Post from Michael Link's Blog:
A quick note
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I think I'm going to start deleting double-posts when I see them. While I understand that sometimes your posts get pushed off the main blog page too quickly, the double-posts only make things worse by causing one more post to go off the page.

However, I'd like your thoughts on this, first.

UPDATE: One issue is that people sometimes write great posts that people not online at the time might miss. So maybe the solution is for us to start a "Diary Rescue" that takes good posts and adds them all into one post, which would hopefully get recommended.

It'd need to be not just by people who support one candidate, so it would have stuff in favor of both of them. Otherwise, we'll have competing diary rescues which diminishes it.

Thoughts on that? Then we wouldn't have as great a need for duplicate posts as we currently have.

Reader Comments
  
To be clear
By Michael Link Apr 29th 2008 at 9:50 am EDT
It's already against the rules, but I often give people a pass so long as the post isn't "too" repetitive (sometimes people post the same thing 10 times, literally).

This is just a question of enforcement, then.
Re: To be clear
By illinoismel Apr 29th 2008 at 10:01 am EDT
Would this be inclusive of posts that are a couple of weeks or longer old?
Re: To be clear
By Michael Link Apr 29th 2008 at 10:14 am EDT
Nope.
Re: To be clear
By SemperFiWM Apr 29th 2008 at 10:16 am EDT
Is there anyway that this site will ever use a forum type blog? Where there are different topics and you post your blog under that topic? That way if there is an Issues topic, then only issues are under it. Then you can have the %$#@* topic and people can burn away the night and each other.

Just a thought.
Re: To be clear
By SemperFiWM Apr 29th 2008 at 10:22 am EDT
Oops, I guess the %$#@* topic would be the Candidates topic. ;-)
  
DELEYE THIS!
By Jackie McIntosh Apr 29th 2008 at 9:55 am EDT
NOTHING ELSE TO SAY EXCEPT i DON'T LIKE SPEECH POLICE AND I DION'T LIKE FACISTS.

DOUBLE POSTS OR IDEAS YOU DON'T LIKE?

DELETE THISD.....
Re: DELEYE THIS!
By AnneK Apr 29th 2008 at 10:49 am EDT
Relax, Jackie. Breathe. Mike's not the enemy. He's trying to make the blog function better for everyone. If you have a suggestion, make it. He'll listen.
Re: DELEYE THIS!
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:41 am EDT
Even you believe in speech police, and I will prove it: should the spam from the auto-loan person be deleted when it is posted again?
  
.
By annie b (mcliberal) Apr 29th 2008 at 9:55 am EDT
i think it is a rule that should be enforced. i don't like seeing the same post in a two-hour time frame.
Re: .
By SemperFiWM Apr 29th 2008 at 9:56 am EDT
aye
Re: .
By Vidya Apr 29th 2008 at 11:27 am EDT
ditto
Micheal
By FreedomOfSpeech Apr 29th 2008 at 10:07 am EDT
I think that what's worse than an occassional double posting , is when someone posts ten times in a row , one sentence posts with a link as if that's worthy to be called an blog entry. I've seen this a lot. Like , they will post a title , and then post a link . They do it like 10 to 15 times in a row. If I wanted to read every story of the New York Times , I would just visit their website.

:)
Re: Micheal
By Bill Dickson Apr 29th 2008 at 10:14 am EDT
Give us a break fos. You are attacking annie b, who post links to some interesting stuff. Takes up a lot less space than your multi-picture junk.
Re: Micheal
By FreedomOfSpeech Apr 29th 2008 at 10:16 am EDT
Hey, I only post pictures because some people can't comprehend text. You know , because of the "different" learning patterns and all ?

;p
Weighing the merit of posts...
By Darlene (DEC) Apr 29th 2008 at 11:02 am EDT
annie, fos. annie, fos. give me annie any day! ;-)
Re: Weighing the merit of posts...
By FreedomOfSpeech Apr 29th 2008 at 11:17 am EDT
You mean ,

Clinton , Obama , Clinton , Obama ?
Take Annieb's post anyday....
By Vidya Apr 29th 2008 at 11:30 am EDT
No contest
Re: Weighing the merit of posts...
By Darlene (DEC) Apr 29th 2008 at 11:47 am EDT
I mean

annie = discernible useful information

verses

FOS = hate spewed crap
Re: Weighing the merit of posts...
By ... Apr 29th 2008 at 2:09 pm EDT
oh my!
Re: Weighing the merit of posts...
By Mike Apr 29th 2008 at 10:20 pm EDT
Where is the love
Where is the love
Where IS the love?
Re: Weighing the merit of posts...
By AnneK Apr 30th 2008 at 3:11 am EDT
Where is the love, to shelter me? Crimson Idol. Best metal album ever.
Re: Micheal
By illinoismel Apr 29th 2008 at 10:21 am EDT
Thank you Bill, you beat me to it.
  
I've also noticed that
By Maggie B. Apr 29th 2008 at 9:56 am EDT
sometimes a post may have a good point and you'd like to see others comments and then other posts come behind it sometimes from the same people and it knocks it off. I wonder sometimes if this is intentional. Just my thoughts.
  
DELETE ME!!!
By Jackie McIntosh Apr 29th 2008 at 10:02 am EDT
This site is becoming increasingly anti-free speech.

Delete me altogether, it would make alot of people happy and I could walk away from this party free and clear.
Re: DELETE ME!!!
By Maggie B. Apr 29th 2008 at 10:08 am EDT
Jackie, you post things of interest. I don't think this post refers to yours.
Re: DELETE ME!!!
By Jackie McIntosh Apr 29th 2008 at 10:14 am EDT
Doesn't matter.

I'm not just out to protect my speech.
Re: DELETE ME!!!
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:17 am EDT
Managing blog sites does not limit your free speech. No one has Constitutional rights to say whatever they want, wherever they want. I think it's time to review "free speech" laws and rights as related to public and private places.
  
I dont like it either
By Re elect McKinley Bailey Apr 29th 2008 at 10:07 am EDT
I believe that there should be an equal chance for publicity
Re: I dont like it either
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:44 am EDT
How is this not egalitarian?
  
You know what
By Maggie B. Apr 29th 2008 at 10:11 am EDT
sometimes posts are post at times when I'm not online. Generally doing the day people know that there is maybe more on line so they post them again. I don't mind that.
  
re
By Bill Dickson Apr 29th 2008 at 10:17 am EDT
Multiple post are a major pain in the rear. The reason all the post are saved is so we can go back and see what we missed. That works fine. With all the misinformed, hateful, trollish, and plain stupid stuff that is being posted lately, once is enough.
Re: re
By illinoismel Apr 29th 2008 at 10:25 am EDT
The problem with that sometimes is the inability to go back to the same page if you make a comment. As you have seen, the back button creates double posts sometimes when people don't know what they are doing. If you post on page 3, then you have to go back to the home page and go through the whole shootin' match to get back to page three. (If this makes any sense). Nature of the beast I reckon.
Re: re
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:46 am EDT
I always open the post in a new tab and just leave it open. It's hard to find where you were otherwise, as you've said.
  
To address your questions
By AnneK Apr 29th 2008 at 10:41 am EDT
As always - first things first: thanks for the job you're doing, Mike.

Okay next. Multi-posting is a hassle, and definitely contributes to the problem of posts getting pushed off the page and into oblivion. Yes, enforcing that rule is a great idea.

Here's another point. Sometimes you see a super long comment written on a post, and then posted as its own individual post, and then spammed on several other posts as a comment... any chance we could deal with that?

I think the forum suggestion is a great one. Then if you're me, you can read all the environment posts and skip all the candidate stuff. Or whatever floats your boat.
Re: Diary-Rescue
By AnneK Apr 29th 2008 at 10:48 am EDT
I forgot... that's brilliant! Do it!
Re: To address your questions
By Retired Army Apr 29th 2008 at 11:11 am EDT
I like this idea also. Multiple posts are being used consistently to push others off. A timer would be great so that one person can't post a new one withing the same hour or hours.

Also the star ratings should not allow the poster to give themselves a boost!
Re: To address your questions
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:49 am EDT
The timer idea is definitely a good one.
Re: To address your questions
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:51 am EDT
A forum set-up will only work if a moderator who is willing to put up with the clueless who are unclear about what their free-speech rights are actively polices them. Otherwise, you'll have people who post to hundreds of groups posting across all the forums for all the same faulty and arrogant reasons they give now.
Re: To address your questions
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 12:06 pm EDT
Invoking logic *and* common sense? On PB? Thanks for the morning laugh.
Re: To address your questions
By SemperFiWM Apr 30th 2008 at 12:42 am EDT
We could have several moderators. I'll nominate you and AnneK. Afterall, you guys are insane enough to read through thousands of blogs ;-)
  
A brief note
By Mike W Apr 29th 2008 at 10:49 am EDT
You seem to want to help those too lazy to read all of what's on
Link
and then too lazy to go to what is on the next page at
Link
etc.

Yes, please let us know and please do delete all duplicate postings found.

Mike W
Tulsa+
Who tries to at least glance at all posts
  
.
By Jackie McIntosh Apr 29th 2008 at 10:52 am EDT
Give me a break!
Re: .
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:52 am EDT
Should spam be deleted?
  
R double comments ...
By Shopman Apr 29th 2008 at 10:54 am EDT
OK?
  
R double comments...
By Shopman Apr 29th 2008 at 10:55 am EDT
OK?
Re: R double comments...
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:15 am EDT
fartsack
Re: R double comments...
By AnneK Apr 29th 2008 at 11:17 am EDT
Oh see ? Now I have to say fartsack because you started that.....
Re: R double comments...
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:30 am EDT
ok - more points to win the trip to Pluto!
  
Maybe you could upgrade
By Maggie B. Apr 29th 2008 at 11:14 am EDT
this blog so as to go back to that date instead of having to scroll in order of date back and back and date. If we know it was posted on this date we could possibly click to that date maybe even am or pm. I don't know what would be involved with this. Just a suggestion.
  
.
By annie b (mcliberal) Apr 29th 2008 at 11:23 am EDT
i don't think it's valid to ask the blog to do your work for you. i make a point of writing down the last blog i read before logging off. the next day, i read all the blogs until i get to the one i had last read. this prevents me from writing about the same thing someone else has already written (remember the day we had four blogs about springsteen endorsing obama? sheesh.) if you cannot take the time and effort to read the blogs, it seems rather hypocritical to complain. there should be some sense of personal responsibility here. this is supposed to be a web community.
Re: .
By Vidya Apr 29th 2008 at 11:44 am EDT
yes, that's a good point, it could require a bin of topics....select here if you want to rant and read about Wright, select here if you want to hoot and holler about Bruce,...select here if you've discovered something to raise skepticism on... or on....., or select here if you want to ....ya da yada...


Except that does defeat the purpose of exposing ourselves to what we would ordinarily not write ourselves... and while redundancy is a problem, it seems to occur mainly with those who are new to the site... How about a welcome wagon message to each new member... multiple posting limits, reposting time limits, civil behavior towards other bloggers...etc... so that it is an invitation to elevate standards rather than a limitation of options.

There are exceptions to every rule... am a Springsteen lover... and can easily see why there may have been a few blogs, expressing similar excitement, am cool with that... I do feel, however, that it would be helpful to stick to the topic of candidates and issues, good or bad, without taking criticisms of the candidates personally. That seems to be the most challenging aspect, as well as distracting and nonproductive.
Re: .
By Darlene (DEC) Apr 29th 2008 at 11:49 am EDT
Yup annie, I do the same thing. One thing, I would like to be able to save a post in progress. I get interrupted alot during the day since I work at home.
  
Diary Rescue
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:29 am EDT
Excellent idea! Perhaps you mods could do a weekly post with that week's top ten rated posts?
Daily reposts are a nuisance
By average guy Apr 29th 2008 at 11:38 am EDT
Good idea Mike.

Daily reposts are a painful waste of our time.
Hourly reposts are an insult.
Spamming does not equal freedom of speach to me.
Re: Diary Rescue
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:46 am EDT
I take back my idea.....people have already been exposed to the top 5 rated posts on a daily basis....I like the other ideas of Diary Rescue perhaps being on topic points or issue related.
Re: Diary Rescue
By Michael Link Apr 29th 2008 at 11:51 am EDT (Updated Apr 29th 2008 at 11:56 am EDT)
I'd do it myself, but:

(1) I can't promote candidate blog posts, given that I have to be completely neutral. There's no way to do this without having at least one person concerned that there's bias to what I'd select.

(2) I think a team of people would be better, anyway. Plus, in the comments of the post, everybody could post stuff they wrote that they like. So it's not just about what gets in the main part of the post, but also a place for everybody to share stuff they want others to read.

Somebody should start a post just about this idea and organize it.
Re: Diary Rescue
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:56 am EDT
Somebody should start a post just about this idea and organize it.

If we can keep from bickering long enough to do it.
Re: Diary Rescue
By SemperFiWM Apr 30th 2008 at 12:47 am EDT
There can be diaries by topic. That way the gossipy people can stick to the candidate bashing diary while the issues one can stay relatively nice. Of course, there would have to be a pro-someone diary and another for the other candidate.

Who is going to volunteer?
  
No Candidate Posts
By Arius Apr 29th 2008 at 11:38 am EDT
At this point, it would have to be a pretty outstanding post to be about a candidate and warrant being included in diary rescue. If only issue or position posts qualified, there would be significantly less complaining about any given entry and whether it deserved inclusion. As it is, all it takes is a couple of pro-(insert candidate here) to make it and your inbox will be flooded with accusations of bias.
Re: No Candidate Posts
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:46 am EDT
Agree
Re: No Candidate Posts
By SemperFiWM Apr 30th 2008 at 12:48 am EDT
There just needs to be multiple diaries.
  
Highest rated posts collapsible lists by policy area
By JMesserly Apr 29th 2008 at 11:41 am EDT
We need rated posts by policy area.

This is a big deal. It ties into whether PartyBuilder is helping or hurting the party. Right now, if I had to guess it is now the tool of the forces that are wrecking party unity. And I raise my hand to admit I have written a few flame posts too.

This side bar may be great for getting people talking to each other, but it is mostly a flame war, running thread where notes have little meaning after they scroll off the page.

I care little about crabby notes about personality politics and that's what dominates, but I am forced to defend simply because it is headlining. Stuff getting the eyeballs amplifies the politically damaging messages, so I really have no choice.

I would suggest javascript hideable lists (eg wikipedia's list of presidents at the end of an article on a president Link ). Notes appear by default in the "General" list of Highest rated posts. Notes may appear in the other lists IF and ONLY IF they have been accepted for inclusion in a Group blog on that issue area.

Perhaps a compressed list of Issues categories taken from the categories for groups. So expandible lists would appear in the sidebar where Highest rated Posts now appears:

* General

* Social Justice

* Health & Education

* Environment & Energy

* Economic Policy

* Foreign Policy / Security

* Government Reform

When the expandible list expands, all others collapse, and the 5 highest posts in that list appear. By default, one of the lists is randomly expanded, as part of a fresh look, don't bury the content strategy.
Re: Highest rated posts collapsible lists by policy area
By Blueberry Apr 29th 2008 at 11:47 am EDT
Great ideas! The tech people at PB should take a look at Daily Kos...Huffington Post, etc. to get a better idea of blog management tools.
  
Dear Mike,
By marsha Apr 29th 2008 at 12:48 pm EDT
I think that's a great idea. I have done it in the past when I have seen excellant posts get buried. If some of us would just post our picks of the day..... Maybe it would help. It would also help those in both camps to see the posts by those people they respect and agree with. It may not really need a moderator, just a group of people who will pass along what they believe is important.
I am certainly willing to put up links to my faves every day or so.
If you decide on a moderator.... let me suggest a group or committee.... that way if one person is unavailable, another can post the faves.
BTW, any news on my problem?
peace to you,
marsha
  
Stay Calm
By Rhoda Apr 29th 2008 at 2:06 pm EDT
All right everyone take a deep breath, back away slowly and no one will get hurt. People we're now arguing about posts? Michael Link gave an opinion not really a big deal. You can agree or not. Our soldiers and innocent Iraqi citizens and their children are being killed everyday. Let's work on solving that problem.
  
...
By ... Apr 29th 2008 at 2:11 pm EDT
Love it...it would give more positive and constructive starting points to conversations that take place here!
  
Categorize
By Sue Sue's Straight Talk Express Apr 29th 2008 at 2:51 pm EDT
The reason people double post is because they believe that their post is being missed. I beleive if we categorized them, then people could to into the category, click on the title and read.
Your sections could be:

In its current form, it is difficult to read everyting daily and you do miss good stuff.

Latest News
Regional Events
Clintonites
Obamaites
Economy
Environment
Foreign Affairs
Millitary
Supreme Court
Cartoons
Blow off Steam
Re: Categorize
By Deborah Williams Apr 29th 2008 at 7:47 pm EDT
Deleting repeat post by same person - same day is ok.
  
Re: Quick note
By Paul Thompson Apr 29th 2008 at 8:07 pm EDT
I think most of the first postings should be eliminated. Maybe all of them.

Seriously, this site has completely lost its focus. It was to be about building the Democratic Party and has, unfortunately, become a place for harping against someone else's candidate.

No party building going on.

It needs more moderation and more clearly established rules. Really, there are no rules (at least none that I can find). It's officially sanctioned chaos.
Re: Quick note
By Mike Apr 29th 2008 at 10:24 pm EDT
The more control over the blog, the more work for Michael Link.

I do get bothered, though, that some posts I'm actually looking for disappeared before I could get back to the blog to see it for myself.

I am not bothered that real NEW posts bump others off. It's the direct copy/pastes that bother me.
  
You're focused on what???
By Mike in Raleigh Apr 30th 2008 at 12:15 am EDT
You asked for opinions and comments, so here are mine. With the ugly blogging and remarks between several irrational supporters of both candidates creating a negative overtone on this Party Builder blog site, you ignore that and focus on what?

I don't understand your priorities. You can't simply bury your head in the sand and pretend the abuse and ugliness doesn't exist here. If you aren't aware of it then you don't spend enough time here, and shame on you, Michael Link! As the owner/moderator (if it isn't you, then name who is), you need to articulate, enforce acknowledgment and agreement of same, and enforce a set of rules and guidelines, and human behavior on this site. I've recommended this to you before, and while you agreed you wanted to think about the right approach.

Instead of you contributing to helping maintain, or steer the tone back to building our party, your inactions and unwillingness to help, are contributing to this blog site becoming as ineffective as our party is headed, a mere six months from the general election.

Michael, get real, and focus on the right priorities. Help stop us from bashing each other, baiting each other, espousing hateful and degrading remarks against each other in the name of one of the two candidates. Moderate this blog site, as a good moderator/owner would. Add to the blogs in a way that contributes and stimulates productive debate and sharing of thoughts, channeled clearly to a common goal of winning on November 4.
Postscript
By Mike in Raleigh Apr 30th 2008 at 12:23 am EDT
If you don't acknowledge and resolve the situation, then you'll be left with about 10-12 people on this blog site who post, and maybe a few dozen others who occasionally read things. The rest of the thoughtful, rational, Democratic party loyalists will have stopped wasting time here, and moved on elsewhere. Failed experiments become obvious eventually.
Re: Postscript
By JJoy Apr 30th 2008 at 1:10 am EDT
but mike in releigh, you're the only one saying anything really negative! And you don't even realize that!
  
I think...
By SemperFiWM Apr 30th 2008 at 12:50 am EDT
this post should be deleted.










Just kidding. I just wanted to see if everyone read all the way to the bottom of the comments.
Re: I think...
By JMesserly Apr 30th 2008 at 2:57 pm EDT
No, but we always scan for what you have to say.
  
Yes, someone did.
By Karen Davis Apr 30th 2008 at 5:03 am EDT
It appears that a lot of people aren't serious about their opinions!

Therefore, Michael, in the interest of having some very good stuff be brought forth, and saving some valuable space (yes, even electrons in cyberspace take up room), Please do some cleanup work. A very good idea, indeed.

Think {CYBERPOLLUTION}

Don't litter.
  
Limits
By Moses Apr 30th 2008 at 12:01 pm EDT
If you can limit the number of lines/words before having to use the extended feature, it might help from pushing off posts.

Another possibility is to use some type of forum setup where posts with the most comments or most recent comments are pushed to the top of the page.

For example, palmdalelee's post about Bill Clinton is the highest rated as I write this. Every time someone posts a comment, it could be moved to the top of the page.

Hope that makes some sense, and thanks for the work you do here, Mike.
  
great idea Michael - kinda like what you were doing on the main "Kicking Ass" blog?
By D. Tree Apr 30th 2008 at 12:48 pm EDT
My only question: who is going to hang out 24/7 to catch all the good posts?

And will you be posting the "diary rescue?"

sounds like a good plan...
Re: great idea Michael - kinda like what you were doing on the main "Kicking Ass" blog?
By Karen Davis Apr 30th 2008 at 1:00 pm EDT
You could do a highest rated of all time list of posts. You could also do a highest average rated bloggers list (this would allow bloggers who don't constantly post to be showcased).

I like the idea of moving newest posts to the top instead of the bottom. Anyone following the discussion would get the newest ideas.
  
Mean, Disrespectful, Obscene Posts
By Gordon Schultz May 1st 2008 at 7:27 pm EDT
I'm with Mike from Raleigh. I've stopped coming to this site because it is so full of ranting. The number of thoughtful, searching posts is very small. This forum has turned into a shouting match. I have tried to write posts with facts and perspective that invite others to think. I try to be respectful to all, especially to people with whom I am in disagreement. In return I receive heaps of abuse, obscenities, and flagrant personal attacks.

If you can't monitor the posts and block posters who consistently violate the norms of mutual respect, then you will drive off anybody who is looking for thoughtful discussion and leave it as a sandbox of idiots bashing each other.