Election Results Open Thread
Chat away...
Comments (192) «
...and Bob, how is that possible? Iran and Iraq have been joined at the hip for centuries. It's Shite as is the majority in Iraq. Even during the conflict between Iraq and Iran (which by the way we fueled and supported financially) you would have been hard pressed to find Shia support for that war. Saddam was Sunni which is no secret. It is completely obvious that Iran, as a Shia country will always have an influence in Iraq.Posted by Michigan_Dave on May 6, 2008 at 04:44 PM
You are 100% correct here Dave. But, I would add that it is also no secret to commanders on the ground in Iraq that Saudi Arabians have had far more to do with the growth of Anti-American forces than Iranians have. We haven't heard the media talk about this aspect, or any other aspect of Iraq for that matter, but the word on the ground is that 40% of all explosive materials used in the production of roadside bombs has come out of Saudi Arabia while most of what remains is produced inside Iraq itself. Iran supplies, at most, 20% of roadside bomb materials and, though hi-tech, these roadside bombs produce fewer casualties than the average Sunni produced bomb.
This is a great point to illustrate just how big a mess these Bush types have created over the years in the Middle East. Go back just a few decades and we find relations with the nations of Iraq and Iran going quite well. But then we failed to respond to a changing diplomatic environment inside Iran, choosing instead to use covert operations inside that country in an attempt to end that transformation. As a result, we were driven entirely from Iran.
Shortly thereafter we began supporting Saddam Hussein who eventually took Iraq to war with Iran. Some time after this began, Cheney and Rumsfeld, then with the CIA, decided that it would smart to support both sides. (Iran/Contra)
As you might expect, this upset locals, eventually leading to the growth of Al Queda in Saudia Arabia, where a young Osama bin Laden recently back from another U.S. funded war with Russia in Afghanistan was instrumental. For a time the forces traded blows via covert strikes, which often involved members of the CIA.
Today, as you can clearly see, this conflict has taken on a life of its own. There are so many facets to it that the original players themselves can not begin to make sense of it, let alone bring it to a close. To be blunt, everything that they have tried has blown up in their face.
Yes, the military option has been nearly exhausted and we have not yet begun to use the diplomatic option as we were accustomed to doing before everything went south.
Good evening fellow Democrats.
Obama \ Clinton 2008
Mr. Link, will you provide us with any links to the NC and IN election results, please?
Much of the history I just relayed to you came from my education and training while a Marine. Our Soldiers, Sailors and Airmen are taught the same.
I have a difficult time accepting the current strategy knowing all of this, just as I find it difficult to accept the words of those who consistently deny it. Now, I can't speak for everyone out there but the training I received required that we use the history of the conflict itself as we set out to resolve it. So it is troubling when I look out there and see that this is only being done on a very basic level, with the small unit commander who is looking for a way to adapt his tactics to defeat those of his enemy.
In the end I guess what I am saying is that I am entirely unsatisfied with the orders that have come done from above. And while it is true that Bush is behind this, it must also be said that others have contributed to this misunderstanding simply becuase they themselves were not as well informed as they should have been. This included leaders from both political parties who supported our initial invasion of Iraq, apparently taking it for granted that momentum would follow us from Afghanistan, where most inhabitants of the Middle East supported our actions, to Iraq.
Here I have trouble, regardless of whether that individual responsible for authorizing the conflict believed the lies told about WMD or not. I have trouble because the decision itself was made without any apparent consideration for how the mission in Iraq would play into the overall strategy. I have trouble because it was apparent from the start that those authorizing the war hadn't even thought to ask themselves how any of this was going to play out.
This is also why I support Barack Obama. Becuase I've heard what he has to say on the topic and can tell from what I've heard that he gets it. Furthermore, I've heard other members of Congress whom I trust with these matters also speak in favor of Barack Obama and his leadership abilities in this area. And only Barack Obama has begun the process of bringing diplomacy back to the table as he is the only candidate running to stand up and say that he will meet with Iranian diplomats without the same preconditions put in place by George Bush.
Special counsel's office raided amid obstruction probeBy LARA JAKES JORDAN, Associated Press Writer
1 hour, 7 minutes ago
WASHINGTON (AP) - Federal agents raided the office and home of U.S. Special Counsel Scott Bloch on Tuesday while investigating whether the nation's top protector of whistle-blowers destroyed evidence potentially showing he retaliated against his own staff.ADVERTISEMENT
Computers and documents were seized during the raid on the special counsel's downtown office, according to two law enforcement officials who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the ongoing inquiry. At least 20 agents were still on the scene as of mid-afternoon Tuesday.Bloch's home, in a Virginia suburb of Washington, also was raided, the officials said.
FBI spokesman Richard Kolko confirmed that agents with the FBI and White House Office of Personnel Management executed "a number of court authorized federal search warrants today" but declined further comment.
Jim Mitchell, communications director with the Office of the Special Counsel, confirmed the search of Bloch's work area and computers. He said the office was cooperating with the investigation.
"We do not yet know what this is about," Mitchell said in a statement, adding that "we are continuing to perform the independent mission of this office."
The raids mark the latest twist in what critics describe as Bloch's bizarre tenure at the head of the federal agency responsible for protecting the rights of federal workers and ensuring that government whistle-blowers are not subjected to reprisals.
He has been on the hot seat since he took office in 2004, in part for closing hundreds of whistle-blower cases allegedly without investigating them.
"It's like finding out that your town fire chief is an arsonist," said Jeff Ruch, executive director of Public Employees for Environmental Protection, a whistle-blower group...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080506/ap_on_go_ot/special_counsel
I remember some of our fellow posters inquiring about this on the previous thread. I hope this clears up any confusion.
No, not more malfeasance from the Bush Administration? Could it be? Absolutely it could be, my fellow Democrats. Republicans are involved therefore, there must be corruption. One again, I have been proven correct in this assumption. Sunlight is still the best antiseptic even to the darkest administration in my lifetime.
Since this seemed to be a big deal to Clinton supporters earlier, I will post it---
Election Journal broke the story earlier today about the Obama volunteer electioneering in a polling place. The story picked up by various outlets and addressed by the Beth White the Marion County Clerk.
The Obama campaign confirms this happened and has apologized.
“A volunteer and credentialed watcher made a mistake and took a sign into the polling booth that was meant for the appropriate place outside of the polling place,” said spox Bill Burton. “The sign has been taken down, and we apologized to the election workers for the mistake.”
H/T to Jake Tapper.
Russia has every right to tell President Asshole to stuff it up his ass. How dare he interfere in Russian matters. F**K you BUSH! Quit interfering in Russian affairs you MF POS.
Posted by MichaelLink on May 6, 2008 at 06:45 PM
Thank you, sir.
Posted by Johne on May 6, 2008 at 06:53 PM
I can appreicate where you're coming from on this especially since it appeals to my isolationst tendancies however, it begs this question. Do we really want PM Putin reconsolodating the former Soviet Union? We know that is what he wants to do.
Johne
My google won't translate page for me
How do I get it to do that?
Sometimes it does it, but seems that when I go to that site---it only translates headings.
This was just posted on the McCain blog
of course no links sources are rare there
UPDATED: First Exit Poll Numbers: NC/Indiana
Tue May 06, 2008 at 05:57:32 PM EST
UPDATE: CNN EXIT POLLING JUST RELEASED UPDATES FORTHCOMING.
Some interesting numbers being reported.
65% say the economy is the #1 issue.
NC:
*Clinton Supporters who will support Obama if he is the nominee
45%
*Obama Supporters who will support Clinton if she is the nominee
70%
INDIANA:
*Clinton Supporters who will support Obama if he is the nominee
48%
*Obama Supporters who wil support Clinton if she is the nominee
59%
I have to say that I'm kind of glad I'm tv-less these days. Life is easier without talking heads.
Posted by margotb822 on May 6, 2008 at 05:58 PM
NO TV! No Faux News?
No Corporate News Network?
No Neo-con Broadcasting Conspiracy?
No Corporate Broadcasting Syndicate?
No All Business Commentary?
You poor, poor soul.
How do you know what to think? How do you hear the spin and lies that they pin on Democrats?
Posted by highserenity on May 6, 2008 at 07:06 PM
I have to admit that I am disappointed in some of the Obama supporters.
They obviously don't know what he stands for----maybe they are just voting for different, and since the other two are like what has gotten us where we are, they chose Obama
For those people who don't want unity, who can tell me about recreate68?
Posted by Big_Yellow_Dog on May 6, 2008 at 07:18 PM
I do want unity but, I think I can answer your question. From what I understand, it is a group that is politically left of the Kucinich-Sheehan wing of the party, funded by the GOP, to start riots at the convention in Denver to protest the Iraq debacle among other grievances. They have a website.
IMHO, they are nothing more than a front for some wacko far right group and \ or the "Paultards".
To Pam B, Michigan Dave, BYD, highserenity and all of the other moderates who post upon this web site:
This is meant to be humorous satire, nowhere near as good as but like S. Colbert.
If you don't have a sense of humor, you might want to scroll on past.
(I am SO going to get hammered for this one!)
Welcome!
To the official site of the "Hillary Haters Club!"
Don't be fooled by the banner above, this is not the site for the Democratic Party
Mission Statement: To bash Sen. Hillary Clinton as much as possible!
Membership requirements:
You must HATE Hillary MORE than you support Sen. Obama
You must HATE Hillary MORE than you support the Democratic Party
You must HATE Hillary MORE than you do any Republican, including, but not limited to dub, dickhead, kkkarl, and especially lamebrain mcsame!
Posting Rules:
As this is a purely NEGATIVE web site, Never post anything positive, not about anything or anyone - even Sen. Obama
Further, you must agree to ' slap down' any and all positive posts or suggestions (regardless of subject) and never, ever offer anything positive in their place.
(This positive posting stuff must be nipped in the bud and never allowed to spread like the cancer that it is!)
You may not, under any circumstances, point out the value of unity within the party or even suggest unity against Republicans, nor can you allow anyone else to do so. Pleas for unity, and all of those who make them, must be hammered immediately and thoroughly to send a message to anyone who might lurk or even visit here under the mistaken impression that this site is dedicated to the support of Democrats!
Senator Clinton (and by extension President Clinton) must be blamed for the statements and actions of anyone who has ever said a negative word about Sen. Obama, including but not limited to, the kid he had a playground fight with in the second grade and the Rev. J. Wright. Everyone knows that she brainwashes these people, ala the Manchurian Candidate and forces them to do her bidding and those she does not brainwash - she simply buys.
Sen. Clinton must be blamed completely and entirely for anything bad that happened during the time President Clinton was in office, regardless of who actually did it - even the actions of republicans, the main stream media and - of course - Monica Lewinsky, whom we all know was and is controlled by Sen. Clinton. Further, she must be given absolutely zero credit for anything positive that was accomplished during that administration - even if she did manage to do some good.
It is never to be suggested that, whether she is right or wrong, Sen. Clinton's support for a 'gas tax holiday' paid for by big oil might actually be something that she believes would provide a little 'short-term' help for working people while a longer term solution is sought. No, this can only be portrayed as 'political pandering' at it's worst. Never let it be suggested that Sen. Clinton's heart might be in the right place or - for that matter - that she even has one. No, no, on this web site, Sen. Clinton is only to be portrayed as an evil political machine, never a human being with a heart! Only mistakes and negative actions by Sen. Clinton can be posted here. Good works by Sen. Clinton can NEVER be acknowledged.
For Example: It can never be acknowledged that Sen. Clinton has voted with a majority of her Democratic colleagues 97.2% of the time while in the Senate. This fact MUST be obfuscated at all costs!
It cannot be acknowledged that she spent her entire adult life championing the rights of children and women. Her tireless volunteer work, prior to running for office, must be completely discounted as meaningless if ever mentioned.
We cannot allow anyone to find out that Sen. Clinton has actually introduced legislation to increase minimum wage!
Her dedication to ensuring that women have complete control over their own bodies, i.e. her total and complete support of Roe V. Wade, again must be obfuscated!
No discussion of her long standing commitment to extending to all Americans universal health care plans comparable to the health care coverage afforded members of Congress (and her tireless work on behalf thereof), can ever be permitted.
And, (Michigan Dave - this is especially for you!) lest anyone forget,
It was the Clintons who personally (while holding hands on their first date) fired the shot on Ft. Sumpter, starting the civil war!
It was the Clintons (while conceiving Chelsea - she's older than she looks, hasn't she held up well!) who assassinated President Lincoln and then (to celebrate Chelsea's birth) started WWI by assassinating Archduke Ferdinand!
It was the Clintons (while celebrating their wedding anniversary), who actually bombed Pearl Harbor!
And It was the Clintons on the grassy knoll in Dallas!
In short, Sen. Clinton and her husband are responsible for everything bad that has ever happened in this country (regardless if they were born yet or not!) and should be held accountable for all of the ills that have ever befallen the world, the country, the Democratic Party or any individual citizen of the United States.
I can feel the 'hammering coming' so I am outta' here - for now anyway!
Text of Open Letter:
Dear Mrs. Federal Chancellor and EU Council President:
We, the undersigned, turn to you with the urgent request to do anything in your power to prevent a US war against Iran.
Everything points to an impending and extensive aerial war against Iran waged by the United States of America. Studies of the International Crisis Group show that an attack would not be confined to the destruction of nuclear facilities alone. The aircraft carriers Stennis and Eisenhower have already been stationed near Iran‘s shores and according to The Guardian, a third aircraft carrier on its way to the Persian Gulf.
Those three aircraft carriers and their formations are equipped with weapons, sufficient to completely wipe out all military and civil infrastructure of Iran, including bridges, highways, power plants, refineries and water supply facilities.
To protect US warships against Iranian missiles, Patriot rockets have been installed in the South of Iraq. With alarming appeals, renowned authorities such as Sam Gardiner, Seymour Hersh, and Daniel Elsberg have been warning for many weeks against a new war by the US-Administration.
On February 4th three former commanders of the US military spoke up in the Sunday Times to warn most urgently against the disastrous consequences of an air strike. A similar warning was expressed by former NATO commander-in-chief Wesley Clarke in Munich.
The New York Times of February 9 is bluntly supplied some pretexts for the attack on Iran by holding Iran responsible for the death of 170 US-soldiers in Iraq. . . .
The situation today reminds us of the false propaganda during the months prior to the Iraq war. Unfortunately there are no indications that the US president is working towards a diplomatic solution. He declines the dialogue with Iran in spite of the recommendations of the Baker Commission. His continuing protestations that he would prefere a diplomatic solution serve to dupe the American people as well as the Europeans.
It appears that within the political leadership of the United States there are those determined to eliminate the regime of the Islamic Republic of Iran and want to bomb the this country into a completely irrelevant political factor in the region by the destruction not only of its nuclear facilities, but also of all its military and relevant economic capacities. If this actually happens, the entire region of the Middle East will tumble into chaos, which will cause a major threat for peace in the world--not to mention its political and economic effects, last not least also for Germany.
With his insane war plans the US president is acting against the majority of the Americans as well as against many of his own party. In our opinion, there is no political and moral legitimacy whatsoever for any further co-operation with Bush in the Iran conflict since any such co-operation would be understood as consenting to his aggression plans.
Dear Mrs. Merkel we ask you to act because danger is looming. Do prevent this war! Otherwise Germany and the European Union could be made responsible for a disaster of unthinkable dimensions.
1. Declare an unmistakable refusal to military aggression against Iran in the name of Germany.
2. Demand the European Union and its member states to express themselves accordingly.
3. Speak out in favor of new negotiations with the Iranian leaders without preconditions but on the legal basis of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation-Treaty.
4. Stand up for a Conference of Security and Cooperation in the Middle East to begin as early as possible, in order to start the peaceful dialogue in the region. Either there is a common solution for the actual conflicts in the region or there will be a firestorm, chaos and new calamity for the whole of mankind.
Hoping that peace can be secured through the efforts from many sides we remain
Yours sincerely,
Hans Christof Graf von Sponeck (former UN-Representative of the project “Oil against food” in the Irak); Prof. Dr. h.c. Karlheinz Koppe (peace researcher); Prof. Dr. Ekkehard Krippendorf (politics scientist); Friedrich Schorlemmer (civil rights activist); Prof. Dr. Oskar Negt (sociologist); Prof. Dr. Christine Morgenroth (physiotherapist); Prof. Dr. Peter Grottian (politics scientist); Dr. Gerald Mader (peace researcher); Prof. Dr. Werner Ruf (politic scientist, North Africa expert); Prof. Dr. Andreas Buro (peace researcher); Prof. Dr. Mohssen Massarrat (politics scientist, Middle East expert); Dr. Peter Strutynski (peace researcher); Dr. Angelika Claussen (chairman of German section of IPPNW); Gottstein (Honorary chairman of IPPNW German Section); Prof. Dr. Hans-Peter Dürr (nuclear physicist);
OK, so how can some one only get 9 percent of the African American vote and think they can get the Democratic nomination?
9 percent. 9 percent.
That's all Sen. Clinton got in NC.
Republicans get more than that.
Sen. Obama got almost 40 percent of the white vote.
She's done.
Good night fellow Democrats. Keep the Faith and keep the faith. The populist revolution has begun!
!968 was called BY THE OFFICIAL U.S. GOVERNMENT REPORT A:
POLICE RIOT
ALSO 1968 was the year of political assassinations. Just WHAT are you advocating because YOUR "favorite" candidate du Jour (i.e., NOT "black") is losing?
If all you Obama haters and KKK members and just plain closet racists think the Denver cops will fall for your shit, YOU AND Flush are sadly and badly mistaken.
Get over it, Hillary is just about mathematically eliminated; and the delegate pool has shrunken to the point of no return regardless of the spin and "New Math" that comes out every day.
I voted for her AND CAN SEE THE WRITING ON THE WALL. You have been an Obama basher since BEFORE he even announced. ("he ran against Bobby Rush!!!, He smokes!!, He DIDN'T WAIT HIS TURN!!, and when asked You said you would vote for "ABO, meaning Any One But Obama".)
connie, OTOH, is just your basic KKK racist.
Regardless of the spin, it's OVER for her. She NOW has to win over 80% of the delegates in the remaining contests. AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN.
Better luck in 16 years, unless she goes the Mark Penn route and trashes Obama so she can run in 4 years against McLame's successor, when she is only 65ish.
Posted by highserenity on May 6, 2008 at 06:59 PM
That's strange. When I cut and paste, the Russian and English text is intermixed. I strip away the Russian text and have to make some modification to the English text because their computer does a lousy job of translating to English.
bush has been interfering in the Russian sphere of influence trying to dictate to Russia what should happen in the previous Soviet republics such as Belarus, Georgia, Ukraine and all the ____izikans to the south of Russia.
I don't think it is our place to dictate to Russia how they relate to nations in their zone of influence.
Putin has made reference to the United States of Russia which he is apparently trying to set up possibly to include the old Soviet states.
I don't know if this is good or bad.
Marymac, when you come back in, I have no idea why you think I am a 'moderate'. I am a Liberal and proud of it, silly gal. And I do not bash Hillary. I do not believe in it, ever since I watched the hatchet job done on Howard Dean.
Have a good evening, Dems.
The Manipulation of Primary Results
Much like intel on Iraq was manipulated to support invasion, primary results are being manipulated in an attempt to support Hillary Clinton. Specifically, concerning North Carolina, where Senator Obama is the clear winner, first one and then another breakdown of the white vote is presented. And this is done absent a similar breakdown of the black vote, thus ensuring that more results apparently favoring Clinton are presented.
There is a certain amount of dishonesty to all of this. Because, when both the black and white votes are similarly broken down, Obama comes out on top by winning the vote among white under the age of 30. An honest breakdown would look something like this.
Black under 30: In favor of Obama
Black over 30: In favor of Obama
Black women: In favor of Obama
Black men: In favor of Obama
White under 30: In favor of Obama
White over 30: In favor of Clinton
White women: In favor of Clinton
White men: In favor of Clinton
And, as you can see this fair division would go in Obama's favor, not in Clinton's as is the case when only the white vote is broken down further. Add to this the fact that Obama won the state overall and it becomes impossible for Clinton to spin these results in her favor.
Posted by Marine on May 6, 2008 at 08:12 PM
Marine,
You are absolutely right. The pundits keep going over the votes by race. The pretend that Clinton is getting huge majorities in white votes when in reality she is only winning by 55 to 45. And when Obama gets 36% of a certain demographic, they claim it is "a little more than 1/3" But whe Hilary gets 53%, they don't categorize it as "a little more than half".
I really wish they would stop the race-baiting. How many Democrats vote for Obama and how many voted for Hillary? That's all that really matters.
Marine,thank you for the Iraq-Iran history.Right on with the history.That is one of the reasons I`ve supported Barack Obama!We need to stop meddling into other countries business and trying to play it to advantage.Then when we screw it all up we want to blow them off the face of the earth? Diplomacy is the answer not trying to push countries around.War is when you have no other choice.
so what happened in Indiana, i mean besides the nuns being disenfranchised with the new I.D. law being upheld by the supremely supremes....
is it now a BLUE state?
operation chaos: mission accomplished?
Mr. Howard Dean, when are you going to step in and stop the embarrasment in your party. You punished Florida (us) and Michigan for violating your parties rules and we accepted it. Now that the candidate of the establishment of your party can not win a clean victory, your party will find ways for her to win in a less than honorable and dirty way. I will remind you, Mr. Dean, that we the independent voters will punish your party in November if this dishonesty is alllowed. Will your party show integrity and offer us a real choice in the November election? Think, Think and do not underestimate the vote of the independents, especially when the Republicans have given us the option of a center right option. Think, Think
fade2bluz,
If Indiana becomes a blue state, the Republicans are in BIG BIG trouble. IN has voted republican in every presidential election since 1964. They voted for Bush over Bill Clinton and for Dole over Bill Clinton. Not the sharpest tools in the shed...
thanks for Johne, I thought it was just on my end---I agree with you----I totally don't think we have any business telling any other country what they can or cannot do. If they are doing something that can be of harm to the rest of the world or thier humanity, then we must meet with other countries and have discussions with them.
______________________________________________
Posted by marymac_memphis on May 6, 2008 at 07:29 PM
awwwww marymac, you are loved and there isn't much you can do about it!
___________________________________________________
The votes are in and it is unfortunate if those who have not gotten to vote yet feel left out----let's help them not to and root them on.
Counting both states Obama probably has won 250,000,000 votes more than Hillary
It is over
To date in the primaries:
Obama won more popular votes
Obama won more delegates
Obama won more states
Superdelegates, hello, Obama has shrugged off two of the best political machines of all times attacking him in the only way they know how. rove style He did not allow it to work. yea
As a California girl, anyone want to convince me that because Hillary won California, Obama can't carry the state in November????
IN's Rokita: Keep It Going
The following is a statement from IN Sec/State Todd Rokita on campaigns or county election bds filing to keep polls open past 6:00 p.m.:
"Our office has received reports that a Porter County Circuit Court Judge ordered polls in a few select Porter County precincts to remain open until 7:00 P.M. CST. We currently have a Special Deputy in Porter County and will keep updated on the situation."
"Indiana Code Section 36-1-3-8 states that county election boards have no home rule over the length of time the polls are open and cannot order that polls remain open past 6:00 p.m. Rather, the local county court makes the call."
"Counties should always follow court orders regarding polling place hours. But, any voter who was not within the "chute," which is the area or pathway that extends fifty feet from the entrance of the polls must vote by provisional ballot. Those provisional ballots go without challenge and are secured separately from those cast prior to 6:00 p.m."
"Voter turnout is high and polling place lines continue to be long as voters arrive at the end of the day. This is a great problem to have and I encourage voters to be patient as local election officials react as quickly as possible."
"Our office also heard of ballot shortages in Jackson County today. The County ran out of ballots in 5 precincts, but complied with procedural fail-safes and printed out additional ballots in time for voters to cast those ballots."
"We have worked closely with the counties, asked them to prepare plenty of ballots due to large increases in voter registrations, and continue to brief the county officials on the appropriate failsafe procedures to ensure that every Hoosier who has the right to vote may do so."
East Chicago hasn't been counted yet. This could be a long night.
Evening highserenity,
You are probably using Explorer. I had nothing but trouble with Explorer so I switched to Firefox.com.
This does a much better job. Another advantage is that I can open both Explorer and Firefox and send to this blog with one and read it on the other seemingly a lot faster.
Try it. Firefox is free.
Posted by marymac_memphis on May 6, 2008 at 07:29 PM
But I see your true colors
shining through
I see your true colors
and that's why... the similarity sorts of breaks down at this point.
Superdelegates say, we will decide
By Alexander Bolton
Posted: 05/06/08 07:57 PM [ET]
Uncommitted Democratic superdelegates in Congress overwhelmingly say they won’t necessarily back the presidential candidate who wins the most primary delegates. Instead, electability will be very important in their decision.
Of 42 lawmakers interviewed by The Hill, only four said they regarded the primary vote as decisive.
The congressional superdelegates’ independence is precisely what Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (N.Y.) is banking on as she trails by about 130 pledged delegates behind rival Sen. Barack Obama (Ill.).
Posted by Chicago on May 6, 2008 at 08:59 PM
that's a big if, doncha think? did you see the turnout?
that looks like Operation Chaos to me. while i'd be delighted to see a BLUE indiana, i think a lot of those votes were cast by republicans.
we will see come November, won't we?
Posted by fade2bluz on May 6, 2008 at 09:08 PM
________________________________________
Hillary is hoping for a catastrophy, and will hang into the end, hoping for it.
Posted by tylinCA on May 6, 2008 at 09:07 PM
that was nicely done. how ya doin', Mary?
is it peculiar that they're confidently calling this for Hil even though the urban areas east of Chicago haven't reported yet? i'm still hopeful, even though the "party leaders" don't give a shit about our votes.
from Bradblog:
Milwaukee Magazine's Bruce Murphy notes today, that if a study recently done in Wisconsin correlates to numbers in Indiana, as many as 620,000 citizens in the Hoosier State might lack the Photo ID needed to cast a vote there. That, even as the state downplayed the numbers in the SCOTUS case, arguing that there were only 43,000 such voters there. The authors of the WI study were unable to check the same numbers in Indiana, because "the Indiana Bureau of Motor Vehicles would not provide the data needed to do the study," reports Murphy.EP's news release goes on to list a number of other incidents being reported (if not yet by the corporate media) so far during voting today in IN and NC both, including multiple reports of voting machines problems; paper ballots not being offered to voters when machines go down; registered Independent voters being disallowed from voting in either party's primary; or voters being given Republican ballots when they believed they were registered as Democrats.
A few of the specific incidents as reported by EP so far, (which we post along with the usual caveat that frequently the most serious concerns do not come to light, if ever, until the days and weeks following such e-elections) include, from Indiana...
* Multiple reports of voting machine problems, including from a school teacher who had to leave without casting a ballot because he had to get to school before classes started. Additionally, he said the mostly African-American voters were untrusting that the poll workers would ensure their votes would count.
* At another polling place, voters were not offered paper ballots when machines went down, and countless voters left without casting a ballot.
* A voter, previously convicted of a misdemeanor, was prevented from voting by a poll worker. Election Protection provided him with the code provision which dictates that only those convicted of a felony and those incarcerated cannot vote.
Posted by fade2bluz on May 6, 2008 at 09:08 PM
Unequivocally, this would be the end of the Democratic Party. Sure, many would vote for any Dem this election, in a last deperate bid for freedom, but even so, the Party would be tainted. People would either flock to third parties or become apathetic. What's the proper response when you learn that you've been misled about the nature of free elections?
Posted by highserenity on May 6, 2008 at 09:13 PM
hoping? she doesn't believe in hope. she'll throw out more red meat, like the Rev. Wright and Ickes "October Surprise" rumors...
she's a fighter, and she'll do anything to win.
she said it herself. it's one of the things that she said that i actually believe.
Is copy pasting from another blog illegal?
oh well, here it is fyi
Posted at 8:35PM on 5/6/08 by hillaryfan4mccain
I am a Hillary supporter but over my dead body will I vote for Barack Hussein Osama!!!
Please join my site @ http://hillaryfan4mccain.johnmccain.com
I just joined and switched to Republican so it might take a few hours to get approved by the webmaster.
that was nicely done. how ya doin', Mary?
Thanks, fade! I'm hanging in there, pleased by the results, so far, in IN and NC. Is there reason to hope?
Well, highserenity, you didn't HAVE to include the site address. THAT may be against the rules. Ulterior motive?
Posted by highserenity on May 6, 2008 at 09:19 PM
more like that are coming on that website that are saying pretty much the same thing, saying they are Hillary supporters and are now joining John McCain, using Barack Hussein Obama etc.
Do you think this is a sign that they know they have lost? or do you think it is Karl Rove? LOL
DBDB that is not the site I got it from
it was part of her post
what do ya think?
maybe if I cut out the name?
ah, Hilary...we can hardly trust ye. seems like there's a big of a gap on that income big Bubba has been hauling in:
THE DISCLOSURE GAP:
2004 — Hillary Clinton reported on her Senate financial statement that her husband earned about $9.5 million in 2004, plus unspecified income from his writings, consulting and a partnership with private equity fund chief Ronald Burkle. The Clintons' tax return showed that he made $17.98 million that year, including as much as $4 million from the offshore partnership with Burkle, the billionaire founder of the Los Angeles-based Yucaipa Companies LLC.
2005 — Clinton reported on her Senate statement that her husband earned about $7.5 million in 2005, plus unspecified income from his writing and consulting. The Clintons' tax returns showed that he earned $17.33 million that year, including more than $5 million from the Yucaipa partnership.
2006 — Clinton reported on her Senate financial statement that her husband earned about $10.1 million in 2006, plus more than $3,000 in unspecified writing and consulting income. The Clintons' tax returns showed that the former president earned $16.42 million in 2006, including $400,000 from INFOUSA, an Omaha-based company that sells marketing information. He also received $2.6 million, some of it in ``guaranteed payments,'' from the Cayman Islands-based Yucaipa partnership, which invested in Xinhua Finance Media Ltd., China's leading, government-controlled financial and entertainment media company.
Sources: Senate financial disclosure statements and Clinton tax returns
McClatchy Newspapers 2008
We need to improve a lot in the education of our population. We are losing our edge in the global economy and we need to correct the situation ASAP.
One problem is the cost of higher education. We need to make public colleges tuition free. Young people today are faced with crippling debt just when they are starting their careers taking them years to pay off. We need to quit being so cheap and fund public higher education for all. Let's get with it. We are in the process of dumbing down America. Before long we will be a third world nation just like the neocons planned.
I will never get over what raygun did to California. When I was graduated from UC Berkeley, there was no tuition. Then raygun stole the governorship and was heard to say "why should I pay for someone else's education". I will never forgive this bastard or the neocons for this. We will soon be going into a powerdive of stupidity.
"One recent study from the University of California, Berkeley casts the following scenario: The US nowranks 13th in the percent of its population that attends higher education and earns a baccalaureate degree or higher; together China and India produce close to a million engineers annually, while the US and Europe combined produce only about 170,000; and so forth. Recommendations include a set of “interrelated strategies” that include much better preparation for college in K-12 education; building a “culture of aspirations”; and increased college participation and graduation rates"
Good evening, all.
Interesting demographic info coming out tonight. Hillary gets the older and less educated whites...especially in cross over states.
Obama is getting the under 65 vote of both blacks and whites.
One has to realize that most of Generation X and Yers have taken some classes at community college or trade schools. This trend actually began in the 1960's when the first generation of children from working class families was given an opportunity to attend affordable state and local publicly funded colleges.
Many of those over age 65 never had the chance to go to post-high school institutions of learning. WW II and the Depression made it an impossible dream for young working people. Only rich women before the 1960's considered a career. Men had the option of high paying union jobs.
We live in an entirely different world today. In the post-NAFTA era, voters are indeed skewed according to their current economic status and need for more education.
Those benefiting from the traditional safety nets put in place by FDR don't see the same problems as those who are now living in a world designed to benefit foreign multinationals not American workers.
This generational gap is going to widen dramatically in the next decade.
The Republicans can manipulate those older Reagan Republicans who don't feel the economic crunch because of Social Security and Medicare, but they can no longer appeal to younger families who see their opportunity for advancement quickly vanishing.
Remember those demographical groups come the November election. Who is going to be more motivated to vote?
Which group do you suppose McCain will draw the most votes from? The over 65 or the under?
Hillary has been drawing from the McCain base which she surely cannot hold in the November. While she can hold Democratic women in that age group, can she realistically capture conservative woman and men in the general?
So it's all up to the younger voters. If they continue registering, come out to volunteer, and are given the chance to vote for the candidate of their choice, our party has a very bright future lying ahead for it indeed.
I can see us winning the November election with either Hillary or Obama.
But can we afford to disappoint these younger voters and give the Republicans an opportunity to begin spinning their negative vibes on those who so obviously wants to be a part of our party?
Let's give them the opportunity to lead us back to being a national party where all states are purple...or rather red, white, and blue.
This is not meant to imply any disrespect to Hillary and all the hard work and attention she's given to shoring up our middle class white base. She has made them think twice about the Republicans. That is no small task after thirty years of Rovarian and Heritage Foundation propaganda.
And perhaps that is the real story of this election. Voters are looking to Democrats for answers again...and finding them. We will overcome and prevail this time.
Good night, everyone.
Fade,
A lot of the Democratic Counties here in Indiana have not fully reported yet.
Marion, Lake, Monroe are all less than 50% reported, so will see if the gap shortens. But no matter what the outcome, Hillary will hang on like a virus that you can't shake off.
Will say that I voted for Barak today.
Doing fine. Been busy making phone calls and canvassing for Obama.
48% Obama
52% Clinton
with 74% reporting...the gap narrows.
i like it.
Posted by Rob-in-Indiana on May 6, 2008 at 09:37 PM
THANK YOU ROB for all your efforts. And have a little hope, because your Sec. of State extended voting hours and it's getting closer.
I'm glad to see you. Are we to believe that Democrats outnumber republicans by 500,000 in Indiana? Or is Operation Chaos a big success?
i don't know what to think about the turnout...it's puzzling.
fade, IN and NC registered over 600,000 NEW voters this cycle. According to the reports it was 85% DEM!.
Indiana is now within 35,000 votes, and Lake & Porter Counties (Gary area) is still only minimally counted.
I'm sorry to say this, but someone seems to have tripped over their own kitchen sinks, (which USED TO BE made in the USA).
MSNBC just said that Lake County (Hammond, East Chicago, Part of Gary, Whiting, etc.) will announce something at 10 PM CDT. About 6 minutes from now.
I listened to Rush today, and he was all agiggle about OC. Had people calling in reporting their vote, so I think that may have some impact, but there were a few heated local races on the Repub. side that kept many people from taking part in OC.
The Secretary of State was all over the media this morning explaining how, in our open primary, people were free to switch party affiliation to take part in OC without breaking any laws.
As of now, 40,000 votes apart, with 20% still out.
Hillary is on the move to the Campaign Party Central Ballroom in Indpls NOW. Something is up!
Paddy,
i'm aware of how many new Democrats registered, but the margin D-R is highly suspect in one of the Republican strongholds. I mean Indiana. If this is what we can expect to see in November, i'll be thrilled. until then, i'm bitter. paranoidly bitter.
;-)
Monroe County, home of Indiana University, and an area that should go heavily to Obama:
Last Update: May 06, 2008 09:31 PM
Presidential Primary
Monroe County
Precincts Reporting: 17 of 71 23 %
Candidate Votes Vote%
Barack Obama 2,911 67 %
Hillary Clinton 1,435 33 %
As of now, 40,000 votes apart, with 20% still out.
Posted by Rob-in-Indiana on May 6, 2008 at 09:57 PM
i'm lovin' it! thanks
Lake County, which is next door to Chicago, is now not going to be reporting until at least 11pm.
Marion County, which Includes Indianapolis:
Last Update: May 06, 2008 09:31 PM
Presidential Primary
Marion County
Precincts Reporting: 455 of 594 76 %
Candidate Votes Vote%
Barack Obama 84,464 66 %
Hillary Clinton 43,786 34 %
Rob: that's SWEET! this is no 'double-digit' game-changer like her 9.2% was in PA
Did Rush Limbaugh actually impact the Democratic primary?
The loud-mouthed radio talk show host has been encouraging Republicans to vote for Sen. Hillary Clinton to continue the "chaos" in the Democratic race. And a sampling of some key exit poll information suggests he may, to a certain extent, be having an effect.
Thirty-six percent of primary voters said that Clinton does not share their values. And yet, among that total, one out of every five (20 percent) nevertheless voted for her in the Indiana election. Moreover, of the 10 percent of Hoosiers who said "neither candidate" shared their values, 75 percent cast their ballots for Clinton.
These are not small numbers. By comparison, of the 33 percent of voters who said Sen. Barack Obama does not share their values, only seven percent cast their ballots in his favor. Basically, more people who don't relate to Clinton are, for one reason or another, still voting for her. These are not likely to be loyal supporters.
On a broader level, among the 17 percent of primary goers who said they would choose Sen. John McCain over Hillary Clinton in a hypothetical general election match-up, 41 percent of that group came from Clinton's own camp. In essence, roughly seven percent of Clinton support in Indiana (40 percent of 17 percent) said they would defect to the Republican should she end up the nominee. That would be a difficult punch to stomach in November. In 2004, nearly 1 million Indianans voted for John Kerry. A seven percent defection rate would have meant 70,000 less votes.
Well, Evan Bayh, our Republican in Democrat clothing Senator, did not pull Indiana off with double digits numbers for Hillary as he promised.
Lake County said "Give us another hour".
Rob, are all the bars still closed in IN until the polls close? I was at a casino a few years ago on IN Primary day and I was aghast! I had to wait for some stupid election that I couldn't even vote on.
BTW, I would have voted YES on the time change BS.
I loved that as a campaign "issue", though. "Joe Donnelly voted FOR the disastrous time zone change law..."
HUH??
DISASTROUS??? All those morons had to do was to skip changing their clocks ONCE and they would be like normal people.
Those Pugs had nuttin then, thay got nuttin' now.
HaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHaHa
Looking to honor the forty-third President of the United States of America, George W. Bush, the recently formed Presidential Memorial Commission of San Francisco is looking to change the name of the Oceanside Wastewater Treatment Facility. It seems the group would like to rename the SF Zoo adjacent facility to the "George W Bush Sewage Plant."
The local grassroots movement, helmed by "Wayne Pickering," is proposing an ordinance initiative for the November 2008 San Francisco ballot in order to get the poop/pee/vomit plant's title changed. Why? To honor our current leader of the free world with an "appropriate and enduring legacy, for no other president in modern American history has accomplished so much in such a short time.
Presidential Memorial Commission of San Francisco Formed to Honor George W. Bush
They go county by county, so in my county they opened at 6pm, but the counties that stayed open later were delayed in bars/liquor stores opening/serving alcohol.
Rob, I can't stand that Buyh! Another republican-lite.
has anyone noticed a pattern regarding election results in states with closed primaries vs. open primaries.
i'm thrilled to reside in a place where the Democrats determine who their nominee will be.
no wonder the reThugs tried to change that here... more possibilities for mischief when it's open.
this is a win for Obama, since he's going to net more delegates than Hil.
now, if we can persuade the superdelegates that our little votes really do matter...regarding electability.
Posted by Johne on May 6, 2008 at 10:15 PM
ROTFLMAO!
i needed a good belly laugh to break the tension! thanks.
i think it's time for the tequila!
North Carolina (Winner: Obama)
78 percent reporting
% Dels
Obama 56 31
Clinton 42 20
Vote margin: 181,685
The way things are going, Clinton will have won Indiana only because of Rush Limbaugh. That's got to hurt.
And poor Hillary -- the final Indiana results won't be known for another hour or so. If she goes on now and declares victory, and then loses the state (even if it's a longshot now), that would be deadly. But if she waits, everyone will go to bed and she'll speak to no one. Dilemma!
And can Obama's popular vote margin in North Carolina hit 200,000, and thus negate Pennsylvania?
Update: Obama would have to win 57 percent of Lake County to win the state. A tall order, but we'll see.
Wow, what a great night for Obama and for future generations of this country. From what I can tell, in Indiana, repugs voted appx. 56% for Hillary, Independants went for Obama, with a 4% lead, which is sure to narrow after the last big county reports, it is a democratic win for Obama. Hillary needs to give her consession speech tonight. I told my son that Obama has to face some strong winds to turn this ship around and he said, "before we hit the whirlpool" he's 9 and I loved it. Go Obama!
another St. Louis?
MSNBC now says it is "too close to call" and made a note of the downgrade. I did some crude numbers and figured that Obama has around 19,000 vote margin to make up in Indiana. Lake County (in the Chicago media market) is still out. 25% of Indianapolis and the surrounding counties (which are going heavy Obama) are still out. For those of us who remember the Show Me State, Missouri had been called before all of St. Louis City, St. Louis County and parts of Kansas City had come in. By the end of the night, every network needed to reverse its call.
Olberman just said Obama may have been "premature" in congratulating Clinton on Indiana. I agree. It is too early. Hold on to your seats! He only need 54-55% of the remaining vote.
Chuck Todd refuses to call it.
UPDATE: Lake County reports it will be in by 10 pm EST. The Chicago suburbs and a bit of Indianapolis are still out. The difference is 35K votes, which means Obama needs just over 17,600 of the remaining votes to win. There is a 4% margin with 20% of the ballots still out. Clinton is headed to the podium shortly.
UPDATE 2: 300,000 votes out. Lake County (Gary) will not report until 11 p.m. EST.
Posted by Rob-in-Indiana on May 6, 2008 at 10:19 PM
I thought they got rid of that "every County can make up its own time" BS and standardized it in 2006.
Early word is that Hillary is NOT going to drop out, she's going to do a "rally the troops" and "SEND MONEY" speech.
That really does make sense. She is in debt up to her eyeballs and all she has to do is keep on keeping on. If she raises $10 Million and only spends 7 she's got 3 Mill to pay off loans and debts. Rinse and repeat.
At this point it's no different than a pie sale or car wash put on by the local scout troop.
Sorry for the reality check. I'm STILL voting straight Dem in Nov.
Posted by newsjunkie on May 6, 2008 at 10:36 PM
big hugs to your son, the future Democratic voter!
yes, we can!
Yep, she just did the "Go to HillaryClinton.com and give money" statement.
"we've broken the tie" HRC
what?
her lips are moving again. omg.
BINGO!!!
"He will outspend me so SEND ME MONEY!!""
Only took 3 minutes. NOW the hard life "story" comes out. It's too bad she went to one of the top public High Schools (then and now) in the Country and had to be driven there from her hardscrabble life in poor downtrodden Park Ridge, Illinois.
After all, she was ONLY lower Upper Class.
The shame.
this is from Americablog, and i endorse this message.
"Her only way to win is to bring it to the convention."
- Rachel Maddow, May 6, 2008
Oh but don't tell Hillary that. She's on TV right now saying that she's staying in race. She's claiming that she won Indiana - and that's not at all clear. She's begging for donations so that she can stay in the race and continue to maim Obama. Her plan is obvious. She wants to so hurt Obama that he loses in the fall, that way she can run again in 2012 against President McCain, the man she's about to put into office.
Enough already.
I can't think of a better way to tell Hillary that it's over, that she has lost, that she is now simply doing harm to our nominee and our party, than to make a big fat donation to Barack Obama for President. Click the blue box to the left and make your secure donation to Senator Obama.
Remember how after Pennsylvania Hillary claimed to have raised millions, and she and the media used that to "prove" that somehow Pennsylvania "changed everything"? Well, nothing changed. And tonight, Hillary is reeling after having lost North Carolina in a rout (that's ABC's word), and all the pundits are saying that she is in big trouble after not being able to win Indiana by a landslide.
Neither Hillary nor her husband give a damn about the Democratic party. They've threatened to defund our effort to keep control of the US House. Her ongoing temper tantrum of a race is literally hurting every congressional candidate we have. They can't raise money. They can't get staff. Even the DNC admitted that the never-ending nomination is hurting their fundraising, money they need to take on John McCain. It's time to send Hillary a message. Donate to Barack Obama now.
You can donate up to $2,300 for Obama's primary race, and then another $2,300 for his general election race (and don't laugh, someone donated $2300 to Scott Kleeb today via our site). Every dime you give goes to the candidate - neither ActBlue nor AMERICAblog takes a dime. And your donation, and your credit card, is totally safe - ActBlue has been around for years. I've set a lofty goal of raising $10,000.
This woman is insane. No one is going to stop her unless we do it ourselves with our own pocketbooks and our political pressure (more on that later). Let's see how large a message we can send to Hillary. Tell Hillary you've had it with the Clinton lies, the Clinton scandals, the Clinton egomania, and the Clinton triangulation that always ends up screwing the Democrats in Congress and key Democratic constituencies that suddenly get thrown under the Clinton bus of convenience. Give to Obama now. This has to end, now.
Thanks guys. JOHN
interesting
http://www.johnmccain.com/Blog/Read.aspx?guid=fbd286eb-abf6-4c9f-ae3e-3b3f8de062b8
Can we now go after McCain?
Florida, Michigan and Hillary Clinton
We all know that Hillary Clinton wants the vote from Florida and Michigan to count as they are. She does so by ignoring the fact that voters were denied the opportunity to get to know a then recently arrived Barack Obama, but even this is beside the point. The point here is that Hillary Clinton asks for Florida and Michigan to be seated, not just regardless of the fact that voters were not given the opportunity to get to know Barack Obama, but after herself having vowed to neither campaign nor recognize those results.
This is significant because it is yet one more example of Hillary's willingness to go back on her own word. Not even her signature appears to give her pause in this case as she makes every attempt to steal this nomination. So I wonder, can we accept a candidate like Hillary Clinton, who has so often given promises that she can't or won't keep?
Can we now go after McCain?
Posted by highserenity on May 6, 2008 at 11:02 PM
now? you're kidding, right?
i'll never drink the "unity" kool-aid this time. if it's a superdelegate "electability" decision that overrides the will of the voters, i'm out.
on the presidential ticket, only.
but if that's not the time for a third party that represents the PEOPLE, then i'll eat my obama bumper sticker.
this is not the time to test the political will of the voters. McLame and the Straight Jacket Express is not currently the problem. you know what is.
Posted by Rob-in-Indiana on May 6, 2008 at 11:11 PM
Lake county?
Hillary's speech tonight disgusted me.
Posted by Kev on May 6, 2008 at 11:13 PM
is that a 'somebody say amen' comment?
okay, AMEN! this lovely margarita is the only thing keeping me from screaming at the computer when i hear that voice. tiebreaker my ass.
yeah, it's disgusting. she's claiming victory when it's too close for Chuck Todd to call. i hope this is another st. louis reporting moment.
not that she would be embare-assed. she has no shame.
Why is that fat head Pat Blusterbuss an "expert" on Presidential Elections? I don't recall his glorious terms in ------------ ever? C'mon, he ran. THAT must mean something. Right? He's an expert on "winning". Isn't he?
If Hillary lost Indiania she still wouldn't quit. How can more Obama supporters vote for her than her supporters vote for Obama, in the general, when she has levied personal attacks and hasn't missed an opportunity to insult him, our potential nominee. What will it take for her behave with some dignity and admit she has lost? I wouldn't mind her going on if she wasn't so destructive to the party as a whole. This is about my childrens future lady, not you.
WISH TV/AP is projecting Clinton as the winner of Indiana, but Lake County, much of Monroe County, and the majority of Marion County have not yet reported.
MSNBC just said 87% in, ans STILL Too Close To Call.
CNN's panel member, I can't remember his name but he is intelligent and "good" is questioning why lake county hasn't reported any votes yet. He says it is remenisant of the old days when they would hold the vote to see how many they needed. He has been dogging Hillary all night so this is not partisan.
Lake County is:
US Steel plants (miles of them)
BP AMOCO (square miles of refineries)
LTV Steel (all over the place)
Casinos (LOTS of them).
A FEW Union jobs, a LOT of "service" jobs.
Who would have thunk that Indiana would be a cliffhanger State?
Marymac, when you come back in, I have no idea why you think I am a 'moderate'.Posted by PamB on May 6, 2008 at 08:11 PM
What's a moderate?
Fellow Democrats:
It's time for the Clintons to get behind Obama. It's time for the Clintons to put the Party's interest and the Country's interests before their own personal interests. I'm tired of this nonsense.
If HRC publicly declared victroy in Indiana and goes on to lose, GOOD! That small amount of public humiliation my instill the humility necessary for her to realize this election is bigger than her.
Obama realizes that. She has not yet realized that. With the Clintons it's always been about them and never about us.
Second largest county in the state, with Gary and Hammond...largest latino population in the state. median income around thirty grand.
sounds like these folks could use a little hope.
i'm not conceeding yet. not until they count the ballots.
i may, however, pour myself another drink. this is going to be a long night.
I do not bash Hillary. I do not believe in it, ever since I watched the hatchet job done on Howard Dean.
Have a good evening, Dems.
Posted by PamB on May 6, 2008 at 08:11 PM
Pam and all of the other good, liberal Dems that I accidentally referred to as moderates - I am so sorry to have misspoken in that way. I don't know what I was thinking using that term! ;-) Please forgive! I, too, am a liberal and proud of it! I was referring only to the fact that you don't bash Democrats and that you know that Democrats (almost any) are a million times better than any Republican!
On to a different subject, can you believe that we still don't have a candidate - officially! I so hoped that one or the other would win handily in both states and we could finally put this primary season behind us and start working to beat the Repubs in November.
I can't see how it will not be Sen. Obama - barring some crazy set of unforseeable circumstances. I just wish it was over!
What's a moderate?
Posted by GregL on May 6, 2008 at 11:38 PM
sure as hell isn't you, or me. what's up with your snarky bad self, Greg?
nice to see you in real time.
Posted by newsjunkie on May 6, 2008 at 11:30 PM
Yeah, riiiiiiiiiight. Population of Lake County IN
It's taking so long because they are slow and holding back reporting. After all, Corn Cob County counted ALL of their 475 votes in about an hour!!
news junkie
Rudy Clay, the chairman of the Lake County Democratic Party, said the counting of 11,000 absentee ballots is delaying the announcement of vote totals here. Although U.S. Sen. Hillary Clinton holds a slim lead over U.S. Sen. Barack Obama in Indiana, most networks are waiting for Lake County's vote to call the state.
Oh My God! 75 - 25 with 28% reporting, thats some pretty even/odd numbers. He's got it anyway, it's over!
Actually, I think I live in Corn Cob County....the precint where I vote said it was high turn out, at least 400 people.
Of course, I'm in a Republican County, and a Republican Township, and I showed up at 5:40pm and there were 5 6 people ahead of me in line, and maybe 8 people behind me.
Record turnout.
Actually, I think I live in Corn Cob County....the precint where I vote said it was high turn out, at least 400 people.
Of course, I'm in a Republican County, and a Republican Township, and I showed up at 5:40pm and there were 6 people ahead of me in line, and maybe 8 people behind me.
Record turnout.
corn cob county, patrick--you crack me up!
Rob, we can close this thing tonight. i might not ought to have another drink, though, until Lake Co. reports.
come on, come on!
CNN and MSNBC both say 91% of precints reporting in Indiana:
Clinton 51%
Obama 49%
Down to 2% spread, Lake County votes are rolling in now.
"Margin of error counting"
by kos
Tue May 06, 2008 at 08:47:19 PM PDT
If the Gary numbers project out, Obama wins.
Indiana
91 percent reporting
% Dels
Clinton 51 31
Obama 49 27
Vote margin: 19,790
Big wheel keep on turnin'
Proud Mary keep on burin'
Rollin', rollin'
Rollin on the river
doo doo doo
Down to 2% spread, Lake County votes are rolling in now.
Posted by Rob-in-Indiana on May 6, 2008 at 11:54 PM
come on Gary, Hammond!
75% in Lake Co are going for Obama so far.
did i mention that i have hope, although i am bitter?
Hillary cancelled scheduled appearances for tomorrow. That's a good first step. Hopefully she'll consider doing what's best for the Party and the Country and hopefully this time, it won't be an April fools joke.
kphx 1480 will have continuing coverage with Jeff Farias from this point forward.
this is progressive talk radio at it's finest.
from Josh Marshall:
Final Votes Coming In
First results reported in Lake County, 75%-25% for Obama with 28% reporting. If he maintains that margin in Lake County he wins the state. But it all depends where in the county those results are from.
The margin is now about 20,000 votes separating the two statewide.
... although i am bitter?...
Lay off the extra limes w/ those Margaritas, gurrll!
Even if she wins with 2%, that 2% is Rush Limberg voters trying to get their preferred opponent. That is the story - they will also be talking about Lake County.
Tim Russert: "We now know who the Democratic Nominee is."
Updated 11:12 p.m.
By Alec MacGillis
As the fate of a nailbiter Indiana primary -- and possibly the course of the Democratic race -- hung on his city, Gary Mayor Rudy Clay said just now that it might take a while yet to finish counting the vote in Lake County, which includes Gary, and said tonight his city had turned out so overwhelmingly for Barack Obama that it might just be enough to close the gap with Hillary Rodham Clinton.
"Let me tell you, when all the votes are counted, when Gary comes in, I think you're looking at something for the world to see," Clay, an Obama supporter, said in a telephone interview from Obama's Gary headquarters. "I don't know what the numbers are yet, but Gary has absolutely produced in large numbers for Obama here."
Clay said the results were late coming in from Lake County because of the large numbers of absentee ballots that had to be counted -- about 11,000. Under local practice, all of the cartridges from voting machines in Gary and nearby East Chicago are first collected at the local airport before being driven to the county headquarters to be tallied with the results from the rest of the county, he said. He said there were no major technical problems holding up the count.
"It takes a little time. We want to be sure that every vote is counted fair and right," he said. "I just talked to the director out there and they are working like junkyard dogs to get that done as soon as possible. They are taking some time but I told them to do it right. That's what taking the time."
Gary, a predominantly African-American, post-industrial city, is considered a major stronghold for the Illinois senator, whose South Side Chicago home is just a short drive across the border. Smaller towns within Lake County are expected to break in a more balanced way between Obama and Clinton. In 2004, 188,000 voters turned out in Lake County, with 61 percent voting for John Kerry. Clay predicted that Clinton would win other towns in the county by narrow margins but that Obama would rack up huge totals in Gary, where he said some precincts reported only a handful of votes for Clinton. So closely was he following the local vote counting that he did not even know how close the statewide vote had gotten -- a four percentage difference at 10:30.
In March, Clay predicted the race would come down to Gary, telling the Northwest Indiana and Illinois Times that tonight on CNN, "They are going to point at Indiana and say Hillary Clinton is leading by one point but Gary ain't come in yet."
Clay himself was deeply involved in get out the vote efforts this afternoon, going door to door to drum up anyone who hadn't yet voted, he said. A volunteer in the Obama office in Gary said that canvassers who went out today found that in some neighborhoods almost everyone reported having already cast an absentee ballot.
"It was one of the biggest get out the vote campaigns I've seen," Clay said. "It was the biggest get out the vote campaign ever in Gary for a presidential election."
Posted by Kev on May 6, 2008 at 11:59 PM
It sounds like Chuck Todd on MSNBC is making noises that Hillary will hang around until this weekend to raise money and then decide whether or not to throw in the towel.
Pumpkinhead Russert just said Obama is the Nominee and Hillary is on "LIFE SUPPORT"..."A realistic chance no longer exists...".
Hillary is pandering for a VP slot now.
Well, HEY, I'm a Cubs fan. I got used to it for the last 100 years.
So close...so close.......
Wait 'til NEXT time!
BTW, {{fade}} tell the Redbirds to STOP beating up on the Chubblie Wubblies until I can see them HERE!!
Best Summer weekend in town EVER!! Card's & Cubs!! Arch rivals who REALLY LOVE each other!
The first totals from Lake County
158 precincts out of 561 reporting.
Half of Gary, half of Merrillville and portion of Munster primarily make up these numbers:
Obama 27,991
Clinton 9,470
Doobee
Hil as VP? bwahahahaa
Cards & Cubs? that sounds like fun
i am so glad that this damned primary is finally over, even if it's not official
Is it me or does everyone have to back out of the blog to get the new posts? So Dos!
Lake County: 316 out of 561 reporting
The first totals from Lake County,
316 precincts out of 561 reporting.
Almost all of Gary and Merrillville and portion of Munster primarily make up these numbers, plus Lake Station, East Chicago:
Lake county
Democratic candidates
President of the
United States
Barack Obama 46,759
Hillary Clinton 25,100
nice to see you in real time.Posted by fade2bluz on May 6, 2008 at 11:44 PM
lol! Cept for how I keep bouncing in and out in the midst of other blogs and cleaning house, and stuff....
Hoping I'll get a nice b'day surprise and see an Obama sweep tonight....although I already got my best present, a job offer from EDS. Yay for me in this lousy economy :)
Ooh, Rockridge Institute has closed down, btw...but the bloggers and some of the former staff members have a new home at The Big Job, for anyone interested in work on framing. We'll see how it works out. :)
Hi all. I don't come (post) around here much anymore. But I want to raise my glass in celebration! It's an historic night!
I hope Barack starts vetting veeps. NOT HILLARY!
My son is going to Denver in August. This makes it that much sweeter for him!
Hi all. I don't come (post) around here much anymore. But I want to raise my glass in celebration! It's an historic night!
I hope Barack starts vetting veeps. NOT HILLARY!
My son is going to Denver in August. This makes it that much sweeter for him!
Well, have to move to the bed, to watch how this turns out.
Hopefully I'll see Barak win this, either before I fall asleep or when I watch the news in the morning.
16,609 votes apart......
Good night all.
Merrilville and Munster are pretty much working class upper lower / lower middle class WHITE areas. A LOT of them take the train or drive to jobs in Chicago or other parts of IL, and therefore have to pay 2 income taxes.
Something has resonated with them.. Must be ALL the square miles of abandoned rusting factories they see from the tollway or train.
You know, they used to make steel and cars and STUFF. Now they work in restaurants in the Loop and live off tips.
Happy Birthday, Greg!
EDS? you mean they hire Americans? good for you!
congratulations!
it looks like there may be a sweep tonight, all the way around. it's looking good, down to 1,660 votes now.
Heading off to bed to watch the remainder of this, at 16,609 difference and Lake County still reporting, maybe I'll see Barak win this.
Goodnight all.
RoseZ! i'll raise a glass to you and your son. so cool that he's going to Denver! you must be so proud!
this could be the end of this silly season...and a powerful convention!
Fade! Thanks. I read here but don't post much b/c of the glitches. It's frustrating sometimes.
I am proud my son is going to Denver. He was elected Veep of the Massachusetts College Dems last January. The college dems also hold their convention in Denver before the regular convention. That's how he got in.
Oh, and the stinker got Daily Show tickets for when they're in Denver, too! Sheish! When I was his age I was a mere secretary without a formal education!!
Good to see you!
Fade! Thanks. I read here but don't post much b/c of the glitches. It's frustrating sometimes.
I am proud my son is going to Denver. He was elected Veep of the Massachusetts College Dems last January. The college dems also hold their convention in Denver before the regular convention. That's how he got in.
Oh, and the stinker got Daily Show tickets for when they're in Denver, too! Sheish! When I was his age I was a mere secretary without a formal education!!
Good to see you!
Posted by RoseZ on May 7, 2008 at 12:33 AM
(Here comes my Leonardo Di Crapola imitation from "Titanic Bore" or whatever it was called...)
{{"ROOOOOOOOOSE!!!!!!!"}}
The Nuns say "You're going to Hell, just wait 'til I tell your parents..."
It's still me. I was thinking of you today. My "Rock Em / Sock Em" nun deflated today and I had to put her away.
Critter snuck up on her last night, I'm guessing.
Fade! Thanks. I read here but don't post much b/c of the glitches. It's frustrating sometimes.
I am proud my son is going to Denver. He was elected Veep of the Massachusetts College Dems last January. The college dems also hold their convention in Denver before the regular convention. That's how he got in.
Oh, and the stinker got Daily Show tickets for when they're in Denver, too! Sheish! When I was his age I was a mere secretary without a formal education!!
Good to see you!
DPD! The nuns no longer have power -- at least not in Indiana ;-)
Poor Rock 'em, sock 'em! Probably all pooped out from fighting the good fight.
Good to see you!
DPD! The nuns no longer have power -- at least not in Indiana ;-)
Poor Rock 'em, sock 'em! Probably all pooped out from fighting the good fight.
Good to see you!
DPD! The nuns no longer have power -- at least not in Indiana ;-)
Poor Rock 'em, sock 'em! Probably all pooped out from fighting the good fight.
Good to see you!
Thanks, fade...and EDS is only 15 miles from my house. It cuts my travel time and gas consumption down. So in addition to making more money salarywise, I get a bonus by having ahlf the distance to travel.
You know, as much as I can't stand Tweety, I always have to watch MSNBC, because I LOVE Rachel Maddow. used ot listen to her all the time when we still had Air America here. She's much more intelligent and much LESS shrill than certain other Air America personalities who shall remain nameless...oh, excuse me, I meant FORMER Air America personalities.
Couldn't have happened to a bigger bitch unless by some quirk of fate Ann Coulter had been on Air America.
Oh my goddess! What BALLS Clinton has! I just go an email about her "victory" in Indiana. Jeez, when will this bithc learn she can't call herself the winner? This is up to OTHERS, you pain in the ass!
You know what did it for her? It was the Obliterate Iran statement. That coupled with her vote for the war and her vote with bush recently to name some group in Iran terrorists came together for some people.
Those poor pundits must be devastated. They've been HRC's bandwagon for too long -- and unjustifiably I might add!
I wonder what they're going to do now!
Yeah, but when Critter least expects it I'll wind up Nunzilla. (The one who waddles around and waves a ruler while sparks shoot out of her mouth).. Critter always thinks that's a "good time". (Not.)
Hillary has just canceled her appearance on the "Today Show" for tomorrow morning. However, she WILL appear at a "fund raising event" in Washington D.C., followed by a Superdelegate "hand holding event" and beg-a-thon, I'm guessing.
It's over.
It's time to realize that the "Magic Number" is now 161 with only 4 games to go.
Sounds like Hillary is dancing around the fact that she's out of it.
She really should have waited to make that victory speech in IN. Now she looks pretty foolish. I mean that even if she wins by a small margin.
Boy, posting on this blog is worse than it was a year ago. What the heck happened? I get error messages and it locks up.
You can put a man on the moon . . .
Good to see you Rose! the 'glitches' here are a little frustrating, but keep posting. it's really cool to see some of the old crew come in.
i'm looking forward to the convention, even though i'll have to live vicariously through your son--who is officially the only person i "know" who is going
good for him! this young generation of Democrats are what i'm pegging my hopes on. good for you, too! you've encouraged him every step of the way. it seems like only yesterday when you were college bound...
It's on to a bloody floor fight in Denver. She will Never quit. And she doesn't have to. It's HER call.
Like I said before, 2% is the republican vote for Hillary, maybe more. Non issue - we have our presumptive nominee
MSNBC is a TEEVEE station with a staff that is ready to go to sleep, rather than wait for the outcome, which will amount to one delegate:
Post-Tribune reporters will be fanning out around Lake County and filing the latest news from the various campaigns. Watch for updates throughout the evening.
11:30 p.m. Gary: With the eye of the national media on Lake County, Lake County Dem Chariman Rudy Clay defended the process here and the people taking part in it. With 28 percent of the vote in, workers were planing on a long night.
"I want to compliment the people who work here regardless of their age," he said. "It looks like it's going to be an overnighter"
You, too, Fade! I've been watching the regulars coming back -- and the die hards sticking through it all.
The in-fighting bugged me a bit, but then I remember when the Deaniacs (me for one) went at it with the others after the "scream." Man, I still love Howard! I think he has done great things for this party. I know others may disagree.
Yes, I'm very excited for my son. Last summer he worked for John Larson (D-CT) and Chris Murphy (D-CT) at the capital in DC. Boy, did that really make him grow up living in a big city like that! He didn't know anyone there!
We went for a weekend to visit and got the grand tour. We got to ride the secret subway that the mucky mucks (pols) ride from their office building to the capital. Kinda cool.
My son starts Thursday heading a grass roots dem office in New Haven. He is also campaign manager/treasurer for a woman running for state senate here in CT.
She and her husband are both Yale professors. Her husband, in fact, works for Barack Obama as an advisor WRT environmental issues. I've never met them, but it is kind of exciting to have the connection.
Oh, and the woman he works for took him to the Jeff/Jackson dinner in Hartford last week. Biden and Dodd were there getting everyone hyped up over our CT elections. They both joked that they should rejoin the race!
Ok, they've called Indiana for her. Heading to bed now. Have a conference to attend for the rest of the week. Later, all. :)
I can't believe MSNBC let Olbermann and Tweety (I don't like him, but still) go with this hanging in the rafters.
Dan Abrams? What does he know about politics? He's the lawyer guy. And isn't his father the dude who represented Judy Miller in the plamegate mess?
Oy.
AWEsome Rose! That brings me such hope, seeing how well-positioned he is. He's an amazing kid with an amazing mom. Yes, we can!
Good to see you on this delightful night. It ain't over til it's over.
We'll see in the morning.
Goodnight and hopeful dreams!
Yes we can!!
Good to see everyone tonight! I need to deprogram! I was quite worried about this one -- needlessly!
G'night and sweet dreams!
Like I said before, 2% is the republican vote for Hillary, maybe more. Non issue - we have our presumptive nomineePosted by newsjunkie on May 7, 2008 at 01:16 AM
This is assuming that you can predict which Republicans answered the call of party leaders and came out in support of Hillary. It is just as likely that, however, that the majority of Republicans voting for Clinton were in fact motivated by this call, in which case the impact would be significant.
A figure of 2% may in fact be the absolute smallest amount of difference that this Republican tactic could have made, with the maximum possible difference being far greater and the actual difference being somewhere in between the two. In either case, however, this impact is significant as it provides proof that Republicans are having some success as they attempt to manipulate our primaries.
I used to love stopping here to read or post a bit. Now, it's gotten so mean and spiteful it pains me to think these are the thoughts of people who are actually party members.
Blinding hatred for Hillary has chased me away from so many Dem party functions I feel like I lost my party.
I'm going to be 54 on my birthday and this Nov will be the first time in my life that I won't even vote for a president because the "presumtive nominee's" supporters are not people I want to have anything to do with. Name calling, petty, vicious, hypocritical......Have you seen some of the e-mails going around about her--from dems? I would burn their party cards if I could. They talk about Clinton like she's a republican and then they get as ugly as Rush Limbaugh. WTF. Really, WTF is going on?
I just want to cry. So, I guess this is a historical year. The ugliness of my own party chasing me away from campaigning grunt work and even voting is definitely historical.
Everyone wringing their hands about the super delegates choosing Hillary should go bleat somewhere else-- preferably a GOP blog. Who votes in the primary? Maybe 40 million or so? How many in the general? 120 million or more? Primary voters don't reflect well the actual voters in Nov, Bill Clinton lost states in the primary and then picked them up in the general. It's really who's best against McSame and I just don't understand how so many people don't see the forest for the trees on this issue. And, get so ugly to boot.
Well, I'm going to go and throw up now since I just lost my party to hatred and vindictiveness. It finally happened, the GOP stole the flag, religion, patriotism and now the DNC.
Anyone still on? Fade - are you by any chance still here? If so, I want to tell you that - if I got too agressive in 'demanding' unity when I should have respectfully 'asked' - I apologize. Please understand that I am surrounded by Republicans who either can't see what their party has done to them or don't want to. When I see enemies of the Democratic Party every where I turn, I come here to get away from that. That's part of why unity is important - Well, that and ensuring that we get the opportunity to appoint liberal justices. I am just terrified of lamebrain mcsame and what more damage he will do to the country if we give the neo-cons even the smallest opening. I hope that you can understand that, while my actions may not have been perfect, my motives were.
In any case, I am thrilled that we esentially have a candidate. The two candidates and their respective operations are now negotiating for concessions. I pray God that by weeks end, we will be united.
I often look to PamB for advice and info on matters. Maybe I could ask you some questions about activisim sometime?
I really am a liberal and I can prove it - I've been on this blog advocating for TVA to be expand into big oil and gas providers and retail outlets! You probably know that TVA is a government owned corporation formed by FDR to keep private owners from price gouging for electricity.
Anyway, can we be - if not friends - fellow supporters of Sen. Obama, together on this blog.
I used to love stopping here to read or post a bit. Now, it's gotten so mean and spiteful it pains me to think these are the thoughts of people who are actually party members. Blinding hatred for Hillary has chased me away from so many Dem party functions I feel like I lost my party.Posted by Kay-Wisconsin on May 7, 2008 at 02:11 AM
Kay,
It is not hatred that you are seeing, but the determination of those who wish to see this nation taken in a new direction and don't believe that Hillary Clinton is the best candidate to do that. You can blame her support for the Iraq war, her kitchen sink tactics, and her many mistatements for this, but certainly not hatred.
I suggest that, instead of coming straight out with these insinuations, that you take a moment to listen to the arguments begin made by those supporter our frontrunner. They do so for a reason, and they may hold ideals that are much closer to your own than you realize at the moment.
Posted by Kay-Wisconsin on May 7, 2008 at 02:11 AM
Kay, I understand your frustration but I am praying that it is about to end. It appears that Sen. Obama has the nomination. Once that happens, some of the bitterness will end and the 'hate posts' against either candidate will go away. We must all realize that Sen. McCain means four more years of Bush and his idiotic policies. We can not afford to give any ground that might allow them to have the opportunity to appoint Supreme Court Justices. There are way too many crucial rulings that will be challenged in the coming years. We need balance on the court.
That is why any Democrat is a million times better than McLame. Please consider all of the benefits of party unity. Even if you can't unite behind the candidate, can you unite against the Republicans who have wrought so much damage? I for one will be voting Democratic in November, regardless of the nominee. I hope that you will too.
Hi, Kay. Mebbe that feeling is the "wurst" of all. (HA HA, local snausage joke fer ya.)
Let's face it, there is nothing any ONE person can do now, except Hillary. It's up to HER whether she quits or not.
Stick around, there are still people pissed off because Dewey didn't beat Truman.
As was writ, "The fault is not in the stars, but in ourselves".
She has the rookie disease of owning the PR company and simultaneously reading her reviews. That kind of thinking got us "Caddyshack II".
Posted by Marine on May 7, 2008 at 02:21 AM
We don't see eye to eye on much, but I loved your post about the msm and the 'breaking down' of polling numbers. Next, are they going to break it down between blonds, brunettes and red heads? That would make about as much sense.
The numbers that matter are the number of Democrats who voted and for which candidate they voted. Period.
Actually, the numbers that count are the DELEGATE TOTALS.
PERIOD.
DBDBD: I wish I had you and some other Democrats at my house tonight. We had dinner guests who just moved back here from Ohio, where his mfg. job was sent to China. They took his retirement and their life savings and invested in a small business. In an effort to keep the business going, they used the kids college funds and then took a heloc mortgage on their house. They lost everything and had to move in with his parents and her husband got the only job he could get, which was delivering pizzas!
His father had a heart attack, but made too much for medicaid and at 62 couldn't get medicare. He was in the hospital for 9 days - two of them in intensive care. Medical Bankruptcy. They now live with their daughter in Kentucky.
My ??friend?? and her husband along with their two teenage kids now live here (with her parents) and he works for her brother.
When they told me this story, I made some comment about hating Bush and the neo-cons for paying companies to take jobs away from Americans and give them to China.
The husband agreed with me and then said, but, what are you gonna' do. I hate the damn Republicans but voting for the Democrats is voting for the n.(slur for African/American)....... party. My head nearly exploded. My husband quickly changed the subject and I went upstairs and ate the Xanax. They've been gone 2 hours and I'm still shaking I'm so angry. Needless to say, they will never be invited to my home again!
She's done. She's cancelled all of her public appearences for tomorrow. No doubt for time to try and rationalize if there isn't any other rule she can bend, asses she can kiss, arguement she can put together, or more likely, mapping out a face saving exit strategy by coasting along and ending on a win in WV or KY or both.
She has almost no credible path now. Obama opened up a big enough lead he could even withstand adding in Florida and Michigan as they stand. (Probably be part of her exit strategy barter)
But rest assured, ding - dong the witch is dead (as a canidate).
DELEGATE TOTALS.
PERIOD.
Posted by Doo-Bee-Doo-Bee-Doo on May 7, 2008 at 02:32 AM
True - hadn't really thought about it that way. I don't see any way that Sen. Obama looses this nomination. I'm willing to bet that the two camps are negotiating for positions and concessions - at least I hope that's what is happening.
Posted by marymac_memphis on May 7, 2008 at 02:52 AM
mary, when I go to Michigan I ALWAYS take the "scenic route" and I tour through Hammond and Gary and Benton Harbor and other DEAD (that is spelled E.X.T.I.N.C.T.) cities along the way. Memphis is just like Gary, only more humid. Empty buses running down empty streets. That Tom Cruise movie cracked me up. I was IN the "Cotton Exchange" right after he did his famous "crowd / chase / escape" scene. When I saw the movie I thought "Where did all the people come from?"
I walked down the middle of Union St. at 5PM on a Friday and I didn't see anything other than one of those empty extra long "bend in the middle" bus things. So, without further ado....
Here is MY plan to fix the USA:
Under the mandate of "Homeland Security" ALL Federal Cabinet Departments MUST NOT be located in a centralized area such as D.C.
Memphis gets the newly created Department of Federal Emergency Management (Centrally located, FedEx hub, major airport DEAD town that needs the labor force making good bucks).
Detroit = Dep't of Labor, for obvious reasons.
Kansas City gets Agriculture, for obvious reasons
NOLA gets Corps of Engineers, for SEVERAL obvious reasons
Transportation goes to St. Louis for obvious reasons
Interior goes to whichever city needs an influx of about 20,000 new residents within 5 years. (Boise? Denver?...)
The point is that there is NO WAY that the ENTIRE Government should be located within the Beltway. And as a bonus, all these dying or dead cities will get educated semi well paid Government workers to go DOWNTOWN to work every day. That will generate restaurants and later on bars and within 2 years HOUSING in the Central City areas.
The ONLY hard and fast rule is that the Department offices MUST be downtown, NOT in some suburban office park.
It'll work with virtually ZERO out of pocket expenditure.
Bonus for real estate owners who fix up those cool Art Deco buildings.
What is the downside? Fix the inner cities, provide secure employment, stimulate retail and service jobs, provide public transportation and SAVE MONEY while de-centralizing the entire Government!
When I rule the world, it WILL happen.
THAT is my first stab at MY "New Deal" TVA / CCC / WPA etc. programs. The rest is gravy.
The following is a post that Esmeralda tried to make at 5:00AM this morning and it failed. Let's see if it works now. She asked me to try.
"Good morning, everyone.
Finally! A full nights peaceful rest.
Anyway, HC's "win" of 23,000 votes is still unofficial. With the "new & improved" i.d requirements, I'm sure there are thousands upon thousands of provisional ballots just waiting on voters to show up at their county board of elections to provide i.d. within a certain timeline so that those ballots would count.
A well managed campaign would know what to do. Enough said.
Morning Doo Bee,
We need the "New Deal" now more than ever. The way I figure it, the Republic Depression of 2009 will hit next year. What has been going on since last year is exactly how the Republic Depression of 1929 played out starting in the mid 1920's. Then they can blame it on Obama. All repukes are snakes and the need to be severely castigated.
Bring back the Civil Works Administration (CWA), the Works Progress Administratin (WPA), and the Public Works Administration (PWA).
Give people jobs building infrastructure, schools, hospitals, parks, water and sewer systems, parks, dams, skyscrapers ala the Empire State Building, airports and ad infinitum.
This government is OURS and not the neocon party or the corporations. Speak truth to power and take our government back.
Posted by marymac_memphis on May 7, 2008 at 02:52 AM
your story reiterates the reason why pandering to these voters is abhorrent. they are not the majority they once were. the kitchen sink strategy is a refined southern strategy--but the upside is that there are more young voters who are truly post-racial in their world view.
we have succeeded in terms of getting out the vote and it will be very difficult for the racist element to be complacent. they will tip their hand.
we don't need them to win.
Morning Pam, Kathy, and Essie,
God is on our side and not on bush's or the neocons side. Why then doesn't he/she strike them with lightning. All at once now, Zap!
I am off to work while it is still there. I AM wondering how the corporations are going to send my job to China or India. I know, they can set up two-way video cameras on a project and the project observer can watch it on television and comment accordingly.
Johne and Doobie,
The new new deal will be revolving around the energy sector with green-collar jobs. i like patrick's ideas about downtowns throughout the nation, which would decentralize government agencies. transportation infrastructure (for those who need light rail) would generate a whole range of employment, and converting recycled trash and animal pond waste to ethanol is not too far from reality.
do we have the political will to insist on the infrastructure project that our future depends upon? i think so.
we have been neglected for too long. it's time the people were, once again, the focus of the policy-making. but FDR didn't start out on that track, the political will drove his decisions.
that's our job.
and it looks like the fundraising pleas have turned ugly:
NRCC Chief: Anyone Who Doesn't Give Us Campaign Cash "Ought To Be Ashamed"
By Eric Kleefeld - May 6, 2008, 5:02PM
The GOP effort to win House seats is so strapped for cash that its leader has now taken to scolding members to get them to cough up donations. In the wake of their defeat this past weekend in Louisiana, NRCC chair Tom Cole reportedly told a conference meeting today that anybody not donating for next week's Mississippi election "ought to be ashamed of themselves."
Very few of them have given to Mississippi GOP candidate Greg Davis, nor did many of them give to Woody Jenkins in Louisiana. By contrast, new Louisiana Congressman Don Cazayoux (D-LA) was able to raise over $160,000 in direct donations from the House Dems, and he and Mississippi candidate Travis Childers have both been helped immensely by the DCCC's financial advantages.
have a wonderful day, y'all
i'm looking forward to hearing from the SuperDelegates today. i think we'll see some movement to close the deal and focus on the general.
keep it lit~
Posted by fade2bluz on May 7, 2008 at 08:29 AM
I'm so happy I don't have the words to express it!
Obama will squash the mental pygmy in the fall'
If McCain get on the same platform with Obama, the difference in intellect, the difference in judgment and the vast difference in vision for this country will send McCain back to Ariz to lick his wounds and ask, "Did anyone get the license number of that big truck that ran over me?"
Hi Y'all! To my surprise (and pleasure) my whole famdamily turned out to vote for Senator Obama by yesterday evening. (I and a few cousins voted early.) It's exhilirating to see such support for a good man and a fine candidate.
So, nu, what's up with the new thread? I see 6 comments on the title page, but when I go into the thread, it says "0 comments".
Just WHAT are you advocating because YOUR "favorite" candidate du Jour (i.e., NOT "black") is losing? ...connie, OTOH, is just your basic KKK racist... Regardless of the spin, it's OVER for her. She NOW has to win over 80% of the delegates in the remaining contests.
Posted Doo-Bee-Doo-Bee-Doo May 6, 08 at 07:59 PM
What are you talking about? You can't go a whole day without insults or playing the race card?
How dare you accuse me of supporting re68!
How dare you call me and Connie racists!
How dare you play the race card when I merely ask a question about something I heard on the radio.
How dare you take a simple question I post, and attack me with charges of racism.
Once again, you show your manipulative and nasty tactics very well. Congratulations, you get the "Race-card player award" of the week.
You are a vicious person. You undermine the message of Sen. Obama. Sorry you are HOPELESS.
Posted by TheOriginalHillWilliam on May 7, 2008 at 09:57 AM
Heydere, Rev. Just post a comment and you will get in and then it's just like "normal". C&P what you just posted if you like.
Hillary keeps saying If. If we ran our primaries like the republicans, we don't. If, If, If, If, If, The supers must move now. America has shown we are awake now and we recognize pandering and we won't be fooled again. Let's end it now, Obama took the high road and NC and IN responded to it. Do it now before hillary burns down the party. The moment is now everyone can feel it - move!
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