Evening Open Thread
Chat away...
Comments (74) «
RICHMOND, VA (AP) - Virginia's Republican chairman said Tuesday that his remark tying Democrat Barack Obama to Osama bin Laden during the presidential campaign was stupid, but he refused to apologize.During the campaign, GOP head Jeff Frederick told a small group of Republican volunteers that "both Barack Obama and Osama bin Laden have friends that have bombed the Pentagon."
The remark, a reference to Obama's ties years ago to 1960s-era radical William Ayers, was condemned by Democrats and Republicans after it was published in Time magazine...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28018265
Well Mr. Frederick, you are correct to point out that the remarks were stupid. And you wonder why you find the GOP in the minority now. This is a typical Republican dumbarse. Hopefully, the GOP won't fire him. We have a gubnetorial election in VA in 2009.
Good night fellow Democrats. Keep the Faith and keep the faith. Yes we can, yes we did, and yes we will!
cactus your the biggest idiot ON THE BLOG not far behind sally and burd turd then swirly but
SWIRLYEYEDOBAMABOT why are you here you worthless piece of shit go to republican sight
freak why dont you do your self get a lobotomies and you can gain a new perspective on life
yeah what you post is worse you hate everybody and we see it every night cement head
millions of people around the world that check this site on a daily basis for laughs, after reading WIRLYEYEDOBAMABOT stupid post eeveynight that are just nonsence
Obama Policymakers Turn to Campaign Tools
Thursday 04 December 2008
by: Ceci Connolly, The Washington Post
Network of supporters tapped on health-care issues.
Barack Obama's incoming administration has begun to draw on the high-tech organizational tools that helped get him elected to lay the groundwork for an attempt to restructure the U.S. health-care system.
Former senator Thomas A. Daschle, Obama's point person on health care, launched an effort to create political momentum yesterday in a conference call with 1,000 invited supporters culled from 10,000 who had expressed interest in health issues, promising it would be the first of many opportunities for Americans to weigh in.
The health-care mobilization taking shape before Obama even takes office will include online videos, blogs and e-mail alerts as well as traditional public forums. Already, several thousand people have posted comments on health on the Obama transition Web site.
"We'll have some exciting news about town halls, we'll have some outreach efforts in December," Daschle said during the call. And tomorrow, when he appears at a health-care summit with Sen. Ken Salazar (D-Colo.) in Denver, Daschle said, "we'll be making some announcements there."
It is the first attempt by the Obama team to harness its vast and sophisticated grass-roots network to shape public policy. Although the president-elect is a long way from crafting actual legislation, he promised during the campaign to make the twin challenge of controlling health-care costs and expanding coverage a top priority in his first term.
Daschle, who is expected to become the next secretary of health and human services, is waging the outreach campaign by marrying old-fashioned Washington-style lobbying and cutting-edge social-networking technologies. Although he has yet to be formally nominated, he has already met with more than 100 insiders, ranging from union leaders and the seniors group AARP to hospital executives and representatives of corporate America.
WIRLYEYEDOBAMABOT your brain melted and you left with empty head ha ha i still have my brain i dont eat ice cream anyway
sally i dont care go get a job or i forgot your stupid to get job
i knew bush would leave us with a mess in the middle east, a lot of soldiers dead and maimed for no good reason other than his own arrogance, a depleted environment, deregulated everything and so on but i didn't realize he would leave us with the worst economic collapse since the depression...worst president ever hardly captures how he will be remembered...perhaps one of the worst humans to ever walk the face of the earth is more like it...
your only retread here look in the mirror i ask you if you had job SWIRLYEYEDOBAMABOT but seem no all you can say stupid things about other people and not answer the question
Dusty i don't mean to be mean, but why do you not post anything with any substance to it? All you do is post to keep the trolls alive and well.
Post something with some substance to it, and leave the trolls alone.
why dont you go to the good will your self SWIRLYEYEDOBAMABOT and ask fora position on the conveyor belt sorting rags or untangling wire hangers.these job are probly to hard for you your to stupid even for simple jobs like these
God bless President Elect Obama, He's my man.
Oh i forgot screw the current Resident in Chief!
Its about time we got someone with some intelligence, and not a drunk and a dope addict. And a failure at everything that he has ever tried to do.
Good riddendence to the worst President in History, Jan. the 20th can't come soon enough.
The worst president in history belongs to the Chimp, not Carter.
Dusty don't get any ice cream Greg, if he does it will be bland made out of Minnesota Snow.
Why are you running off Dusty? Why is it you only show up when the trolls are here? Are you one of them in disguise? I'm beginning to wonder, understand I'm not to bright, but even idiots like me have inquiring minds.
Sally i have been busy, but just wanted to let you know, that i appreciate you reaching across the isle, and offering to send me a quart of home made syrup. Thanks!
Take care and have a good Christmas and a Happy New Year.
We got a lot of folks on this blog, that don't know how to reach across the isle. Its either their way or the HiWay!
Unlike, a lot of folks on this blog, I'm a fair person, and try to make amends with all. When you get my age maybe you all will understand, life is to short for ignorant argument. Their is a happy median for all.
That's the reason I love Obama he understands, the middle of the road, that a lot of people on this blog don't.
O.K. I'll lay back and relax, i guess i run everyone off.
Sally you sound like a typical Repo, drill baby drill. You like paying the terrorist's that you despise. So what is wrong with this scenario?
We got to get energy independent, thats whats wrong with it. Drill baby drill, is horseshit.
Drill baby drill, is OLD SCHOOL, the new School is Nat. Gas Vehicles, and Electric, and Hydrogen vehicles, and battery operated, even if you don't agree with green and clean technology. Why would any of us want to keep funding the terrorists, that your so worried about? Like i said drill baby drill, is old school.
Sally, if you can't change with the times, you'll, get left in the dust. Old school don't work in these times, you can change with it, or ge left, in the wind.
Sally if you can't see want Obama is going to do in his administration, with WIND POWER, and SOLAR POWER, And HYDREGEN POWER and ECT, you have not been paying attention, this will happen whether you like it or not. You can either wise up or get left in the wind.
Evening Chassie and Dusty,
I tuned into limpballs this morning and he was sniffling and carrying on. He either has a cold or he is using Cocaine.
drill baby drill" refers to our oil here at home. That is what will make us independent of Saudi oil
37Sally-* on December 4, 2008 at 09:16 PM
Are you crazy or what, we don't have enough oil here to fuel 10 percent of are energy needs.
"These new Green Mountain Boys have a people and community orientation that comes out of Vermont's tradition of direct democracy through the town meeting. Howard Dean's fifty state strategy is in essence an extension of the practice of direct democracy to party politics and electoral organizing. And it scares the hell out of the D.C. regulars and the corporate elites. It takes us beyond the culture of the expert --- the serious foreign policy expert from the northeast corridor, the Yale graduate organizing on behalf of janitors, Wall Street bankers trying to fix a system they broke --- to organizations and coalitions of ordinary people choosing leaders and solving problems on their own. It harnesses the new communication technologies to spread power and enable real conversations between those on the ground and those back in a state capital, D.C., or elsewhere.
For the D.C. and corporate elites, this model of direct democratic movement politics is very dangerous indeed."
Interesting post at Open Left about the establishment's take on Howard Dean.
And the kind of politics of Leahy, Jeffords, and Sanders as well as Dean.
Obama is picking the best of the best from my old alma mater. That traitor loo, bush's buddy, is unfortunately teaching there too.
"BERKELEY — U.S. President-elect Barack Obama announced his intention to nominate University of California, Berkeley, macroeconomist Christina D. Romer, an authority on monetary policy and business cycles, to chair the White House Council of Economic Advisers (CEA).
Romer is the Class of 1957 Garff B. Wilson Professor of Economics and has taught at UC Berkeley since 1988. She is also co-director of the monetary economics program at the National Bureau of Economic Research, and is a member of its Business Cycle Dating Committee, which assesses periods of economic recession and recovery.
Romer, an American Academy of Arts and Sciences fellow, has written extensively about monetary and fiscal policy, the causes of and sources of recovery from the Great Depression, and macroeconomic fluctuations over the 20th century. "I am convinced that every concept in economics can be interesting," she wrote in an essay accompanying her 1994 UC Berkeley Distinguished Teaching Award.
More..............
Good evening, Johne, I hope all is well with you and yours, YES! Johne, i never tune in to Limpnuts, if i come across him its a accident. How is the imbeciles Bates brothers doing? Are they up to their usual crap?
You need to check your facts. We have more oil here than all the middle East countries combined.
45Sally-* on December 4, 2008 at 09:33 PM
If that is true, then why have we been buying, and giving are money away for decades, and decades? And funding the terrorists?
the bates brothers haven't changed. They still call themselves expert economists and spew Bible verses.
Yhe ones calls himself a doctor of something, a banker, an oilman and whatever else he can lie about.
These two imbeciles are hopeless.
hannity today was praising chimp and extolling his virtues. Last time I looked chimp had no virtue at all and will end up in the gutter somewhere when Laura leaves him.
Bakken Oil Formation in North Dakota could hold as much as a trillion barrels of oil.
49Sally-* on December 4, 2008 at 09:42 PM
If that's true Sally, why are we not getting it, for are consumption, and please don't tell me we're holding it in reserve.
time I looked chimp had no virtue at all and will end up in the gutter somewhere when Laura leaves him.
53Johne on December 4, 2008 at 09:46 PM
Johne, all I can say is maybe, just maybe Laura will meet him at a cross roads like she killed her first boyfriend, and kill him to.
If that would happen I shall not shed a tear, but would rejoice, with the world in his death.
Ask the Democrats, they have been blocking off shore drilling and ANWAR drilling for those decades.
51Sally-* on December 4, 2008 at 09:44 PM
THAT DOG DON"T HUNT.
Geez, pay attention - they did it again this year by refusing to bring it to the floor for a vote.
58Sally-* on December 4, 2008 at 09:58 PM
O.K. Sally I'll make a compromise here, the Dems. have been blocking Drilling in An war for years, and years, but i agree with them. Their is much better alternative's that I spoke about in my previous posts. Why are you so gun hoe that drill baby drill is the only way to go? Their is other alternatives, as you know, and will come to past with the Obama administration, you can change with it or get left in the wind. Its your choice.
Good night everyone, my wife is calling me to come to bed. And who am I to tell her no?
There are no alternatives to oil. Maybe for cars that drive around in cities but not for trucks, buses, tractors, trains etc.. Even for cars though you are merely moving the pollution from the car to the power plant. It is pointless to drive tiny little electric cars when we have vast reserves of oil and the earth makes more everyday.
61Sally-* on December 4, 2008 at 10:13 PM
Sally your wrong their is alternatives, with Buses, and especially trucks, its Natural Gas, that we got a abundance of, of course the tech has to change to this kind of energy, check out T. Boone Pic kens web site. A Lot of cities have been running buses on Nat. Gas for years check out Atlanta Georgia. I'm sure there is other cities doing the same thing.
And as far as trains goes, I'm not sure what the alternatives their is, as far as freight trains goes. And i worked on the rail road for 38 years. But I'm positive that their is a alternative fuel of some kind.
Good night Sally, My best half is getting ready to kick my ass, so i got to go she's 10 years younger then I, so I'm at a disadvantage here, if you know what i mean.
Thanks for the debate. Talk to you later.
jeb bush blocked oil drilling in the Gulf of Mexico when he was governor of florida. last time I looked he was a neocon like his asshole brother.
the State of California has been running state vehicles on natural gas for at least fifteen years.
I also know that some city had Hydrogen powered buses more than twenty years ago.
chassie i went to be to be with friend and talk nice girl and then help put puzzle together
the worst president of the united states of america and one of the worst people to have ever lived says his long and meaningless goodbye:
http://blog.indecision2008.com/2008/12/04/jon-stewart-is-going-to-miss-president-bush/
seats dont get stolen there won fair as square when franken wins you scream he stole it sally your whiner republican stole senate seats by supressing the black vote in the south for decades
you cant cheat in minnesota but you have to count all the vote that you and coleman dont wantt to where has ther been stealing votes ? in minnesota
repelicans are thinking of letting the big three auto makers go under putting a few million more people out of work. i guess they don't plan on being a majority party again for a long, long time.
Editor's Note: The U.S. Geological Survey recently released its long-anticipated study revising its estimates of the Bakken formation. The report confirms the Bakken is the largest "continuous" oil accumulation ever assessed by the USGS... and has 25 times more oil than its previous estimate. The Bakken story is just heating up, and investors are now faced with an unprecedented opportunity to capitalize.
This is a crock of crap, as usual. Dug out from old distorted archives. Here is what Snopes says about it:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/gasoline/bakken.asp
Chassie----Never, Ever believe a word that this old man says.
He knows Nothing.
And as for your assertion about we should be reaching across the aisle (you mean like the Repugs did with us for the last 15 years, right?), then where do you suggest we start? Perhaps we meet them on giving Corporations tax breaks, and maybe, just maybe this time it will trickle down? Perhaps we should meet them and go bomb Iran off the map? How about we meet them on Roe v Wade, and we get rid of that silly right. Or some of those darn entitlements, like who needs Medicare or SS anyways. It is all about Personal Responsibility anyways!
This is not the same Republican Party of yesteryear, where maybe some good things for the country could be accomplished if we all worked together. Did you watch Chambliss speech, where he encourages the GOP Senators to all obstruct whatever the Dems bring out? He is not alone in that desire----watch how much they want to meet us half way across the aisle.
morning {{{{gregg}}}}
I was watching a TV segment the other day, and the expert on Global Warming was saying, that an intelligent person could not look at short term, with a frigid cold day, to try and disprove Global Warming. It has to be looked at over a longer period, for instance back 2 years, back 5 years, back 10 years, how much has melted and is gone to judge whether there is global warming or not. Photos and actual facts of what has been lost in the Artic, the Antartic, all prove without a doubt that we are in a period of Global Warming.
Like with his predictions, you KNOW the MN fool will come out when it has all been proven without a doubt----that he was merely taunting us, he didn't mean it at all! LOL
good morning pam. from the nytimes:
"Gov. Sarah Palin’s traveling makeup artist was paid $68,400 and her hair stylist received more than $42,000 for roughly two months of work, according to a new campaign finance report filed with the Federal Election Commission.
Ms. Palin’s makeup artist, Amy Strozzi — who was nominated for an Emmy award for her cosmetics work on the television show “So You Think You Can Dance?” — was paid $32,400 by Senator John McCain’s presidential campaign between Oct. 16 and Nov. 24, the period covered by the most recent reports filed with the commission..."
so i guess miss strozzi went from "so you think you can dance?" to " so you think you can think?"...remember all the noise about edwards haircut? seems like small potatoes compared to what the pelicans spent to try and put lipstick on a pig...
Gregg, I have noticed since the Alaskan might hunter, Ms. Palin's LOSS from the election, that her hair is stringy, and her make-up consists of two big peach colored balls on her cheeks. Betcha she misses those durn gals who use to work on her for hours!
I am waiting breathlessly for those RNC clothes to be put up for sale. I am dying to own that red leather jacket ! Good golly, I am willing to bet that cost a couple of thousand just by itself!
The nra lobbyists are going to be pissed at the repukes if they take away their machine guns. They will no doubt blame the Democrats like they have been doing for years.
"WASHINGTON (AP) -- The Justice Department is readying indictments that could send Blackwater Worldwide guards to prison for at least 30 years for their involvement in the deadly 2007 Baghdad shooting of Iraqi civilians, people close to the case said.
Charges could be announced as early as Monday in the shooting, which left 17 civilians dead and strained U.S. relations with the fledgling Iraqi government. People familiar with the charges said they may include an aggressive Reagan-era anti-drug law cracking down on assault weapons.
More................
pam, i was hoping to buy that alaskan state jet off e-bay but i can't seem to locate it...
let's make sure we push our elected reps to CRA all the way with all this bullshit bush is enacting as he leaves office...
"...After he’s inaugurated on Jan. 20, President Barack Obama should be able to shelf some of the newest rules before they go into effect– usually 30 to 60 days after they’re published in the Federal Register.
“I would expect that the Obama administration will do something similar to what the Bush administration did when it came in: Look through the books to see what regulations [it] does not like, and if possible, stop them from being published in the Federal Register,” says former EPA official Jason Burnett, a Carmel resident who helped raise money for Obama and Farr’s campaigns.
But once the rules have taken effect, the president can only reverse them through a cumbersome bureaucratic process that can take months or years.
That’s where Congress can step in.
Dems may tap a Clinton-era law, the Congressional Review Act of 1996, that allows a fast-tracked, filibuster-proof vote on new regulations within the first 15 legislative days of a new president’s term. The Democratic majorities in both the Senate and House of Representatives means that a party-line vote could repeal rules enacted within 60 legislative days of the last Congress’ adjournment– as early as last June. A veto by Obama would be unlikely.
California Sen. Barbara Boxer, who chairs the Senate Environment and Public Works Committee, is reportedly considering invoking the CRA. Boxer did not respond to the Weekly’s requests for comment. .."
We are taking it in the shorts again. Thanks bush. I suppose the repukes will let the auto makers go broke throwing 3,000,000+ people out of work. That will show those Democrats. How dare they vote for Obama.
Stock intended to eventually earn taxpayers a profit as part of the Bush administration's massive bank bailout has lost a third of its value - about $9 billion - in barely one month, according to an Associated Press analysis. Shares in virtually every bank that received federal money have remained below the prices the government negotiated.
Most of the Treasury Department's investments since late October have been in preferred bank stocks, more than $180 billion worth, with investments in giants like Citigroup and JPMorgan Chase, and many small community banks. But the government also negotiated options to buy up to 1.2 billion shares of common bank stock that was valued at $27 billion.
why SOMe one as arigant as sally get off telling me that if dont agree with him that im stupid he even dont live in minnesota why does he care what happens here
The nra lobbyists are going to be pissed at the repukes if they take away their machine guns. They will no doubt blame the Democrats like they have been doing for years.
Johne,
Morning paper here, has a big front page article on a lawsuit being brought against the Father and the Gun Club here, where an 8 year old boy was taken and let shoot an UZZI. Of course the kid could not control the gun, and it went backwards and blew his head off! Bet that Father was so proud of his kid, going to shoot an Uzzi! What hunting or self protecting the kid could do with that! And then of course, we have the Father who taught his kid how to shoot guns, and at 8 years old, he is now being tried for murder of same father!
And they wonder why we preach some gun control!!!
OH, and BTW, did you all see on TV where Georgie & Laura Bush are looking for a house in Dallas to move to in January!!!
OF COURSE, that old farm dump, all that brush cutting, etc was nothing more than for show, to try and make Bush into some kind of everyday, blue collar dude! One of the guys on TV was saying he bet the brush was even flown in for the photo shoots!
Nothing worse than a phoney lying Republican!
thAT sad about the kid where was this where can you get uzzi ?
Gregg, that jet was sold for FAR less than it's value, because of stupidity of the Palins.
Regarding this one, I am going to keep a Close eye on what the Palins end up reporting on their income tax for this year, because this is all Gifts!
RNC spends $180K on Palin and family
Salons and spas, including $350 at Escape Skin Care and Day Spa in New York, were the latest unusual expenses to appear in the Republican National Committee’s coordinated expenses account with the McCain-Palin campaign, according to November reports released late Thursday.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/20081205/pl_politico/16223;_ylt=AoaDaEiPAaA_ynhxey2i6q6yFz4D
shit, now they say they are going to give that red leather jacket and rest of all the clothes to charity???? There will be some homeless lady laying in an alley in that Jacket that I would give my eye teeth for?? Oh, well, it was probably way too big anyways.
Will Republicans win here, the only way they know how-----fraud, stealing, intimidation, Voter disenfranchising??????
"The discovery of uncounted and missing ballots has complicated the final days of the recount in Minnesota's U.S. Senate election, the closest Senate race this year.
With just a day left of counting, the campaigns for Republican Sen. Norm Coleman and Democratic challenger Al Franken found themselves in a tussle with state election officials over 171 uncounted ballots that were discovered in a precinct in Ramsey County, and the search for another 133 ballots that appear to have gone missing in a precinct in Minneapolis. Both areas are Democratic-leaning.
The Franken campaign cheered the discovery and counting of the Ramsey County votes earlier this week. That was followed by a terse statement today on the situation in Minneapolis, in which lead attorney Marc Elias said, "We won't stand for the disenfranchisement of 133 Minnesota voters, and neither will the people of this state," and demanded that election officials "find the ballots."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/cq/20081205/pl_cq_politics/politics2993439;_ylt=AnakDpQrlHp.wLufkVFYYvayFz4D
Ah yes. The good old Nixon / Ford years. More proof that Pugs can't do anything good.
Doo-Bee-Doo-Bee-Doo
2008 - 0150 = 1993
Nixon? Ford?
Hey, good morning, everyone.
My meeting was canceled this morning, so it's like a snow day today for me. Yippee. Now what to do with all unexpected time? Wish I had got the call before driving half-way there.
Did you catch how Bush used the term "do-over" when talking to Charlie Gibson about the Iraqi invasion?
Interesting choice of words, don't you think? His whole life he's been using that excuse or similar ones to explain his failures. It also was an admission of guilt...Bush chose to paint his own legacy as a mistake? Freudian slip?
The other thing that strikes me as odd is that nobody in the MSM is talking about the legacy of our other president, Mr. Fourth Branch.
Cheney is keeping low under the radar...as usual. But don't we owe him the courtesy of bringing his dubious actions out into the light of day and examining them more closely as he leaves office? He took on so many responsibilities....that didn't belong to him.
I'd like to see an open, spirited discussion on 24/7 entertainment news about the Man Who Would Be King and how he manipulated, lied, and grabbed power and wealth wherever he went. This guy was been more diabolical than Rasputin.
Where is the Oliver Stone movie? I bet actors would kill to have that role. Move over Richard III. Dickie is one frickin' bastard villain for all times.
So, yeah.
Nixon and Ford.
Doo-Bee-Doo-Bee-Doo
Oh, I see, I was mistakenly going by the link you posted:
Unemployment surges; hits 15 year high
Because 2008 - 15 = 1993
Gentlemen, instead of arguing percentages let's look at the numbers in real human terms:
Employers cut 533K jobs in Nov., most in 34 years
By JEANNINE AVERSA, AP Economics Writer Jeannine Aversa, Ap Economics Writer
WASHINGTON – Skittish employers slashed 533,000 jobs in November, the most in 34 years, catapulting the unemployment rate to 6.7 percent, dramatic proof the country is careening deeper into recession....
"These numbers are shocking," said economist Joel Naroff, president of Naroff Economics Advisors. "Companies are sharply reacting to the economy's problems and slashing costs. They are not trying to ride it out."
The unemployment rate would have moved even higher if not for the exodus of 422,000 people from the work force. Economists thought many of those people probably abandoned their job searches out of sheer frustration...
The U.S. tipped into recession last December, a panel of experts declared earlier this week, confirming what many Americans already thought.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081205/ap_on_bi_ge/financial_meltdown
Imagine the numbers that will be unemployed when the auto industry goes bottom up? Just how many people provide goods and services for those 2-3 million auto workers? Their suppliers? Their dealers? Those that that repaired those cars? Those that provided the gasoline and fixed the roads those cars drove on?
GM in many ways was the engine that kept this country moving....kept Americans moving. The U.S. is going to come to a grinding halt...both literally and figuratively. Even Toyota posted a 37% decrease in sales this last quarter. All those jobs in the Deep South are going to go belly up, too, as the depression deepens just like the ones in Detroit.
This is the reality that the Congressional Republicans can't face...just like they still spin about WMD and al Queada terrorists that were not there.
Bush is planning for his new life in Dallas in little more than a month without any remorse over what he has done to this great nation. Laura is busy decking the halls at the White House oblivious to the rising dismay around her in the nation. I bet she's spending hundreds of thousands decorating that new house in Dallas just like they decorated Sarah Palin and her family.
The most startling fact remains...The Bush Crime Family and the Congressional Republicans took great care to protect their K Street and Wall Street friends from the economic mess they made...even as they clean out their desks and scurry out of town like rats trying to avoid The Plague they created.
How do they think they can go back home after the damage they have done and avoid the suffering that will surround them? Did I hear someone say, "Bah humbug"?
At least they are leaving. There is much to be thankful this holiday season after all.
bbl.
I never said a word about Clinton. I just thought your math was off.
Good morning,
The US's entry point into the third industrial revolution? Or the exit point of an empire hell-bent on getting the worst deal in the blood-for-oil business? Opportunity for dawnish change:
----------
Sunset carmakers should look to a new dawn
By Jeremy Rifkin
American, European and Chinese carmakers are calling on governments to come to their aid with a large infusion of public funds and warn that if help is not forthcoming, they could face collapse. While some politicians favour a bail-out, fearing a catastrophic blow to the economy, others argue that the companies should be cut loose and allowed to survive or perish in the open market. There is another way to approach the problem, but it would necessitate a radical change in perspective about what is happening in the motor industry and what should be done about it.
The introduction of the internal combustion engine and the highway infrastructure marked the beginning of the oil era and the second industrial revolution in the 20th century, just as the introduction of the steam engine, the locomotive, and the railway infrastructure marked the beginning of the coal era and the first industrial revolution in the 19th century.
The second industrial revolution is heading into the sunset and its prime energy and technology are on “life support”. The dramatic rise of the price of oil over the past few years signals the beginning of the endgame, not only for gas-guzzling cars, but also for the internal combustion engine itself.
The reality is that growing demand for oil has been bucking up against a limited and dwindling supply. The result was steeper prices, which created an inflationary spiral across the logistics and supply chain, putting a damper on global consumption, especially as oil began to tip over $100 a barrel. We hit the firewall of “peak globalisation”. This is the point at which the global economic engine stalls, the economy contracts and energy prices fall because the world is using less oil. The motor industry is the early warning system that tells us we are approaching the twilight of the second industrial revolution.
So what do we do? We need to shift the conversation from rescues and bail-outs of the internal combustion engine to research, development and deployment of electric and hydrogen fuel-cell plug-in vehicles powered by renewable energy. The shift in our energy regime and automotive technology is the entry point to a third industrial revolution and a post-carbon economy in the first half of the 21st century.
~snip~
By positioning the motor industry at the centre of an infrastructure shift from the second to the third industrial revolutions, we begin to change the public debate from bailing out companies to how best to invest in a new economic game plan for the world.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4422eab4-bfb0-11dd-9222-0000779fd18c.html?nclick_check=1
100
Doo-Bee-Doo-Bee-Doo on December 5, 2008 at 10:37 AM
If they don't help the auto industry, that's going to be a just a drop in the bucket.
It isn't only the auto industry that will be going down.
Our economy is a lot more intertwined than that. The auto industry is not a stand alone entity, and neither is the rest of the economy.
The auto industry is a base industry. You have sub contractors, who supply generators, tires, rearview mirrors, headlights, and a whole host of other parts that get assembled into the cars, that the auto manufacturers don't make. If the Big Three goes down they will also go down, since the foreign automakers ship in the majority of parts to assemble their vehicles here. They have their own sub contractors overseas.
All the employees of both the auto manufacturing plants and the sub contractors get paid, go out and spend money on food, clothing, housing, medical care, and entertainment.
A conservative estimate is that each base industry job provides 5 other jobs in other areas. That is also true for the sub contractors. It means that grocery stores, appliance dealers, home improvement stores, clothing stores, electronics stores, auto dealerships, and others will be closing down or laying off their employees. Even Wal-Mart and their Chinese slave labor suppliers will feel the pain.
It will be like a big dirty snowball, rolling farther and farther and getting bigger and bigger.
And that doesn't even consider what the loss of that much of our manufacturing capability will do to our national security. Our manufacturing capability is what allowed us to win WWII. What happens if we need to pull our butts out of the fire again, and we don't have that capability?
Don't say it wouldn't happen again, they also said that we'd never have another Depression either.
This fellow puts up an argument to back up the statement, but it is hardly exhaustive:
--------
The U.S. Military as an Oil Acquisition Service
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x4583286
they also said that we'd never have another Depression either.
109
Butte on December 5, 2008 at
But Butte, we have Prozac now -even better than Soma. But it's not such a brave new world, after all.
And Japan and China and many other countries have tarrifs and other forms of protection for key industries like autos.
Businesses have just free-traded away jobs and manufacturing for years to get labor concessions. Just for what? Global economy all linked in depression when the gas engine stalls with no plan b ready?
Hello everyone. Just wanted to share my latest effort - a site that compiles all the high quality Obama wallpapers in one place. I'll be adding new wallpapers each day (6 were added today).
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