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Iraq!
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Iraq is a waste in my opinion. I dont think anyone knows why the f*** we are still there. Although I am no better, i have no sugestions of how to pull out and still save what we have acomplished there. Anyone have an opinion? C'mon people speak up!

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IRAQ
By Marek Oct 19th 2006 at 10:44 am EDT
I agree....its a waste for us to be in iraq and we went in there for the wrong reasons so wht the hell are we doing there now
  
well too bad
By Patrick Oct 19th 2006 at 10:48 am EDT
The sad fact of the matter is that we cant leave. We went in and did it all wrong. We did a complete takeover of the government and threw the country right into what comes very close to a civil war. If we leave now the Muslim world will win. If we leave now Iraq has no chance of haveing a decent goevernment(not that they have much chance now). We wont leave for the longest time because everyone has their own plan and no one is willing to comprimise them. The sad fact is that our gov. has failed us yet again.
Re: well too bad
By D. Tree Oct 19th 2006 at 5:21 pm EDT
The idea that we can't leave without making things worse is false. It is a FEAR, not a reality.

The reality is that Iraq is following the same pattern of all guerrilla conflicts and "suicide insurgencies."

The best thing we can do for the Iraqi people and our soldiers is to leave now. I guarantee you the country will stabilize more rapidly once we redeploy.

We asked out troops to topple Saddam and enable a constitutional democracy... they've done that and they did it well.

We did not ask them to become Iraqi policemen and POLITICIANS, nor did we ask them to become sitting ducks in a civil war.

It's time to honor the sacrifice of our sons and daughter by getting them out of there.

Bush/Cheney and their private contractors are just going to have to take what money they have already made and be satisfied with that.
  
my 2 cents...
By snakelips Oct 19th 2006 at 11:25 am EDT
I think the immediate value of the war in Iraq is that it is concentrating terrorists there. I would much rather fight them over there than over here. Long term, if you guys on the left would have a little patience and vision, the idea is to plant democracy and freedom in the middle east. That benefits them because the people could live out their lives without a dictator or a theocracy. It benefits us in that we will have an ally and hopefully a free state trading partner in the middle east. I know you on the left HATE Bush, so I wonder what your opinion would be if Kerry were president and invaded Iraq. Regardless, that's not the point of this discussion. If you are really looking for reasons why we are in Iraq, I just gave you a few.
Re: my 2 cents...
By D. Tree Oct 19th 2006 at 5:11 pm EDT
This is ridiculous reasoning.

"Fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them here" is NOT a strategy, it is a SLOGAN.

Slogans and "vision" as you call it do not win wars. Get with reality.

The Troops have done their job. It's time to redeploy.
Re: my 2 cents...
By Patrick Oct 19th 2006 at 8:54 pm EDT
ok D tree...what do you think we should do?
Re: my 2 cents...
By D. Tree Oct 19th 2006 at 10:21 pm EDT
Redeploy.

It's time for Iraqis to take responsibility back for their country.

We can't be their policemen and politicians.

The troops have done their job, and they've done it well.

They toppled the dictatorship and caught Saddam.

They completed the search for WMD's.

They ensured elections and the formation of a government.

Its time to {{{Bring them Home}}}
Re: my 2 cents...
By snakelips Oct 19th 2006 at 10:57 pm EDT
I believe that redeploying now would allow the terrorists in Iraq to surge and overthrow the fragile democratic government we've helped form and show them once again that if they just badger us long enough, we'll fold. Our presence there helps stabilize the situation, much like you'd stake a new tree you've planted. Please explain to me the benefits of redeploying. I suspect the real reason you'd like to see a pull out is to make Bush look bad. I don't think that is worth all the bad consequences. Let's stick with it and have a stable ally and friend in the middle east. Bush will be gone in a couple of years, so try to think beyond that.

Thanks,
snakelips
Re: my 2 cents...
By D. Tree Oct 20th 2006 at 11:45 am EDT
How many times must one explain something so simple? Read my post again if you want reasons to redeploy.

I don't know where your obsession with Bush is coming from, but this is about War and very real strategies and consequences. this is not politics. Politics is is what you are asking our military men and women to do and that's not part of their job: that's a job for the Iraqis and world leaders not our troops.

Am I to believe you are one of the folks that thinks Vietnam could have been "won" if we just "believed more in the war?" Wishful thinking doesn't win wars. Practical thinking does.

This is not about psychology or "planting trees." America has inspired countless revolutions and democracies simply BEING AMERICA: a free and open democracy where all people are equal and have a chance to succeed. You don't spread democracy with force, just look at the history books.

I don't know why people are so concerned with "appearances," this is about the reality of war and suicide insurgencies. the fact is, the mission WAS accomplished when the Iraqi's had their elections. We can't babysit them forever, and they'll never take control of their own country unless we give them the opportunity.

Our troops did their job, now it's time for the Iraqis to do their part.
Re: my 2 cents...
By D. Tree Oct 20th 2006 at 12:11 pm EDT
BTW, I recommend checking this book out... it replaces speculation with empirical data on suicide insurgencies.

Link