Sunday Open Thread
Chat away...
Comments (204) «
Good morning. What a wonderful feeling to wake up knowing that shortly the presidummie will be back to riding his tricycle, eating pretzels and drinking near beer while the country is run by a person with brains.
Ok, that is annoying. I REALLY hate being over on the old thread when there is a new one.
Reposts from last thread:
SandyH on November 16, 2008 at 01:09 AM
Responsibility, fiscal included, plays a much more important role in a progressive worldview than it does in a conservative worldview. I mean, look at the "responsibility" of conservative up to this point. We have a military occupation in two separate countries costing us $11 billion dollars a month. We have a financial market that ran completely out of control into a complete meltdown because no one took responsibility for their actions. We have an infrastructure that is crumbling away because conservatives have gutted the departments RESPONSIBLE for that infrastructure. WE have an administration which constantly uses the words "NO one could have foreseen THAT". Corruption and scandal, and it is always the fault of someone else. It's just a few bad apples.
Well, it's NOT just a few bad apples. It's the result of looking at the world as if those in charge can do no wrong.
159
GregL on November 16, 2008 at 10:11 AM
Pam, I have nothing against reaching across the aisle to get things done. Progressive Democratic politicians need to reach out to Republicans who they can work with to get work done on issues. The thing people like chASSIE don't seem to understand is, reaching across the aisle does not mean compromising your principles, it means finding people on the other side who want the same thing you do.
160
GregL on November 16, 2008 at 10:29 AM
Of course, you also have to find, or convince, people on your OWN side that an idea is worth time and consideration.
Esme, I have nothing against Blue Dogs, most of them are more progressive than they think they are. It's just that the past forty years of having asshole conservatives define what it means to be liberal and progressive has undermined real progressivism.
161
GregL on November 16, 2008 at 10:44 AM
104 chassie on November 15, 2008 at 09:22 PM
Chassie, this post poses a fascinating hypothetical and I must say that my friends and I have posed that hypothetical as a philosophical game on many social occasions.
But we would post the question in these terms.
If Hitler's baby were left on your doorstep what would you do? Would you kill it or would you raise it or would you pawn off the problem on someone else doorstep?
Now granted, the troll is nowhere near reaching the level of insanity that Hitler reached. But the concept is the same.
.....................
In the case of Hitler:
This is a dilemma because no matter how you answer the question, you are either a baby killer, a Hitler/Nazi sympathizer or a coward for not taking responsibility for a serious dilemma.
........................
In the case of the Sally:
My guess is you are championing the case for bi-partisan cooperation and using Sally as the basis for your position.
If Sally were my neighbor and his house was burning down and I had the ability to save him, of course I would and I believe that many on this blog would to.
However,
I'm certainly not betting the farm that Sally would do the same.
And more specifically, as someone on this blog who has either been banned or whose posts have been erased because I engage with the trolls more than the other bloggers would prefer,
Sally has clear history of passive/aggressive behavior on this blog and he isn't above using your sympathy as a way to create a wedge with you and other bloggers here.
Esmeralda used to stick up for him all the time and you should notice how he treats her.
.......................
As far a republican bi-partisan cooperation is concerned in regards to the Obama Administration,
When the republicans were in control, there was only unilateral, "go at it alone", "if your not with us your a terrorist", cowboy diplomacy.
Now that the Democratic Party is in control, bi-partisan behavior is what everyone wants.
But bi-partisan behavior doesn't come without it's caveats.
"It takes two to tango."
"If you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours."
"Who willing to offer the olive branch first."
Clearly the Democratic Party holds the leverage and any effort at bi-partisan cooperation can be taken away just as fast as it was given.
With the republican party, bi-partisan cooperation is mandatory because they no longer have any political leverage, at least for the next four years.
Obama has many republicans on his side (Colin Powell, Chuck Hagel, not to mention the many ex-republicans like Jim Webb).
My point is, everyone here knows I'm a registered Independent, and as an Independent it is my opinion that the Democratic Party has done more than their fair share of reaching across the aisle.
I believe the republicans past partisan behavior is why they are in this current mess in the first place.
With the republican party, bi-partisan cooperation is mandatory because they no longer have any political leverage, at least for the next four years.YayObama on November 16, 2008 at 10:58 AM
You know there's another election in 2010, right? And that what happens during this next session of Congress could help determine the outcome of THAT election and who will control Congress?
That being said, as I stated above and on the last thread, finding common ground is more a function of finding those Republicans and Democrats who basically agree in certain areas and working with them to get the legislation we want passed. Are we going to have to compromise a bit on the actual methods? Certainly. Should we compromise on the underlying values? Never.
Good morning, all.
gregg on November 16, 2008 at 10:22 AM
Maybe Spunky can party with our resident German troll...
TODAY IN HISTORY
1811 There's a whole lot of shakin' going on when an earthquake in Missouri of all places causes the Mississippi River to flow backwards. The quake is traced to a fat lib in a Speedo doing belly flops.
The_Evil_Dr*Burd on November 16, 2008 at 04:24 AM
For a foreign worker staying in this country on a work visa you certainly derive a lot of satisfaction from ridiculing Americans facing potential catastrophic suffering. Your continued crude remarks indicate that you know nothing about OUR history, geography, geology, or sense of unity in times of crisis.
That was the largest earthquake in recorded history in North America deep within slave territory and was caused by the shifting of two massive continental plates. Its force shook church bells in Boston.
If it had occurred today, it would have flatten Memphis and large portions of Nashville, Little Rock, Louisville, St. Louis, Huntsville, and Oklahoma City much like those Category 4s took out New Orleans and Galveston.
So you think this event was funny? Geologists say we are way overdue for another earthquake of that magnitude in the heartland of this nation.
Your continued arrogance and lack of even the most basic of knowledge continues to undermine everything you say here. You're a No Nothing Republican with that unique compassionate Katrina conservatism for the plight of others.
It’s way past time you returned to Germany to compete with cheap Middle Eastern and African labor in Europe. Take your multinational philosophy with you and see how well it works for you there.
GregL,
The election in two years would have to yield a landslide for the republicans in order to change the majority of power.
That would mean the American voter in 2010 would have to be extremely dissatisfied with the what happens in the next two years.
I don't believe the republicans should be counting on that.
...................
But aside from partisan politics,
Ultimately, whatever works....works.
1) Obama's job is implement policies that fix the current mess.
2) He has vowed to understand those who did not vote and support his presidency during the election.
But these two dynamics are not one in the same.
..................
Obama has already reached across the aisle when many Republicans endorsed his election.
Obama has many Republicans who are more than happy to work with him.
The Democratic Party majority in Congress only helps keep the republicans from their 8 year history of "partisan/divisive nature".
If the republicans start filibustering legislation because for ineffective ideological and partisan reasons, then I don't anticipate not do I bet any change in Congressional power in 2010.
GregL,
I suspect that we are incomplete agreement.
I'm just reading and writing about politics as an exercise to help me better develop my beliefs about what's going on.
GregL on November 16, 2008 at 10:47 AM
I have no problem with your analysis. The GOP does indeed think they can do no wrong....but history has proven otherwise.
Their conservative ideology doesn't work because it's basically flawed by allowing Republicans with no moral conscience to exploit others. Conversely, liberals have always exercised fiscal responsibility when conditions indicated it was necessary...while keeping our pledge to further equal opportunity for all.
Conservatives are too corrupt to put into practice what they preach...and don't really subscribe to it anyways.
bbl
GregL,
The issue of bi-partisan cooperation is a double edges sword.
The reason republicans were swept out of power is because their policies are incompetent and partisan.
Why would anyone want to cooperate with republican incompetence?
GregL,
But there is one thing that can't be overemphasized.
Obama and even the Congress has already won the support of many Republicans who were disenfranchised by the extreme right.
Obama was endorsed by many Republicans during the election.
And there were House Representatives and Senators who ran on a campaign as being able to work with Obama.
I believe that bi-partisanship with the coming Administration is a given.
Oh, my, the far right wing of the party is already lecturing Obama not to listen to those mean old "liberals." Bob Kerrey and Al From are using the same talking points about overcoming partisanship.
Bob Kerrey, Democrat, says Obama faces threat from liberals.
I find it insulting to be called a threat to my own party.
As you know from your medical training, untreated paranoid schizophrenia can lead to disillusionary behavior and misfired thoughts in the diseased brains of elderly adult women. Coupled with the early onslaught of Alzheimer's and dementia, the condition of these poor unfortunates will continue to deteriorate until they reach the deepest depths of madness
conservitive
May God have mercy on their souls.
SWIRLYEYEDOBAMABOT like most of the asshats on here, have no other life.
swirlyeydobabot no why do you copy other person seem you need the hockey helmet more them me i can type just fine i come as one person you come in here many people you need help
where do go when you so much hate in your gut ? why is everybody that come robert you are getting loony
Dusty,
Don't pay any mind to the trolls.
Henry Kissinger thinks Clinton would be an "outstanding" choice for Secretary of State.
What do you think?
Dusty,
Obama is expected to meet with McCain tommorrow.
Obama is being compared to Abraham Lincoln as being a great "Uniter".
Isn't that amazing?
iam dusty nobody else dumbass iam from minnesota like you not nj
Dusty,
Even Arnold Swartzeneggar is saying good things about both Hillary and Obama.
It seems as the Republicans are all supporting Obama.
Talk about bi-partisan cooperation.
Boy, Obama must already be doing a great job.
Dusty,
You are from Minnesota?
Wow, you must be proud because Minnesota is a blue-state that voted for Obama.
Afternoon Dems,
I can smell sour grapes, mixed in with arrogance right thru this smell-o-vision monitor this afternoon! YUK. These trolls were shrill PRIOR to the election when they saw Obama ahead, NOW they are downright girlish in their squeals!
Especially you, MN Thomass! Have you been scolded by your boss for your Racist, homophobic, nasty attacks on their internet lately??? TORO may be progressive, but they sure don't like you not doing what you get paid for do they? There are plenty more balkies where you came from, for them to put up with you!
Give it up, girls. Here we have a Sunday, and not one of you have anything else to do. No yards, No homes , no family to spend time with, no friends, no ballgames with neighbors or friends. NADA. Just big fat zeros.
All you do here, is reinforce how much your guts HATE losing ! OBAMA WON. YOU LOST. GET OVER IT. SUCK IT UP. You merely make fools of yourself now that it is over, and you are still here. It sure makes me smile to see how pissed off you all are!!!!!!! I can't wait to start the 2010 election and flush out some more of the Criminal, Corrupt, Perverted Republicans. Stevens? Chambliss? Coleman? Just another example of what your party is all about.
yayobama why is this trool such a ass hole who is robert that sally so fixated on ? is ths his gay lover
Oh, and Danny. Don't make yourself look so stupid, ok????
"Asked about opposition to the bill, even by groups normally allied with the president, such as the National Organization for Women, White House Press Secretary Mike McCurry said: "We acknowledge there are strong feelings against this bill amongst those who are traditionally supportive of the president and president's party. But the president is determined to make welfare reform work; he promised the American people that we would reform welfare as we know when he ran in 1992."
This was the week's third bill signing, part of the White House's effort to generate momentum going into the Democratic convention, which starts Monday in Chicago. Earlier, Clinton signed legislation boosting the minimum wage and guaranteeing the portability of health insurance, when workers change or lose jobs.
Clinton was one of the greatest Presidents, DESPITE a Republican congress who started trying to impeach and obstruct him from day one!!!!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dusty,
The trolls are mad because they are lonely and have no friends.
Did you watch the Colts/Texans game?
It was real close and a good game.
Which is your favorite football team, Dusty?
yes iam from minnesota yayobama sally is a stain on are great state of minnesota
GregL,
I have no problem with reaching across the aisle, and compromising on bills, but when the only way for Democrats to get bills passed, is to throw in things like Bridges to Nowhere so a Pussy Senator like Stevens will sign it, then the reaching is useless! Once this Republican Party gets back to it's original platform, and gets some decent members in congress, then maybe the reaching will be effective and beneficial. You get your Boners, your Blounts, your McConnells, etc all who wouldn't meet half way on a bill, it is useless.
Esme, I still say Blue Dogs are not needed, not even in small rural areas like your's. It is a matter of re-framing our image, from what the Repugs made it into. Dems don't want to take away guns! Dems don't want generation after generation living on welfare. Dems want to make Abortion rare and for those who need it, plus Dems are for education on sex. ( Not like Palin who says if you are raped, tough shit, you are going to have that kid! ) Dems also mind their own business over what other people do in their bedrooms, and what two consenting adults who love each other do, is no one's business but their's.
So when you finally show the people what the Democratic party is, and that it helps all low and middle income people, then we do not need those that say they must be a Blue Dog, because their constituents demand it. Their constituents need educating and enlightment.
I think Clinton did a great job reforming welfare.
The welfare policies that Clinton reformed were never addressed by bush 41 or reagan.
I wonder why the republicans never reform welfare when they are in office.
It seems that the Democratic Party is always doing what it takes to make America strong.
i see sally dreaming about robert and see everybody who comes as he but iam not robert get that straight iam from minnesota
YES, OLD TROLL WHO SHOWS HOW STUPID HE IS, EVERYTIME HE OPENS HIT BIG FAT MOUTH:
CLINTON DID SEND THAT BILL BACK, BUT BECAUSE THE REPUBLCIANS WERE TRYING TO SCREW LITTLE CHILDREN WITH THEIR GREED AS USUAL!!!
"The president vetoed two earlier bills which he said contained too little protection for poor children, but said this one contains $14 billion for child care -- $4 billion more than the present law"
BBL, DEMS. Time to get some dinner started here.
But let's face it. There is no other news bigger than the possibility that Hillary could be the Secretary of State. I believe that Obama could be a team that would make this Administration extremely effective in turning back all the bad policies from the previous Administration.
i think ms clinton will do good job as the secretary of state
Dusty,
Do you watch football?
Do you like nachos?
I like football.
I like nachos.
wow the giants are really good and now that farve was smart enough to move east out of that waste land in the midwest he and the jets look really good as well.
hey did anyone get around to pulling sally out of the burning house? if not i will get to it right after i finish sanding this one foot on edge piece of teak wood into a toothpick using a number 200 grit sand paper....
The_Evil_Dr*Burd on November 16, 2008 at 12:12 PM
I'm not confused. You take whatever shape you want. I can take the same liberties with your persona.
sally very evil and vile man with no compassion for anybbody but himself if any
he_Evil_Dr*Burd im just one person why are you such idiot iamniot robert or anybody in your small mind to think of
I watched a Wolf Blitzer interview with sarah palin this morning for about 10 seconds before I changed the channel.
sarah palin is as dumb as the troll we have on here she will drive moderate towards us
gregg on November 16, 2008 at 04:53 PM
He's O.K. They threw what was left of his cardboard box into a dumpster where he was heading for dinner anyways. The Evil Dr. Turd has agreed to take him in with the option to buy. Someone really ought to tell that German that we abolished slavery over a century ago. Someone ought to tell sally*.
YayObama on November 16, 2008 at 05:05 PM
It must have been one of her better performances?
Sandy,
Leno put it best.
Sarah Palin has been receiving a lot of letters begging her to run in 2012. To bad all the letters were from Democrats.
All Americans like the Dixieland tune Obama sings...
A New, Blue Dixie
By Bob Moser
This article appeared in the December 1, 2008 edition of The Nation.
November 13, 2008
...Obama, precisely the kind of Democrat who was supposed to be an impossible sell in the South, eschewed such fakery. He looked South and saw not stereotypes but--wonder of wonders!--Americans.
The Senator from Illinois showed up to campaign not just in exploding urban and suburban areas (where he won big) but also in towns like Bristol. He talked--seriously, soberly, in detail--about healthcare, the climate crisis, education and kitchen-table economics. He understood that while most Southerners remain cultural traditionalists, they are also increasingly progressive on economic and environmental issues. That insight best explains why Obama won three of the region's five largest states (Virginia, North Carolina and Florida), and earned the fifty-five electoral votes that lifted him from a narrow victory to a landslide.
And voilà! The wedge issues that had fueled the GOP's Southern successes ever since Richard Nixon became afterthoughts, not obsessions--try as the Republicans did to stoke the same old fires. It was in Guilford County, North Carolina, where Sarah Palin made her controversial proclamation that she was happy to be in "Real America." On election day, Guilford County went 59 to 41 percent for Obama, a nine-point swing from 2004...
Regionwide, Obama won the majority of the under-35 vote from all races. He doubled Kerry's vote among young white evangelicals. He blew McCain away among Latinos--the South's swing vote of the future. And he did it with the same message and same organizing that fueled his victory in the rest of the country. America, he said shortly before the election in another Virginia town, Roanoke, "will rise or fall as one nation."
As we say in the South, it's about damn time.
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20081201/moser
Lincoln may have won the Civil War. But Obama is finishing it for once and all.
Hi, Dusty.
Did you put out the fire at sally*'s cardboard box home? I think he feels we would let him burn in a hell of his own making.
YayObama on November 16, 2008 at 05:42 PM
I don't know. I think a lot of the contenders would like to run against her in 2012 and wipe her out. You could achieve hero status in both parties by performing that service.
My husband would personally congratulate anyone that silences that woman's shrill, snidely remarks....she reminds him too much of a past supervisor who was always criticizing others actions regarding procedures she was too stupid to understand.
I wonder what's going to happen in Alaska now that oil is back down below $60 a barrel? Where are all those $3,400 welfare checks going to come from that the lovely and talented Sarah promised every citizen?
I'm not sure she's going to have a power base on which to stand in 2012. Huckabee is a man after all. The Fundies could do a lot better and they know it.
bbl.
i dont smoke dumb ass sally minnesota is nice to live i have been hinckley nice place
the only asshat here is sally the stupidest person in the world
It's funny to see the republicans squirm now that their lame duck time is slowly dwindling away.
The talking heads are always bringing up the subject of what will the gop do next.
And all the republicans are completely dumbfounded in trying to answer the question.
were these item from your past sally over-sized shoes, hockey helmets and tin lunchboxes l
my past was fine i went to school i was normal but i suspect your had problems in school that you needed the hockey helmets to protect your empty head did the kids make fun of you for being so stupid in school
bbl i have life other then being on here
GregL, now here is an example of why there will never be any reaching across the aisle, as long as there are Republicans. Democrat are for this rescue, Not a single Republican is. Now what is going to happen is, each party member will stand up there for 2 days, each one reiterating the same party rhetoric over and over, and then at the end, Democrats will be forced to throw in all kinds of pork or they will not get a single Republican to vote for it. Story of our lives. See, Republicans KNOW this. So that is why they start out objecting to the bills. Then they throw out the things they want for their states, and they say Add them to the bill and I will vote for it. So all this added pork , all this added millions of dollars==== is nothing more than Republican Games!
Showdown looming in Congress of automaker rescue
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081116/ap_on_go_co/auto_bailout
I am not saying I think we should bail out companies that did this to themselves, but I also know towns where the main industry is dependent on the auto manufacturing and they will have to be re-trained, and financed.
and one last quote from another Great President besides Bill Clinton:
"As a result of the war, corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed. I feel at this moment more anxiety for the safety of my country than ever before, even in the midst of war. God grant that my suspicions may prove groundless." : U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864 - (letter to Col. William F. Elkins) - Ref: The Lincoln Encyclopedia, Archer H. Shaw (Macmillan, 1950, NY)
He sure knew what he was talking about. Republicans tried to destroy our Republic, but luckily the American people caught it in time!
Good night, Dems. Blog ya tomorrow.
Remember to smile when the trolls post their arrogant, boring bullcrap. WE WON, THEY LOST!
Keep the cheese for your own whine, stevie boy! God knows you have done enough of it the last 6 months. Oh, and save yourself the copy and pasting with any more global Warming bull crap you manage to find in old archives. this country can finally start catching up with the rest of the world, and putting in global warming iniatives. God Bless President Elect Barack Obama ! Let that roll off your tongue a few times! teehee.
swirly,
Your writing style reminds me of someone with no life who is angry that the republicans got their butts handed to them by the Democrats.
It must suck not having any meaning in life.
Remember to smile when the trolls post their arrogant, boring bullcrap. WE WON, THEY LOST!75
PamB on November 16, 2008 at 07:52 PM
maybe laugh too. the only one's reading their posts are themselves. it doesn't matter. for the life of me, i can't fathom why anyone would post except to excite themselves to see their writings...oh well, just passing thru. back in the future. oh, by the way, obama-biden won and the demos picked up several more congressional seats. that's an accurage post. off and away. god blessed america!
86
SwirlyEyedObamabot on November 16, 2008 at 10:04 PM
there you folks ... go callin' names not knowing. fyi i'm not a commie nor do i fret, quite the opposite...surprise.
it's ok, since i've been postin' here, off and on, say maybe 5 yrs. now that the election has been decided and the country will move fwd, i invite you to post as much frustration as you and "pammy" like. it doesn't make a difference. obama-biden won, the demos picked up congressional seats, and i was on only one lone vote in a sea of votes. as a matter of point, several large states gave near a 60%.
the only regret i have is we have to put up w/the goof playing president for some 60 days until we america gets the change "they voted for."
so post and post and post and call names. slande, swear, it doesn't change one thing that's been voted.
oh by the way, i love apple-pie, honor our american flag, and love this country.
enjoy slandering "pammy" ... maybe she's baiting you too?
you troll clowns are the useless who dont work should quit asking for hand outs
It looks like the Girly Man has been sleeping on the couch of late...
Schwarzenegger Walks Back Claim That Obama Is "Scrawny"
The Huffington Post
November 16, 2008
On ABC's "This Week," California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger backpedals from his campaign-trail joke that Obama has "scrawny little arms":
"Look, I've seen him playing basketball. He's a better basketball player than I am. But I think that no one should take that joke that seriously, because Columbus, Ohio, is the place where they have the world championships in lifting and in body building every year. And so ... you talk about body and legs and skinny and all -- pumping up, and all of those kind of things. So this was not meant to be an insult in any way. It was meant to be to lighten up the place and to make everyone laugh a little bit."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/16/schwarzenegger-walks-back_n_144158.html
This must be the guy that the lovely and talented Sarah patterns her interview style after. "And so ... you talk of all those kind of things."
Yep, that's Palin.
No wonder Bobby Jindal is saying there is something wrong with the Republican Party...the can't solve any problems and can only say "no" to those who have the answers that never occur to them.
Jindal: Something Is Wrong With The GOP
Nov. 16, 2008
(CBS) When asked about the future course of the Republican Party following their losses on Election Day - losing not only the White House but also considerable ground in the House and Senate - Gov. Bobby Jindal of Louisiana said it is imperative his party offers solutions to voters, and not just be the opposition...
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/11/16/ftn/main4607907.shtml?source=RSSattr=HOME_4607907
But Bobby, your Party doesn't have any solutions. The GOP just creates problems and wants to blame them on others. It's Obama's Great Depression? Paulson came up with a bailout because Obama made him do it?
There is no way the Republican Governors can separate themselves from the last eight years of GOP incompetence unless they want to switch Parties. We don't want them. The voters don't need them.
i think we are really going to like this guy!
Obama Wrote Federal Staffers About His Goals
Workers at Seven Agencies Got Detailed Letters Before Election
John Gage, president of the 600,000-member American Federation of Government Employees, requested that Barack Obama write the letters.
By Carol D. Leonnig
Washington Post Staff Writer
Monday, November 17, 2008; Page A01
In wooing federal employee votes on the eve of the election, Barack Obama wrote a series of letters to workers that offer detailed descriptions of how he intends to add muscle to specific government programs, give new power to bureaucrats and roll back some Bush administration policies...
this really is going to be a new day in america..
i see sally has lots of great ideas for how to further destroy our economy....and they come from two really credible sources, the losers at little green footballs and the humorists at the onion.
not much left for sally to hang it's pathetic little pin head on anymore...and there won't be for a very long time to come.
gregg on November 17, 2008 at 06:50 AM
:gasp: He didn't! Whoa, we lefties better watch out! With "centrist" moves like that, he's just gonna make us all CRY! /sarcasm off
good morning gregl. hope all is well with you. remember the bradely effect? i got this over at kos, it is a letter to the editor of the ny times.
Letter
The Polls and the Election
Published: November 17, 2008
To the Editor:
Amid all the post-election analysis, barely a word has been spoken about the so-called Bradley effect — the bogus view that some white voters lie to pollsters about their voting intentions. Neither have we heard much about the equally misguided reverse Bradley effect, which made the rounds among the pundit chattering class.
Now, it seems that the Bradley effect vanished with Barack Obama’s election.
He got pretty much what pre-election polls predicted. It’s something akin to the World Is Flat Society suddenly discovering its round shape. Too bad the world was never really flat.
The public deserves a more enlightened discussion of what makes voters do what they do and how polls measure their views.
Lee M. Miringoff
Director, Marist Institute
for Public Opinion
Marist College
Poughkeepsie, N.Y., Nov. 10, 2008
Literary agents are queueing up to sign her to a book deal that could earn her up to $7m. (Snip) ''She’s poised to make a ton of money,'' said Howard Rubenstein, New York’s best-known public relations adviser
95Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 02:35 AM
hmmmmm, now I wonder if Missy Palin will make her chosen publisher come up with new wardrobes for her and hubby and all those kiddies, including maternity ones for the pregnant teen! And of course, she will make them pay to fly all those kids to un-invited signings, etc.
She sure knows how to play the system by now, and will squeeze every last dollar she can out of them.
The only way she will make any money on any book, will be to have the Holy Roller churchs make it mandatory reading and sell copies at the Church Door!
the pelican sentors ( the one's who are left ) don't want to help the american auto industry because their states are populated with japanese and german car makers....yup they are in the tank for the axis powers!! so who is a traitor now? anyhow if they kill the bailout and general motors goes under they can forget about any votes from great lakes states for a few decades....it is amazing to watch a party choose to get smaller and more irrelevant. and when those japanese and german plants start closing as their economies go in the toilet these senators will try to blame the democrats...sad but true:
"WASHINGTON—Top Republicans heaped scorn Sunday on a plan by Democrats to spend $25 billion rescuing American automakers, raising doubts about whether the auto bailout can pass the lame-duck Congress that begins today.
"Just giving them $25 billion doesn't change anything," Sen. Jon Kyl of Arizona, the Senate's second-ranking Republican, said on Fox News Sunday. "It just puts off for six months or so the day of reckoning."
Sen. Richard Shelby of Alabama, the senior Republican on the Senate banking committee, called the plan "a road to nowhere." He called the "Big Three" — Detroit's three major automakers — "a dinosaur," and said on NBC's Meet the Press that they are "not building the right products. … They don't innovate."
Shelby's state is home to plants owned by Honda, Toyota and Mercedes-Benz, foreign-owned companies that would not be eligible for bailout funds under a proposal by Sen. Carl Levin, D-Mich."
pam, somehow a book by palin does not get me to line up early at the library to reserve it.
Democrat Jim Martin will be a rubberstamp for liberal Democrats that need Jim Martin's help for complete control of government:
Oh, God, we can only Hope!
Another lie being outed. Remember how they were trying to wind us up for an Iran invasion, because Iran was supplying arms to those who were shooting our boys??? Guess what!
US Task Force Found Few Iranian Arms in Iraq
Morning yerself, Gregg. All is as well as can be expected here.
And top of the mornin' to you, Lady Pam. Nice to see the military contradicting Bush. Wonder if we'll find out the "yellowcake" Bush was talking about way back when with Iraq was actually a Nigerian recipe for "pound cake". :)
Gregg, If Palin does write a book, I assume they will call it "Memoirs of a Loser!"
I am waiting for news of the Sale of the RNC owned Palin clothing . I would love to get that red leather jacket that must have cost about $1500 . Of course, it will probably be too big on me, but It was gorgeous! :)
I love to read the rants and spewing of the trolls these days. there is a certain desperation and jealousy and shrillness that just makes me smile, knowing the pain in their guts over not just Obama, but all those Congress seats. I still am holding out hope for the AK, MN and GA seats! Three more would be Gravy!
Morning to you, too, GregL!
I strongly believe that Obama's cabinet will HAVE to bring charges against Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld, and Rice, etc for the lies they committed. Here is what they cost:
Number Of Iraqis Slaughtered Since The U.S. Invaded Iraq "1,284,105"
http://www.justforeignpolicy.org/iraq/iraqdeaths.html
===
Number of U.S. Military Personnel Sacrificed (Officially acknowledged) In America'sWar On Iraq 4,201
http://icasualties.org/oif/
The War And Occupation Of Iraq Costs
$571,856,158,608
See the cost in your community
http://nationalpriorities.org/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=182
===
OMG, is this right on, or what?? Just look at our trolls, and then read the list of what makes them tick!!!
The Architects of Fear:
“Family Values” Up Close under the Roof of Domestic Terror
By Craig Chalquist, PhD
According to this research, people who favor authoritarian politics and succumb to reactionary rhetoric exhibit a consistent personality pattern of “antidemocratic tendencies and fascist potential.” In other words, they tend to share common psychological characteristics, including some or all of the following:
An entrenched obsession with safety, security, and order.
Rigidly absolutist “black-and-white” thinking (e.g., us against them).
An overemphasis on “strength,” power, and control; a “might makes right” orientation.
Authoritarian submission: a willingness to blindly obey the rules of authorities.
Authoritarian aggression: an aggressive attitude towards individuals or groups disliked by the authorities; bullying individuals or groups perceived to threaten traditional values.
A belief that negotiation, understanding, empathy, and compromise are weak.
A belief in the need to punish those who do not follow rules to the letter.
Scornful rejection of the subjective, imaginative, and aesthetic dimensions of life.
Superstition, cliché-mongering, stereotyping, and fatalism.
A belief in fixed, unalterable, and traditional roles for women.
Secret insecurity when unable to live up to high standards imposed publicly on others.
Identification with those in power, with excessive emphasis on posturing toughness.
Destructiveness, cynicism, general hostility, and a habit of putting down perceived opponents.
Projection: the tendency to see evil, exploitativeness, and danger in others instead of in oneself.
An exaggerated concern with other people’s sexual activity.
Good morning, all.
pam, somehow a book by palin does not get me to line up early at the library to reserve it.
gregg on November 17, 2008 at 08:24 AM
I hear that Spunky is acting as her editor. It will be called "Boy, Is Our Children Not Learning".
gregg on November 17, 2008 at 08:23 AM
gregg,
That's not my take. When those Japanese and German plants in the South go under, the voters will blame their Republican Senators and Reps. There is a growing trend in the South and everywhere else to put blame where it really belongs.
When you are forced by the incompetence of others to live in a reality-based world that the Republicans' ideology insisted must resemble hell on earth, the sheeple can even get it right.
Democrats are the FDR alternative. People in the South will take it. If it wasn't for the wedge issues, they would have taken it a long time ago. The Reagan Revolution was doomed from the start.
Gotta go. Later.
Good morning,
Looks like there still are some rats in the woodwork that need to be smoked out. Invesitgate election fraud and get confidence back into the voting system.
------------
Exit Poll Shows DEFEAT of Same-Sex Marriage Ban!
Submitted by davidswanson on Sat, 2008-11-15 02:16.
Election Irregularities Surfacing Re: California's Proposition 8!
Volunteers Needed NOW to Monitor Post-Election Procedures
Velvet Revolution
The Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual/Transgender (GLBT) Community and its supporters nationwide are mourning and organizing in the wake of last week's announced 52-48% passage of Proposition 8, which eliminates the rights of same-sex couples to marry in the state of California. But an accurate count of the votes may not yet have occurred, according to early indications.
The integrity of an election takes time to investigate, and it's far too early to draw conclusions. However, consider the following:
Around the world, exit polls are used to determine the need for investigation of elections. In the U.S., the National Exit Poll (NEP, also known as Edison/Mitofsky) now adjusts results to match vote counts before issuing its final polling numbers. Election Defense Alliance downloaded NEP numbers from the internet on election night, however, before poll results were changed to match the official vote count.
This is the exit poll from early in the evening of election night. There were 2,168 respondents, and they break down as follows (a "yes" vote is a vote against same-sex marriage):
Males:
Yes on Prop 8, 48%
No on Prop 8, 52%
Females:
Yes on Prop 8, 48%
No on Prop 8, 52%
View actual screen capture
This is the exit poll from later in the evening. There were 2,240 respondents -- 72 more respondents than in the earlier poll -- and they break down in a very different way:
Males:
Yes on Prop 8, 53%
No on Prop 8, 47%
Females:
Yes on Prop 8, 52%
No on Prop 8, 48%
View actual screen capture
This discrepancy should be ringing alarm bells. Something doesn't add up.
Because exit polls adjusted to match election results are of limited usefulness, this year independent exit polls were conducted in several states by a group including Ken Warren of the Warren Poll, Jonathan Simon of Election Defense Alliance, and Steve Freeman of Election Integrity. This team is still analyzing results of their exit polls, but Simon told Velvet Revolution that their California exit polls, some of which were conducted by Judy Alter and Protect California Ballots, tend to corroborate the findings of the above exit poll that show a defeat of Prop. 8.
I'm sure Pam most probably does know what her local food bank NEEDS. But still, an intelligent and thoughtful comment. That just makes me all warm inside. :)
Now it's up to the Iraqi congress. Shouldn't it also be up to the US senate also?
----------
Iraqi cabinet approves security agreement with firm 2011 withdrawal deadline.»
****
Update Spencer Ackerman: "The Bush administration intended the SOFA process to entrench the occupation. Instead it gave the Iraqi government the means to end it. And that's the best-possible way for the war to end: with the Iraqi government -- the one we've disingenuously told the world we're in Iraq to support -- showing its political maturation to get us out the day after tomorrow. And out actually means out. The SOFA demands that every last U.S. serviceman is on a plane by December 31, 2011. Obama's plan for a 30,000-troop residual force? Officially overtaken by events. As I say, the impact of this appears not to have sunken in. The Iraqis have forced an end to the war."
http://thinkprogress.org/2008/11/16/iraq-security-agreement-approve/
Tom, getting all U.S. servicemen out is all well and good. What about Blackwater private armies?
Hi again, GregL.
Was someone questioning whether I know what food banks need? I do, because I donate and drop off turkeys, etc all the time. Thanksgiving is coming, turkeys, stuffing, boxed potates, vegetables, are all needed.
Must have been AZ troll, he has such an obsession with food!
I notice all the dirt has been swept away. Thank you DNC moderators. Like a breath of fresh air.
rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 01:05 PM
Stark reality is that really, most Americans hold progressive views on mostly everything. Stark reality is that there never has been, and never will be, a "center". Consider that Chuck Hagel is considered a "moderate". Consider that Joe Lieberman is considered, by most, to be a "moderate". Chuck Hagel and Joe Lieberman agree on pretty much NOTHING. Hagel is anti-Iraq Occupation, pretty much conservative on everything else. Joe Lieberman is a hawk on the Middle East, he's conservative on some aspects of education reform, pretty much liberal everywhere else. So someone PLEASE tell me how they can both be "moderates"?
Afternoon GregL, RJ, Pam and any/all good Dems who might be here!
I hope that everyone is doing well!
Pretty much the only good thing that can be said is at least they still have jobs!
Reviving a Dispirited Workforce
Monday 17 November 2008
by: Carol D. Leonnig, The Washington Post
Obama urged to tackle frustrations of federal employees.
When President Obama takes over in January as manager in chief of nearly 2 million federal employees, he will need a plan to reinvigorate a frustrated and demoralized workforce, career employees warn.
In numerous federal agencies, civil servants complain that they have been thwarted for months or even years from doing the jobs for which they were hired. Federal workers have told leaders of the presidential transition team that they feel rudderless, their morale affected by the Bush administration's opposition to industry regulation, by steep budget cuts or by the departures many months ago of Bush political appointees in high-level positions. Although they fear publicly identifying themselves, numerous federal workers said in interviews that they are down but also excited about new leadership.
"Many we talk to are wary but cautiously optimistic that with this change in administrations they will get to do their job again," said Jeff Ruch, executive director of the nonprofit Public Employees for Environmental Responsibility. "In the environmental agencies we deal with, they weren't allowed to do their jobs because the Bush White House operated on a very centralized basis. The rule was: That which the White House doesn't want to hear shall not be said."
RJ: I gotta' go for a little bit but I think that we need to go in an sieze the WH records to ensure that they are preserved for future prosecution here and at the Haigue. I'll be the shreaders are about ready to 'catch fire!'
One has to be a real dumbass to still believe in global frickin warmin whilst the earth cools.
Sally-*
Sally, I never was convinced about just how real this whole global warming threat was. I work in a related field but off to the side, many of my friends and associates work directly in climatology and we've had many discussions regarding global warming.
Many of them think little of this theory. They believe that more than likely what we are seeing is the normal temperature fluctuations in earth temperatures, mostly do to the elliptical orbit of earth as well as solar gas flares on the sun's surface.
It would be a dangerous thing to alter the world's economies, no doubt for the worse, based on incomplete, one sided scientific theories and possible profit making schemes.
I hope that doesn't make me one of the dumbasses you refer to.
Ole Stevie must have missed the TV segment this morning, where they showed NASA photos of the Artic and Antartic Circles 2 years ago, compared to how small they are today. NASA (you know, that Government Agency) Agreed that global Warming and trapped gasses, etc are causing Global Warming and is very very dangerous.
But then, what does NASA and actual Photos mean, when we have an on-line Mensa winner telling us they know nothing! LOL----always the fool, isn't he!! He was wrong on Election predictions, yet thinks we should read these half baked crapola articles he finds. Save your bad breath, Stevie. Nobody pays any attention to you.
A plain turkey with no means to cook it, is not much of a gift and most communitys have places to go for a prepared meal.
106CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 02:44 PM
Hey Numb Ones, I don't know about the ghetto you live in, but here in CT, they appeal on the radio and TV all the time, which Grocery stores accept donations of turkeys and get them to families to cook for Thanksgiving! Huge boxes also accept your purchase of stuffing, canned vegetables, also. GOT IT NOW?? My God, you must be the stupidiest man I have ever seen! And you just keep your mouth aflapping!
stevie, what happened to the Silverado you just bought 6 months ago? was that just another 'taunt" (code word for Lie?)
You are such a narcissist! Always trying to prove you are superior, just looking low class, unintelligent and foolish!
sheeesh, Gingrich must not have talked to Stevie about how Palin is going to be the President in 4 years! He says she is just a fad, too!
Gingrich says Palin's star is going to fade
Former House Speaker New Gingrich (R-GA) said Sunday that Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin will likely fade into a crowd of other Republican governors in the years to come and won't become the leader of the Republican party.
“I think that she is going to be a significant player,” Gingrich said during CBS's 'Face the Nation.' “But she’s going to be one of 20 or 30 significant players. She’s not going to be the de facto leader.”
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Gingrich_says_Palins_star_going_to_1117.html
rj,
I watched that roundtable on "This Week" and, yes, I believe that it was an embarrassing moment for George Will.
But even though George Will can be too conservative for my taste when it comes to his views on politics,
I still remember how fast he came out for Obama. His conservative endorsement for Obama was a sign that George Will wasn't a neo-con "yes" man.
A lot of the trolls on this blog are extreme right wing "yes" men who will say anything to endorse right wing ideology.
I respect George Will for endorsing Obama.
The republican party is falling apart before our very eyes. Everyday I read news about how republicans are having squabbles about the direction of the party.
And the trolls on this blog do nothing but to confirm that the conservative movement is in a tailspin.
I would be surprised if McCain can even get reelected as Senator next time.
"South Carolina Sen. Jim DeMint joined the growing ranks of Republicans turning on Sen. John McCain for betraying his conservative principles in the pursuit of the Oval Office, CNN reported.
McCain is largely responsible for the Republican Party straying from its own "brand," DeMint told a group of GOP officials in Myrtle Beach on Friday during a conference on the future of the party.
http://rawstory.com/news/2008/GOP_senator_McCain_put_nail_in_1115.html
duhhhhhhh, fruit face ----we were TALKING about Thanksgiving! Or did you pea brain not quite catch up yet????????????????
Good afternoon, all.
PamB on November 17, 2008 at 03:58 PM
Pam,
Palin's star isn't going to fade; it's already gone dim...witted.
Hello Dems.
I see the trolls are out trolling for the truth again. The problem is they wouldn't know it if it came up and bit them on the nose, which it does all the time. They are just too thick headed to feel anything.
Global warming is real and is man made. The world scientific community is in concensus agreeing that not only is it real but is man made. The only people that dispute it is the United States Republican party and their talking heads they call scientists and Corporate leaders that want to continue polluting our world.
Obama will close Gitmo, he is just trying to figure out what to do with all the current occupants. One thing is for sure, the days of America torturing are over, at least for the next 4 to 8 years.
One time I bought several cans of canned peas, when I got them home I saw that one was a can of spinach. I wondered if poor people liked canned spinach so I put it in the poor people box. And one time I gave a cigarette to a bum.
Of course you don't donate to the poor. YOU ARE the poor!
And Danny ole boy, just because you go down to the local Food pantry and get your week's worth of food, don't think you know what CT Food Bank is currently collecting. Just stick to your own local collections, not a REAL state's.
Events:Thanksgiving for All 2008
Thanksgiving for All is a series of events and food drives hosted and sponsored by local civic and religious organizations, charitable foundations, businesses, media and supermarkets which help Connecticut Food Bank make Thanksgiving special for thousands of our neighbors in danger of going without a holiday meal.
After these events have concluded on Thanksgiving week, our member programs are able to pick up the makings of Thanksgiving dinner to serve to people in need. In 2007, "Thanksgiving for All" raised more than 25,000 turkeys and more than 500,000 pounds of ‘trimmings’ – enough for more than 407,300 meals for those in need during the holiday season.
Below are information of the events and food drives planned for 2008 listed by date. Click on the event for more information. You can also stop by Connecticut Food Bank's warehouses in East Haven, Fairfield and Waterbury to drop off your donation. Click here for directions and hours of CFB's warehouses.
Nov. 4: Hard Rock Cafe, Foxwoods
Nov. 6: Dream Spa and Hair Spa of Westport
Nov. 6: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 8: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 9: MADD Dash
Nov. 12: Simply Baby and Kids
Nov. 12: WPLR Fill The Bowl
Nov. 13: Home Depot Can Drive
Nov. 13: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 13: WPLR Fill the Bowl
Nov. 14: Home Depot Can Drive
Nov. 14: WPLR Fill the Bowl
Nov. 15: Home Depot Can Drive
Nov. 15: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 15: WPLR Fill the Bowl
Nov. 15: Fill the Bowl at Yale Bowl
Nov. 18: Bank of America's Turkey Tuesday
Nov. 20: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 21: KC 101's Stuff-a-Bus
Nov. 21: WATR's Big Heart at Big Y
Nov. 22: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 22: KC 101's Stuff-a-Bus
Nov. 22: WATR's Big Heart at Big Y
Nov. 25: Star 99.9 Food for Friends
Nov. 26: Hard Rock Cafe, Foxwoods
Nov. 28: ChowdaFest
Nov. 29: ChowdaFest
Details of the Events and Food Drives
Hard Rock Cafe, Foxwoods:
Nov. 4 at Foxwoods, Route 2, Mashantucket. Electric Touch - $5 cover to benefit Connecticut Food Bank as part of the Imagine There's No Hunger promotion.
Dream Spa and Hair Spa of Westport:
Nov. 6, 6:30 p.m. to 9 p.m. at 1220 Post Road East, Westport. Open House, cocktails and gift card sales, proceeds to benefit Connecticut Food Bank. Visit www.dreamdayspa.com for more information.
Star 99.9 Food for Friends:
Nov. 6, 5 p.m. to 7 p.m. at Stop & Shop, 1160 Kings Highway, Fairfield.
Nov. 8, 10 a.m. to 2 p.m. at Stop & Shop, 100 Quality Street, Trumbull.
Nov. 13, 5 p.m. to 7 p.m. at Stop & Shop, 2335 Dixwell Avenue, Hamden.
Nov. 15, 10 a.m. to 2 p.m. at Stop & Shop, 72 Newtown Road, Danbury.
Nov. 20, 5 p.m. to 7 p.m., at Stop & Shop, 15 Franklin Street, Seymour.
Nov. 22, 10 a.m. to 2 p.m., at Stop & Shop, 385 Connecticut Avenue, Norwalk.
Nov. 25, 5 a.m. to 7 p.m., at Stop & Shop, 1790 Main Street, Westport.
Nov. 25, 5 a.m. to 7 p.m., at Stop & Shop, 1360 East Town Road, Milford.
Nov. 25, 5 a.m. to 7 p.m., at Stop & Shop, 898 Bridgeport Avenue, Shelton.
MADD Dash:
Nov. 9, 9 a.m. at Edgewood Park, New Haven. Visit www.madd.org/ct for more information.
Simply Baby and Kids:
Nov. 12, 7 p.m. at 477 Main Street (Route 25), Monroe. Mama's Nite Out, proceeds to benefit Connecticut Food Bank. Visit www.simplybabyandkids.com for more information.
WPLR Fill the Bowl:
Nov. 12, 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. at ShopRite, 155 Cherry Street, Milford.
Nov. 13, 7 a.m. to 7 p.m. at ShopRite, 155 Cherry Street, Milford.
Nov. 14, 7 a.m. to 11 p.m. at ShopRite, 155 Cherry Street, Milford.
Nov. 15, 7 a.m. to 11 a.m. at ShopRite, 155 Cherry Street, Milford.
Visit www.wplr.com for more information.
Home Depot Can Drive:
Nov. 13, Regular store hours at Home Depot, 114 Federal Road, Danbury.
Nov. 14, Regular store hours at Home Depot, 114 Federal Road, Danbury.
Nov. 15, Regular store hours at Home Depot, 114 Federal Road, Danbury.
Fill the Bowl at Yale Bowl:
Nov. 15, noon at Yale Bowl, Route 34, West Haven. Bring a frozen turkey, 10 non-perishables or $10 donation to CFB for 2 tickets to the game.
Bank of America's Turkey Tuesday:
Nov. 18, 6 a.m. to 10 a.m. at the lobby of Bank of America, 157 Church Street, New Haven. Bring a frozen turkey or non-perishable food to the bank lobby.
KC 101's Stuff-a-Bus:
Nov. 21, 6 a.m. to 8 p.m. at Shaw's Plaza, 2100 Dixwell Avenue, Hamden.
Nov. 22, 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. at Shaw's Plaza, 2100 Dixwell Avenue, Hamden.
Visit www.kc101.com for more information.
WATR's Big Heart at Big Y:
Nov. 21, 8 a.m. to 8 p.m. at Big Y, 85 Bridge Street, Naugatuck.
Nov. 22, 8 a.m. to 4 p.m. at Big Y, 85 Bridge Street, Naugatuck.
Hard Rock Cafe, Foxwoods:
Nov. 26 at Foxwoods, Route 2, Mashantucket. Flowers & Kain - $5 cover to benefit Connecticut Food Bank as part of the Imagine There's No Hunger promotion.
ChowdaFest:
Nov. 28, 11:30 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. at Unitarian Church, 10 Lyons Plain Road, Westport.
Nov. 29, 11:30 a.m. to 4:30 p.m. at Unitarian Church, 10 Lyons Plain Road, Westport.
Visit www.chowdafest.org for more information.
For more information about Thanksgiving for All events, contact Stefanie Stevens, Special Events Coordinator, at (203) 469-5000, ext. 302, or sstevens@ctfoodbank.org.
These events also allow for ample volunteering opportunities. To learn more about how you could help Connecticut Food Bank during the Thanksgiving season, please contact Kim Damien, Volunteer Coordinator, at (203) 469-5000, ext. 311 or kdamien@ctfoodbank.org.
For media inquiries, please contact the Development Department at (203) 469-5000 or cfb@ctfoodbank.org.
Shut the fuck up now, Dan-bitch.
Oh and as for "Please collect only non-perishable items" that means if you're RUNNING a food drive, moron, because the FOOD BANK doesn't know if you have facilities for making sure perishable items are kept well.
How You Can Help:Overview
There are many ways you can help Connecticut Food Bank fight hunger. You can donate food, funds, or time and have a direct impact on your community's well-being.
Donate Food
Donate food at a food drive or local food program.
Plan a food drive any time of year to benefit a local program.
Shop during 2-for-1 sales and donate the second can/box of food to your local food pantry.
Plant an extra row of produce in your garden and donate that bounty to a food bank.
Donate unused prepared food from weddings & parties to a local soup kitchen or shelter.
See the PERISHABLE items in BOLD, Fucktoy-For-Animals? Now get back in your box!
PamB on November 17, 2008 at 04:03 PM
Huh? McCain was the EPITOME of conservative principles during this campaign. Fucking conservative assholes! We can NOT let them get away with this "The sky is green until later when I'll say I said it's blue" shit anymore!
There may be a consensus of liberal scientists.Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 04:22 PM
Real science is only conducted by real scientists. All REAL scientists are liberals.
Benji: George Will is one of the very few conservatives that I can listen to, in great part because - while I almost always disagree with him - he's provacative and he states his opinions in an intelligent manner. He's not just some gas-bag blow hard like limpballs and o'liely. That said, Paul Krugman stops short of walking on water, but only just barely. Dr. Krugman is one of my all-time heroes. He should have his own television show on all major networks at the same time that is required viewing and teach all of us economics! The brilliance of Dr. Krugman is not just in his expansive knowledge of economics at all levels but his true genius lies in that he can explain it to those of us who don't! (Even George Will!)
MSNBC - If Dr. Krugman, Dr. Stiglitz, Paul Volcker, Robert Reich don't end up as part of the new administration, how about giving them their own show "The Economists." They can host other economists and hold pannel discussions with conservative and liberal economists alike. PLEASE!
MaryMac,
Before 04, when for the most part I didn't care about politics, George Will was hard to listen to because it was as if he never spoke plain English.
But after 04, when I decided to become politically active, I would listen to George Will and try to decipher his views.
What I found was that even though he leaned to the right politically he always backed up his arguments with thought provoking arguments that had to be addressed if anyone wanted to logically disagree with him.
Sam Donaldson seemed to be very quick with an answer.
When the campaign became extremely heated he stayed consistent and then when George Will finally came out against McCain during the debates, I finally respected his view as being non-partisan.
I saw the last roundtable and I knew George Will wasn't going to be the final say on economics because of the guest and his credentials but it didn't change my respect for George Will.
George Will's backing of Obama and makes his opinion important because he's not a right-wing waterboy like limpballs and the trolls on this blog.
what makes limpballs, o'liely, anne coldsore gas bags is that anyone can predict what their opinions are before they have a chance to state them.
It's kind of like the trolls on this blog.
Benji: I try my best not to respond to trolls as it is much like feeding stray cats - you never get rid of them; but, did you happen to see the stupid response above - Of course ignorant trolls don't want to learn about the economy because then, they would be forced to admit how badly the republicans have messed it up. I suggested pannel discussions between liberal and conservative economists and the troll is so stupid that he/she/it can't fathom learning anything from either group. Trolls only listen to gas bags because gas bags tell them what to think so that they don't have to work so hard, thinking for themselves! And they wonder why we have no respect for them and no interest in the opinions of fools who can only regurgitate what someone like o'liely tells them to. They are complete fools!
FIVE - COUNT THEM - FIVE YEARS AGO! He predicted the current economic crisis - 5!
From Wikipedia:
In September, 2003,
Krugman published a collection of his columns under the title, The Great Unraveling. Taken as a whole, it was a scathing attack on the Bush's administration's economic and foreign policies. His main argument was that the large deficits generated by the Bush administration—generated by decreasing taxes, increasing public spending, and fighting a war in Iraq — were in the long run unsustainable, and would eventually generate a major economic crisis. The book was a best-seller.[28][29][30]
Now get back in your box!
GregL on November 17, 2008 at 04:35 PM
I thought it burned and the firemen threw the remains in a dumpster. So why does the troll need a food pantry when he's going to be living in a shelter instead of his cardboard box? They don't let you cook there.
Good evening fellow Democrats.
CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 05:44 PM
Dan, Dan, Dan, of course we'll use those terms. Here's how: "The economic crisis caused by President George W. Bush due to his massive deficit spending, tax breaks for the wealthy, and his unwarranted war on Iraq has caused the national deficit to double and we've seen a spike amongst the ranks of the homeless since the Bush Administration refused to do anything to help mortgage holders duped by nefarious lending tactics."
See how easy that was. :-)
CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 05:36 PM
You haven't begun to see the bottom of this Republican downturn. It's called a Depression. Didn't they teach you anything about that in Germany? Or were you home schooled with the rest of the Boys from Brazil in South America?
Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 04:48 PM
Nah, we could make that show a top ten. All we'd have to do is put them in front a green screen so that during the broadcast, we'd have bikini-clad girls jumping on trampolines and showing the insides of rock star houses. That'll have the "Jerry Springer crowd" hooked in a minute.
166CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 05:44 PM
Those terms will be meaningless because Obama would have addressed them.
Unlike the republicans who are the cause of the economic crisis, homelessness due to joblessness and the national debt,
The Democratic Party has a history of economic prosperity, low joblessness and budget surpluses.
After a year of Obama don't be surprised if the there is a dramatic shift with the American economy.
I find it interesting that the trolls have started whining about the Obama presidency even as the bush/republican recession has begun during the bush/republican lame duck session.
phil graham must have been refering to the republicans.
It seems the republicans are a party of whiners.
And the republicans are a party with no agenda and no new ideas.
WASHINGTON (AP) - Prospects dimmed Monday for enactment of a $25 billion bailout for the faltering auto industry before year's end, as congressional Democrats and the Bush administration seemed headed for a stalemate. Help for Detroit's Big Three, which have been battered by the economic meltdown that has choked their sales and frozen their credit, is falling victim to a partisan fight over where the money should come from.Senate Democrats said they would press ahead with their plan to carve out a portion of the $700 billion Wall Street bailout to pay for the loans, but aides in both parties and lobbyists tracking the plan acknowledged they did not currently have the votes to do so. The White House and congressional Republicans insist that the automaker bailout money instead come from redirecting a separate $25 billion loan program approved by Congress to help the industry develop more fuel-efficient vehicles.
In addition, besides opposing the use of any of the $700 billion for the automakers, the administration has told top lawmakers it does not plan to ask for the second half of that huge fund that Congress approved this fall to aid the financial industry, congressional officials said Monday...
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20081117/D94GUIK80.html
And the Republicans can figure out why they're not competitive in MI, WI, MN, or other car manufacturing states. But that's OK. Remember this GOP; if any one of the big three go under before we take over on 20JAN09, we'll hang that millstone around your neck for the fifty years.
But leave it to the GOP to get our priorities screwed up. We'll help the banking industry, who in turn produces nothing but paperwork, over an industry that produces tangible assets such as motor vehicles? Are you conservatives crazy? Setting aside that auto manufacturing is the heart and soul of U.S. manufacturing, you're putting three million jobs in jeopardy and that's just in the auto industry. That doesn't account for the other millions of jobs associated with this industry.
Of course, the counter to that argument is some free market claptrap which I'm sure will be espoused by someone who isn't smart enough to realize that this "Laissez-Faire Ayn Rand Caveat Emptor" system is fundamentally flawed because it fails to take into account one of the few things that is constant amongst all humans; greed.
However, I'm going to quote Pat Buchanan from the McClaughlin Group on 14NOV08 because he gave the best answer as to why we can't allow the auto industry to fail.
MR. MCLAUGHLIN: Question: What's the argument for bailing out Detroit's big three, and what's the argument against the bailout, Pat?MR. BUCHANAN: Well, the argument for it is millions of jobs will go under. You will lose the largest manufacturing unit in the United States, the heart and soul of American manufacturing. R&D goes with it. Technology goes with it. Engineering goes with it.
And more important, the auto industry has an enormous future in this world. Americans, we buy, in a good year, 17 million cars. China, India, all these countries are opening up. People are moving into the middle class. They're going to be wanting cars. You will carve the United States out of much of the future. But in terms of viability, what's killed General Motors, John, is they have dropped the greatest, highest-paid guys who give the most in taxes, the cleanest, safest factories, dropped them into global competition against factories in places like China, whose managers would be in a penitentiary if they were doing in the United States what they're allowed to do over there.
176CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 06:22 PM
You could use a refresher course in fundamental English grammar.
"It made now look good."....?
What the heck is that supposed to mean?
marymac_memphis on November 17, 2008 at 05:31 PM
mary,
Republicans don't take advice and always re-write history to explain their mistakes.
Warnings from economists like Krugman meant nothing to them five years ago. Hell, they didn't listen to our Generals before marching into Iraq...under-equipped, under-staffed, and without a strategy. Bush fired anyone who had a brain or wouldn’t capitulate to his will.
It's just isn’t common sense to put into motion every conceivable stupid thing you can think up and expect anything but disaster. As Obama likes to say, "It's been the silly season." The conservative economic ideology created havoc because it ignored a reality-based world.
The Republicans were going to create their own reality. Well, look what we got…exactly what Krugman predicted.
The massive failure of Voodoo Economics is a fitting death to the Reagan Revolution. I’m pleased that St. Reagan will be assigned a share of the blame by historians.
177BobVADemocratHawk on November 17, 2008 at 06:25 PM
If the big three go down because the republicans played hardball,
This could be a sign of the "magic 60" in 2010.
No one can blame the economic crisis on anyone except the bush administration and the republicans.
All those employees who are dependent on a bailout and who lose their jobs will have no choice to blame a non-filibuster proof Congress for their woes.
American voters who are affected by a big three fallout will come in force to help strengthen the Democratic Party majorities in Congress and the republican party may very well be as influential as a third party.
It seems the extreme right is shooting themselves in the foot.
There are suprisingly a lot of people who are for the bailout.
The only ones who are vocal about it are the disenfranchised republicans who don't want the bailout to add legitimacy to the arguement that the republicans are incompetent with the economy.
The "bailout" is a paradigm to the "surge".
The "surge" was supposed to help an already failed Iraq occupation. An occupation that is a direct contributor to the economic problems we are having on the "homeland".
The "surge" disquised the symptoms but hasn't solved the problem. Osama bin Laden is still at large. Al Queada still exists. Iraq is still a mess.
But the republicans were pro "surge" because it was supposed to save face for the republicans incompetent ability to address national security.
You probably wouldn't have had much fun on the surface of the moon. It's not the exploring or the bouncing or the buggy-roving that would have bothered you. It's the worrying.Landing on the moon is fine, but you need to get home too. That means heaving your multiton spacecraft back off the ground and up into space--and if that's going to happen, all its thousands of components have to work just so. There's no guarantee that they will--which is why the first time men landed on the moon, President Richard Nixon had a short address prepared just in case things went wrong. "Fate has ordained that the men who went to the moon to explore in peace will stay on the moon to rest in peace," he would have said. When they're writing your obit while you're still alive, it's hard to have a good time.
But the astronauts themselves had a grand time on the moon--and the U.S. had just as much fun sending them there. For a big, loud, hootenanny nation like ours--one that has spent the better part of its history whooping its way west--having an empty landmass to explore a quarter-million miles (more than 400,000 km) offshore was a powerful tonic. The fact that the exploring took place in what was otherwise a very hard decade made the experience only more bracing.
By any measure, the current decade is a hard one too. And again--perhaps coincidentally, perhaps not--we're eyeing the moon. By 2015, to hear NASA tell it, a new manned spacecraft--the evocatively named Orion--will be carrying crews to Earth's orbit. By 2020, Orion will be paired with the lunar lander Altair. That same year, fresh American bootprints will be made on the lunar soil--the first since the Apollo 17 mission in 1972. Contractors have been chosen, metal is being cut, and most important, money has been allocated. "This is a real program," says Jeff Hanley, manager of NASA's Constellation program, which oversees manned exploration. "We're spending a couple hundred million dollars a month, and thousands of people are marching to a strategy."...
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1858878,00.html
What burns me up is that we should already have a permanent base on Luna and be working toward a permanent presence on Mars and the mining of the asteroid belt. Instead, we've cut NASA funding to the point where a small robot is considered expensive. Let's get it right this time.
The "bailout" on the otherhand legitimizes regulations in the market place and further adds credence to the fact that the republicans are fiscally incompetent.
If the "bailout" succeeds that would ensure that the republicans history for supporting de-regulation is another reason for the American voter to question the republicans fiscal competency.
Cactus,
If there are so many people against the bailout then why aren't they protesting at the Capital?
Where are they?
CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 06:22 PM
I lived through the Carter administration and it was nothing like this world economic meltdown. Did all the world superpowers nationalize their banking systems to correct the problems caused by the OPEC oil embargo? NO.
This is a Depression. They go on for six or seven years and you have to buy your way out of them. There is no easy solutions especially when we don't know how bad or deep the damage runs. Bush is acting way too coy and cavalier.
I bet the deficit and unemployment is much bigger than what is being reported and the banks are in far worse shape than anyone in this administation is willing to admit.
Live with your silly illusions. This is not a simple downturn in the economy that will work it's way out by getting rid of earmarks.
Come January 21, we'll start finding out the truth.
CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 06:32 PM
For the banking bailout; the answer is no. For the auto industry bailout; the answer is condtionally yes. The GOP has managed to gut our manufacturing base and our unions. This practice ends 20JAN09.
YayObama on November 17, 2008 at 06:32 PM
We could be at sixty by the middle of next month if all goes well in AK, MN, and GA and you count Sen. Lieberman (I-CT). I believe the only reason we're stringing him along is to see if we actually need him for vote number sixty. He darn sure doesn't have any business chairing the DHS Senate Committee, IMHO.
No, there is no way of escaping it.
The only ones who are protesting the "bailout" are talk radio show hosts looking for ratings.
There is not an overwhelming majority of Americans outraged at the proposed "bailout"....
...simply because...
....the economic crisis that the republican party and the bush administration created is part of a right-wing legacy that will end on Jan. 20.
192BobVADemocratHawk on November 17, 2008 at 06:46 PM
I completely agree.
The sixty that the Democratic Party needs isn't official and even if the last three were to go republican (which is unlikely) there's no reason to show your hand until the last bets are placed.
Rj,
I definitely believe the trolls aren't here to logically engage in any discussion regarding the issues.
They are here to vent because they are angry that they got their butts handed to them.
p.s. I am really benji, everyone knows except Sally and the trolls. Sally and the trolls think you, I and some guy named Robert in NJ are the same. (what a bunch of losers)
cactus,
You are setting yourself up for failure if you believe that there is a strong demographic of American voters against the "bailout".
Where are they?
They don't exist.
"Frightened" David Frum Quits National Review
NY Times
November 17, 2008 12:52 PM
In a span of 252 days, the National Review lost two Buckleys -- one to death, another to resignation -- and an election. ...
Now David Frum, a prominent conservative writer who enmeshed himself in a minor dustup during the campaign by turning negative on Governor Palin, is leaving, too. In an interview, he said he planned to leave the magazine, where he writes a popular blog, to strike out on his own on the Web. ...
"I am really and truly frightened by the collapse of support for the Republican Party by the young and the educated," he said.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/17/david-frum-quits-inationa_n_144353.html
So From is frightened of telling the truth? He knows it won't get you anywhere in the Republican Party these days?
All the GOP has left are crazy and/or corrupt old men, bigots, and fundies. They young and educated need not apply.
rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 06:58 PM
rj,
You found this article irresistible, too?
The young and educated need not apply at the RNC.
rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 06:57 PM
I'd say that the pirates saw what K Street and Wall Street did and see no risk.
Cactus,
I will admit that the UAW is against concession for the "bailout"
But the UAW is not against the bailout and the UAW is certainly against the possibility of Chapter 7.
Chapter 11 may not be possible because banks aren't lending and lending is a key for the big three to file Chapter 11.
Chapter 7 is full asset liquidity and means immediate layoffs for UAW.
cactus,
That liberal percentage argument is the same thing Swirly has been arguing.
Your giving yourself away.
CactusBarrack on November 17, 2008 at 07:03 PM
What happened to "It's the economy" being your answer to every argument I make?
Now you want me to believe that "it's only 22 percent" who support Barack Obama? No way, no how, no conservative coalition exists.
This country was high jacked by a bunch of corrupt, lying, incompetent "so called" conservatives who destroyed our Middle Class Way of Life and the public will no longer put up with them.
You're in exile. Get back in your box...as Cal said.
208 rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 07:02 PM
rjsnj,
I read that too. drug limpballs is trying to characterize this as an "Obama recession".
limpball political antics are growing too predictable.
Add "Obama recession" to the list of short-lived slogans with
"cut and run"
"shock and awe"
"mission accomplished"
"tax and spend"
"drill baby drill"
"country first"
"liberal bias"
The right-wing are too predictable.
Good night fellow Democrats. Keep the Faith and keep the faith. Yes we can and yes we did!
rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 07:07 PM
rj,
This pirates' tale just might be Spunky's last stupid attempt to go out in glory. He'll probably sent our entire fleet after these creeps and then they'll blow up the tanker when all our ships are too close.
The Saudis can afford to pay these pirates a ransom...and then hire Al Queada to dispose of the problem.
Pirates are just mavericks and you saw how stupid they can be. There's no reason to blow this up out of proportion. I'd lay odds that Bush will.
No pirates in the world? Of course, there are pirates and terrorists and all kinds of people taking advantage of the situation when there is a vacuum of power in the world.
so i guess if there are just 22% of the voters who are liberal and if obama is the most liberal guy to ever run for the presidency he must have lost. so when is president mcbush's inauguration???hahahahaha
here is some more of the bush legacy...
More American kids went hungry last year
USDA: Number jumped 50 percent in 2007 — that's nearly 700,000 children
updated 2 hours, 53 minutes ago
WASHINGTON - Some 691,000 children went hungry in America sometime in 2007, while close to one in eight Americans struggled to feed themselves adequately even before this year’s sharp economic downturn, the Agriculture Department reported Monday.
The department’s annual report on food security showed that during 2007 the number of children who suffered a substantial disruption in the amount of food they typically eat was more than double the 430,000 in 2006 and the largest figure since 716,000 in 1998.
Overall, the 36.2 million adults and children who struggled with hunger during the year was up slightly from 35.5 million in 2006. That was 12.2 percent of Americans who didn’t have the money or assistance to get enough food to maintain active, healthy lives...
so now the trolls are trying to prove that the election actually proves that americans are just like them?? i had no idea there was still so much brown acid in circulation.
apparently the snake oil salesmen huckster is coming out with a book...from realclearpolitics:
"From Time's Michael Scherer's preview of Huckabee's upcoming tell-all book:
Mitt Romney, Huckabee's principal rival in Iowa, comes in for the roughest treatment. Huckabee writes that the former Massachusetts governor's record was "anything but conservative until he changed the light bulbs in his chandelier in time to run for president." ...
His treatment of former candidate Fred Thompson, a rival who helped sink Huckabee's upstart ambitions in South Carolina, is somewhat more favorable, if only because it is less personal. Huckabee maintains that Thompson's biggest mistake was strategic: he didn't understand the need to expand the Republican Party beyond its base..."
this is hysterical in that it was the huckster's mob that insisted that palin be the vp candidate which totally screwed up the already moronic mcbush campaign....but the huck is trying to tie the can onto romney's tail so in 2012 the field will be clear for a totally religious nut ticket....god speed huckster, god speed....
GregL,
thanks for taking my back today. I have been babysitting all 3 grandkids and only sporatically got on. I should have learned that I need to use pictures, when Danny is around, because he has trouble with posts unless you spell it all out.
I do donate when the Postal service has their annual drive. The Boy Scouts do an annual drive. Where I used to work, we used to put up boxes around the Holidays and someone would deliver them. At the UCONN games every week, there are boxes by the doors for food. There is a HUGE warehouse a few towns over, that the CT. Food Bank owns. They are now asking for Turkeys. I have earned 3 of them this year from various stores, from spending $300 during a certain period of time. I always donate those at Thanksgiving. I eat at my sisters so do not need them.
Danny ate at a soup kitchen once, and now thinks he is an expert on how they all work.
rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 06:44 PM
rj,
I love it. Huckabee is not going to give up without a fight.
The remarks about Gary Bauer and Haggee are priceless. There isn't much unity left in what remains of the Christian Coalition a.k.a what's left of the Republican Party.
Young and educated evangelicals need not apply with the RNC either? Even older and crafty evangelicals like Huckabee need not apply?
It's like the Republicans have an identity crisis inside of a mass suicide. That Jim Jones episode should have told us where the Reagan Revolution was going to lead.
Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 07:30 PM
He has a good house band. Maybe Sarah would like to sit in with her flute?
gregg on November 17, 2008 at 07:28 PM
I knew a Christian public relations guy would write a hell of a tell-all book.
rjsnj on November 17, 2008 at 07:15 PM
I thought a lot of Yankees moved down to Atlanta in the last few decades. Would they or their first-time-voting kids really look at Zell as anything but a maniac?
I have a feeling that Georgia has seen enough of the Old Guard Republicans...just like the rest of the country. They might not be able to vote for a black man, but I can't see why they would want to vote to keep an incompetent Republican in the Senate.
He's going to be losing all his pork barrel dollars for the state and will have no clout in the committees. There comes a time when self preservation kicks in...especially during a economic meltdown.
rj, a repost from this morning. Is this 100% on the mark of our trolls and the extreme right wingers???? I wonder if they recognize themselves......
The Architects of Fear:
“Family Values” Up Close under the Roof of Domestic Terror
By Craig Chalquist, PhD
According to this research, people who favor authoritarian politics and succumb to reactionary rhetoric exhibit a consistent personality pattern of “antidemocratic tendencies and fascist potential.” In other words, they tend to share common psychological characteristics, including some or all of the following:
An entrenched obsession with safety, security, and order.
Rigidly absolutist “black-and-white” thinking (e.g., us against them).
An overemphasis on “strength,” power, and control; a “might makes right” orientation.
Authoritarian submission: a willingness to blindly obey the rules of authorities.
Authoritarian aggression: an aggressive attitude towards individuals or groups disliked by the authorities; bullying individuals or groups perceived to threaten traditional values.
A belief that negotiation, understanding, empathy, and compromise are weak.
A belief in the need to punish those who do not follow rules to the letter.
Scornful rejection of the subjective, imaginative, and aesthetic dimensions of life.
Superstition, cliché-mongering, stereotyping, and fatalism.
A belief in fixed, unalterable, and traditional roles for women.
Secret insecurity when unable to live up to high standards imposed publicly on others.
Identification with those in power, with excessive emphasis on posturing toughness.
Destructiveness, cynicism, general hostility, and a habit of putting down perceived opponents.
Projection: the tendency to see evil, exploitativeness, and danger in others instead of in oneself.
An exaggerated concern with other people’s sexual activity.
I need to get on with my life here. Catch you all later.
Good night, everyone.
Looks like we got one more seat!!
Alaska-based GOP pollster David Dittman, who worked for Sen. Ted Stevens during this year's primary race, believes Democratic challenger Mark Begich is all but certain to expand his current razor-thin lead and snatch the seat.
"I don't think Stevens can come back," Dittman said, noting that he thinks the remaining trove of uncounted ballots will help Begich "increase his lead."
Even if Begich's advantage grows, however, Dittman believes it's highly unlikely that Stevens will concede the race until every last ballot is counted. "He's probably waiting in Washington," Dittman said. "I haven't talked to him since the evening of the election, when I called and just told him I was sorry for the way it turned out."
and this!!!
Despite trailing his opponent by slightly more than two hundred votes, Democratic challenger Al Franken stands a strong chance of passing Sen. Norm Coleman during the upcoming recount, according to at least one prominent political scientist.
Professor Michael C. Herron of Dartmouth College, has put together a new study of the voting patterns in Minnesota, in the process determining that the majority of voters who cast unrecorded ballots in the Senate race were likely Franken supporters.
"If someone put a gun to my head and said, 'You have to bet,' I would bet Franken,"
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/17/frankens-position-looks-s_n_144449.html
Our local Salvation Army requests for "needy" families has gone from 543 last year to over 700 so far this year, and the "Season" hasn't even begun.
The local grocery store has groceries already packed, all a person has to do is pay $5 or $10 depending on the size of the bag you wish to donate. It goes to the Salvation Army as well.
The local hospital has an Angel Tree that lists children's first name and the child's coat and boot sizes so that you can pick a name and supply their need.
Our office permits us to wear jeans on Thurs. and Fri. for the price of 2 canned goods per day. We usually donated 1,200 lbs of food a month.
And it's always a great idea to donate $$$ to local churches, not just your own, but others in your area.
I like to donate craft making material for the children's craft day with Santa and his elves to the ladies association where my daughter serves as village councilperson.
A smile and a kind word works wonders too.
Evening all good Dems,
On either the Stephanie Miller show or the Ed Schultz show today they reported that Governor Schwarenegger made a speech urging the nation to adopt the Democratic platform in so may words.
His Democratic wife must have grabbed him by the balls and got his attention. She was married to a Kennedy.
He sounded just like President-Elect Obama calling for environmental improvements, alternative
energy improvemens, green jobs, etc. California already has some demo Hydrogen cars running around L.A. They even have some Hydrogen pumps thanks to Schwarznegger.
YayObama on November 17, 2008 at 08:28 PM
Benji: I read that as many as 1 in every 10 manufacturing jobs in the USA is directly or indirectly related or in some way dependant upon the auto industry.
You are correct - failure is not an option; but, how is just handing them money going to help? They need to be selling and maufacturing autos. Send vouchers (say $10,000 to $15,000) to every taxpayer for credit toward the purchase of a new car from one of the 'big 3' automakers. They can redeem those for 'bailout' money. At least the taxpayers get something out of the deal!
YayObama on November 17, 2008 at 08:42 PM
Benji: You know that if Bible Spice so much as looked in Sally's direction, Sally would have a heart-attack and die and then - of course - looking at his ugly mug - she'd end up throwing up all over the RNC's clothes! LOL
There is no way the Republican Governors can separate themselves from the last eight years of GOP incompetence unless they want to switch Parties. We don't want them. The voters don't need them.
64SandyH on November 17, 2008 at 12:40 AM
Are these the red states and counties that we send the bill to for our reimbursement of the loan we just gave them for the damages incurred for the last eight years of majority rule when we need to pay our own bills, and how soon can we start making them pay back with interest to The People of The United States of America?
Reach across the isle, for what? More debt? Sorry, as a consumer I don't want to buy that. Does anyone else? Just thinking...
As for manmade = contributing to global ecological changes see current article:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22935934/
I feel so badly for those who lost their homes and all their belongings in So CA and hope they get the help they need to start anew. I cannot imagine how shocking such experiences must feel and we have had too many people losing homes one way or another lately.
Reading - some recent issues: Can anyone do anything about the Ohio Statute of Limitations? It is still 16 years, that is atleast 8 years too long as compared to all the other states (National is 7)? Why? No medicaid here. Down with medical debt and loss of housing and credit. People boycotting medical care. Homeless population growing.
Meanwhile, back at the old fort, snow's here, hello heat bills. Hmmmm....have a nice day, it's good to be alive. Thanksgiving soon, share and care It is OUR holiday and remember what it stands for, the opposite of greed - and keep safe fellow Dems - never forget that the power is with The People. It is there in our goodness, our trust in each other, our appreciation of the intrinsic gifts and talents each of us shines with, our souls warming each other...our smiles. Happy Thanks Giving. A Logical Historical Truth.
I am pleased that Obama is already making moves to curtail the power of the Lobby Monster. We Won, We Did It, We Do Not Have To wheel and deal with scammers and crims and cons.
They can become blue anytime they want honestly, publicly, and openly with transparency. They can apologize to the People they represent as civil servants.
We need to return to our broad based middle class as equals, get off the ego trips and false conciousness. Now is the time to get real and help put this nation back together.
A new medical plan for the states is a good start. Enough food in our food banks is important also. People are suffering as I write. More American kids going hungry.
Yes We Can, The only ones that can do something in reality NOW is what is real to believe in, believe in ourselves, get down to earth with the facts, you me us we are THE PEOPLE and THIS IS OUR TIME as Obama said.
Take it back Dems, don't get fooled again, no more bluffs, lies, thievery, bribery. Bust it up and put it away. No more enabling. History has shown us now. We are not fooled. We need healing, not monopoly, not scams.
Yes, We Can. Don't give it away.
OBAMA/BIDEN 2008 OUR TIME IS NOW
Sandy:
Did you see that the best all around player in major league baseball just won his second MVP award!
Pujols powers way to 2nd NL MVP award
By BEN WALKER, AP Baseball Writer 3 hours, 8 minutes ago
NEW YORK (AP)—Albert Pujols views MVP voting a little differently these days.
“You have to consider everything. You have to put all the numbers together,” the St. Louis star said Monday after powering past Philadelphia slugger Ryan Howard to win the award for the second time.
Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 09:11 PM
it's a secret code that you aren't in on.
Just stopping by...
Have you seen this?
Glenn Beck Accosted At Wendy's: "You Racist Bigot!"
Huffington Post
November 17, 2008 03:28 PM
Beck's full Wendy's rant below:
It happened to me at Wendy's Saturday night. We are on the bus and we stop to get fuel and I said, I'm going to go in, I'm treating. Everybody wants a Frosty. I'm going to go get Frosties. And one of the security guys, said, No, you're not. I said, Yeah, I am. I mean, it's a truck stop. How much trouble am I going to get in in a truck stop? Everybody here you can trust. You're not going in. I went in, but I had to bring the swat team with me and so I'm just, I just want to Frosty, please, the guy standing next to me, who, by the way, I may point out. Had food in his hair, is a truck driver and he turned around. He looked at me and the recognition was immediate and he said, You racist bigot! And I just said -- I wanted to say, I think you have me mistaken for someone else, but I knew he knew who I was and he just hated me for who I was. You conservatives that have destroyed this country! And the hatred was so deep, it was breath taking. Luckily the swat team was there and I just separated myself from him and he just shouted through other people and there were children in the restaurant and he blamed me for everything, I believe including the Holocaust, and the hatred was palpable. The guy screamed at the restaurant, you better not let me see you in the parking lot because I've got a truck and I'll run your ass over!
Wow. Is this who we've become? Is this who we've become?
The TV and radio personality recently signed a deal to jump to Fox News, where he will host the 5PM hour starting in spring 2009.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/17/glenn-beck-accosted-at-we_n_144411.html
Yes, Beck. This is who you conservatives have become and have been for about 20 to 30 years now. You have encouraged this type of behavior and some like yourself made a living doing it. Sarah Palin does it better than any of you; and if you are so disgusted by it, quit acting that way.
And certainly don't take a job at Faux News. It's like admitting that you can't do any better.
Everyone knows that that is what Robert J Scardapane of Sommerset NJ is doing, even if they pretend like it is not true.
257Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 08:57 PM
"we" might as well let him in on it. actually, all of "us,: with the exception of you, dan and dr burd, are really robert.
there are really just the 4 of us on this blog.
marymac_memphis on November 17, 2008 at 09:03 PM
Hi, mary.
Yes, I heard about it earlier tonight. I'm sure he's thrilled. This Cardinal season was nothing to write home about. So, this is really good news for our town.
Albert is a very nice man and contributes a lot of time and money to our community and local charities, as well as being a great baseball player and family man. He's also one of those humble players from the Dominican Republic who worked hard to make it to the major leagues.
His "special" hitting coach is his wife who always seem to see things nobody else does when Pujols is going through a slump. She certainly shares in this award.
But I'm not sure he's quite as young as he says....the man has been losing his hair since he was 21.
Sally-* on November 17, 2008 at 09:11 PM
I'm so happy to have finally posted something you could understand.
http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/pawlenty-gop-must-adapt-to-changing-country-2008-11-16.html
“We've absolutely forgotten how to communicate a message, to firmly… espouse those very principles in the context of people's everyday lives,” Steele said.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Too late.
;)
ok,sandyrobert.
***
me too.
time for beauty sleep, roberts of the world carry on.
enjoy the evening, everyone of us.
O Lord, you will hear the desire of the meek; you will strengthen their heart, you will incline your ear to do justice for the orphan and the oppressed, so that those from earth may strike terror no more.
- Psalm 10:17-18
It is there in our goodness, our trust in each other, our appreciation of the intrinsic gifts and talents each of us shines with, our souls warming each other...our smiles. Happy Thanks Giving. A Logical Historical Truth.
MarieDNC on November 17, 2008 at 08:59 PM
And Happy Thanksgiving to you, too, Marie. This is a wonderful sentiment.
Esmeralda on November 17, 2008 at 09:50 PM
I think we may have found our way home.
Good night and sweet dreams, Essie.
Pawlenty said on “Fox News Sunday”. “And we have to learn to do a better job of applying our conservative principles to this new marketplace.”...
Now that's a true Republican speaking here. He's concerned about the "new marketplace" while the rest of us are concerned about our homes, jobs and our children's future.
A pundit was saying the other day that most Americans aren't worried about Wall Street or even Mainstreet. It's what's happening on America's Side Streets that must be addressed.
We must pull together and not let this opportunity slip away to help the majority of our countrymen not those who have exploited and manipulated the marketplace.
I'm calling it a day, too.
Good night, all.
sally if you have time tonight while you are....well whatever the hell you are doing up all night...would you please disprove the theory of evolution again and also re-explain how last weeks electoral outcome was great news for the right wing. thank you and good night.
times sure do change don't they. i remember four years ago after kerry was defeated ( or was it robbed---notice that this year was the first indisputably clean presidential win in 12 years ) i and others were lamenting the lack of think tanks and policy generating organizations on the left and the mass of them on the right. well that is over and now we have a president who leans left and some outside, well funded groups that are trying to influence him....and the right wingers are squealing about soros...hahahahaha
"Nov. 18 (Bloomberg) -- Three blocks from the White House, on the 10th floor of a sleek glass building, young workers pound at computers, with giant flat-screen TVs overhead. It has the look and feel of a high-tech startup.
In many ways it is. The product is ideas.
Thanks in part to funding from benefactors such as billionaire George Soros, the Center for American Progress has become in just five years an intellectual wellspring for Democratic policy proposals, including many that are shaping the agenda of the new Obama administration.
Much as the Heritage Foundation provided intellectual heft for the Republican Party in the 1980s, CAP has been an incubator for liberal thought and helped build the platform that triumphed in the 2008 campaign.
``What CAP has done is recapture the role of ideas as an important political force, something the Republicans had been better at for 25 years,'' said Walter Isaacson, president of the Aspen Institute, a non-partisan policy-research organization in Washington.
CAP's president and founder, John Podesta, 59, former chief of staff to President Bill Clinton, is one of three people running the transition team for president-elect Barack Obama, 47. A squadron of CAP experts is working with them..."
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aF7fB1PF0NPg&refer=home
good morning, roberts of the world!
sandyrobert, "marketplace" I'm glad that caught your eye as well. says a lot about how they see "the game of life."
YayObama on November 18, 2008 at 06:39 AM
moosedogs with cheese whiz. ;)
I made some venison meatballs in the crockpot the other day. It doesn't take as long to cook, because the meat is lean. yummy...I'm taking them for my late lunch today at the office. noon to midnight shift due to a special congressional district general election.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=6274607&page=1
Senate Democrats to Decide Lieberman's Fate
Esmeralda, I thought we were all Spartacus but I guess we are all Robert!
meanwhile bushie deadbeats are trying to get those protected civil service positions the right wing supposedly abhors...but i am sure the obama gang will ferret out as many as possible and send them on their way down the road...but gee you would think all these ayn randers would be eager to get out into the "real world" and start selling apples on wall street...
By Juliet Eilperin and Carol D. Leonnig
updated 12:57 a.m. ET, Tues., Nov. 18, 2008
Just weeks before leaving office, the Interior Department's top lawyer has shifted half a dozen key deputies -- including two former political appointees who have been involved in controversial environmental decisions -- into senior civil service posts.
The transfer of political appointees into permanent federal positions, called "burrowing" by career officials, creates security for those employees, and at least initially will deprive the incoming Obama administration of the chance to install its preferred appointees in some key jobs.
Similar efforts are taking place at other agencies. Two political hires at the Labor Department have already secured career posts there, and one at the Department of Housing and Urban Development is trying to make the switch...
It takes a whole lot more faith to believe in evolution than it takes to believe in creation.
291Sally-* on November 18, 2008 at 12:10 AM
faith in humankind, faith in God the Almighty.
shall I put my faith in my chevy lumina to get me to work, or shall I put it in God to see I arrive?
Hebrews 11:1
Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see.
good morning, ggspartacus! I was just about to post a similar article on protecting positions.
cooling down here in the hudson valley essie. 25 or so last night.
Morning Dems!
ESME, you gave our secret away. We are all Robert! Poor Stevie will not know which way to turn! heehee. And just to show how very easily he is led, MN Thomass sent him an email about Johnny Boswell and told him it was Rj, and sure enough, our quick witted Stevie Bought it! My Goodness, guys like stevie prove that Evolution has not come all that far---some's brains are still those of the early reptilian family!
Stevie, if you will not accept Evolution because there are no fossils of early life procreating, then please save your beer cans and fly to the Smithsonian in DC. They have a wonderful exhibit , where they lay out every fossil next to the next one they evolved into, and it is very very easy to believe . Yes, old man, you too came from an ape, and you have the face and brain to prove it! :)
Morning Essie, gregg and YAYOBAMA,
It appears that the repukes in the Senate are going to block anything the Democrats do. I don't expect them to change in the 111th Congress. We still don't have their attention. When the rest of them are purged in 2010 we will definitely see an improvement. In the meantime, lay it on these repukes and make them look like the malcontents they are.
Today we are resurfacing four tennis courts. It's a little late in the year but the weather is cooperating. It was 72 yesterday.
So Lieberman is going to get away with spitting in our faces! After all the hard work we all put into making sure we got a Democratic majority, (still giving to GA, AK and MN Dem candidates to win), those Weak Democratic Senators decide to all hold hands and sing songs with Lieberman ! SOB-------This really pisses me off. I have faxed thru to Lieberman's office several letters, telling him if he had an integrity, was any kind of a man, he would remove himself, but of course, like other chickenhawks, he won't!
Morning Pam,
The repukes are obstructionists. I read on the AP that lieberman may keep his committee post. Sad.
I hate to break the troll's hearts so early in the morning, but Senator Kennedy is still alive and well!!!!!!!
Senator Kennedy Returns to Work
»
by: J. Taylor Rushing, The Hill
Sen. Edward Kennedy, accompanied by his wife, Victoria, arrived on Capitol Hill Monday to meet with his staff. (Photo: Stephen Crowley / The New York Times)
Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-Mass.) returned to work in the Senate Monday after spending the past six months battling brain cancer back home.
A smiling, upbeat Kennedy made his second public appearance on Capitol Hill since he was diagnosed with a brain tumor. He was accompanied by his wife and two dogs, and attended a meeting in the same Russell Office Building room where two of his brothers declared their presidential candidacies.
Stevie still plastering us with Global Warming stories, which, when finally PROVEN without a shadow of a doubt, he will say he was only 'taunting' us with. You see, this is how Stevie gets to come in here, swaggering and know-it-all lying, and then trys to get off the hook when shown to be a fool! He was just taunting us, didn't really mean it. How bout those predictions we took to the bank, huh???
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
here's that Co2 that is so good for us all, including trees and plants! ahhhh, I can smell it now! :)
Coal Power Projects On Hold Over CO2
good morning, greggrobert, esmerobert, yayrobert, sandyrobert, and the rest of the roberts!
greggrobert,
I've just started to get into reading CAP's site. I'll let y'all know what i think of their use of language at some point...probably very loudly if they are using conservative framing. :)
Now see, guys like Danny will go slop out some soup at a kitchen today, and figure that is his way of helping children eat. Don't raise his taxes though, to get food to these kids! NO SIR, just get them bused to his soup kitchen and he will feed them there!!!!
WASHINGTON -- New government figures show that almost 700,000 children went hungry in the United States at some point in 2007, up more than 50 percent from the year before to mark the highest point since 1998. And that's even before this year's sharp economic downtown, the Agriculture Department reported Monday.
The department's annual report on food security showed that during 2007 the number of children who suffered a substantial disruption in the amount of food they typically eat was more than double the 430,000 in 2006 and the largest figure since 716,000 in 1998.
PamRobert!
Hey, no problem about having your back yesterday...Stupid moron thinks because he cuts and pastes one item that no one will notice what he conveniently leaves out. I am sick of the little bitches coming here and pretending not to understand words just to try and get their kicks. Little fuckhead in Arizona is definitely going to regret it one day.
hi robertrobert. see what you have started. haha I'm loving it.
{{{GregL}}}
Unfortunetly, I have to give a handicap to the AZ troll, because of his mental deficiency. His posts show that he is a man of very low IQ, and sometimes I feel sorry for him. :)
OH, and for those that may have missed, it , it WAS Domingo that outed Bruno for being 4 different people. We emailed about it before he came out and confronted him. Again, Stevie's narcissism makes him want to be first !
rj, any man who can sit back and let children go hungry, is no man at all. Greedy Republicans do not care one single bit. Not even if these are the same children they stood at the abortion clinic and screamed at their mothers to let them be born!!!!
i figure if they handed out all that cash to banks and insurance companies why not throw 25 billion to the car industry if it will keep a few million people employed for awhile and maybe even get them past the worst of this republican economic crash...could it be the pelicans are so opposed to punish michigan and the industrial belt for not voting for them??? of course not it's all about principles!!
and domingo was mary. snicker
time for this robert to walk power walk and then head to the big city.
Psalm 119:105
Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light for my path.
Enjoy the day, everyrobert.
The man who was my boss for 30 years died yesterday. He was the salt of the earth type, and one of the finest men I ever knew. I never could figure out WHY he was a Conservative, but we used to have fun debating the issues. He was a Real Conservative, not one of these new hate filled neo-cons who justify illegal occupations and killings.
yeah, Danny, it is a put down, when guys like you think it takes the place of paying taxes to feed hungry children! And that buck a week your old lady throws in the church bucket is supposed to be your fair share too.
You guys squeal to bring them into the world, but then you do not want to feed or clothe them.You think slopping hash at the food bank takes the place of it. they would not BE AT the food bank, if not for guys like you. Never wanted to give them an even break all their lives. Or else now they are homeless veterans, because of your backing of this illegal invasion and occupation. Must be over 30,000 missing limbs now, thanks to you. And over 4200 cold in the ground. All that blood on your hands.
Oh, and that remark about canned spinach was from your hero, Stevie. that was HIS entire donation to the poor! Feel foolish now???
We need a new thread! This blog behaves better when there aren't so many comments in a thread!
What happened to Monday, anyway?
Good morning,
Why would anyone bet on oil when there is so much manipulation in the markets, like cartels?
And why would a country bet its future on oil, when it is clearly such a dirty business?
Oh yea, $.
-------------
Traders set for 2,000% return on oil bet
By Javier Blas
Published: November 17 2008 02:00 | Last updated: November 17 2008 02:00
Investors who placed summer bets that oil prices would fall below $100 a barrel are set to make huge profits today, with some speculators reaping a return of more than 2,000 per cent in less than six months.
The expiry of the December put options - derivatives that give holders the right to sell at a predetermined price and date - means some investors will be selling oil at prices as high as $100-$120 a barrel, well above Friday's close of $57.04 a barrel.
Traders warned the expiry was likely to trigger volatility in the oil market.
Olivier Jakob, of Swiss-based oil consultants Petromatrix, said the number of options to be delivered was set to be a record.
He said a net 500,000 contracts were likely to be delivered at the end of the trading in New York today, almost 80 per cent above the previous record set this summer and more than 10 times the average since January 2007.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/22213372-b447-11dd-8e35-0000779fd18c.html?nclick_check=1
And I heard a HuffPo post by Neil Young read on the radio yesterday about what conditions should be placed on the bailout and the future of American autos: produce green cars only. Make the cars but with no engines, and convert them to electrics until the US companies can produce the whole jalopy.
Respectfully,
Robert Young
Good morning, all.
TomN on November 18, 2008 at 11:05 AM
TomN,
The Democrats need to stop this irresponsible gambling of commodities. Speculation is what caused the Great Depression and the current mess.
We need a War on Speculation just like the War on Terrorism. They are one and the same thing as far as I'm concerned.
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