And to all a Good night!
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Gold
By Jan CO Jun 14th 2008 at 7:52 pm EDT
Even I don't find that one funny, not when it comes to POW's. I consider all U.S. POW's hero's. That's the only issue I have bashing McCain, everything else is fair game...except his kids and mom of course.
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Re: Gold
By Jan CO Jun 14th 2008 at 8:02 pm EDT
you missed this discussion earlier today kobe, it'll answer your question Link
Re: Gold
By The One Called Goldstein Jun 14th 2008 at 7:59 pm EDT
Thats ok but there are serious questions about McCains account of what happened in Hanoi. Vietnam Veteran groups question his honesty and call him the songbird. If you Google, McCain Traitor, you'll be surprised at what is in question.

Not only did he block release of the transcripts of his many broadcasts in support of the North Vietnamese, but he stopped cold further efforts to find POW/MIA's.

These are claims from Veterans, not me.
Re: Gold
By Obama/Biden4highserenity Jun 14th 2008 at 8:04 pm EDT
Jan
I am lucky enough to KNOW many heros. Most right here in my own neighborhood.
I think what we need here is a definition of what is a Hero to you?
There are some POW's that were not heros.
They went to WAR with a different agenda----

I have studies McCains background and he in no way shows up on my hero meter.

While dropping bombs, nor in his personal life.
  
Indeed
By Joe Meeker Jun 14th 2008 at 7:52 pm EDT
And not only did he get captured, but he was one of the biggest talkers once captured.
Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Deleted by admin
Re: Talk is cheap.
By Joe Meeker Jun 14th 2008 at 8:27 pm EDT
McCain was beaten and stabbed during his initial capture. Once he was put into prison though he was operated on by an excellent surgeon and was treated extremely well by most regards. He talked as a repayment for his excellent treatment.
  
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Re: cancer
By The One Called Goldstein Jun 14th 2008 at 8:02 pm EDT
Think what you want, the questions are there and Vietnam Veterans raise those questions. Not every POW in the Hanoi Hilton made broadcasts for the Enemy.

You can follow Blind obedience to the Military if you choose.

Does that remind you of another point in History!
Try around 1939-1945.
Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Deleted by admin
Re: cancer
By Obama/Biden4highserenity Jun 14th 2008 at 8:09 pm EDT
yea----let's talk about his million dollar health care that we paid for and he doesn't think is good enough for we who pay for his and ALL his billionaire family.
Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Deleted by admin
  
Personal attacks on others will not be tolerated. Deleted by admin
Re: Very poor taste!
By The One Called Goldstein Jun 14th 2008 at 8:23 pm EDT
Heres one of the links that made me think hard about McCain.
Again, I didn't make this up.
Go check it out if you really want to judge for yourself.

Link
Re: Very poor taste!
By Obama/Biden4highserenity Jun 14th 2008 at 8:32 pm EDT
Did you have a brother who died at the Hanoi hilton, because he was never treated, and never sang about his brothers plans and positions?
A brother who was in the trenches, and not privilaged to fly planes above the fray?

Did you have a loved one that was MIA when McCain was fighting against the MIA families who were asking for help?

Did you have a loved one, that wanted all the Hanoi Hilton records released, and McCain fought against it because he doesn't want the records to exposed?

You are VERY POOR TASTE as you point your finger and continually contradict yourself.
  
If I were a Republican
By Mark in LA Jun 14th 2008 at 8:36 pm EDT
like DemHypocracy or jenniforhillary,
This is the type of post I'd put up.
It makes us all look bad.
I disavow your tactics.
Republicans win "at all costs," becuase they have no conscious to worry about.
We are different.
  
My opinion
By Hollywood Jun 14th 2008 at 9:07 pm EDT
McCain was in the military. He was shot down, he was injured and captured. He let the enemy use him for propoganda purposes for whatever reason. If it was because he was going to die, then just say it. He talked under duress and fear of torture/death.

But don't call him a "hero".

The Vietnam Veterans Against McCain group points out something which I think is relevant. There were hundreds of thousands of "grunts" who did maybe 7,000 hours of combat duty in the jungles of Vietnam getting shot at every day. They didn't get a bunch of medals for doing it, and nobody except their families call them "heroes". But John McCain received approximately 1.5 medals of valor for every hour he spent in combat - all of which were dropping bombs from an airplane - he got shot at once. And he is a "war hero" - because??????

I had an uncle who was captured by the Germans during WW2 in 1941 and spent the rest of the war in Europe in a POW camp. He and the other men of lower ranks were treated horribly. He didn't give the Germans any information in exchange for special treatment. Yet nobody called him a "hero" except his loved ones.

Call McCain a veteran. Give credit to him for signing up for active duty, whatever his motives. He didn't have to follow family tradition, and I imagine his father would have gotten him out of serving in Vietnam if he really didn't want to go.

But just give credit where credit is due. No more, no less. He's no "war hero", he's just a guy who went to war, like millions of other Americans past and present.
many thanx
By luckeyduckey Jun 15th 2008 at 12:59 am EDT
for your lucid discussion of McCain's wartime experience. There must be something a little more in one's conduct under duress to deserve the reputation of being a "hero". This kind of automatic upgrading lessens the respect given the title. Actually what you have described does not seem to fall into this category. I guess one would expect a hero to exhibit courage under fire or the equivalent. This is only my opinion--i am no authority on heroism.
  
Don't sink to the Swiftboater's Level
By John Dukovich Jun 18th 2008 at 2:55 pm EDT
The Swiftboaters took John Kerry's heroic military service and mocked it. As a veteran, I was disgusted to watch other veterans say that Kerry did not earn medals and was only in Viet Nam to bolster his political aspirations. In fact, John Kerry was quite heroic, even beaching his boat to go on the extreme offensive against a shore-based machine gun post (and quite possibly saving many lives by that one action).

Leave McCain's service alone. Regardless of the differing accounts of what he did or did not say and do in the Hanoi Hilton, unless you were there you can't know for sure. Additionally, after 5 years of torture I think most people would not be themselves and would say just about anything to get out.

By attacking McCain's military record, you look like a Swiftboat Scumbag. I would like to see an election won without resorting to Karl Rove's disingenuous tactics.

McCain is doing enough damage to himself by promoting offshore drilling, faux actions like the gas tax holiday, and offering more tax cuts to the rich. All you have to do is repeat McCain's own words to show how out of touch, unfit to govern, and irrelevant he is.