supports an occupying force. On top of that, their effort and philosophy is supported by members of an Iraqi military and police who defect and often turn their weapons over to the Sadr militia. It is also not a secret that Sadr also has support from Iran. Nothing wrong with that, they are Shia, so it's natural.
The Iraqi Military and Police pay good money, by Iraqi standards that is, so they will always find some volunteers who will sign up, get trained, get a rifle and go fight...for a minute. Philosophically, they are more likely to be Sadr loyalist and against an occupation, but ya' gotta eat.
al-Maliki has threatened to block Sadr from being part of the electoral process if he continues to arm his militia's and wage attacks on the green zone or americans. Good luck with that.
Our only reason for being in Iraq (other than oil resource management) is to keep a friendly government in control. If we were to withdraw, Sadr would probably run the country, along with the clerics ala Iran.
International support and sympathy is gone for this folly and to tell you the truth..we're fucked. The repercussions for this will be felt for generations.
Posted by BlueinIdaho on April 7, 2008 at 03:09 PM
Here is my problem with insurance companies. Now, If I am paying them $500/month for coverage, and my employer is paying them around another $500/month for coverage, and I, or a family member goes to the doctor for a $50 visit, Why do I still have to pay $20?
Also, if I do need a procedure that costs, say $1000, whay do I still have to pay $200? Why am I giving these people so much of my money and then they do not pay my medical bills?
Now on top paying premiums, companies are starting up medical funds that the employee can pay into to cover costs that the insurance companies don't cover. The real kicker in this is that if you do not use the money you pay into it in a year then the you lose that unused money.
I asked our CFO, who gets this money that magically disappears and she said, "no, no, no, it doesn't disappear, it goes back into the pool."
My response was "Huh? what pool? It no longer belongs to me, and the money still exists, who gets it?" She refused to push the issue anymore. But my guess is it goes to pay for the shiny, company owned escalade she drives around.
This is my problem, we keep throwing money at them, businesses keep throwing money at them, and now we are creating more accounts to throw money at them. If all this money is being thrown at them, then where is all that money going, if you go to use their services and they don't pay 100%?
Waste - Anything other than the minimum amount of resources to produce a quality product. Insurance companies add a lot of waste to our health care system.
I was a critic of the insurance companies long before it was popular. I am excited that it is front and center as an issue that concerns Americans.
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